Ashton's Cinderella - new Royal Ballet production

[Bluebird]

6 hours ago, Richard LH said:

This is the clip I saw...https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DzD2gCpLr2V0&ved=2ahUKEwjmjrmHjvX9AhUSRsAKHZlIBigQwqsBegQIDRAF&usg=AOvVaw1yY4TREnCuT-85iFmKse6V.....she only appears to leave the coach wearing a short transparent cape on this occasion....

 

If you look very carefully (you might have to pause the clip), you'll see that the train is behind her in the carriage.  As she goes down the steps the train gradually becomes more visible and the courtiers take hold of it and straighten it out.  Of course the clip is far too brief for this to be shown.

 

[Pas de Quatre]

14 hours ago, Sim said:

I am also looking forward to tonight.  Does anyone recognise this name please (FG in Disguise):

 

OLGA SABADOCH

 

Thanks!

She is a Russian ballerina married to Mikhail Messerer.

[MJW]

8 hours ago, Sim said:

All I will say at this juncture is that the production is visually stunning!  

 
And a perfect comic performance from Gary Avis.

 

 

ps Rather a shame some people didn’t heed the request not to film or photograph the curtain call.

Edited March 25, 2023 by MJW

[Richard LH]

8 hours ago, Bluebird said:

 

If you look very carefully (you might have to pause the clip), you'll see that the train is behind her in the carriage.  As she goes down the steps the train gradually becomes more visible and the courtiers take hold of it and straighten it out.  Of course the clip is far too brief for this to be shown.

 

Thanks Bluebird, yes you are right I can see this now you have explained it.....

[capybara]

Just as well we can’t comment on rehearsals 🫤

The Senior Stage Manager’s announcement about not taking curtain call photos was far from clear. Ushers made requests to sections of the audience but were not very clear either. However, from my seat in the Stalls Circle, I didn’t see a single phone or camera out and my view was of hundreds of people.

I think that it’s OK to reveal that the audience seemed very appreciative.

 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by capybara

[Geoff]

43 minutes ago, capybara said:

I think that it’s OK to reveal that the audience seemed very appreciative.

Indeed. I believe I heard screams, not just at the end.

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by Geoff

[Shirley]

2 hours ago, capybara said:

Just as well we can’t comment on rehearsals 🫤

The Senior Stage Manager’s announcement about not taking curtain call photos was far from clear. Ushers made requests to sections of the audience but were not very clear either. However, from my seat in the Stalls Circle, I didn’t see a single phone or camera out and my view was of hundreds of people.

I think that it’s OK to reveal that the audience seemed very appreciative.

 

 

 

I was standing in the stalls circle and saw lots of phones out taking photos of the curtain calls especially in the rear section of the centre block of the stalls which was directly in my view. 

[BalletBoysDad]

On 18/11/2022 at 23:26, oncnp said:

 

Mine just came in the post today and for the best Grand Tier boxes (4 tickets) the seats were £2K + suggested donation of £4K 

 

The "cheapest" are the performance-only stalls (£170 + £105)

Sorry, I haven’t read through the whole thread yet. I bough gala tickets very late. Still, ‘performance only stalls’ were £275. I wonder if they sold fewer of the ‘super premium’ tickets, and later raised the prices when it opened to general booking? All orchestra stalls, performance only, have been showing £275.

[San Perregrino]

20 minutes ago, BalletBoysDad said:

Sorry, I haven’t read through the whole thread yet. I bough gala tickets very late. Still, ‘performance only stalls’ were £275. I wonder if they sold fewer of the ‘super premium’ tickets, and later raised the prices when it opened to general booking? All orchestra stalls, performance only, have been showing £275.

they have always been priced at £275

[BalletBoysDad]

1 hour ago, PeterS said:

they have always been priced at £275

Thank you, was just curious to know how the pricing structure worked, as I’m not a ‘friend’ and never saw what was available from the original releases.
 

It’s been a frustrating week as I bought my tickets very late. It was the ‘best of a bad bunch’ that was available in the stalls at the time, but I was looking forwards to it. As each day went by, I saw really good stalls seats come available again, several at a time. On Tuesday, almost an entire central row became free. Numerous attempts to pay the booking fee and swap for a better seat failed due to phone calls going unanswered for ages, the ‘press 1 and we will call you back’ not working, emails being unanswered. Some very good seats were available for 4 hours and I had no success getting through in that time frame. 

[JNC]

46 minutes ago, BalletBoysDad said:

Thank you, was just curious to know how the pricing structure worked, as I’m not a ‘friend’ and never saw what was available from the original releases.
 

