The Royal Ballet: Wayne McGregor triple bill, November 2016

[John Mallinson]

…

 

However, perhaps the RB could take note that as a great fan, this is one production which I can't face, and don't want to see.  I can't believe I'm the only person who feels like that, however loyal a fan.  Revenue lost.

 

Not entirely. The performances sold out.

[JennyTaylor]

Not entirely. The performances sold out.

Ah, but at what prices......

[billboyd]

The performances sold out.

 

 

Knock down prices.

[alison]

Not exactly, Bill.  The prices are noticeably higher than what the RB usually charges for "new works".

 

And with that I'm going to bed, because this *thread* is what's giving me a headache.

[Melody]

With what appears to be first call on some of the finest dancers in the world, seat prices discounted to 50% or 60% and relatively few performances it is hardly surprising that his works find an audience. What is extraordinary is the way that resources are thrown at them.

 

I don’t resent for a moment the normal high prices for what it is some of the finest art performance in the world. I pay them gladly and consider myself very fortunate. But I do feel strongly about the misuse of my hard earned shekels to subsidize works that belong properly with a contemporary Dance Company.

 

  I also feel strongly that our fine artists who have devoted their entire lives to the mastering of their highly specialist art are wasted on works that fall outside that very specialist field and that the sacrifice in terms of time, cost, expertise and alternative works cannot be justified.

 

Others have spoke about the damage which young ballet dancers may be doing to their bodies – I am not qualified to comment but I worry about the pressures they must feel to double up with contemporary dance styles. I also worry about what seems an unusually high level of injury over the past few years - despite the Company's high investment in physiotherapy, etc. And while I do not have the expert knowledge of many who write in these forums my impression is that the Company's technical standards in its own repertoire are falling.

 

There are many Contemporary Dance Companies, dancers and choreographers out there and we should support them: when it comes to contemporary Dance they are much, much, much more exciting! Why is the RB wasting its time and resources in a futile effort to compete when so much of its own unique repertoire remains unperformed and it can call on a number of fine choreographers who are steeped in its own tradition and able to evolve that tradition in exciting ways? It is that tradition and style that makes the Company unique - not its cross-over aspirations.

Ninette de Valois said much the same thing about how ballet companies shouldn't be competing with contemporary companies on their own turf. If a company like the Royal Ballet is resorting to contemporary dance rather than finding a way forward with ballet, that's pretty sad. Mind you, I think it's trying to do both; however, the contemporary stuff should be a once-in-a-while experiment, not a major part of the repertoire.

[Terpsichore]

Ninette de Valois said much the same thing about how ballet companies shouldn't be competing with contemporary companies on their own turf. If a company like the Royal Ballet is resorting to contemporary dance rather than finding a way forward with ballet, that's pretty sad. Mind you, I think it's trying to do both; however, the contemporary stuff should be a once-in-a-while experiment, not a major part of the repertoire.

 

Surely the Royal Ballet has always been adventurous.  I think that is one reason why it is so good.  Helpmann's Miracle in the Gorbals  with its uncomfortable story and absence of pointe work must have seemed off the wall to theatregoers when it was first performed.  I have seen works that are stranger than McGregor's triple bill in the 50 years or so that I've been coming to Covent Garden.

 

I might add that the Royal Ballet is not the only major classical company to stage McGregor's work.   I mentioned the Dutch National Ballet's performance of Chroma last year and I see from McGregor's website that the Australian Ballet, the San Francisco Ballet and even the Bolshoi have danced it.

 

Finally, I am rather grateful for  the opportunity to sit in the centre of the stalls for £47.   Usually, I have to pay that amount just to get into the amphitheatre although that sum would usually buy me a good seat in The Lowry or The Alhambra.   It is a shame that the House can't discount its seats more often.

[Sim]

A good thing to get people in, but the problem is, it isn't ballet ( in my view-but does anyone think it is?) so in a sense it hasn't persuaded a new audience to watch ballet.

This is a very good point, Mary.  We all notice 'the McGregor crowd', especially on the opening nights.  They seem to be from the worlds of fashion, music, entertainment and general all-round trendies.  I must say I don't see them at any Sleeping Beauties, Swan Lakes, etc.  So they come to see McGregor, and that's it.....thus negating the theory that getting people in to watch McGregor works will then entice them back to see the classics.  Of course, I am generalising here, but on the whole I think it's the case.  

[Vanartus]

 

Well I guess I quite like being associated with the crowd you mention! Having said that I didn't see more than a handful of under-30's in the Balcony seats, and I rather enjoyed seeing a rather stylish crowd in the interval...I'm 63 and have been going to ROH since I moved to London in 1976, so I can see and enjoy the mix from both sides of the age spectrum. So sorry, long live the young, the fashionable, the people who contribute to the vibrancy of London!

