balletla Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Paragraph 24 of the 'providers scheme guide' says: The income assessment for the tuition fees should normally last for the duration of the course however schools have discretion to re-assess fees at the end of an academic year (not in-year) where there has been a dramatic change of circumstances for example where the change is long term and not subject to fluctuation or where the change has occurred for the whole of the previous academic year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nana Lily Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Moneypenny, I think we posted at the same time! From memory the % drop is 15% or there is a phrase do do with something like "hardship from the drop in income", worth speaking to school though. Just re read your post Angela, if your income has dropped this year (2012/13) and you stay on previous year assessment for September then your contribution will reflect your new circumstances. NL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa O`Brien Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Just to add my own views,which some people here may not have considered. It`s all very well suggesting a dance /performing arts degree to get around the funding issue,but not every child out there will be clever enough to be able to undertake a degree in the first place. What are they supposed to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletla Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Paragraph 24 of the 'providers scheme guide' says: The income assessment for the tuition fees should normally last for the duration of the course however schools have discretion to re-assess fees at the end of an academic year (not in-year) where there has been a dramatic change of circumstances for example where the change is long term and not subject to fluctuation or where the change has occurred for the whole of the previous academic year. Just to make clear this is a reply to Moneypenny about DaDAs. It has got lost in a question about MDS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimi'smom Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Hi Nana Lilly Moneypenny and Ribbons Thanks all for your prompt replies - it really won't be a huge amount but every little helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimi'smom Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Just to make clear this is a reply to Moneypenny about DaDAs. It has got lost in a question about MDS. My fault Ribbons - sorry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAIRBELLES Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Re DaDa: It was my understanding that it was indeed the previous year you are assessed on and doesn't change for the whole three years unless something major happens . The maintenance element is assessed every year. Someone please correct me if this is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecarte Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 As you know not many of us on this forum are fans of this new DADA system and if you look back through my posts on this subject you will see that I am passionate that these should be awarded on merit not ability to pay. I still stand by this. My DD has been offered 2 DADAs one offered before our income was declared and the second afterwards. Naturally she is delighted. However one of her very close friends is also on the audition trail this year( no idea how she is doing or where she has applied) and word got out that DD had had 2 DaDa offers ( DD would never volunteer such info as she is very modest) Anyway this good friend turned to her and said that its only because you are poorer than me that you have got a DADA and I haven't . Appart from the fact that a close friend should not be so unsupportive /mean to my DD, it does leave the whole system open to this sort of comment. Last year she could have definitely held her head up high and know it was awarded on merit, but this year it is much less obvious either to us or to others it could be on merit but it could be that we fit into one of the income brackets. There is no solution to this I suppose other than perhaps changing this friend. Sorry rant over, but this new system is very flawed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afab Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) Absolutely! PS I'm sorry your DD had to hear that, it's mean! Edited March 28, 2013 by afab 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAIRBELLES Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I agree this year is a nightmare but as you point out your daughter has been awarded dada funding before and after financial info given out ..... We were at Laines the other day ( I know not ballet ) and Betty Laine said she had the power to award scholarships if you were over the threshold for financial help obviously from Laine funds. Take no notice the colleges are not going to take people because they are poor !! If they were going to take anyone in this funding nightmare it would be the people nearer the middle who have to contribute quite a lot and find their own maintenance and I don't believe they will do this either !! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELee Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I do not have direct experience myself from what I understnad about what is stated here, even with a 'full' DADA it appears to me that one is looking in the least at paying £8,000 in top up fees and accomodation. The 'poor-poor' can't find this money already and are unable to access training that is DADA funded, talented or not. What was said to your daughter Ecarte was unkind, but I wonder where the girl in question was given that opinion, clearly from an adult comment or perspective. I think our young people are under a lot of stress at this difficult time having to take on board very grown up issues of finance in a complex situation where the adults around them do not always think carefully about how they phrase things for younger ears. The result being the comment made. It must be very hard for all these young people whatever their background to learn to deal with all the issues involved in this audition and selection process. I gues for some disappointment is going to be harder to deal with than others. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anon2 Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Sounds to me like your dd's friend has a bad case of green eyed monster. You and your daughter should be very proud - two offers of places with DaDa funding is a fantastic achievement, there will be lots of children chasing the places that fit into the funding category. Someone is going to get lucky too and be offered one of her 'places' off a waiting list. She has been offered the places on merit. We were told by one sixth form that the providers have a duty to only take those that they believe stand a good chance of gaining employment in the field. