Audience Behaviour - Thread 2

[art_enthusiast]

On 03/04/2024 at 11:34, bangorballetboy said:

I'm not sure the price of tickets has any bearing on whether a show is suitable for children or how they behave

That’s not really what I said. The point is that if you pay higher than average, you deserve a better experience - e.g less noise during the performance, no noise of people eating or drinking - which thankfully is banned at the ROH.

 

Same as if you pay for a business/first class class seat on a plane. More money equals a better experience, usually… 🤔

 

If I’m paying £170 for a Swan Lake ticket for example, I deserve to have a good experience? No? I thought that would be part of my Consumer Rights.

 

This might be money that I’ve been saving all year. I deserve to have a premium experience for a premium price.

[BeauxArts]

Interesting. My perception at the ROH has always been that the higher ticket prices correlate to a better view of the stage. I don’t regard proximity to the well-heeled occupants of the Grand Tier as guaranteeing me a better consumer experience! The Upper Slips are modestly priced, have a sub-optimal view but the viewer experience is usually very good because of the calibre of the other nearby audience members, often some of the most knowledgeable people at the ROH. They also don’t audibly unwrap sweets….

[alison]

... Unlike the person somewhere behind me in the concert last night (as soon as the quiet movement started) ...   

[art_enthusiast]

3 hours ago, BeauxArts said:

I don’t regard proximity to the well-heeled occupants of the Grand Tier as guaranteeing me a better consumer experience! The Upper Slips are modestly priced, have a sub-optimal view but the viewer experience is usually very good because of the calibre of the other nearby audience members, often some of the most knowledgeable people at the ROH. They also don’t audibly unwrap sweets….

Please don’t mistake me, I don’t think proximity to rich people means a better standard. Definitely not. I myself am clearly not rich, don’t dress up to go to the ROH, and I am about 40 years younger than most of the elderly rich you find in the top price seats. I sometimes do purchase them as I have credit leftover and I like the immersive experience of being close. (And I go less often to accommodate for paying higher prices).

 

I never sit in the Grand Tier, only the OS and stalls circle sides.

 

I don’t think of the ROH as an elitist venue, I just think because of its incredible legacy and history, a standard of behaviour should be adhered to. It’s like going into a cathedral as you do for free, to see the beautiful paintings and architecture, or to worship. Silence and respectful behaviour is just part of the experience.

 

Watching ballet is almost like a religious experience for me and a lot of others I’m sure. The last thing you want is to be distracted from that.

 

I just meant that if you’ve paid top price it strings a bit more if your experience is ruined by any annoying audience behaviour, as…. money is valuable and I just invested it in having a good non disruptive experience and a good view of the stage.

[Sophoife]

50 minutes ago, art_enthusiast said:

Watching ballet is almost like a religious experience for me and a lot of others I’m sure. The last thing you want is to be distracted from that.

Absolutely! I despise people who

• talk after the lights have gone down (unless of course it's a genuine emergency),
• explain every step or plot point to the child/ren with them,
• discuss every plot point with their theatre-going companion,
• can't remember despite reminders to turn off their phone,
• allow a younger person with them to bounce around and/or kick the seat in front of them,
• insist on either crunching away on a noisy food (crisps etc) or continually dipping into noisy packaging,
• sit leaning forward in their seat for a better view and block the view of the person behind them,
• lean their head on their partner's shoulder thereby blocking the view of several people behind them,
• constantly slurp on a drink (I'm not talking about those who take a discreet sip of water here),
• light up half the auditorium by looking at their phone,
• decide to film as much of the performance as possible on their phone, or worst of all
• get physically violent or verbally abusive toward a patron who might, despite trepidation, politely request them to cease any of the above.

Signed, Curmudgeonly.

Edited April 5 by Sophoife

[Dawnstar]

I was thinking that now we're into April the respiratory virus season would be ending but the amount of coughing at the ROH tonight seemed to indicate otherwise! It seemed particularly frequent & loud during Requiem.

[Scheherezade]

I do get what you are saying @art_enthusiast but I don’t believe that the more expensive tickets should carry a greater expectation of courtesy from your neighbours. Or, for that matter, that it’s likely to come with the territory. As @BeauxArts said, the contrary is often the case since the cheap tickets are frequently taken by those who love the art form rather more than their own sense of entitlement. 
 

