Dance and Drama Awards

[Jazzpaws]

Bring on more access to student finance like Central !

I think it's a flat playing field for all at 16 anyway Where anyone has been before, guarantees nothing .

[balletla]

Yes it's a flat playing field for talent and getting a place. I am not saying that they are entitled to a place. But what is the point of the Government using it's precious funding for under 16s if they then can't continue because there is no access to funding over 16? Surely it is sensible to have the pre and post 16 systems aligned from a funding point of view? And the fact it that has changed very suddenly is totally unfair on the students that have come through that system and wastes everybody's time and money. 

[Tulip]

But on a positive note, your lovely daughter has been able to access a good private school education combined with her dancing all under one umbrella. The thousands of pounds that you have spent hasn't all been wasted surely not. As parent of students arts none arts must have a contingency plan in place, simply because this government is pulling funding and benefits left right and centre. None of us should presume that what funding is available now will continue. We may even see MDS's at risk we just don't know. So for all the funding my daughter has had including student loans that all my children have up to now had, I consider myself very lucky and I feel very sorry for all the kids coming through who wont have the same opportunities.

[Tulip]

Perhaps if vocational 6th forms offered the full BA honours degree all student would be able to apply for student loans?

[Danceemum]

I may be wrong as but I don't think that the change was that sudden. Didn't they talk about changing dada funding last year but decided against it so that they could give it more thought?

Edited April 14, 2013 by Willow

[balletla]

Sudden as in the details were only published in February this year. Not much time to respond to what are significant changes with a wide impact. And I would have needed at least 5 years notice for this level of change so that we could have made the decision not to go to vocational school in the first place. I don't think anyone could have prepared for this level of change. Yes it was clear that DaDAs were going to be means tested but I think most people expected it to be broadly along the same lines as MDS.

[if only!]

Perhaps if vocational 6th forms offered the full BA honours degree all student would be able to apply for student loans?

 

Absolutely!

[Pas de Quatre]

But going to Vocational school at age 11 never gave any guarantees, it might only be for 1, 2 or 3 years.  The only time that there is continuity is from Year 10 to 11 so children can take GCSEs without any problems.  It has never been logical to assume that there would be the full eight years of training in one place.

[Kat09]

is anyone else considering divorce?

[Tulip]

Ha ha poor hubby Kat09 but it might be a possibility if he doesn't pour that wine faster. Also he might be part ofy contingency plan if the government changes anything else.

[Aurora]

No guarantees at 11 obviously but the best possible chance of success for sure. To remove the opportunity to complete the training after lower school is utterly unfair. Yes they might have had an excellent private school education meaning it wasn't completely wasted but most people would not choose to have their child live away at boarding school for an academic education alone. Families give up a lot, both financially and emotionally to have their child go to vocational school at 11. To then not be given the chance to complete the training, after those 5 years of sacrifice must be completely soul destroying, especially when your child is talented enough to be accepted and it is purely finances that prohibit it.

[Tulip]

Yes it is upsetting. I still feel robbed of not having my daughter all to myself for them five years she went away. This was something she really wanted to do. But no funding was ever guaranteed for more than a year, if you got it for the following year then it was a sigh of relief and so on. We are all terrified of our children being assessed out of their schools and if funding is pulled. As parent we are all under terrible pressure that noone would ever understand unless their child was away at vocational school. Our children are also under pressure for the same reasons. Arguments aside there is nothing any of can do except petitions etc but I think we are all in for a very rough ride, so if you can please make plans, start looking for sponsors, start a savers plan anything but don't hope that funding will stay for ever, I hope it does but who knows.

[kiwimum6]

Savers plan, Tulip?  There isn't anything left!!

 

I agree that we can't assume funding will be there forever....but what to do when we have invested so much already and there is nothing left to give.

 

I would console myself that the education was excellent...but , truth be told,  it is even better at our local comp which is consistently 'outstanding'.  They didn't go where they did for the academics,.

[Tutudesigner]

It is interesting to skim read research by Warwick University search

 

Dance and Drama Awards Strategic Review 2009 final report

 

It highlights importance of DADA Awards on Arts industry and helpful to read background reports that led to the changes, this is part f the bigger picture.

