zxDaveM Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Just now, PeterS said: ? Bruce Springsteen's Giselle ? 🙂 LOL Giselle leaps up onto the stage from the audience, and all that 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 11 hours ago, alison said: I'm pretty certain I've seen it omitted in the odd Royal Ballet performance in favour of something ... less horizontal ... too. I'd suspected it was a Bolshoi insertion. I think I may actually prefer the Skeaping approach. BTW, any reports on today's casts? I'll report both 12th and 13th evenings when not so tired from 2 long journeys on consecutive nights in 0°C weather outside....I promise I'll try my best not to turn in an epic length contribution! In agreement with some members I like the candle lift in other ballets or pas de deux but not in Giselle as it's a 20th century addition and not authentic, and to me, doesn't make sense as Giselle should not stay still long enough for Albrecht to lift her like that, ie he wants to catch her and see her, as a wish to rekindle their love, recapture their time together, express his contrition etc etc so why would he lift her above his head? It feels slightly gimmicky and illogical. That said, I appreciate and admire the dancers who perform it beautifully eg at RB. Equally I appreciate the dancers who omit it and replace it with something lovely and more historically informed! Last word to coaches and choreographers: most fans don't care what their fave dancers perform as long as it's not outlandish. And newbies will not remember or be extra impressed if a difficult acrobatic lift was included instead of a less risky one, but will more likely remember if there were wobbles in Giselle and Myrtha's arabesque penchées or Albrecht fell/came off balance on a landing onto the knee in the jumps or turns. None of my newbie companions remember the overhead lifts at all, although they do praise ENB, RB, BRB and UUB (United Ukrainian Ballet) for recent excellent Giselle performances. 😉 Edited January 14 by Emeralds 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinMM Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 PeterS 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinMM Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 I always take it that although Albrecht may be trying to connect Giselle is not so easy to catch hold of so goes flying aloft!! But it has to be seen to be done without effort on Albrecht’s part for it truly to be effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 1 hour ago, LinMM said: Yes I agree am just fed up with not being able to see what’s going on ( though can’t see this Giselle this time around) It’s SO disrespectful to audiences and even Amateur Companies would not dream of doing this in my experience! Surely there must be some compromise here of somebody going up into the top of the House and seeing what actually CAN be seen from up there so the lighting is at least just bright enough for the action to be seen. Nobody’s suggesting Picadilly Circus!! I agree- the audience missed a stunning double tour from Erik Woolhouse as Hilarion because it was in darkness. Also, the scene with the male peasants and Hilarion in the forest in front of and near Giselle's grave was so dark that a few audience members had to switch on their programmes to work out what was happening....an unfortunate consequence of saving on lighting! Less disruptive to have more lighting on the stage and less in the auditorium. They all missed Hilarion miming that he still loved Giselle and missed her. They could have a bit of light (not a powerful spotlight but dim ones) over Giselle's grave to suggest there's moonlight on it and one on the peasants to suggest their lamps are working. We'll still be able to discern the wilis frightening them in the dark. I don't remember it being this dark in the last run. I thought perhaps it was my eyesight going with age (!) but the teen in our group with the robust eyesight of youth said, "no it isn't you- it's much too dark." Maybe someone at ENB could mention this to Mr Mohr to turn up the lighting a bit in this scene..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 1 hour ago, PeterS said: It is a bugbear of mine that contemporary choreographers spend months in the studio creating masterpieces that are so poorly underlit that the paying audience can only guess at what they are watching. It would seem that Mary Skeaping was doing it decades ago. Just because something was done once upon a time doesn’t mean it can’t be revisited and evolve for revivals. I don't think Mary Skeaping (who died 9th February 1984) can be blamed for the poor lighting in 2024. I don't recall it being too dark to see when I first saw her LFB Giselle way back in the early 1970s. Obviously, a certain amount of gloom is required to build up the atmosphere of the forest, though not so much that it defeats the ability to see what is happening. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Emeralds said: Also, the scene with the male peasants and Hilarion in the forest in front of and near Giselle's grave was so dark that a few audience members had to switch on their programmes to work out what was happening....an unfortunate consequence of saving on lighting! Less disruptive to have more lighting on the stage and less in the auditorium. They all missed Hilarion miming that he still loved Giselle and missed her. They could have a bit of light (not a powerful spotlight but dim ones) over Giselle's grave to suggest there's moonlight on it and one on the peasants to suggest their lamps are working. We'll still be able to discern the wilis frightening them in the dark. I didn't have a problem seeing the peasants on Friday, albeit I was sat front row stalls, but I was puzzled by their second appearance. I recall in the UUB production them being there at the start but not their reappearance being chased later by the wilis, while I don't recall them at all in the RB production. Is this my memory being useless or do they make an extra appearance in this production? It seems a bit much having not only Hilarion but also half a dozen other men killed in a single night! Still no cast list up for this afternoon. I'm on a train to London in the hope Oliveira & Frola are indeed on but I haven't yet bought a ticket in case they're not. I really hope there will still be tickets available by the time the cast is confirmed. Edited January 14 by Dawnstar 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Dawnstar said: I didn't have a problem seeing the peasants on Friday, albeit I was sat front row stalls, but I was puzzled by their second appearance. I recall in the UUB production them being there at the start but not their reappearance being chased later by the wilis, while I don't recall them at all in the RB production. Is this my memory being useless or do they make an extra appearance in this production? It seems a bit much having not only Hilarion but also half a dozen other men killed in a single night! I think the male peasants were more prominent in the original production and were subsequently cut in 20th century productions for various reasons (wanted to make Hilarion more prominent, no need to include them in rehearsals, less overtime pay, thought the wilis look nicer on their own with Hilarion, touring venues and new theatres too small to fit so many people, etc etc) and this was carried on to the 21st century. I could pick out the various characters as I knew what I was looking for. But from upstairs it looks like some guy is just flapping his arms in the dark, not Hilarion saying I'm here mourning her because I loved her. And that's from the front row- goodness knows what the patrons in the back and balcony are missing). Edited January 14 by Emeralds 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annamk Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Has anyone seen confirmation of casting today yet ? Does no confirmation mean it’s the scheduled cast ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridiem Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 2 minutes ago, annamk said: Has anyone seen confirmation of casting today yet ? Does no confirmation mean it’s the scheduled cast ? Casting as advertised, except that Alison McWhinney replaces Angela Wood as Myrtha: https://www.ballet.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/14-Jan-2.30.pdf 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 So relieved it's finally up. I've literally been refreshing the page every couple of mins. Oliveira & Frola on plus McWhinney as Myrtha. So I am very happy! Now I just have to hope I can still get a ticket... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Dawnstar said: I didn't have a problem seeing the peasants on Friday, albeit I was sat front row stalls, but I was puzzled by their second appearance. I recall in the UUB production them being there at the start but not their reappearance being chased later by the wilis, while I don't recall them at all in the RB production. Is this my memory being useless or do they make an extra appearance in this production? It seems a bit much having not only Hilarion but also half a dozen other men killed in a single night! PS Dawnstar have you decided if you might try to attend today? I can't due to a commitment that I can't change but so wish I could. Can't believe Francesco Gabriele Frola is only going to get one show of this ballet which suits his technique and artistry so well (though to be fair the first two Albrechts whom I've seen are excellent too). But really sad when so many (me included) are keen to see him as Albrecht. Would have bought an extra ticket for next week (and never mind losing the multibuy discount)! Edited January 14 by Emeralds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Just now, Dawnstar said: So relieved it's finally up. I've literally been refreshing the page every couple of mins. Oliveira & Frola on plus McWhinney as Myrtha. So I am very happy! Now I just have to hope I can still get a ticket... Sorry, you answered same time as I posted! Ignore my question. Should have no problem getting a ticket in a place with good sightlines but not sure if it will be in your preferred Stalls area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 7 minutes ago, Emeralds said: Sorry, you answered same time as I posted! Ignore my question. Should have no problem getting a ticket in a place with good sightlines but not sure if it will be in your preferred Stalls area. I've just booked stalls E2, which is the nearest I can get to the stage without having to pay £95. I guess I'm lucky to be able to get anything only an hour an a half beforehand but compared to my lovely front-row-for-£50 on Friday...! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizbie1 Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Just a few thoughts from me on yesterday's matinee: first and foremost, thanks are due to Irmgard for her loving care of this production. It is a thing of great beauty (definitely my favourite Giselle), and I'm very pleased that she has resisted the entrechats six and the Bolshoi lift. Lee and Haw were very affecting yesterday - this is the first time I've seen them at any length and I'm very pleased both are now at ENB. Aside from the dancing: I was in the Balcony, albeit near the front, and my eyesight is not the best, but I thought that the lighting was the right side of "atmospheric". The audience - and I'm judging many were not regulars - were well behaved. I sat next to a first-timer couple who were not from the usual demographic and they enjoyed it a lot. I just wish that ACE could be bothered to understand that classical ballet, done well, transcends age, race and politics. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogoat Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Just spotted and spoke to Frola on the street outside the Coli and he IS dancing this afternoon! 😁 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 39 minutes ago, Lizbie1 said: I'm very pleased that she has resisted the entrechats six and the Bolshoi lift. I suspect had these been inserted (I'm sure @Irmgardwouldn't dream of allowing it, as the guardian of Miss Skeaping's work) the phantom of Mary Skeaping may well have been seen flitting in and out of the line-up of Wilis to glower at the perps! She may have even taken up Cecchetti's big stick (she was a distinguished proponent of his 'method'). Her history with this ballet goes back to dancing it with Pavlova's company. Long may this lovely, genuinely Romantic production continue. Others can do melodrama and crowd pleasers, those who prefer subtlety and more than a nod to ballet history really should go and see it while you can. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAB Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Also the peasant pas de deux instead of a pas de six. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 7 minutes ago, MAB said: Also the peasant pas de deux instead of a pas de six. Yes. I can see that the six gives more dancing for soloists which is important in a large company and a long run, but the deux is historically more accurate and sort of makes more sense dramatically (though historically it was inserted to please its original female dancer). In the days when Giselle formed only part of an evening's programme, not so very long ago really, other dancers could be given roles in any additional ballet performed. Nowadays, Giselle is performed as a standalone. So, to keep people busy, a pas de six. Edited January 14 by Roberta 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 A pas de six, by diffusing the dancing, also doesn't create the confusion of a "secondary" leading couple who just come on, dance and then vanish for no apparent reason. The Skeaping version deals with this better than most, as they are more integrated into the plot, being part of an entertainment put on for the visiting aristocracy. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Just now, alison said: part of an entertainment put on for the visiting aristocracy. Yes, and that means Giselle's desire to perform has context. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 2 hours ago, Lizbie1 said: Aside from the dancing: I was in the Balcony, albeit near the front, and my eyesight is not the best, but I thought that the lighting was the right side of "atmospheric". From my experience of having viewed Act II both from above and from something rather nearer stage level, I'd say that that certainly applies to viewing from above, but I suspect those down in the stalls may have found it more of a problem. The fact that production design, until relatively recently, will have been based on the assumption that dancers are fair-skinned won't have helped. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) Extended interval then announcement that Oliveira is ill & being replaced by Takahashi for Act II. It does feel a bit doomed trying to see this cast! Edited January 14 by Dawnstar 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 22 minutes ago, alison said: The fact that production design, until relatively recently, will have been based on the assumption that dancers are fair-skinned won't have helped. Also it used to be the case that dancers in white acts painted themselves in something called 'wet white'. I'm really showing my age here! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zxDaveM Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 20 minutes ago, Roberta said: Also it used to be the case that dancers in white acts painted themselves in something called 'wet white'. Was that the stuff that gave them lead poisoning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 (edited) 31 minutes ago, zxDaveM said: Was that the stuff that gave them lead poisoning? I think that was in earlier centuries when faces were painted with lead paint. This was more like shoe whitening. (I've recently junked a cache of ancient Leichner grease paints and heaven only knows what was in those too. They didn't smell too wonderful, after all this time. Possibly I should have sent them to the V & A! Also liquid brown body paint, for 'gypsies'. All very incorrect these days.) Edited to add this link. It's about racism in ballet and other things. I'm neither agreeing nor disagreeing with its argument. Wet white wasn't a figment of my imagination. https://www.city-journal.org/article/beside-the-pointe "Since the nineteenth century, dancers in a corps de ballet often applied white body paint in works, such as Giselle or Les Sylphides, that feature a supernatural element. The intent was to create an impression of ghostly creatures from beyond the grave who might doom any red-blooded prince who crosses them. The use of white makeup was not a statement about white supremacy: there were virtually no black dancers in Russian or Parisian ballet troupes at the time against which a statement about skin color might be made. If one is looking for slurs, the body paint could be seen as anti-white, in its association of whiteness with death." Edited January 14 by Roberta 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 59 minutes ago, Dawnstar said: Extended interval then announcement that Oliveira is ill & being replaced by Takahashi for Act II. It does feel a bit doomed trying to see this cast! Oh dear, I do sympathise (more of which when I'm on a computer). I'd been trying to prioritise the Giselles who I thought might not be around next time, so I'm sorry not to have seen Oliviera ☹️ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capybara Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Oliviera was really lovely; but so was Takahashi. And we got Gabriele Frola! It’s amazing to think that Erina, who is in her mid forties, danced Giselle last night as well. Both these ballerinas are ENB gold. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Wow, this run of Giselle has been full of dramatic changes! (Almost as dramatic as the Raymonda run two years ago!) Wishing Fernanda Oliveira a very speedy recovery and hope all works out well. Gold stars and biggest bouquets 💐 💐 💐 to Erina Takahashi, Katja Khaniukova and Aitor Arrieta who have now all stepped in to dance twice on consecutive days (no doubt Erina will say she only danced one act but it's still super tiring at very short notice and she actually had less recovery time as this is a matinee after her evening show). Toi toi toi to the company for the rest of the run! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emeralds Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 17 minutes ago, alison said: Oh dear, I do sympathise (more of which when I'm on a computer). I'd been trying to prioritise the Giselles who I thought might not be around next time, so I'm sorry not to have seen Oliviera ☹️ Me too 😞....hope Mary Skeaping's Giselle production returns to London again sooner rather than later! Best wishes to Fernanda. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Such a shame for Oliveira, especially as she had a wonderful first act. It really set up Act 2 to be very emotional, but it wasn’t to be. She had such a lovely connection with Frola, who was one of the most affecting Albrechts I have seen for many a year. He made me melt, on so many levels. He still managed to establish an emotional connection with Erina, even though they hadn’t had the benefit of Act 1 together. It says a lot for them both, their artistry and their professionalism. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pas de Quatre Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 1 hour ago, Roberta said: Also it used to be the case that dancers in white acts painted themselves in something called 'wet white'. I'm really showing my age here! When I was performing as a professional ballet dancer it was normal for management to tell dancers that if they sunbathed during the summer and got a tan then they would have to use white makeup on exposed arms, shoulders for Giselle, Swan Lake etc. Water soluble pan cake did the trick. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinMM Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 I really love this production of Giselle but I wouldn’t put other productions down because of it. I think Ballet should have a wide umbrella. I suppose I’m a bit of a “both and” person rather than an “either or” one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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