New McGregor ballet - Untitled, 2023

[Dawnstar]

15 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

Am more concerned about this pessimism.....does this mean nobody is going to Laura Morera’s farewell? Or is this just a bit of a chit chat? Website still showing a lot of unsold tickets. (I’ve bought mine).

 

I'm intending to see Morera's farewell, assuming I can get a rush ticket as none of the cheapest seated stalls circle tickets were available when booking opened. However I may well not see Untitled 2023 & I'm not certain if I want to see Corybantic Games either. Since I didn't even like Woolf Works, which is supposed to be the McGregor work that people who don't like McGregor do like, I suspect there's no chance that I'll like Untitled 2023. Hence wanting to buy a cheap ticket, if I end up only seeing either third or two thirds of the triple bill!

[JohnS]

Despite my irritation with some aspects of McGregor, I’ve booked for three performances (2x Morera, first and last nights, and 1x Osipova) plus the General Rehearsal. I wasn’t impressed by Corybantic Games last time and we’ll have to see what the new McGregor offers although I don’t have high expectations. But Anastasia Act 3 I’m sure will be searing and I think fitting for Laura Morera to bring the curtain down on her fabulous career as dancer.

[JNC]

I am going and with an open mind as I’ve not seen any of the works. I can’t make Morera’s last night sadly but aiming to catch her penultimate performance. 

[MJW]

Not having seen any of the three pieces (obviously in the case of the new McGregor!), I'm going with an open mind and hope to be pleasantly surprised (having been blown away by Woolf Works I am hoping for the same reaction!).

 

Going to opening night next Friday.

[bridiem]

I'm going to Morera's farewell (I had originally intended to save a bit of money by not booking for this bill, but then I realised it was essential for that reason). And yes, I had recently been more positively disposed towards McGregor because of the recent wonder of WW, so I had almost been inclined to look forward to the new work until today's irritation. 

 

[Richard LH]

6 hours ago, Ondine said:

 

Though if your work is not actually 'about' anything concrete, but about marks on the canvas, an exploration of space, colour and the rest, not a depiction of anything, not a portrait, a still life, a landscape, evocation of mood,  etc,  why call it anything? Same with dance.

 

https://www.lissongallery.com/artists/carmen-herrera

 

 

Is it the same with dance though? Dance, by definition, is always about human expression and movement, unlike art. Perhaps that allows us to  expect some sort of context to hang on to,  at least by way of a title, if not a detailed explanation.

[annamk]

I didn't think much of Corybantic Games when it premiered, I hate Anastasia and I find most McGregor more style than substance so I only have tickets for Morera's final performance and I am even dithering about that. 

[Emeralds]

7 minutes ago, Sim said:

Yes I am going to Morera’s farewell.  Just that one show as I don’t like Corybantic Games and another McGregor short ballet doesn’t excite me.  I love Chroma and Infra but none of his other short ballets have done it for me.  

Funnily enough, Sim, I was wondering if I was the only person who was more apprehensive about Corybantic Games than about the new piece!

 

Love the Bernstein music that CG is set to (another title that will potentially set people off - Serenade, after Plato’s Symposium - sometimes written as Serenade, after Plato’s “Symposium”) but just detest the costumes. Considered sitting it out but think I might just go in and listen to the music.....either way I’d still feel bad for the dancers though. I wish the costumes and hairpieces/gel could be ditched for practice clothes and normal hair. Balanchine’s Apollo doesn’t need unflattering costumes and hairdos to tell us it’s Ancient Greek mythology (although it did start off life with slightly unflattering costumes).

 

Having seen the BRB casting for their programme in June, I’m also disappointed that the RB programme couldn’t have Laura in all 3 ballets for a few of the nights or just the last night (I know the McGregor is a new work so the casting can’t be just altered for one night, but why couldn’t she be in it- she was great in Chroma)....and I’d certainly be able to overlook the CG costumes if Laura was dancing in it.  (She could dance in a sack and still move you to tears or have you in stitches - pun unintended- laughing.)

[MoVR]

Harris Bell has replied to a comment on Instagram saying he'll be on every night of the run. I don't know if that means anything significant casting wise.

[alison]

My big disappointment was that Corybantic Games was originally on a bill with Prodigal Son, yet that hadn't reappeared, unlike the Wheeldon. Now, that I would have paid good money to see.

[JNC]

Prodigal son is one of those programmes cancelled due to covid that sadly seems unlikely to make a reappearance. Wasn’t Monotones also due an outing? 

[Lizbie1]

I'm not a fan of either Wheeldon or McGregor, so I have a question for those who have enjoyed their ballets. Is there a sense of diminishing returns with their one-acters? I get the impression from a lot of the discussion here that, setting full length ballets aside, their earlier works are more appreciated.

