Royal Ballet Spring 2024

[Peanut68]

And it’s not just about thd bottom line money in the till…. But goodwill & retaining loyal audience surely…. This leaves a very sour taste…

It seems that ‘dynamic pricing’ has become the latest thing in so many fields…. Long been the accepted norm in the travel industry for flights/hotels etc and always leaves a bitter taste doesn’t it to see ticket one day is x amount & the next it’s at y - which is more often more expensive so you regret not booking sooner…The idea is surely to encourage quick buying decisions. So, getting more expensive is kind of win win but getting cheaper? I’m not sure I see this as anything other than making people hood off buying in the hope it’ll get cheaper…. A vicious circle. 
Not good.

I definitely agree it’s a combination of poor programming - give an audience what & who they want to see & the tickets will sell & also have tickets at better price points. 

Edited October 19, 2023 by Peanut68

[Rob S]

10 minutes ago, zxDaveM said:

 

This maybe so, but it's still difficult to understand the logic of £150 stalls seats 'given away' for £12, when amphi seats have gone from £23ish to £52 (as the view is still restricted at the higher price)

I guess if the ROH’s priority is the appearance of a full house rather than the revenue at that short notice their £150 to £12 strategy is more effective than that of Paddington’s Sainsbury’s on my way home from a performance the other night 

 

 

[zxDaveM]

that's obviously so you can spend a penny later on...

[Richard LH]

47 minutes ago, Rob S said:

I guess if the ROH’s priority is the appearance of a full house rather than the revenue at that short notice their £150 to £12 strategy is more effective than that of Paddington’s Sainsbury’s on my way home from a performance the other night 

 

 

😂

[LinMM]

That gave me a laugh today Rob S 😂

Sainsbury’s sensational bargains 🙄

[alison]

The most fun (?) is the Wednesday after they change offers, when items reduced the day before may suddenly be more expensive than ones with a longer shelf life!

[JNC]

I feel others have already said a lot of how I feel (ie not good) about the current pricing strategy.

 

what I will add is, as someone who no longer lives in London, I can’t take advantage of any last minute discounts (unless existing plans happen to coincide). Tickets are booked months in advance, corresponding trains (and sometimes hotels) having to be booked.

 

I can’t afford to wait for discounts and I’d rather have a full house so don’t mind some seats being sold for much cheaper to young ROH, NHS or staff friends/family, ROH friends etc as that’s the reality of things.

 

what I do take issue is the (difficult to exactly now but it seems quite clear it’s not just a few tickets every now and again but a reasonable proportion each performance) scale it’s happening at now. 
 

I saw DQ and paid £60 odd for amphitheatre tickets and was so far away it just didn’t feel worth it for me. On top of the other costs I have not being local I think I’ll just not bother to go as much now (even not living in London I made a real effort to go on average monthly, now that will reduce to probably 1-3 times a year). ROH might not care about me (why would they!) but I used to be a big champion for them among friends and family and donated money to them during Covid and also was a Friend until recently. That goodwill has now completely evaporated and whilst I’m just one person if others feel the same it’s potentially a large group of Friends/ex Friends that will then have more of an impact both in the short and long term. 

[Sophoife]

This is sadly familiar to me from AusBallet's strategy over the last five or six years.

 

1. Sell subscriptions in late Year 0, no casting information whatsoever available, but best seats all go then.

2. Make single tickets available, again late in Year 0, no casting information available.

3. Season commences in, say, June Year 1, and only 60% of the house is sold.

4. Special offer of A and B Reserve tickets for $99 (more than a 50% discount even for B Reserve) to fill house.

5. Pissed-off subscribers, many of whom (not me) regularly buy more than one ticket for each production.

6. Subscriptions for Year 2 open late in Year 1. Prices have gone up by approx 19-23% across the board. No casting information available.

7. Rinse and repeat.

[annamk]

11 hours ago, JNC said:

 

I saw DQ and paid £60 odd for amphitheatre tickets and was so far away it just didn’t feel worth it for me. On top of the other costs I have not being local I think I’ll just not bother to go as much now (even not living in London I made a real effort to go on average monthly, now that will reduce to probably 1-3 times a year). ROH might not care about me (why would they!) but I used to be a big champion for them among friends and family and donated money to them during Covid and also was a Friend until recently. That goodwill has now completely evaporated and whilst I’m just one person if others feel the same it’s potentially a large group of Friends/ex Friends that will then have more of an impact both in the short and long term. 