Edited November 19, 2016 by Vanartus

[zxDaveM]

Knock down prices.

 

The prices (at least, the standing ones I use) were equivalent to a 'normal' triple bill of MacMillan/Ashton/AN Other or whatever. Triple bills were always cheaper when I first started attending (back in 2004) and often didn't sell out even then. Happily, they do seem more popular currently - the McGregor effect?

 

As for moving ballet forward - McGregor's pieces are recently usually in pointe shoes (so yes, for me, definitely ballet), and whilst some of the steps are frankly ugly, many are astoundingly beautiful - so yes, I think he is expanding ballet, if not necessarily moving it 'forwards'. And whilst some may not, many of the the dancers do seem to enjoy working with him. Wasn't the same thing said of MacMillan in his earlier works and some of the steps and lifts he created? Many of the 'contemporary' Ballet Russes works back in the day (thinking of the Stravinsky's here in particular) were howled at - and are now considered classics (some of which though, I'd happily never see again I can't deny).

 

Just my 2p worth   :-)

[aileen]

I think that McGregor has a reasonable 'strike rate' and believe that Chroma and Woolf Works at least will stand the test of time. Whilst some people prefer Scarlett because he is more solidly classical I feel that his early promise has rather evaporated and that there has been a rather poor return on the generous resources that the ROH has afforded him. Personally, I am not keen on two or three choreographers (or less in some companies) 'hogging' all the new commissions. I appreciate that there are benefits in a choreographer getting to know a company well and creating a few pieces on them but I would prefer ADs to open their companies to a wider range of choreographers. I understand that not all works can be stellar but I have seen rather a lot of lackluste works produced by ADs and in-house / associate choreographers recently. If a company is publicly funded to the tune of millions of pounds then I feel that it has a responsibility to give opportunities to a wide range of choreographers, not just the company's AD and perhaps one or two other favoured choreographers. In-house or associate choreographer positions should be time limited IMO.

[bridiem]

Just for the record, the seats I normally get have been priced as follows recently/for upcoming performances:

 

Sleeping Beauty £28

Nutcracker £26 

Fille £24

Jewels £24

Mayerling £24

Anastasia £20

Woolf Works £20

McGregor/MacMillan/Wheeldon triple £14

Dawson/Wheeldon/Pite triple £10

McGregor triple £10

[MAB]

I find myself wondering what Monica Mason was thinking when she appointed Wayne McGregor in the first place.  Was it bums on seats?  I know nothing about his history prior to his RB appointment. Did he have a huge following already? 

 

Yes he did have a huge following elsewhere, he also has his own company, Random Dance.  I imagine that as other classical companies embrace modern dance it was felt it was time for the RB to follow suit.  The dearth of good classical choreographers may have had something to do with it too.

[Sim]

Well I guess I quite like being associated with the crowd you mention! Having said that I didn't see more than a handful of under-30's in the Balcony seats, and I rather enjoyed seeing a rather stylish crowd in the interval...I'm 63 and have been going to ROH since I moved to London in 1976, so I can see and enjoy the mix from both sides of the age spectrum. So sorry, long live the young, the fashionable, the people who contribute to the vibrancy of London!

Vanartus, did I say anywhere that there was anything wrong with them?  All I said was that that is the crowd that McGregor seems to attract.  I have also been going to the ROH since the late 70s, and I am younger than you are, so I too can see and enjoy the mix.  I didn't say that I don't.  Personally, I wouldn't call a lot of what I see in the intervals of a McGregor opening night stylish, but to each their own.  And of course long live the young....they are young.  Although I didn't use the word 'young' anywhere in my post. I never see more than a handful of under-30s in the Balcony seats.  They tend to sit up in the Amphi, or the Slips, or they stand.  And if you aren't seeing more than a handful of young people sitting in places they normally wouldn't, perhaps the 'getting young people' in isn't working as well as they'd hoped.

[Fonty]

I haven't noticed that the McGregor programmes have attracted a particularly young crowd.  I have seen more young people, and children especially, at the more traditional triple bills.  I suppose it depends on where you sit.

 

I have no problem with the RB performing new works, and tackling something in a more contemporary style from time to time. And I also have no problem with their dancing a piece by McGregor.  While it is perfectly obvious he is not my personal favourite, I have seen two or three pieces by him that I have enjoyed.  I am not so narrow minded that I cannot watch something new and different.  There are quite a few Balanchine ballets that are not to my taste either.  And that is tantamount to sacrilege in some quarters!

 

The issue I have is with McGregor's appointment as the resident choreographer.  Apart from anything else, he will be the person that the next generation of choreographers will be watching and learning from.  And that is the real problem I have.  His style is hardly the one to watch,in order to create a new work in the classical style, however many dancers he puts in pointe shoes. 

