2dancersmum

CDET organises conferences where various schools and colleges come together with workshops for students, Q & A sessions and a chance for parents to meet with and ask questions also. Previous ones have been held at Elmhurst and Hammond. The next one is at Urdang. It might be useful for some http://www.cdet.org.uk/advocacy/dance-musical-theatre-careers-conference-2016

When you have passed your Adv 2 you also have to apply to the RAD and be 18 or over in order to be allowed to used the letters ARAD after your name and as Ellie says you have to remain a member (in other words pay every year) to keep on using the letters too. In terms of hours - don't forget quality over quantity. My DD did not do that many hours compared to many before she went to vocational school at 16. Our local ballet school is only a small one - she had perhaps 6 hours of ballet a week there and a couple of jazz. But she had good teachers and small classes so she got a lot of attention. We supplemented her local ballet class with associates (once a month), workshops (once a month) and a summer school. She was in adv 1 ballet at the time of auditioning and had taken it by the September she started her new school. If we had had more time and more money so that she could have gone to a school further away and done more hours, she may well have had more offers than she did. There's just no way of knowing and regardless she now dances professionally and is happy doing so, albeit a cruise ship not a ballet company (though she has a ballet solo on pointe). So regardless of exams taken (and by what age), numbers of hours etc, it shows that the schools know what they are looking for in a potential student. As someone else said, quoting grades is a very general guide.

I gave up!!!

Got 2 DDs with frizzy hair - one curly and one straight. Hair length definitely can make a difference to the condition of the hair - especially if you are not washing it that often. Ends dry out, split and cause even more frizziness. If you can persuade your DD to have a trim and talk to the hairdresser you might get some help from her. Curly haired DD has an argon oil conditioner for when she washes her hair. She uses straighteners before attempting to put her hair in a bun as that gives the neatest effect and she will sometimes use argon oil then and always hairspray. Gel does nothing for her. The teacher did come to accept all the wispy curls around her face though as she tried when I failed and decided it suited her. I should say that DD is now older and working professionally and her hair was probably hardest to manage up to about age 13/14 and then it calmed considerably. Straight haired DD with very long hair, prefers to put her hair in a bun whilst still damp after washing. She twists, pins and sprays the wispy bits near her face and as she is getting older, the hair stays put better.

My advice would be to take your DD with you to a Boots store and ask. The lady at our local Boots talked us through products and how to apply them and did DDs face for her to show her how to apply the products too. Certainly good for the foundation . we then bought a cheaper mascara and eyeliner from MUA at superdrug.

I echo the advice to talk to your DDs current school. I wrote and explained my DDs ambitions. It was so much easier to have one point of contact (her head of year) to give permission for time off , write references and to ensure that clashes with exams were avoided. GCSE exams might be at the end of the year but we found that the science practicals and language oral components were earlier and giving the school all her audition dates as we got them meant that they were able to put DD and her group on days that did not clash. A few years ago so with new GCSEs I realise this might not apply, but best to check. I also agree with the idea of going with an open mind. My DD had a clear favourite before her auditions but her favourite I think ended up being 5th out of 6 six schools she auditioned at in the end. I think you also have to assess each school as to if it is a good fit for your DC - would your DC be happy to go there if they got an offer. There was one school by DD said she would not want to go to, even if they offered her a place. So yes cast your net wide, keep an open mind and take the whole package into consideration - course, finances, accommodation and general feel of the place (gut instinct)

Hammond have an open morning coming up on 1st October. Not sure about Elmhurst - to be honest DD had done quite a few classes there with RAD so we had already seen some of the school.

I've had tears in my eyes reading all these posts. I'm so happy for those that have come out the other side from long battles with illness and I hope your DC continue to go from strength to strength - not just in health but in following and living their dreams. For those still living through hard times, I wish you and your DC courage and all the best for a return to health and happiness.