 

Perhaps they've just run out of things to say outside of a full length narrative (narrative-ish in McGregor's case) framework.

[Jan McNulty]

1 minute ago, Lizbie1 said:

I'm not a fan of either Wheeldon or McGregor, so I have a question for those who have enjoyed their ballets. Is there a sense of diminishing returns with their one-acters? I get the impression from a lot of the discussion here that, setting full length ballets aside, their earlier works are more appreciated.

 

Perhaps they've just run out of things to say outside of a full length narrative (narrative-ish in McGregor's case) framework.

 

I've seen McGregor's own company several times over the years and have much preferred what I have seen them do (especially F.A.R which I thought exceptional) although I have to say that I enjoyed both Chroma and Infra when I saw them.  I wasn't so keen on Obsidian Tear.

 

I wonder if the difference is that with his own company he can choose the dancers he wants whereas when he is working with RB he can only choose dancers from the RB.

[Ondine]

56 minutes ago, Richard LH said:

Is it the same with dance though? Dance, by definition, is always about human expression and movement, unlike art. Perhaps that allows us to  expect some sort of context to hang on to,  at least by way of a title, if not a detailed explanation.

 Is 'Untitled 2023' really so very far removed from Ashton calling Symphonic Variations ... Symphonic Variations?

 

Balanchine's Symphony in C?

 

I wonder what the composer has called her music?

 

Nobody has seen it yet.

[OnePigeon]

2 minutes ago, Ondine said:

 Is 'Untitled 2023' really so very far removed from Ashton calling Symphonic Variations ... Symphonic Variations?

 

Balanchine's Symphony in C?

 

I wonder what the composer has called her music?

 

Nobody has seen it yet.

 Yes, I think so.  Untitled 2023 sounds like a work in progress, like he hasn’t chosen a title yet and we’re still waiting to find out what it is.  Still, each to their own.  
 

I don’t plan on seeing the triple bill as I have no desire to see any of the other works and I really don’t enjoy McGregor’s style (what I’ve seen of it at any rate as I rarely seek it out - maybe he’s done a beautiful Ashtonian piece and I’ve missed it.....) but I hope all those that are interested, appreciate McGregor and/or are going for Morera’s farewell enjoy their evening(s).

[Emeralds]

3 minutes ago, Lizbie1 said:

I'm not a fan of either Wheeldon or McGregor, so I have a question for those who have enjoyed their ballets. Is there a sense of diminishing returns with their one-acters? I get the impression from a lot of the discussion here that, setting full length ballets aside, their earlier works are more appreciated.

 

Perhaps they've just run out of things to say outside of a full length narrative (narrative-ish in McGregor's case) framework.

You don’t even like The Winter’s Tale or Woolf Works, Lizbie1? 

 

For the short ballets, it depends....Wheeldon’s Within the Golden Hour, Polyphonia and Ghosts (not in the RB repertoire-it’s in San Francisco Ballet’s) I like, but not Strapless or CG. I like DGV and After the Rain if it’s a cast I like. For McGregor, it actually depends on the cast too....I have seen one cast whom I’m afraid were quite wrong for Infra apart from Yasmine Naghdi, who absolutely understood her character, the style of the piece and was utterly moving, and I thought Infra was “easy” to dance, so that was an interesting discovery. I haven’t seen all his one act works nor do I like all of them, but Chroma, Infra, Limen, Yugen, Terractys (which I liked) are very different to WW (I like) and Dante Project (not sure). I liked the music for Obsidian Tear but not the choreography.

 

I think perhaps if you’re the sort of person who enjoys Forsythe, Dawson, Tetley and a lot of the abstract works often danced in North America and continental Europe, you might like their one act works, but if you don’t like them then you might feel similarly about WM & CW ballets. I guess that if one believes the best ballet should be less abstract and more like Ashton, Fokine, Petipa, Bournonville, MacMillan, Perrot (Giselle, Esmeralda), maybe the one act ballets feel too..... boring? (Actually Infra is very interesting-different people in the city, including one young woman who may be suicidal - and is almost more like Fokine or MacMillan.....a really sad one, that is.)  Then again, MacMillan did abstract works too, as did Ashton, so there’s some overlap. And oddly, I like Bournonville, Petipa, etc but also like CW & WM.

 

Wheeldon and McGregor sometimes use music that isn’t classical (sometimes quite loud!) or may be borderline classical (eg is Michael Nyman film music or classical?) and both use Joby Talbot who has his distinctive sound that one might not like. I’m ok with what they’ve picked- have endured worse - and a lot of Wheeldon’s classical picks are beautiful. 