And @Sophoife, I would endorse every one of your examples of behaviour to despise. I’ll take your curmudgeonly and raise you cantankerous, adding people who:

 

indulge in manspreading and glare at you with undisguised hostility if you try to reclaim even the smallest piece of your own designated space;

take an eternity to move from their end of row seats at the interval while a restless queue is shifting uncomfortably, trying to get out;

wear a too-cool-for-school hat and keep it on throughout the performance;

drape their coats over the seat in front to the discomfort of the person sitting there;

cough and sneeze repeatedly without covering their mouth;

play with their hair, flicking it, pushing it up, pulling it down and endlessly twirling it round their fingers;

remove their shoes, delighting their neighbours with a lovely cheesy smell for the duration of the performance;

whisper during the quiet bits in the mistaken belief that the hissing sound they make can’t be heard by people sitting nearby. 
 

The worst offenders, though, must surely be the loved up couples who lean in to each other from the moment the lights go down, heads touching throughout, exchanging meaningful hugs and kisses with depressing regularity. Get a room! And I don’t mean the auditorium. 
 

Edited April 5 by Scheherezade

[FionaM]

Coats and large bags in the auditorium are a personal bugbear of mine as they inhibit anyone moving in or out at intervals.  I’m told in Germany they are required to be deposited (free) in the coat rooms, as they are considered a fire hazard.  I wish those rules applied everywhere.  

[Roberta]

I know I'm probably lowering the tone here and I'll be as polite as I can... 

 

... there are people (none of us) who *break wind* in the theatre and well, the whiff wafts around and it's not very pleasant is it?  My pet bugbear and it's happened near me more times over the years than I like to think about really. 

 

OK, gripe aired and over. 

[Silver Capricorn]

3 hours ago, FionaM said:

Coats and large bags in the auditorium are a personal bugbear of mine as they inhibit anyone moving in or out at intervals.  I’m told in Germany they are required to be deposited (free) in the coat rooms, as they are considered a fire hazard.  I wish those rules applied everywhere.  

Exactly when I first visited the ROH, I was shocked by what the audience brought with them to the auditorium (winter coats, jackets, backpacks...).  Here in Prague, at the National Theater and the State Opera, no one like that would be allowed into the auditorium, everything must be stored in the coat rooms.  The same applies in other European theaters, in Vienna, Berlin, Munich. Spectators also (except tourists) wear formal clothes to the theater, there is no such thing as going to the theater in a sweater and jeans.  The spectators themselves are trying to force their way so that inappropriately dressed people are not allowed into the auditorium.  A visit to the theater is considered a social event here, and people show respect for the theater and the artists by dressing appropriately and behaving appropriately.

[Sabine0308]

30 minutes ago, Silver Capricorn said:

...

The spectators themselves are trying to force their way so that inappropriately dressed people are not allowed into the auditorium.  A visit to the theater is considered a social event here, and people show respect for the theater and the artists by dressing appropriately and behaving appropriately.

While I agree with your previous sentences, I strongly disagree with "trying to force their way...", this certainly does not happen in Berlin. I do like it when people dress up for the Night, as I do myself (Igrew up with going to theatres this way). But in Berlin, you can go as you please. I'd say that seeing people in festive clothes is a good example and gives other people an idea for their next visit.

[BeauxArts]

47 minutes ago, Silver Capricorn said:

Exactly when I first visited the ROH, I was shocked by what the audience brought with them to the auditorium (winter coats, jackets, backpacks...).  Here in Prague, at the National Theater and the State Opera, no one like that would be allowed into the auditorium, everything must be stored in the coat rooms.  The same applies in other European theaters, in Vienna, Berlin, Munich. Spectators also (except tourists) wear formal clothes to the theater, there is no such thing as going to the theater in a sweater and jeans.  The spectators themselves are trying to force their way so that inappropriately dressed people are not allowed into the auditorium.  A visit to the theater is considered a social event here, and people show respect for the theater and the artists by dressing appropriately and behaving appropriately.

i am more troubled by discourteous audience behaviour than what people wear. I have been to the ballet a number of times in Germany and appreciate that many people dress up - seeing traditional  Bavarian dress in Munich was a great pleasure! However, the ROH audience is diverse and people should not - in my view - feel discouraged from attending/intimidated because they don’t fit in sartorially. One of my most enjoyable evenings of late was the first night of the new choreography evening, which was attended by a very eclectic audience, some of whom gave the costumes on stage a run for their money and made the atmosphere quite edgy and fun. 