Hull has a point about minimum grades required at GCSE before an A level in that subject can be taken. Around here 'B' is the minimum grade for most subjects at GCSE before they can be taken at A level. Perhaps worth checking with Elmhurst what A level subjects they actually offer and if a minimum grade is required. Though English and Maths are probably still advised. Check also the school's entry criteria in terms of age. Students starting after age 16 might not be required to take A levels in any case, especially coming from an alternative schooling system.

For a normal 6th form I think they expect you to have a minimum of 5 GCSEs in order to study A levels. These would include English and Maths - as another poster said if grade c (or equivalent in the new system) is not achieved a student has to retake until the age of 18. So it might not apply to your DD but given that these 2 subjects are expected, they would be good ones for her to attain. For other subjects, I think it really is a case of what interests your DD and what she might do best in. At the parents talk for Northern Ballet, GCSEs were talked about - the Principal was only interested in how many GCSEs were predicted at GCSE and not what the subjects were. She made it quite clear that when she asked the students in their mini interview she was looking for a number and no further detail and she mentioned 5 as guideline for minimum - just to give them an idea. Any vocational school is however mostly interested in the audition and the dance ability and not the number of academic qualifications. This is especially true when the child has not followed typical UK schooling ie home schooled, different age at entry, coming from a different country. I do know of students at vocational school without GCSEs, who have successfully gained places - not necessarily from abroad. I believe it is correct that you do not need to do A levels at Tring. Other ballet schools without compulsory A levels include Central School of Ballet and Northern Ballet. I know Central in their 'how to apply' section do list their entry requirements. Not sure if you have considered there.

And adding to the country roads hazards: farm machinery on narrow roads that occupy both sides of the road dips in roads prone to flooding no streetlights people parking in such a way that the bus cannot get through a village (or fire engines, emergency services etc)

Not sure if anyone has seen or is interested but the RAD are doing a free day of classes at HQ in Battersea for dancers aged 50+ as part of their Silver Swans program. https://www.rad.org.uk/events/dance-for-today?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=Dance%20for%20Today%20Sept%2016%20campaign

Personally I think going to the press did more harm to the chances of another ballet school wanting to take on the little girl (as she comes with her father) than anything the teacher said. The article ran in only one of the local newspapers and I think a lot of other local teachers, schools and parents would not have seen it. Some of DD2's friends attend this school and they were unaware until it hit the national press. DD2 even went to watch their show in June so I know there were more opportunities last year than just the watching week. Incidentally the school has a website that clearly gives all term dates a long way in advance and clear details of classes - even giving ages alongside. As I said before the teacher in the article is the Principle of the school and she would not have taken two classes a week for the pre-school classes so I think another teacher will have been caught up in this also. The Principle needs to look after her staff and other children at the school aswell as the concerns of one family. I don't approve of the wording or the tone of her emails as she certainly does not come across very professional. What is not known however is what has been said to the other teacher (if anything), what was posted on social media (to cause her to consult a solicitor) and if the family took all the emails to the press or only selected ones. I have no links to the school and am not meaning to side with one party or the other. There are wrongs on both sides. But The school has been going a long time and I don't think it has a reputation of being pushy, with most students recreational. Its also a dance school as opposed to just ballet. There are plenty of other dance and ballet schools in Cheltenham itself and in the general area. I cant imagine this is typical behaviour from the teacher and I think the little girl may well get to dance again elsewhere.

I think there is probably more to this story than meets the eye. Things that jumped out to me were the fact that the girls mother had been to watch classes - it was only the father that had not. And if parents watching classes are at the end of every term and he last watched in December - what happened to Easter and Summer end of terms? It also states that the teacher went to the police after he was contacting her parents - for harassing them and causing them distress. What on earth have her parents to do with it? The teacher is also actually the Principal of the school and has several teachers working for her. The Principal may well be responding on official school policy after one of her staff has been approached. I do know of this school and it is perhaps worth noting that the school has several venues within Cheltenham, not just one base - particularly for the younger children . And I agree that parents watching whenever they want can be very disruptive - especially in smaller venues for the little children that this school uses. I happen to know also that this school did a show in the summer term which was presumably another chance to watch them perform?