 

I know we've discussed the pricing a lot already but @JNC your post really reminded me again how wrong I think the Amphi pricing in particular has gone. £99 for the top price Amphi seat for Manon and more than £100 for Don Q. Those seats are cramped and too far away from the stage to justify that pricing. The Friends and Public seem to be voting with their feet - at the moment the Amphi sales for most performances of Manon are virtually non existent even after public booking. Although of course the performance is still a long way off but wasn't there a time when pre sales would be much better and Amphi seats used to be seen as value for money ? 

 

Fortunately there are other options for ballet lovers. ENB's Our Voices at Sadlers Wells was brilliant and much better value for money, as is Giselle at the Coliseum in January.

 

BUT even though Giselle pricing is lower than the RoH there are many many unsold seats and I have to admit I am waiting for a ticket offer because there are so many casts I want to see. 

 

[San Perregrino]

The promotional drive in the media of recent days and/or special offers seem to have worked in magicking away most of the seats below the Amphi for the first two nights of Anemoi/The Cellist. Wishing it every success.

Edited October 20, 2023 by PeterS

[Amanda Liu]

I heard tickets for Saturday night have been added to young ROH

[LinMM]

Very sad to read your post JNC 

Just when we need the Ballet the most to be driven away by thoughtless pricing and disregard for loyal customers. 
Unfortunately Loyalty is very under valued in todays World. 

[capybara]

I had confirmation last night that the Sat mat seats last weekend were offered to all staff, including the dancers 😨 cast in that show. The person who told me was shocked to hear that I have never received any reduced price offers.

Obviously, there has been a 'special offer' for the double bill for Saturday but, from Monday onwards, the situation remains dire. I have never seen anything like the chart is showing for next Wednesday and the 1st Nov and the nights featuring more 'star names' are not much better. Even if the auditorium can be filled from the ROH's 'lists', this borders on the disastrous.

[Fonty]

Just to say that I went to see Don Quixote last night, courtesy of someone selling a standing ticket on this forum.  I didn't quite catch what the young lady in front of me going in to the auditorium said, but it was something along the lines of not having an official ticket as she had received a student pass.  The usher said she still had to show the email, so I went through ahead of her.  Later I saw quite a large group of youngsters who appeared to have received the same offer.  So it wasn't just happening at the weekend, apparently.  

Edited October 20, 2023 by Fonty
Terrible grammar!

[capybara]

But last night's performance had been showing as 'sold out' for weeks (apart from the odd ticket which came up as a return). Whatever is the ROH playing at?

[San Perregrino]

8 minutes ago, capybara said:

But last night's performance had been showing as 'sold out' for weeks (apart from the odd ticket which came up as a return). Whatever is the ROH playing at?

I also witnessed a trio of extremely well-dressed young people, perhaps students, perhaps not trying to bluff their way into the stalls circle for Act 3.

The usher at the door politely but firmly told them that whatever it was they were waving in front of her on their phones was NOT a ticket and directed them to the Front Desk. They did not reappear.

[Scheherezade]

35 minutes ago, capybara said:

But last night's performance had been showing as 'sold out' for weeks (apart from the odd ticket which came up as a return). Whatever is the ROH playing at?

This is baffling, worrying and, potentially, utterly disgraceful all at the same time. 

[Emeralds]

If they're giving away £100-150 tickets in the Stalls and other areas for free to staff and dance students (plus their friends) while making the Amphitheatre and other lower priced (and restricted view/reduced comfort) areas ridiculously overpriced, that might explain why, according to Bloomberg, the ROH is currently having a £15million deficit. Unsurprising when they are effectively kicking out their loyal audiences who used to keep the RO & RB going. (Don't forget corporate donor/advertisers also spend thousands or more in advertising or donations so that their brand names can be seen. They're not going to advertise to an empty house or students with very little purchasing power.) I think it might be time to ask if the ROH orchestra is more useful or the finance team with their disastrous new pricing policies. It's high time the pay of the orchestra (and dancers, if applicable) was restored to pre-pandemic levels with backdated pay rises.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-10-19/can-royal-opera-house-s-finances-be-saved-by-tiktok-and-luxury-brands?leadSource=uverify wall

 

For the nth time this season, I should remind ROH- look at what ENB do over Christmas: 15% discount for customers who buy both/all productions at the Coliseum. That's how they sell out so many performances so well (Im referring to past seasons as October is too early to tell whether this coming December and January performances will sell out, have returns, or not). Bring back the subscription packages for ballets and operas- and not at a pointless 5% but at 15% if you want to reduce and not add to the deficit.