[Tutudesigner]

I appreciate nothing will change on DADAs this year however pushing the petition will be the only way to lobby to change for the future. I am not sure if an Impact Rsk Assessment was done to assess impact on students and their families which woul have prepared everyone for a plan B or C

[Tulip]

Some will consider down sizing of houses, using a small run around car no summer schools etc etc. I will be honest now, because my middle child had mild dyslexia but was very intelligent, me and my husband were able thank goodness to put our children into private school this was because the state system stated that children with a learning difficulty have to be three years behind. Our middle child absolutely thrived in this small private school, infact all three did. I vowed to my husband if anything happened with our jobs I would even live in a little flat, to give our children what they needed. During that time my husband was made redundant and it was extremely stressful but fortunately he landed an even better job position phew. When all options have really and truly gone then very sadly and I do mean this, then that is unfairly the end of the road. Put plans in place now and good luck. Now where is that husband of mine with that wine. Can I just add my dyslexic child is now at a top university studying maths and science phew.

[Kat09]

As a Mum of a child that has not attended Vocational school and therefore not had any access to funding we were rather looking forward to "the level playing field" at 16. We have spent our last few years spending all available funds on after school classes,weekend Associate classes,spring summer and easter courses,private lessons etc etc in the hope that our DD will be able to compete with those in Full time training. We have spent a small fortune on lessons,travel,hotels and the like. Like many we have given up family time,weekends and holidays.Does that make us any less deserving of funding than those that have had mds funding to this point? Whatever our children's background none of us had the right to expect funding post 16 - but all of us, and our children have worked towards that funded place at upper school only to see that avenue closed to many of us. With another child due to start University in the same year the obstacles to supporting them both look insurmountable - but hey, I always like a challenge - watch this space

[Tulip]

Kat09 what a positive attitude you have. I really hope that your daughter gets to vocational school and your son to university, oh and don't divorce your husband yet as you might need him ha ha.

[Kat09]

You are right Tulip - he will have to give me one of his Kidneys,when I have sold both of mine!   

[Aurora]

We all make a lot of sacrifices for our children (especially us dance parents, amongst others) but I think sending them away to boarding school at 11 is the biggest one you can make. To find out that it was completely wasted and that you've missed out on so much of your child's life and can't even complete their training because of such drastic changes must be a really awful thing to go through.

 

There are a lot of people in very difficult positions and I really do sympathise with them all. I just can't understand why they have made all these changes when it's costing the government exactly the same amount of money anyway!

[Tulip]

Kat09 my husband is on medical trials and doesn't know it, he has one kidney and half a liver, I am just holding out on the insurance ha ha, I am only joking you have to font you? I am just hoping the schools will come up with a solution as I can only see student loans being the best option. Up to now a graduate has to be earning 21k before they pay the loan back. Do dancers earn that much?

[Spax]

If they do Tulip its only £6 in a £100 payback over £21k. Then written off after so many years if not paid up.

[balletla]

I support the view that there are no guarantees about having continued access to a funded place and that this could be lost at any time. This is what happens if your child is considered no longer suitable for training or other children are considered to have more potential and therefore get that funded place instead.

 

That is not what has happened to my daughter and many others on this forum . She was successful in gaining 3 DaDA places because she does have the potential to succeed, but because of this last minute change to funding rules, there is no funding available this year at this income level.

 

I would be quite happy to accept it if she had been told there was no funding because she is no longer talented enough, but not because the government drastically changed the funding rules at the last minute. I have spent approx. £45,000 over the last 5 years and the government has spent approx. £75,000. That money now goes to waste, not because she is not talented enough to continue but because the government decided to change the funding rules overnight, with no phasing or allowances or alignment to existing funding policy.

 

I feel sad that some people seem unable to see that there is a difference in these two situations.

[Tulip]

I can see the difference, we all can, but what can you do? This has happened, it is terrible and unfair. We thought that it was going to happen last year. but it didn't, we knew it was going to happen somewhere along the way, sadly it was this year. None of us are stupid to not see the difference, but we knew something was going to change. We are all here to support each other but we can't change this, other than petitions. I am not being unsympathetic to what your family is going through Ribbons, it is unfair and unjust. I hope you can sort something out for your daughter so that she can continue with her training. This year is an extremely stressful year for the year 11s anyway without this on top of everything else. Good luck.