[Vanartus]

Vanartus, did I say anywhere that there was anything wrong with them? All I said was that that is the crowd that McGregor seems to attract. I have also been going to the ROH since the late 70s, and I am younger than you are, so I too can see and enjoy the mix. I didn't say that I don't. Personally, I wouldn't call a lot of what I see in the intervals of a McGregor opening night stylish, but to each their own. And of course long live the young....they are young. I never see more than a handful of under-30s in the Balcony seats. They tend to sit up in the Amphi, or the Slips, or they stand. And if you aren't seeing more than a handful of young people sitting in places they normally wouldn't, perhaps the 'getting young people' in isn't working as well as they'd hoped.

 

Text/possible sub-text

 

Yes, the trendies were stylish.

 

Didn't you label check the Balenciaga, Saint Laurent, Vêtements, Loewe, Anderton?

 

Gareth Pugh - as ever - was modest and pleasant.

 

I normally sit Amphi - you know those seats F to N sides right which are as cheap as chips...but seeing that there be bargains to be had I upgraded.

 

What a depressing thread this is...

[Vanartus]

I haven't noticed that the McGregor programmes have attracted a particularly young crowd. I have seen more young people, and children especially, at the more traditional triple bills. I suppose it depends on where you sit.

 

I have no problem with the RB performing new works, and tackling something in a more contemporary style from time to time. And I also have no problem with their dancing a piece by McGregor. While it is perfectly obvious he is not my personal favourite, I have seen two or three pieces by him that I have enjoyed. I am not so narrow minded that I cannot watch something new and different. There are quite a few Balanchine ballets that are not to my taste either. And that is tantamount to sacrilege in some quarters!

 

The issue I have is with McGregor's appointment as the resident choreographer. Apart from anything else, he will be the person that the next generation of choreographers will be watching and learning from. And that is the real problem I have. His style is hardly the one to watch,in order to create a new work in the classical style, however many dancers he puts in pointe shoes.

 

The successor will be someone completely different. That's how it works.

[Sim]

 

What a depressing thread this is...

Well I trust you won't be contributing to it anymore then.

[bangorballetboy]

The successor will be someone completely different. That's how it works.

Am now picturing a naked man at the organ...

[Vanartus]

Am now picturing a naked man at the organ...

 

Not a bad way to end...

[Fonty]

The successor will be someone completely different. That's how it works.

 

I think you have completely missed the point I was making, Varnatus. 

[Duck]

... We all notice 'the McGregor crowd', especially on the opening nights.  They seem to be from the worlds of fashion, music, entertainment and general all-round trendies.  I must say I don't see them at any Sleeping Beauties, Swan Lakes, etc.  So they come to see McGregor, and that's it.....thus negating the theory that getting people in to watch McGregor works will then entice them back to see the classics.  Of course, I am generalising here, but on the whole I think it's the case.  

 

There is, thankfully, an array of styles available at the ROH that goes beyond the classics and McGregor. If someone who goes to see McGregor at the ROH and then maybe doesn’t come back for Sleeping Beauty/ Swan Lake, they may well decide to do so, however, for works by other choreographers, whether past or present.

 

 

... The issue I have is with McGregor's appointment as the resident choreographer.  Apart from anything else, he will be the person that the next generation of choreographers will be watching and learning from.  And that is the real problem I have.  His style is hardly the one to watch,in order to create a new work in the classical style, however many dancers he puts in pointe shoes. 

 

Past seasons have seen Wheeldon, Scarlett, Dawson, Ratmansky, Shechter, Marriott, etc., create new works. I think that all of these can be learned from as part of the creative process.

[Nina G.]

Text/possible sub-text

 

Yes, the trendies were stylish.

 

Didn't you label check the Balenciaga, Saint Laurent, Vêtements, Loewe, Anderton?

 

Gareth Pugh - as ever - was modest and pleasant.

 

I normally sit Amphi - you know those seats F to N sides right which are as cheap as chips...but seeing that there be bargains to be had I upgraded.

 

What a depressing thread this is...

 

What's so depressing? A difference of opinion?

[Geoff]

A quote from the Luke Jennings review (not as uncritical as some have reported):-

 

>>I’m not alone in my deep concern about the Royal Ballet’s lack of direction, and the role that McGregor and his spectacular but narrow-spectrum productions are to play in its future. If O’Hare has a vision, he has yet to communicate it.

 

For the whole piece, here's the link again:-

 

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2016/nov/13/wayne-mcgregor-triple-bill-chroma-multiverse-carbon-life-vincent-dance-virgin-territory-review

[alison]

... The issue I have is with McGregor's appointment as the resident choreographer.  Apart from anything else, he will be the person that the next generation of choreographers will be watching and learning from.  And that is the real problem I have.  His style is hardly the one to watch,in order to create a new work in the classical style, however many dancers he puts in pointe shoes. 