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiz Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 What a very unkind and hurtful thing to say to your lovely daughter, Ecarte! Some friend she is It is obvious to me that she is extremely jealous of your daughter. Tell her to hold her head high and be proud of herself and to forget the nasty remarks made by her so-called friend. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie4dancin Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 So sorry Encarte that your dd has been made to feel this way by her so called friends... Just when they are needed most!! A lot of its probably jealously, frustration or maybe parental comments either way it's probably best to walk away with your heads held high!!! Cx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legseleven Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 What a horrible thing for a so-called friend to say, Ecarte! It is undoubtedly because she is jealous of your daughter's offers. Unfortunately this does happen when people are successful - it happens everywhere, not just in the dance studio. The awful thing is that it takes all the joy out of successes. If your daughter is upset and feels unable to hold her head up high, could you perhaps ask her teacher to congratulate her publicly on her successful auditions and on her 2 DaDa offers and to mention that one was made before your financial circumstances were disclosed? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dramascientist Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Wow this was nasty comment Ecarte and I have to agree with ELee that it sounds like a comment overheard from an adult. I think its sad that sometimes the green eyed monster is not restricted to the children, I've heard a few nasty comments from mothers in my time as well, especially at festivals and competitions. Why can't we all be pleased for each and every child that manages to be a success in what, lets face it, is an industry that is often dismissed as unimportant to those who have no knowledge about the drive and determination needed to succeed! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecarte Posted March 29, 2013 Share Posted March 29, 2013 Thank you everyone for your lovely support and comments. DD is happy and has now made her choice and hopefully her so called friend will get a place somewhere she is happy with too and can be happy in herself and then maybe for others in turn. Good luck to everyone with difficult choices to make over the coming weeks. Just to be offered a place at all is a major achievement. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tutudesigner Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I find the new DADA situation soul destroying, regardless of income, the Government consider I need no support to fund my daughter who has been offered a DADA subject to means testing, I already support another daughter and the only way I could fund my daughter is to lose our house, these are exceptionally high payments. Try explaining that to someone who has worked their socks off, it is not easy. I spoke to my MP Robert Halfon who had no knowledge of this and was willing to look into it further. these changes appear to have been rail roaded in with little media attention and have caught most people unaware. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecarte Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 Tutudesigner have you seen and signed the petition that is linked earlier on in this thread? Perhaps you could point your MP in its direction too. With pressure we may at least get a hearing. I am thrilled that your DD is considered talented enough to be awarded a DADA and then as you,horrified that it will not be of help. She should be proud of herself but I know this is of little comfort if she is not able to take up the place offered. It is a real shame. You both have my sympathy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonlady Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 It is the same for us....DD did a final audition despite knowing she was over the DADA limit....the lady in charge kindly pointed that one out to her just before she went in . She has a place but finances for us mean a lot of heart searching to figure out what to do now....this has spilled over to Central School (on a different thread) where a lot of otherwise potential places are being taken by dancers who have had offers for a DADA but cannot take them up. What a mess this all is.... No dissrespect to the dancers who take up the places, they are truly well deserved...it just means less choice for those not able to use the DADA system. T 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lildancer96 Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 Really is frustrating and so grateful that my dd got a dada last year before all this mess started Even if it is reviewed and changed, it will probably be too late for this years intake. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletla Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 I'm surprised you didn't throttle her Dragonlady. I really think these schools have got their heads in the clouds. Don't they realise that in the long run, these DaDA arrangements mean that they will miss out on some of the most talented children. I know lots of people who are over the threshold for DaDA, even some that are a long way over the threshold, who are saying that they simply can't afford the outgoings. Some are going to Central, some are going to small local schools in the hope that things might be better next year and they can re-audition and others are now auditioning abroad. Some are also trying to negotiate with the schools to get additional funding but the school's own reserves are normally used for exceptional people from abroad who don't qualify for funding under EU rules. Meanwhile still no reply from David Laws. The only way anything will get done is if pressure comes from the combined force of the schools telling the government that their new funding formula is having a detrimental effect on their outcomes, which probably can't be evidenced for a few years until the graduate destinations start to deteriorate. What is even more soul-destroying is that the total spend on DaDAs has remained the same, it's just the way it is distributed that has changed, so the government isn't even saving any money with these new arrangements 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonlady Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 I was talking to DD's school last week about the DADAs and the lovely lady who manages the dance admin side of things has echoed what we are all saying here....she has noticed that a lot of their preferred choices for DADA's have had to turn them down because of the dramatic cut off point. She has said that she too (as the school's representative and admin for this scheme) will be supporting the arguments that it is actually restricitng talented dancers and skewing the merit based offers figures (if this makes sense?) to the lower income bracket.....not that