[Pas de Quatre]

This is unfair, but it is life.  Exactly the same thing is happening at company level throughout Europe.  Several companies have had their funding cut, some with and some  without warning, and thus have not been able to renew all their dancers' contracts, let alone employ new ones.  I really fear for those graduating this year, few will find jobs.  If you are making decisions for September, you really need to look at the big picture before deciding whether to take the risk of further training, or go to plan B now.

[primrose]

Just a thought to the students who were on MDS funding, why cant that funding be carried on into 6th form as I know that a few of the schools do this. I know Tring had done this for several years now. It might be worth asking the schools about it. If the schools want to keep the students and feel they are talented enough, then they must be able to allow the student to retain the MDS funding. I suppose they would have to weight this up agains the future talent entering year 7.

[Spax]

 

I can see the difference, we all can, but what can you do? This has happened, it is terrible and unfair. We thought that it was going to happen last year. but it didn't, we knew it was going to happen somewhere along the way, sadly it was this year. None of us are stupid to not see the difference, but we knew something was going to change. We are all here to support each other but we can't change this, other than petitions. I am not being unsympathetic to what your family is going through Ribbons, it is unfair and unjust. I hope you can sort something out for your daughter so that she can continue with her training. This year is an extremely stressful year for the year 11s anyway without this on top of everything else. Good luck.

[Spax]

I put child benefit in savings account for my dc. Got another job while still running my business. As soon as things were getting tight had to put plan B into effect.

[CouldDoBetter]

It is as it ever was ... we all want to give our children the best chance to succeed but most families have financial limits.

 

I was angry when I first heard the new DaDa funding arrangements. But I am becoming more philosophical as time goes by. Why should the government fund so many ballet dancers? I must admit there are a lot of things they do fund that make my blood boil - but there are clearly more children trying to become ballet dancers than the world really needs.

 

At a personal level, one DD is at vocational school (yr 10) and I really cannot see that she will have any options at the end of yr 11 to continue at ballet school as we simply will not be able to afford it. Does that annoy me? Yes. But would I have made different decisions at the start of yr 7 if I had known at the outset? I don't know but I suspect we still have gone down the same route. We have still not made any decisions yet - and she will audition for places next year. But my expectation is that she will come home and do A levels at a local college and dance at a local dance school for a couple of years. We have had a few difficult chats with DD so it does not come as a bolt out of the blue. I expect she is in denial - "they will find a way" - but it is just not possible on a DaDa as stands. My other DDs currently has a DaDa under the "old" funding arrangement which we clearly can afford - which makes it even harder. "You can for her but not for me!".

 

So I may be philosophical - but none of this is easy. But I am buying a lottery ticket every week so you never know.

[Tulip]

Hi CouldDoBetter, would your daughter not consider applying for the dance schools where they can apply for student loan? This may be the only way for dance students to go forward with their expensive dance training.

[CouldDoBetter]

Hi Tulip. Nothing ruled out yet. We will need to see what options are available when she gets the results of auditions next year - but not optimistic at the moment. I am trying not to think too much about it now as I cannot influence anything - and trying not to stress out DD so that she can just concentrate on her dancing and GCSEs.

[balletmadmom]

I have written to my MP and the Minister of Education just to air my views, knowing that there would be no point, but I just felt that I had too.

 

My gripe is that while the government will fund my eldest son to do a three year Professional Chef Diploma from 16-19 and my second son to take A levels for two years, there is no funding (other than a degree loan at Central or Rambert) for my DD next year.  Surely there should be some funding available to them, even if it is in the form of a loan.  The new system is just so brutal, earn £69k pay bugger all, earn £70k pay full fees.  Just so ridiculous, a sliding scale like Royal for ENB and Elmhurst would make total sense, you have nothing you pay nothing, you are completely loaded you pay full fees, you earn somewhere in the middle, you pay some fees.

 

The MoE had the cheek to say that there are plenty of funded courses for dance at 16 available.  Clearly an idiot, who does not know the difference between vocational classical ballet training and a course to get someone on X Factor.

[Strawberyy]

My DD was lucky enough to get a DaDa back in 2005 so we just had to fund the accommodation costs. But it should be remembered that you can only get one student loan so if it is used for a ballet course like Central or London Studio Centre if you need to go to Plan B after dance college it can't be another degree.

I feel for you all having to make these tough decisions.