 

Yes, but "watching and learning from" (thankfully) doesn't mean slavishly copying.  I think (hope) that what young choreographers will gain from him is maybe more a way of thinking about and around what it is you're creating, exposing yourself to a variety of thoughts and influences outside the narrow confines of ballet, collaborating with musicians and artists, that sort of thing. 

[Timmie]

Who was that masked girl…

 

I went to the triple bill last night. Chroma was excellent and I grinned especially foolishly as Lauren Cuthbertson exploded across the stage. I am so used to seeing her in purely classical roles that this contrast made LC my first highlight of the night.

 

Multiverse. I forgot my earplugs (not part of my usual pre-ballet checklist of phone, keys, wallet and jelly babies). As it turns out they must have turned the sound down as the volume was OK. The first fifteen minutes or so was really irritating and put me into too subdued a state of mind to enjoy the rest which may actually have been quite good. I was quite thankful for the thirty minute interval to get into a better state of mind with the help of the jelly babies.

 

Carbon Life, I enjoyed this very much but won’t be that bothered if I don’t see it again. Whilst very entertaining it’s not what I go to the ballet for. The second highlight of my evening was that masked girl. She was amazing, so totally immersed in the music that the audience may as well not have been there. She was as slippery as a fish* in her pas de deux and when she was on stage I was transfixed. I have no idea who she was and was planning to try and ID her at the curtain call but she kept her mask on (stuck maybe). She was the smallest performer and dead centre for the curtain call. Please tell me who she is so I can watch out for her in the future.

 

*an analogy that instantly sprang to mind as I watched her.

[John Mallinson]

Francesca Hayward, eye-catching as ever.

[SPD444]

Have to say, I felt sorry for her the night I was their. Whilst everyone involved in the production appeared for their curtain call, ( or so it seemed ) there is poor Frankie stuck in her mask. She was good though but, then again, she always is.

[Timmie]

Thank you both. I can’t believe I didn’t recognise her, I’ve only seen her a few times but even so… In my defence they all look a bit the same with slicked down hair and then wearing the mask. (I do have an appointment with Specsavers coming up ).

[LinMM]

It's easy to miss people you think you will recognise when wearing certain costumes and wigs et al !!

 

I haven't seen the programme but am not finding this thread depressing am enjoying all the variety of views.

 

Can I just ask if there is a "resident" choreographer does this mean that the RB can only commission works from that choreographer or can they use others as well.....for new works I mean.......does it just mean the resident choreographer is expected to do more not all?

 

I'm trying to think of a thread to put this info on ..but recently saw one of the best nutcrackers in years by the Mikhailovsky ballet and this had been re worked by Nacho Duato .....also on the modern side ....but the movement was so refreshing and flowing in this ....really beautiful in parts .....so not all modern choreographers are doom and gloom non classical so to speak.

[bridiem]

Yes, but "watching and learning from" (thankfully) doesn't mean slavishly copying.  I think (hope) that what young choreographers will gain from him is maybe more a way of thinking about and around what it is you're creating, exposing yourself to a variety of thoughts and influences outside the narrow confines of ballet, collaborating with musicians and artists, that sort of thing. 

 

I agree with this Alison, but if McGregor is held up as the prime exemplar I'm afraid that young choreographers will be encouraged to think that they have to be clever/intellectual/relevant etc rather than allowing their creativity and dance instinct to guide them. And he is not the only choreographer by a long way who collaborates with musicians and artists and allows wider themes to affect their work. What matters in the end is the work that emerges, not the method or the motivation.

[Timmie]

You are right LinMM. In some ways I am quite pleased that I didn’t recognise her – a bit like a blind wine tasting when you pick the good one .

[zxDaveM]

I agree with this Alison, but if McGregor is held up as the prime exemplar I'm afraid that young choreographers will be encouraged to think that they have to be clever/intellectual/relevant etc rather than allowing their creativity and dance instinct to guide them. And he is not the only choreographer by a long way who collaborates with musicians and artists and allows wider themes to affect their work. What matters in the end is the work that emerges, not the method or the motivation.

 

I thought his role was more as a mentor, offering encouragement and ideas for collaboration for enhancing the choreography of the young, next generation choreographers, rather than making them follow directly in his stylistic footsteps. The new works in the Clore that were put on before the McGregor triple on the main stage, bear that out.

[bridiem]

I thought his role was more as a mentor, offering encouragement and ideas for collaboration for enhancing the choreography of the young, next generation choreographers, rather than making them follow directly in his stylistic footsteps. The new works in the Clore that were put on before the McGregor triple on the main stage, bear that out.

 

I wasn't talking about making them follow his specific style (or even encouraging them to do so); I was talking about the context and impetus for creating works. The intellect can only take you so far. But I hope he can indeed be effect as a mentor/stimulus.