[Jan McNulty]

7 hours ago, art_enthusiast said:

Please don’t mistake me, I don’t think proximity to rich people means a better standard. Definitely not. I myself am clearly not rich, don’t dress up to go to the ROH, and I am about 40 years younger than most of the elderly rich you find in the top price seats. I sometimes do purchase them as I have credit leftover and I like the immersive experience of being close. (And I go less often to accommodate for paying higher prices).

 

I never sit in the Grand Tier, only the OS and stalls circle sides.

 

I don’t think of the ROH as an elitist venue, I just think because of its incredible legacy and history, a standard of behaviour should be adhered to. It’s like going into a cathedral as you do for free, to see the beautiful paintings and architecture, or to worship. Silence and respectful behaviour is just part of the experience.

 

Watching ballet is almost like a religious experience for me and a lot of others I’m sure. The last thing you want is to be distracted from that.

 

I just meant that if you’ve paid top price it strings a bit more if your experience is ruined by any annoying audience behaviour, as…. money is valuable and I just invested it in having a good non disruptive experience and a good view of the stage.

 

 

10 hours ago, art_enthusiast said:

 

 

If I’m paying £170 for a Swan Lake ticket for example, I deserve to have a good experience? No? I thought that would be part of my Consumer Rights.

 

This might be money that I’ve been saving all year. I deserve to have a premium experience for a premium price.

 

 

You've dug yourself into a bit of a hole here.  "The elderly rich" vs "saving up for".  How do you know whether or not the people sitting in the top price seats are rich or whether they have saved up all year.  If I wanted to see the current production of Swan Lake sitting in a top price seat for an evening performance, excluding food, it would cost me up to £400 for the experience.  If I want to have a good experience wherever I go whether I spend £10 or £170 on a ticket is immaterial - I still expect to enjoy myself (hopefully respectfully of other audience members).  In fact, I recently went to see a play at the Shakespeare North Playhouse in Prescott.  My ticket cost me about £22.50, I had a 30 minute drive each way and free parking.  Is that a lesser experience than going to ROH??  If we are talking ballet - 3 performances of BRB's Sleeping Beauty in top price seats in Sunderland plus 2 nights in the nearby Premier Inn and parking cost me less than one evening trip to ROH.  Does that make it a lesser experience because it was cheaper?

 

Your comment about ROH legacy is interesting - there are other theatres in London and elsewhere in the country - that have far more "legacy".

 

If you want to go about making ballet an elitist experience then you are doing a wonderful job with some of your comments.

 

[LinMM]

Well hopefully will be back at ROH (for the triple) on Tuesday for the first time since November! Of course I now have a streaming cold which started a couple of days ago! I’m really hoping it will be much better by Tuesday but just apologising in advance if (with some trepidation)  have to blow nose at some point! Hopefully this won’t disturb anybody’s concentration too much or religious experiences as unfortunately the winter bugs do still seem to be around whether we want them or not!! 

[Jan McNulty]

28 minutes ago, LinMM said:

Well hopefully will be back at ROH (for the triple) on Tuesday for the first time since November! Of course I now have a streaming cold which started a couple of days ago! I’m really hoping it will be much better by Tuesday but just apologising in advance if (with some trepidation)  have to blow nose at some point! Hopefully this won’t disturb anybody’s concentration too much or religious experiences as unfortunately the winter bugs do still seem to be around whether we want them or not!! 

 

The advice I was given re nose blowing in general (as well as in a theatre) is not to do it as it just makes your nose worse!  I was told just to wipe my nostrils if they were streaming.  This was many years ago by my doctor.

[Tango Dancer]

1 hour ago, Jan McNulty said:

You've dug yourself into a bit of a hole here.  "The elderly rich" vs "saving up for".  How do you know whether or not the people sitting in the top price seats are rich or whether they have saved up all year.  If I wanted to see the current production of Swan Lake sitting in a top price seat for an evening performance, excluding food, it would cost me up to £400 for the experience 

 

I agree with this so much.  I think what makes it a good experience depends on how much you enjoyed the whole thing and doesn't always correlate with the prices. Earlier this year I paid £10 for a balcony seat for Giselle at the Coliseum on special offer, stayed in a budget hotel and thoroughly enjoyed myself.  Part of the fun was the feeling of getting a really good bargain (£10 to see Frola was the deal of the century in my view).  I've paid a lot more and had less fun.  
 