It’s been a frustrating week as I bought my tickets very late. It was the ‘best of a bad bunch’ that was available in the stalls at the time, but I was looking forwards to it. As each day went by, I saw really good stalls seats come available again, several at a time. On Tuesday, almost an entire central row became free. Numerous attempts to pay the booking fee and swap for a better seat failed due to phone calls going unanswered for ages, the ‘press 1 and we will call you back’ not working, emails being unanswered. Some very good seats were available for 4 hours and I had no success getting through in that time frame. 

I know this relies on you having the cash flow to wait to cash in the gift voucher for a future purchase but you could have perhaps bought these better tickets to return yours (for credit minus £4). 
 

do roh allow exchanges anyway, I’m sure they would charge £4 for that too? I guess the advantage is you don’t have additional money going out now. 

[BalletBoysDad]

25 minutes ago, JNC said:

I know this relies on you having the cash flow to wait to cash in the gift voucher for a future purchase but you could have perhaps bought these better tickets to return yours (for credit minus £4). 
 

do roh allow exchanges anyway, I’m sure they would charge £4 for that too? I guess the advantage is you don’t have additional money going out now. 

It all got happily sorted out in the end. Two (not that great side stalls) tickets were £550. I could have bought the ‘better 2’ new tickets like you say and have asked to convert the previous 2 to credit. But with moving house etc I rather keep the money. During Nutcracker, I had some side balcony seats and on 2 occasions, at a later date I saw some centre front row balcony seats become available. I can’t remember the exact amount I paid, but it was the relatively small cash difference in ticket price and maybe a £4 or £6 rebooking fee. I can’t quite remember, but it was definitely worth paying it for changing to much better seats without a huge price difference.
 

That’s what I planned to do for Monday, but the issue was really the effort it took to get through to the box office. I’ve always found the box office to be fair and reasonable. It’s just on this occasion it was very hard work. 

[BalletBoysDad]

It wouldn’t have bothered me for an opera. Sight lines of legs and feet are maybe less important there. 😂 But I’ve had some quite misfortune experiences with sightlines for ballet in the stalls, more so from the sides.  That’s why I was surprised they were all a flat price for the performance-only gala stalls seats, when clearly some are much better than others. 

[Candleque]

It felt privileged to attended the rehearsal and I can't wait until next week so we can talk about the show.

I had never seen Ashton’s Cinderella before, so had no (choreographic) expectations. Have to say it felt liberating as an audience member not to be waiting for the iconic fouettés or famous fish dives that symbolise other well-known classical ballets. So I could just watch and enjoy.

My main shareable take-away thought atm — which may belong in the ROH Marketing thread and frankly did not occur to me until I actually saw the show — is a genuine befuddlement programming-wise as to why would the Royal Ballet choose to do Cinderella in the same season as Sleeping Beauty? A beautiful damsel in distress is rescued by a prince. Lilac Fairy Godmother and gorgeous side Fairies giving gifts. Déjà vu all over again. Maybe that's why the ROH poster looks more like Aurora 😄

 

[Geoff]

3 hours ago, Candleque said:

My main shareable take-away thought atm — which may belong in the ROH Marketing thread and frankly did not occur to me until I actually saw the show — is a genuine befuddlement programming-wise as to why would the Royal Ballet choose to do Cinderella in the same season as Sleeping Beauty? A beautiful damsel in distress is rescued by a prince. Lilac Fairy Godmother and gorgeous side Fairies giving gifts. Déjà vu all over again. Maybe that's why the ROH poster looks more like Aurora 😄

You’re not wrong Candleque. In, I would suggest, two ways, one of which will be easier to talk about once the show is public.

 

It is simple biographical fact that Petipa was Ashton’s choreographic hero. There is a famous story - sourced in David Vaughan’s book - of Ashton saying that he would slip away to watch Sleeping Beauty whenever he could “for a private lesson”. Ashton intended aspects of Cinderella to be recognised by audiences as his homage to Petipa’s greatest work. 
 

The other reason you felt a resemblance is, I believe, because of aspects of how this particular production has been mounted. In other words, this is not so much a marketing question as one of design, staging and production (you might like now to watch a recording of the earlier production and see what you think) In any case let’s come back to this aspect when we are free to discuss it.

 

Edited March 26, 2023 by Geoff

[capybara]

5 hours ago, Candleque said:

My main shareable take-away thought atm — which may belong in the ROH Marketing thread and frankly did not occur to me until I actually saw the show — is a genuine befuddlement programming-wise as to why would the Royal Ballet choose to do Cinderella in the same season as Sleeping Beauty? A beautiful damsel in distress is rescued by a prince. Lilac Fairy Godmother and gorgeous side Fairies giving gifts. Déjà vu all over again. Maybe that's why the ROH poster looks more like Aurora 😄

 

A ‘log-jam’ arising from the pandemic?