a lot of families can afford these fees either......... as I said before....this is a huge mess and our children are paying the price T 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi4ballet Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 It seems to be severely restricting the schools' choice - they can't be happy about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tutudesigner Posted April 6, 2013 Share Posted April 6, 2013 Tutudesigner have you seen and signed the petition that is linked earlier on in this thread? Perhaps you could point your MP in its direction too. With pressure we may at least get a hearing. I am thrilled that your DD is considered talented enough to be awarded a DADA and then as you,horrified that it will not be of help. She should be proud of herself but I know this is of little comfort if she is not able to take up the place offered. It is a real shame. You both have my sympathy. Thank you Ecarte I am promoting the petition as It is only through pushing against closed doors that change can happen albeit this may take time. Despite praising my daughter on her achievement and she was delighted it is a bitter sweet pill to swallow at the moment. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletla Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 I also spoke to someone yesterday who said that regardless of whether they could afford to pay full fees/maintenance or not, is paying out up to £90,000 over 3 years the best use of that money for their child? What if they train for 3 years and don't end up with a job at the end of it all? They would be much more willing to take the chance if the financial outlay was a lot lower. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumofsixthformer Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 As a proud Mum of a daughter who has been given a sixth form place at Elmhurst I am now having to look at all possible ways to cut back because we know we are over the limit for a DaDa. She previously had an MDS for lower school and even that had a much higher cutoff point and we got help with fees plus BUPA and uniform costs were all covered. Elmhurst has a number of bursaries available though and they are assessing how many people fall into the 70K+ bracket so we are hoping we can also get some financial help through a bursary. I am deeply saddened by what the government has done as I know of many people that are now worried out of their minds as to what they can afford. My husband and I worked hard to get good University degrees and good jobs and we try to set an example to our children that hard work pays but the new DaDa system makes a mockery of this - so much for the government encouraging people back into work and rewarding married couples! I really hope we dont lose a lot of talented potential dancers but I think this is likely to happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tutudesigner Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 I can only imagine the worry this is causing parents who currently have their child(ren) at vocational school to be faced with the new financial pressures. After adopting 2 children I worked hard to get qualified to ensure we had a reasonable income however this has backfired and in effect is now excluding my daughter from her DADA offer. Although my daughter says she understands the dilemma the finality of it all will break her heart. I am currently waiting for her to complete a call back to a second audition which will allow some access to student loan up to £6k pa and looking at all early retirement options I may just be able to scrape through. There is the dilemma of whether this is financially a safe bet, however I believe it is better to have tried and lost than to give up, so only time will tell. In the interim I am bringing the matter of DADA 2013 up in any arena I can to inform change for the future, true 'means testing' should take consideration of a families existing commitments as they may have more than one child to support. ''Equality of education' seems to have been lost in the new process and the lack of access to Student Loans Company for some institutions could be the key to lessening the financial burden for the future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooZoo Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 Hi all and Ecarte in particular - I am sorry to hear that your daughter has had mean comments. You say Last year she could have definitely held her head up high and know it was awarded on merit, but this year it is much less obvious either to us or to others it could be on merit but it could be that we fit into one of the income brackets. I don't understand exactly what you mean here? Why would someone get in if they need a DADA and not otherwise? Are you saying that people who need full funding get a better chance of getting in? I am confused. If the DADAs stay the same, I doubt we would qualify for one. Does this make it LESS likely that my DS would be offered a place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletla Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 (edited) People who qualify for DaDAs (I.e. those who earn less than £70,000) will get priority for places as schools will have to use their DaDA funding or lose it. So whilst the number of DaDA places is the same, they ALL go to those under £70k. It is effectively a divided system now. All those under £70k in one group competing for DaDA places ie the majority of places, and all those over £70k in another group competing for the few non-funded places that are left. So you are less likely to get a place over the threshold as it is no longer just about talent! Edited April 11, 2013 by Ribbons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna C Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 Look. If you get offered a place at any of our Upper Schools you have done brilliantly well. Let's not speculate about students' places and how talented they are, on the basis of their parents' salaries. I would not want any student to read this thread and think that we are implying that those who have been offered places - and are fortunate enough to be able to take them - are any less talented or have done any less well, just because their parents earn less and can therefore accept a DADA. The new DADA thresholds are unfair, we are agreed on that. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooZoo Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 Do you have to submit details of your income before you audition then? Could you just explain that you will do it after??!! Alternatively, if you say you "need" a DaDa and then eventually don't, they wouldn't be able to retract your place would they? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afab Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 Apparently some schools asked for financial detail first (even though they shouldn't) and others asked for them after... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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