Well done to your DS. I will always remember him as the small boy who grew so rapidly I barely recognised him a year later. I wish him all the luck in the world for his professional career and I hope you manage to get out to see him perform some time.

I was surprised to see just how many of DDs friends still get to perform ballet professionally despite not joining ballet companies. Many cruise lines offer ballet numbers in their shows and like at least some of their dancers to be able to dance on pointe, my DD included, though I am aware that several of her friends working abroad in Majorca and Greece in particular, at hotel complexes - also have ballet in their shows. My DD was advised by an agent to always keep up her ballet as it will be in demand and not all those working on cruise ships have the strength or proficiency required. And back on topic of good dancers being priced out of being exceptional - DD's small village ballet school never did festivals and only the occasional competition (Fonteyn Nureyev when it ran). She had some private lessons as exam preparation from about age 12. The school was so small she was allowed to attend the grade below hers free of charge to give her more hours. Her first summer school was aged about 13 and she only ever did one a year. We could not have afforded more, though luckily her home ballet school only shuts for 2-3 weeks in the summer anyway. She went to vocational school aged 16 and was offered her first professional contract on a cruise ship in May of her final year. Would she have been a better dancer if we could afforded more for her when she was younger? I don't know - possibly but possibly not. You cannot forsee how a child will develop physically, emotionally or mentally when they are only 7 or 8 years old - or even when they are in their early teens. There are so many factors that come into play. We may have been priced out of many things as she grew up - but regardless she is happy and earning a living dancing and that's all I ever really wanted for her.

It is just fees and you are right that it is the student/parental contribution to the fees that is quoted, varying on a sliding scale depending on income. The DADA is precisely the money in the form of an award that the government pays to cover the shortfall of the cost of the course. The second column on DADA maintenance rates refers to the amount you can get towards accommodation costs. Again it depends on income for if you get any assistance with accommodation costs.

I echo the words of Janet and janiceandellen. Remember also that your DD, if she is just going into second year of her course, still has two full years of training to go and will be a much stronger dancer in 2 years than she is now. In your position, if possible, I would encourage her to do further summer schools, workshops etc that have a contemporary focus. There are quite a few contemporary classes around although some ask for students to be at the end of their second year in training - and often at that stage they can apply to take company class. It really is a case of doing your research - check out also article19.co.uk and dancingopportunities.com - these are both sites that post auditions but also have details of workshops, masterclasses .

Aileen - the two boys I know personally were both told why a place was not offered and asked to audition the following year, which they did successfully. One of them was a day pupil at the vocational school already for lower school and I know some arrangement was made so that he was able to take some classes there still. The other boy continued training locally, although I know the school in question kept in touch with him. This is different schools and a few years apart. Both were summer birthdays - July and August.

Picking up on farawaydancers point about the range of physiques at upper school, I would just like to say that for both girls and boys, changes relating to puberty are not necessarily finished by the age of 16 and the time of auditions for upper school. Boys have often not finished growing at this stage or filling out a skinny frame. I know of more than one boy not offered a place at upper school aged 16 as they have not been tall enough or physically ready but who aged 17 are significantly taller and broader. And girls often change shape age 17/18 - gaining curves for example - quite a few years after puberty. I also think it is dangerous to look at parental and even grandparents as too much of a predictor of height/build of an aspiring dancer. My friend and her husband are both about 5'6" tall, slim build with their parents shorter or similar height. Their 4 children range in height from 5'5" to 6'3" and only 2 of them have the slim frame of their parents.

I've know of expulsions due to unacceptable behaviour also, including at upper school so I know it happens. Interesting the personality study. I have to say neither of my DDs would fit type A in the slightest. Self critical about their own dancing is probably the closest , but even then its not without the joy of accomplishing something they have been working on.