Productions for which high prices could be charged?

Classical dancing opportunities for a Company with talent in depth?

Contractual arrangements to be fulfilled?

[BalletBoysDad]

1 hour ago, capybara said:

A ‘log-jam’ arising from the pandemic?

Productions for which high prices could be charged?

Classical dancing opportunities for a Company with talent in depth?

Contractual arrangements to be fulfilled?

Pre-pandemic, I have in the back of my mind that I heard whispers that a new Cinderella was being planned for a Christmas run. Then it probably went into a period of covid-induced hibernation. Post-pandemic, maybe swapping a revenue-assured 34/36 performances Nutcracker run at Christmas for Cinderella wasn’t something they felt comfortable with. If indeed, it was originally planned for Christmas. I’m sure I watched Coppelia in 2019, when there wasn’t a Nutcracker that Christmas. (I am probably wrong) 

[Bluebird]

37 minutes ago, BalletBoysDad said:

Pre-pandemic, I have in the back of my mind that I heard whispers that a new Cinderella was being planned for a Christmas run. Then it probably went into a period of covid-induced hibernation. Post-pandemic, maybe swapping a revenue-assured 34/36 performances Nutcracker run at Christmas for Cinderella wasn’t something they felt comfortable with. If indeed, it was originally planned for Christmas. I’m sure I watched Coppelia in 2019, when there wasn’t a Nutcracker that Christmas. (I am probably wrong) 

 

You're not wrong.  Here's the Coppélia thread from that season:

 

Edited March 26, 2023 by Bluebird

[BalletBoysDad]

1 hour ago, Bluebird said:

 

You're not wrong.  Here's the Coppélia thread from that season:

 

Ah, thanks for that. That was the first time I had ever watched Coppelia and I thought it was extremely charming. 
 

My prediction is that they will have another Nutcracker this Christmas (23/24 season) , and depending on the success of this Cinderella, possibly look to run it over Christmas 24/25 season and give Nutcracker a rest.

[LinMM]

I would love to have Coppelia again! 
I know it’s a light weight but is a great ballet for Christmas time and the final pas de deux is especially wonderful. I think they could even get some of the WL children into Coppelia! As it’s partly about “dolls” perhaps a bit of music where they can dance with their dolls Dr. Coppelius has made them lol! 

[Fonty]

I thought Coppelia was a wonderful treat at Christmas, and made a nice change from the Nutcracker.  Was it popular?  I can't remember.

[capybara]

39 minutes ago, Fonty said:

I thought Coppelia was a wonderful treat at Christmas, and made a nice change from the Nutcracker.  Was it popular?  I can't remember.

 

I think it was. Certainly, there was no ticket sales crisis such as we are seeing now with Cinderella.

[Lizbie1]

Everything except Swan Lake and Nutcracker is selling slower post-Covid (though there were signs of a slow-down before IMO). On the bright side I think there's also a pattern of sales picking up mid-run.

 

I understand why people are anxious about this and agree that the ROH marketing department could do better - though in fairness the return to "traditional" advertising is a welcome development - but I think we are rather quick to catastrophise here when ballets we love don't sell out.

Edited March 26, 2023 by Lizbie1
typo

[Guest oncnp]

9 minutes ago, Lizbie1 said:

I understand why people are anxious about this and agree that the ROH marketing department could do better - though in fairness the return to "traditional" advertising is a welcome development - but I think we are rather quick to catastrophise here when ballets we love don't sell out.

Fair point. 'Haven't seen Cinderella yet so don't know if I'll love it but the catastrophe I'd be worried about is the financial one for the ROH as they keep harping about how they lost 3/5 (60%) of their revenue.  With the potential loss of ~ 10% of the ACE funding I would think they cannot afford half-sold houses.

Edited March 26, 2023 by oncnp

[San Perregrino]

3 minutes ago, Lizbie1 said:

when ballets we love don't sell out.

… especially given that even we, who are avid ballet consumers, don’t know yet if we will love this Cinderella. So, i’d suggest that Joe/Josephine Public are quite sensible to wait until after opening night to book. 

[BalletBoysDad]

1 hour ago, capybara said:

 

I think it was. Certainly, there was no ticket sales crisis such as we are seeing now with Cinderella.

I’m not seasoned enough to make any comparisons, but would it be fair to say that Cinderella ticket sales look worrying at this stage? 