 

The other funny thing is that I find Chroma doesn’t look as interesting on screen as it does in real life, while I appreciated WTGH more only after the being able to see it onscreen during the pandemic and appreciate the fine details.

[Linnzi5]

5 hours ago, capybara said:

 

Yes - there is a photo of Fumi and William on Instagram now.

 

[Apologies if I mistook Leo Dixon for Marco Masciari earlier.]

 

Thank you! I have been out all day and haven't checked Instagram today. I am now even more pleased that I am going to both the opening and closing nights, so I do hope they are dancing on those days! 

[Ondine]

In 1946, had we had the internet, there would have been a thread here complaining that Fred Ashton was too lazy to think of a proper title for Symphonic Variations which gave us a clue what it was about.   Much sucking in of breath and hitching up of bosoms, along with dark mutterings about how we are going to hell in a handcart and chimps at the zoo could do equally as well, or some such.  That there Mr Petipa did PROPER DANCING with REAL TITLES and we knew what to expect with Sleeping Beauty. Even the De Valois woman had stories we could understand.

 

Rhapsody. Called after the music?

 

I could go on.

 

I didn't used to like Prokofiev's ballet music, I worked at it and of course I saw the light.

 

I am old enough to recall when MacMillan's ballets were not widely admired by respected critics. Now of course he's hailed as a genius.

 

Nobody has even seen it yet!  Nor heard a note nor seen the set and cossies.

 

[Linnzi5]

I actually quite like Corybantic Games (and Chroma and Infra). I am looking forward to seeing Untitled. Not sure my other half is though! 🤣

[Emeralds]

9 minutes ago, Linnzi5 said:

Thank you! I have been out all day and haven't checked Instagram today. I am now even more pleased that I am going to both the opening and closing nights, so I do hope they are dancing on those days! 

 Linnzi5, you’ll be glad to know Fumi and William are in the cast of CG on both opening and closing nights.....although I think I know who you’re actually looking out for in the cast.....yes, he was dancing both nights. 😊

[Ondine]

"Erdem’s designs for Corybantic Games in their nude tones, made of fabric of such “low denier they almost appear naked above the waist” responds – unknowingly – to Balanchine’s puritanical utilitarianism"

 

Sarasota Ballet's Daniel Pratt on costumes.

 

https://www.dancing-times.co.uk/daniel-pratt-on-costumes-for-ballet/

 

(I don't like the white lycra knickers, I feel for the women who have to wear them, but that's another issue.)

 

 

[Linnzi5]

2 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

 Linnzi5, you’ll be glad to know Fumi and William are in the cast of CG on both opening and closing nights.....although I think I know who you’re actually looking out for in the cast.....yes, he was dancing both nights. 😊

Thank you!  I am a huge fan of both Fumi and William, though William is my favourite male dancer, as you know. (I do like others very much too, though). He just makes me want to watch him all the time when he dances and Fumi is just lovely to watch. Together I just adore them both. I wonder if they will be dancing Untitled on those nights too or if there are is another cast?

[Emeralds]

3 minutes ago, Linnzi5 said:

Thank you!  I am a huge fan of both Fumi and William, though William is my favourite male dancer, as you know. (I do like others very much too, though). He just makes me want to watch him all the time when he dances and Fumi is just lovely to watch. Together I just adore them both. I wonder if they will be dancing Untitled on those nights too or if there are is another cast?

I don’t follow Instagram, but @MoVR has found posts saying that Fumi and William are in Untitled, so they should be in Untitled on the first night, and probably the last night, I guess, as the last night has the first cast of CG and Anastasia Act 3. A bonus for you, Linnzi5- your faves in not one but two ballets! 😊

[bridiem]

23 minutes ago, Ondine said:

In 1946, had we had the internet, there would have been a thread here complaining that Fred Ashton was too lazy to think of a proper title for Symphonic Variations which gave us a clue what it was about.   Much sucking in of breath and hitching up of bosoms, along with dark mutterings about how we are going to hell in a handcart and chimps at the zoo could do equally as well, or some such.  That there Mr Petipa did PROPER DANCING with REAL TITLES and we knew what to expect with Sleeping Beauty. Even the De Valois woman had stories we could understand.

 

Er - no, there wouldn't have been. And if that's what you really think about this forum and its members, I wonder why you bother participating.

 

23 minutes ago, Ondine said:

I didn't used to like Prokofiev's ballet music, I worked at it and of course I saw the light.

 

I am old enough to recall when MacMillan's ballets were not widely admired by respected critics. Now of course he's hailed as a genius.

 

Some people still don't like Prokofiev's ballet music, and that's a perfectly legitimate reaction (though not one I share). There isn't one 'correct' response to art.