I also agree with you it's impossible to know whether people are rich or whether they've saved up.  I took my parents to the opera this year and lashed out on a box because for once we really wanted to be indulgent and for dad to have room for his mobility aids in comfort.  We dressed up to the nines because it was a special occasion.  Yes it probably did look like the elderly rich in a box but the truth was I saved and economised a lot to get those tickets because I wanted to give them a really good experience and neither I nor my parents are well off. 

 

I like a bargain and usually I'm a "cheap seat, back of the gods" person but occasionally I want to splash out for something special.  Interestingly I go to the ROH in person much less now partly because I'm no longer living in London but also because the cinema relay is so good and gives you a great view and level of comfort without needing to go very far.  So I do that and go to other things.  

 

 

[Amanda Liu]

8 hours ago, FionaM said:

Coats and large bags in the auditorium are a personal bugbear of mine as they inhibit anyone moving in or out at intervals.  I’m told in Germany they are required to be deposited (free) in the coat rooms, as they are considered a fire hazard.  I wish those rules applied everywhere.  

In quite a few venues in Europe the cloakrooms are not free (e.g. €1.70 per piece at a concert hall in Vienna and cash only). Also some people may need to rush to catch a train after a performance so may not have time to queue…

[alison]

Yes, I must admit it was marvellous being able to make my earlier train last night.  15 minutes' earlier departure = nearly 30 minutes' earlier arrival home.

[Silver Capricorn]

5 hours ago, Sabine0308 said:

While I agree with your previous sentences, I strongly disagree with "trying to force their way...", this certainly does not happen in Berlin. I do like it when people dress up for the Night, as I do myself (Igrew up with going to theatres this way). But in Berlin, you can go as you please. I'd say that seeing people in festive clothes is a good example and gives other people an idea for their next visit.

Maybe Berlin wasn't the right example, but the Vienna Opera certainly was.  The emphasis on dress code applies to the largest classical theaters in Prague.  And yes, I was also brought up to dress up for the theater.  I regularly fly to London with only cabin luggage, and its main content is evening clothes for the theater, including shoes and a handbag.  I can't get used to ski jackets and knitted sweaters with deers at my age😄

[LinMM]

To blow or not to blow that is the question for me 🤔

Hopefully will be no need by Tuesday! 

[Sophoife]

2 hours ago, Silver Capricorn said:

I regularly fly to London with only cabin luggage, and its main content is evening clothes for the theater, including shoes and a handbag.  I can't get used to ski jackets and knitted sweaters with deers at my age😄

 

I was brought up to dress for the theatre, too. 

 

However, if I'm sitting in the second back row of the balcony at the State Theatre in Melbourne, I can slip in through the back door (which is at street level, the majority of the theatre is below ground level), watch the performance, and slip back out. Not only will nobody else care what I'm wearing, I won't care what I'm wearing (I hasten to add it's always clean)!

 

Last year as many people know I flew to Denver then London and Paris to watch some ballet, and I managed to be away for a month with only one carry-on. Decent black trousers, acceptable-for-evening black shoes, black T-shirt, my mother's "faux" fur-lined coat (it's not faux), and a necklace (can't remember if it was The Amethysts or The Pearls - @Sim?).

 

I would never wear a knitted jumper with deer or snowmen or anything else on it to the theatre - unless it was a warehouse venue and cold!

[tiltwithlips]

I love to dress up for a Saturday performance - but if the cast I want to see is on a weekday evening, I'll be coming straight from the office and would rather not have to change there and leave my normal clothes at work! It also feels more pleasurable to dress up if I have company, whereas if I'm alone - as I often am at the ROH - I don't really want to be in full evening dress. I also sometimes feel very self-conscious about being dressed up in the very cheap seats, as though people will think I had unrealistic expectations of the evening (a comment I've seen applied to people "overdressed" for the standing places before, whether accurately or not!). I ultimately don't think that, if accessibility and encouraging new audiences matters to the long-term survival of the art form, it's terribly useful to focus on what people are wearing (invisible once the house lights dim anyway) instead of how they conduct themselves.

[Sim]

33 minutes ago, Sophoife said:

 

I was brought up to dress for the theatre, too. 

 

However, if I'm sitting in the second back row of the balcony at the State Theatre in Melbourne, I can slip in through the back door (which is at street level, the majority of the theatre is below ground level), watch the performance, and slip back out. Not only will nobody else care what I'm wearing, I won't care what I'm wearing (I hasten to add it's always clean)!

 

Last year as many people know I flew to Denver then London and Paris to watch some ballet, and I managed to be away for a month with only one carry-on. Decent black trousers, acceptable-for-evening black shoes, black T-shirt, my mother's "faux" fur-lined coat (it's not faux), and a necklace (can't remember if it was The Amethysts or The Pearls - @Sim?).