Edited October 20, 2023 by Emeralds

[PatC]

I’ve got to say I’ve been very intrigued by the young vociferous audience at the back of the Amphi. Even on opening night of DonQ it seemed to be an unusually exuberant area. I strongly believe the RB school are packing out areas undersold - great for them but I viewed that DonQ performance from not my usual area side Amphitheatre due to the exhorbitant pricing. 

[capybara]

25 minutes ago, PatC said:

I’ve got to say I’ve been very intrigued by the young vociferous audience at the back of the Amphi. Even on opening night of DonQ it seemed to be an unusually exuberant area. I strongly believe the RB school are packing out areas undersold - great for them but I viewed that DonQ performance from not my usual area side Amphitheatre due to the exhorbitant pricing. 

But the opening night was also sold out weeks ahead. So no excuse for ‘papering’ anywhere with students then.

[alison]

2 hours ago, Fonty said:

Just to say that I went to see Don Quixote last night, courtesy of someone selling a standing ticket on this forum.  I didn't quite catch what the young lady in front of me going in to the auditorium said, but it was something along the lines of not having an official ticket as she had received a student pass.  The usher said she still had to show the email, so I went through ahead of her.  Later I saw quite a large group of youngsters who appeared to have received the same offer.  So it wasn't just happening at the weekend, apparently.  

 

2 hours ago, capybara said:

But last night's performance had been showing as 'sold out' for weeks (apart from the odd ticket which came up as a return). Whatever is the ROH playing at?

 

That seems most odd.  I wonder if there was some confusion somewhere.  Is the ROH still keeping that block of tickets for students (even if possibly limiting it to dance school students)?  Could that have been what was meant?  There were certainly a lot of student-age-seeming people in the stalls circle last night.  But I'd have thought you still needed to show a ticket to get in.

[bangorballetboy]

2 hours ago, Fonty said:

Just to say that I went to see Don Quixote last night, courtesy of someone selling a standing ticket on this forum.  I didn't quite catch what the young lady in front of me going in to the auditorium said, but it was something along the lines of not having an official ticket as she had received a student pass.  The usher said she still had to show the email, so I went through ahead of her.  Later I saw quite a large group of youngsters who appeared to have received the same offer.  So it wasn't just happening at the weekend, apparently.  

 

To be fair, that was probably someone from the ballet school, noting that there is a section of the standing area held back for them.

[Jamesrhblack]

And here are the prices

[Dawnstar]

Looking at those prices, I can only be glad I saw lots of Swan Lake performances in the last run because I won't be able to afford to this time. The seats I paid £67 for last time, which was quite bad enough, are now £75. I'd love to know if whoever sets these prices has ever actually sat through a performance on the stalls circle bench seats to realise exactly how view-restricted & uncomfortable they can be. In the case of SL, neither the Act III vision of Odette nor Odette's death can be seen: two rather important moments!

[Lizbie1]

5 minutes ago, Jamesrhblack said:

And here are the prices

 

Good thing I'm not planning on seeing Swan Lake this season! I see that there is one less price band in the Amphi than for the MacMillan bill, and it looks like the missing band is very far down the order. I would not be at all surprised if the front amphi sides are £55.

[capybara]

PHEW 💨 !!!

[Sim]

So are the SCS places the ones that are £16 and £14?  My SLs are also going to be heavily reduced in number.   I would rather spend the money on the triple, which contains ballets we rarely get to see.  

[OnePigeon]

Interestingly, there are now three different prices for the stalls - not that stalls seats for Swan Lake are a possibility for me, not being well heeled or one of the chosen ones to get £12 tickets 😏.  I’ll try to save up for the triple though as it’s not much cheaper to sit in the amphitheatre these days.

[MJW]

51 minutes ago, Jamesrhblack said:

And here are the prices

Not convinced ROH has learnt its lesson on prices! 