 

And MacMillan is still not universally hailed as a genius. But he clearly received enough encouragement to keep choreographing.

 

 

Edited June 1, 2023 by bridiem

[Linnzi5]

1 hour ago, MJW said:

Not having seen any of the three pieces (obviously in the case of the new McGregor!), I'm going with an open mind and hope to be pleasantly surprised (having been blown away by Woolf Works I am hoping for the same reaction!).

 

Going to opening night next Friday.

I always try to keep an open mind. I just love seeing ballet, so I am reasonably easy to please - though I am a huge fan of Tchaikovsky and Prokofiev ballets and those are probably my favourite things to see, along with Ashton works. However, I still haven't made up my mind about Dispatch Duet by Tanowitz (at the Diamond Celebration) - I just can't decide if it was really clever or just, well, terrible! Dancers were brilliant though. Not sure I would want to see that again unless it was on a mixed bill with things I wanted to see. 

[Linnzi5]

2 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

I don’t follow Instagram, but @MoVR has found posts saying that Fumi and William are in Untitled, so they should be in Untitled on the first night, and probably the last night, I guess, as the last night has the first cast of CG and Anastasia Act 3. A bonus for you, Linnzi5- your faves in not one but two ballets! 😊

That would make me most happy . However, I will have to suffer Mr Linnzi whining all night about the ballets being 'modern rubbish and not Nutcracker'! Though he did like Cinderella and didn't complain too much about Wolf Works, so there is hope! 

[Ondine]

Just now, bridiem said:

Er - no, there wouldn't have been. And if that's what you really think about this forum and its members, I wonder why you bother participating.

 

 

Er... it was humour. But really, some of this thread is wincemaking and some people should try to get out into the wider world more. Untitled 2023 as a title isn't really so very revolutionary in the art world that it should be causing apoplexy.  The late Herrera called many of her pieces 'Untitled'. She designed the set. Perhaps it's also a homage to her?

 

3 minutes ago, bridiem said:

There isn't one 'correct' response to art.

 

Well that's me told, isn't it?  😊

 

 

[bridiem]

2 minutes ago, Ondine said:

Er... it was humour. But really, some of this thread is wincemaking and some people should try to get out into the wider world more. Untitled 2023 as a title isn't really so very revolutionary in the art world that it should be causing apoplexy. 

 

In the context of your previous posts here, it didn't sound like humour. And of course using 'Untitled' is not 'revolutionary'; it's just tedious. It's causing irritation, not apoplexy.

[Emeralds]

13 minutes ago, Linnzi5 said:

I always try to keep an open mind. I just love seeing ballet, so I am reasonably easy to please - though I am a huge fan of Tchaikovsky and Prokofiev ballets and those are probably my favourite things to see, along with Ashton works. However, I still haven't made up my mind about Dispatch Duet by Tanowitz (at the Diamond Celebration) - I just can't decide if it was really clever or just, well, terrible! Dancers were brilliant though. Not sure I would want to see that again unless it was on a mixed bill with things I wanted to see. 

I’ll be bringing earplugs if Dispatch Duet is on any programme, and recommend that others do the same if we want to be able to hear any music in 10 years’ time. 😉😁 Anna Rose and William were great in it! And thankfully, the costumes were ok! 

[Ondine]

2 minutes ago, bridiem said:

 

In the context of your previous posts here, it didn't sound like humour. And of course using 'Untitled' is not 'revolutionary'; it's just tedious. It's causing irritation, not apoplexy.

 

I really don't know what to say to someone who read what I wrote and didn't see it as anything but lighthearted.

 

"Untitled, 2023, inspired by the untitled art works of the late Cuban-American artist Carmen Herrera, who has designed the set."

 

Herrera clearly was beneath contempt. How dare she.

 

[Vanartus]

Well if this is the reaction to the ballet before its premiere, I can’t wait for the reaction after! 🤣

[Ondine]

1 minute ago, Vanartus said:

Well if this is the reaction to the ballet before its premiere, I can’t wait for the reaction after! 🤣

 

I'm hoping for a Rite of Spring type riot, with people screaming HOW DARE YOU NOT GIVE THIS WORK A PROPER TITLE WE DEMAND A TITLE! Maybe gluing themselves to the floor? 🫥

 

[LinMM]

Unfortunately I cannot get to any of Morera’s performances or otherwise I would have booked at least one show!! 
I’ve seen Osipova in Anastasia ( and she’s terrific of course) but that was the full length version am not so keen on the one act version. 
So as I’m not keen on the Wheeldon piece and the McGregor could be okay but not sure if he’s anything really new to say any more I thought I’d save some money on this one.