 

I would never wear a knitted jumper with deer or snowmen or anything else on it to the theatre - unless it was a warehouse venue and cold!

Ha ha I can't even remember what I was wearing yesterday, so I'm afraid I can't remember your necklace!!  But whatever it was I'm sure it was lovely! 

 

[zxDaveM]

nothing wrong with a nice Christmas jumper for a Nutcracker show (ahem - ok, guilty as charged! lol)

[Sabine0308]

50 minutes ago, Sophoife said:

... (I hasten to add it's always clean)!

...

Actually, this is the only MUST BE on my list.😁

[Dawnstar]

4 hours ago, Amanda Liu said:

Also some people may need to rush to catch a train after a performance so may not have time to queue…

 

Yes, I never leave my coat in the ROH cloakroom because the majority of the time I have to leave pretty briskly in order to make sure I get my train. What I do it sit in my coat, with my arms slipped out of the sleeves, so it's not as if it's in anyone else's way. As for dressing up, I'm afraid my theatregoing clothes have to deal with a half an hour walk each way between train station & ROH so I have to go for practical clothes & flat shoes. (I never wear jeans to the ROH, though I do occasionally to other theatres.)

[LinMM]

I’ve worn a Christmas jumper to ROH before with snowflakes and reindeer on reasonably tasteful I suppose in black and white. 

[Linnzi5]

18 hours ago, Sophoife said:

Absolutely! I despise people who

• talk after the lights have gone down (unless of course it's a genuine emergency),
• explain every step or plot point to the child/ren with them,
• discuss every plot point with their theatre-going companion,
• can't remember despite reminders to turn off their phone,
• allow a younger person with them to bounce around and/or kick the seat in front of them,
• insist on either crunching away on a noisy food (crisps etc) or continually dipping into noisy packaging,
• sit leaning forward in their seat for a better view and block the view of the person behind them,
• lean their head on their partner's shoulder thereby blocking the view of several people behind them,
• constantly slurp on a drink (I'm not talking about those who take a discreet sip of water here),
• light up half the auditorium by looking at their phone,
• decide to film as much of the performance as possible on their phone, or worst of all
• get physically violent or verbally abusive toward a patron who might, despite trepidation, politely request them to cease any of the above.

Signed, Curmudgeonly.

Yep. That covers my list of intense dislikes! 

[Linnzi5]

6 hours ago, LinMM said:

To blow or not to blow that is the question for me 🤔

Hopefully will be no need by Tuesday! 

I always cough when there is loud music, as sometimes, I do get the sudden urge to do so. If I actually have a cough, I don't attend performances. Blowing is a tricky subject - as long as it's a discreet blow and not a 'foghorn' one, I don't think it's an issue.  One elderly 'gentleman' last night kept falling asleep and snoring. It actually made me smile, especially as his partner kept poking him 😂 

[Linnzi5]

3 hours ago, Dawnstar said:

 

Yes, I never leave my coat in the ROH cloakroom because the majority of the time I have to leave pretty briskly in order to make sure I get my train. What I do it sit in my coat, with my arms slipped out of the sleeves, so it's not as if it's in anyone else's way. As for dressing up, I'm afraid my theatregoing clothes have to deal with a half an hour walk each way between train station & ROH so I have to go for practical clothes & flat shoes. (I never wear jeans to the ROH, though I do occasionally to other theatres.)

No. Me neither. I sit with my coat on my lap.  I do not dress up either. I wear what's comfortable for me, as I have to walk and sit on trains. I wear flat shoes as I can no longer walk in the vertiginous ones I used to. The thought of walking to my local station, navigating stairs in the underground and walking from Holborn in high heels fills me with dread! As a youngster, I would not have even thought about it as being an issue.

 

 

[alison]

And there can be a chilly draught in the amphitheatre at times, so a jumper may sometimes be necessary. 

[Sabine0308]

I often take the (not so) high heels to the theatre and change shoes there. And see some people do this as well. The only theatre  where I can get in High Heels to, good weather provided, is in Munich. The Tram literally stops in front of the Opera House, so it's a 2 Minute walk.

[Linnzi5]

58 minutes ago, alison said:

And there can be a chilly draught in the amphitheatre at times, so a jumper may sometimes be necessary. 

Most definitely. My cardigan is on and off - I tend to get hot and cold! 😳