[Dawnstar]

16 minutes ago, OnePigeon said:

Interestingly, there are now three different prices for the stalls

 

Were you expecting more or less than three? I thought it had been three for a while.

 

I've just had a look back at my tickets for the last 2 runs of Swan Lake & back in 2020 I had a stalls ticket for £94.30 with package booking that would have been £115 full price (not that I ever got to sit in it because of covid) while in 2022 when I treated myself to a stalls ticket for my first live SL it was £123 (which I think was the most I've ever spent on a theatre ticket). The same seat will now be £159. That's a price rise of £8 in 2 years between 2020 and 2022 but a price rise of £36 between 2022 and 2024. Now I know inflation has increased in the last 2 years but is it 4 and a half times more than it was in the previous 2 year period?

[OnePigeon]

47 minutes ago, Dawnstar said:

 

Were you expecting more or less than three? I thought it had been three for a while.

 

I've just had a look back at my tickets for the last 2 runs of Swan Lake & back in 2020 I had a stalls ticket for £94.30 with package booking that would have been £115 full price (not that I ever got to sit in it because of covid) while in 2022 when I treated myself to a stalls ticket for my first live SL it was £123 (which I think was the most I've ever spent on a theatre ticket). The same seat will now be £159. That's a price rise of £8 in 2 years between 2020 and 2022 but a price rise of £36 between 2022 and 2024. Now I know inflation has increased in the last 2 years but is it 4 and a half times more than it was in the previous 2 year period?

You’re right - I forgot about the small amount of slightly cheaper seats at the front to the side.  I’ve never tried one of them as I worry about the view being too close, but maybe they’re worth a try.  I’m not sure if they have always been slightly cheaper, or if it’s a more recent thing?  I don’t recall seeing them as an option when I used to regularly sit in the stalls around 15-20 years ago.

[Jan McNulty]

7 minutes ago, OnePigeon said:

You’re right - I forgot about the small amount of slightly cheaper seats at the front to the side.  I’ve never tried one of them as I worry about the view being too close, but maybe they’re worth a try.  I’m not sure if they have always been slightly cheaper, or if it’s a more recent thing?  I don’t recall seeing them as an option when I used to regularly sit in the stalls around 15-20 years ago.

 

I've always tended to like looking sideways on so I really like the view from those seats on the front row.  I first started sitting there when it was all I could get at the front and now they would be my preference.  They have been cheaper since I discovered them about 10 years ago.

[Emeralds]

A relative who now qualifies for Young ROH tells me that all the seats (barring the ones that are £29 or less) still unsold for Wed 23 Oct (Anemoi/Cellist double bill) have now been offered to Young ROH for £30. All 700 of them. If I didn't see the screenshot I wouldn't have believed it but it's  true.

 

That may sound like a great bargain for Young ROH members but in reality it's not. Unlike the Barclays Dance Pass at Sadler's Wells, you can't book it for yourself and an older or younger attendee- if you book two tickets the other attendee has to be a Young ROH member too. Not all your peers will want to sign up for something they might only want to see once. £30 is a massive sum of money for a lot of sixth formers, college students, or young workers who are feeling the pinch of high rents and costs of living. The double bill could be a pleasant midweek family outing  but that means one person pays £30, but the cost for parents are the £67 to £110 tickets unless they don't sit together-which is not exactly a fun night out. So I asked my relatives if they're going-they said no, despite the apparent "bargain" of £110 reduced to £30 for 1 of the tickets. 

 

The problem is that original prices of the tickets are simply too high. It also doesn't make a  tempting offer if you have to pay £110 for your younger child while your older child gets in for £30. (I'm using the  £110 tickets as an example because they have to sell 230 of them, at the moment.)

 

And from the viewpoint of ROH needing ti fill the auditorium, are they likely to find over 700 young people aged 16-30 who want to go out on their own (or find a likeminded friend who has also signed up) for a £30 ticket with 5 days to go? (bearing in mind ENO and Wigmore Hall are offering young people free tickets and Royal Festival Hall orchestras £5-£8 tickets). I doubt it. Yet if they do, they're losing £80 (over 70%) per £110.

 

Are they really going to continue these money-losing policies and fan-alienating prices for the next three months? Looks like they are. Not looking good for that deficit.