I also went to see the Forever Dance show at Hammond last week. I thought the first half with the lower school was absolutely superb and really showcased all the styles and standards the pupils attain. It was an eye opener for one of the people I was with to see just how tough her competition for upper school will be. The second half, with the upper school I had some mixed feelings about. I would have liked to see more ballet also. This is about the fifth end of year show I have been to, and bar last year when the professional students had already performed a full length ballet in the March, the end of year show has always been in three parts with the first part being ballet. Its a shame there was so little this year. I was surprised also to see more vocal numbers and the inclusion of drama and MT students, who had already performed in their own end of year productions. Although I guess it does always depend on availability of students as much as anything else and quite a few of the graduate year have already started contracts. I did however thoroughly enjoy the show and thought the standard as high as ever. My favourite pieces were Gasp and Supremacy, although it is quite difficult to choose as there were quite a few worthy options. Well done to all the dancers!

People keep making the point that getting the first contract with a company is tough but I have to say that when my DD was looking at auditioning , it was simply - 'a temporary contract' with a company rather than joining the company itself in many cases. Positions were often advertised as 'required from date a to date b', sometimes offering the possibility of further contracts afterwards. One of DDs friends would describe herself as 'freelance'. She teaches in between contracts and sometimes during, depending on if she is touring or where she is based but since graduating she has done 'seasons' or shorter contracts both at home and abroad with a number of different companies. She is probably employed as a ballet dancer for around 9 months in any 12 month period - six months here, a few weeks teaching, three months there, a few weeks teaching etc. Not all companies offer the route of joining the lower ranks and working your way up. Well done also to Tulips DD. Cruise ship positions are not as easy to come by as some might think. Competition is fierce. My DD had just signed contracts for a cruise position when a ballet director requested in person she come to his audition and asked that she reconsider. But he was offering six months and she had been offered 15 months and at better pay. She has not regretted her decision.

To be honest Interested Parent I don't know. Funding also relates to the qualification and if it is classed as further or higher education. Level 3 is further education, levels 5&6 are higher but I don't know which level 4 is classed at. Student loan guidelines for eligibility say they are available for the first higher education qualification only, regardless of whether that qualification has been self funded. I think you can get student loans to top up the HND to a full degree as I have seen several such courses offered but whether you could get a full student loan for a new 3 year degree course is a different matter. Regulations suggest not but I think the cracks in the system are so wide and with so many people not understanding the system, it might well be possible to fall through the cracks and get a student loan regardless. I say this because I do know of people who have self funded the Trinity diploma and then gone onto university - apparently with full student loans, ("no problem, it was very straightforward") but I cannot of course know what they declared on application forms or what they actually got. The whole system is a minefield!

The reason that you cannot get student finance for a level 6 diploma but can for a degree is not really related to the qualification but to the institute that provides it and awards it. The colleges are private institutions whereas universities have some public funding - ie we all pay something towards them through our taxes. And it is something to do with the legalities of private versus not. It was further explained to me that there is a shortfall for any degree course between what the student pays and the actual cost of providing the course and that is effectively paid by government funding. I don't know whether it is actually the financial equivalent but the government also gives the private colleges this 'shortfall' in the form of DADAs and this is one of the reasons they argue against going to do a degree course with a student loan afterwards, because vocational students have already had their allocated pot of public money - that shortfall (here DADA) I cannot remember where I found the information as I googled intensively before DD auditioned, obviously quite a few years ago now. The Trinity level 6 diploma or BA Honours degree difference does come down to academics. When they award levels they do take into account the level of difficulty and hours of study needed to achieve a level. Diplomas are about 25% theory/academic, 75% practical and for a dance degree it is more like 40-60 (though there are probably exceptions in the form of the conservatoire schools like Central - I don't know). A level 6 Trinity diploma meets the entry requirements for many masters degrees - for contemporary dance and other dance/performing arts masters programes. This is in much the same way as universities will look at level 3 qualifications like btec and not just traditional A levels. If they wish to go onto to a masters in a different subject though or do something like a PGCE for teaching, a diploma student does need to do a conversion or top up course to do a few more academic modules in order to meet entry requirements.