[JNC]

1 hour ago, Lizbie1 said:

Everything except Swan Lake and Nutcracker is selling slower post-Covid (though there were signs of a slow-down before IMO). On the bright side I think there's also a pattern of sales picking up mid-run.

 

I understand why people are anxious about this and agree that the ROH marketing department could do better - though in fairness the return to "traditional" advertising is a welcome development - but I think we are rather quick to catastrophise here when ballets we love don't sell out.

I agree with this - overall the proportional of seats sold is probably not terrible at this stage given first night reviews may play into things and I do expect that will pick things up.

 

my question is - will there be further discounts (that we are aware of?) that will skew this information (ie very plausible that most, if not all, of the shows will sell out at this point, but how many tickets will have been discounted). without that information it’s difficult to make a full assessment of the success / revenue etc on ticket sales and which variable (such as pricing, or a new production of something not as mainstream as nutcracker/swan lake) has made the most impact…
 

 

 

[Beryl H]

There are a surprisingly high number of performances too.

[BalletBoysDad]

10 minutes ago, JNC said:

I agree with this - overall the proportional of seats sold is probably not terrible at this stage given first night reviews may play into things and I do expect that will pick things up.
 

True. It also felt similar during the early sales stages of ‘Like Water for Chocolate’. Unless you were familiar with the novel, the trailer and marketing gave very little away. Though mid-run, and after mostly favourable reviews it became ever more difficult to get a ticket.  

[LinMM]

I’ve got to re book a seat for April 25th and have never seen so many seats available in all areas of the house but especially the Amphitheatre…where unfortunately there will be one more available soon! 
I know it’s still a month away but the rail strikes have been suspended already the school holidays will be over by then so am surprised at so little sales so far. 
I can’t help thinking that it must have something to do with BRB Cinderella in the round at RAH coming so soon even though a totally different version etc. People just haven’t got the money to go to that many different performances and the BRB production has been advertised for a while now. 
Hopefully things will pick up in the next couple of weeks though. 
Will just add here if anyone is interested in a seat in the Amphi G.64 (£70) on 25th April ( Takada and Edmonds) then please message me! 

 

[Blossom]

2 things.

1. Glad to see there’s been some movement in terms of tickets for the first few days but still lots of pockets (which has meant that I was able to upgrade my seat for Wednesday with friends to one just infront which I am much happier with)

2. Pricing aside, as the people most likely to be booking ballet in the first place, I wonder what we might be able to do within our own networks to help.  

[Ingrid]

13 hours ago, Candleque said:

It felt privileged to attended the rehearsal and I can't wait until next week so we can talk about the show.

I had never seen Ashton’s Cinderella before, so had no (choreographic) expectations. Have to say it felt liberating as an audience member not to be waiting for the iconic fouettés or famous fish dives that symbolise other well-known classical ballets. So I could just watch and enjoy.

My main shareable take-away thought atm — which may belong in the ROH Marketing thread and frankly did not occur to me until I actually saw the show — is a genuine befuddlement programming-wise as to why would the Royal Ballet choose to do Cinderella in the same season as Sleeping Beauty? A beautiful damsel in distress is rescued by a prince. Lilac Fairy Godmother and gorgeous side Fairies giving gifts. Déjà vu all over again. Maybe that's why the ROH poster looks more like Aurora 😄

 

 

my thoughts about Cinderella are these:

 

Cinderella does not want to go to the ball so she can meet the prince and marry him, she just wants one night for herself, where she is not abused by her family. Meeting the prince and they falling in love is something that happens but she’s not too hopeful about it ( given her circumstances). When she is back at home and prevented from coming forward as the girl the prince is looking for, she fights to free herself and try the glass sleeper because she is tired of the life of servitude and literal abuse she was forced upon by her step mom and sisters. The Prince does his part but Cinderella is part of the reason they meet again at the end. 

 

Now, I don’t know how that comes across in the Ashton ballet and to me if the narrative is one similar to the one above it should be different enough from SB and Aurora.
 

I never thought of those 2 characters as being similar before anyway.

[gdallas]

What a long thread! 

I am a Friend and didn't get offered any discounts- I actually have a single ticket for The Gala Opening (no black tie for me though) and then going with my wife in April.

The website, marketing and general comms from ROH is very frustrating and has been for ages. I do not think this can be blamed on Covid any more, it just seems incoherent. But I have experienced this sort of thing in other (non-creative) organisations, and it is really very tough to think through a new approach - even harder to make it happen. There are usually people, whole teams of people, established processes, embedded software, even things like office layouts all of which combine to create inertia. But it would be good if they could somehow get hold of the issue. Other companies seem to.

I've been listening to the score for weeks now. 

I am stoked 

See you next week!