ROYAL BALLET AND OPERA - new name for Royal Opera House

[FionaM]

 

https://www.gramilano.com/2024/04/interview-royal-ballet-kevin-ohare-2024-2025/

EXTRACT:

 

So, Kevin, the ‘big news' is the birth of the ‘Royal Ballet and Opera' – after all The Royal Ballet and The Royal Opera companies have performed under the same roof since 1946, so it makes sense.

It's really great – what happens at the Royal Opera House is ballet and opera, not just opera, so we're calling it the Royal Ballet and Opera from now on. Some people didn't quite get that there was ballet in the Royal Opera House, so we want to shout about it… it's what it says on the tin.

The flags outside will now say ‘Royal Ballet and Opera', so as you walk in you go, “OK, this is what happens here.”

 

It's also good that people understand what is here at the Royal Ballet and Opera, so the Arts Council grant, for example, is actually going to two companies, not just the building [The Royal Opera House] and the orchestra. It's just clearer.

 

Some people thought that opera was at the Opera House, and ballet was somewhere else?

 

Yes, even some people who should have known better! And the new logo works much better on social media or on a bus or whatever – you can see it much better.

 

So under the new flag you are announcing the new season.

 

I'm excited about the season. It's going to be good. A snapshot of what The Royal Ballet is today.

[FionaM]

This is hugely significant.   No idea why I’m reading it first on Gramilano.com

 

In rebranding themselves it impacts us  … we should use RBO instead of ROH in future.  
 

Bravo to Kevin for this important change.  

[Jan McNulty]

You could have also  read it in The Guardian or Bloomberg as included in Today's Links today.

 

It's also mentioned in the RB season thread.

[FionaM]

Thanks @Jan McNulty

 

i think this change deserves its own thread.  

[Jan McNulty]

1 minute ago, FionaM said:

Thanks @Jan McNulty

 

i think this change deserves its own thread.  

 

I don't disagree with you.

 

 

[bridiem]

So does 'The Royal Opera House' actually no longer exist? If so, I don't think I'm convinced by the thinking behind this. I find it very hard to believe that anyone even vaguely interested in such things doesn't know that the Royal Ballet performs at the ROH. And I can't think of any other of the world's great opera houses (at many of which ballet is also performed) where such clarification is deemed to be necessary. The Royal Opera House is a building (and a very famous and beautiful building), as well as an entity; a building in which two companies (and often other smaller companies) perform. It's more than just the two separate companies - it's the building in which they perform and all the people in it who make the performances possible but may not be linked directly to one or other of the companies. (And although the crest - if that's the right word - is beautiful, I find the rest of the logo unbelievably ugly.)

[lady emily]

That font for the new logo is dreadful. 

[lady emily]

14 minutes ago, bridiem said:

So does 'The Royal Opera House' actually no longer exist? If so, I don't think I'm convinced by the thinking behind this. I find it very hard to believe that anyone even vaguely interested in such things doesn't know that the Royal Ballet performs at the ROH. And I can't think of any other of the world's great opera houses (at many of which ballet is also performed) where such clarification is deemed to be necessary. The Royal Opera House is a building (and a very famous and beautiful building), as well as an entity; a building in which two companies (and often other smaller companies) perform. It's more than just the two separate companies - it's the building in which they perform and all the people in it who make the performances possible but may not be linked directly to one or other of the companies. (And although the crest - if that's the right word - is beautiful, I find the rest of the logo unbelievably ugly.)

 

Completely agree. I don't think anyone was bothered by this before and I have no idea why they would put the time and energy into this when the majority of people will continue to refer to it as 'ROH'. 

[JNC]

I feel the press release and statements from Beard and O'Hare about the name change are a bit unclear to me. I'm not sure exactly what (and how) is changing? Is it the overarching company name, the building name, the structure of the company/companies, or a combination of all the above? 

 

Whilst I don't think the name change was necessary, I'm not opposed to it for the overarching company, it makes sense for Alex Beard for example to be CEO of the Royal Ballet and Opera. 

 

But regarding the name of the building itself, without 'house' it doesn't make sense. If I say 'I'm going to the Royal Ballet and Opera' (as opposed to going to see the Royal Ballet/Opera) it just sounds odd to me. It is an opera house! Like or not 'ballet house' just isn't a thing, historically ballets have been performed in opera houses. Surely the building is still going to be called ROH?

 

And I presume the part of the company that is still the 'Royal Ballet' will remain its own (sub) entity within the wider 'RBO' brand? Otherwise we have got rid of the Royal Ballet? 

 

Re the new logo I don't love it. The proportions seem odd to me - the old one was all 'within the lines' whereas the new one is a bit wider and so not as 'tidy' in space? My eye is drawn more to the '&' so it looks off-centre to me. 

 

The font feels like it's trying to be more 'trendy' than 'timeless' and too thick/bold to be in harmony with the text in the crest (the way the current one is). Reading what Kevin says I suppose that's deliberate though for the visual impact for it to be stronger with advertising. 

 

[bridiem]

I've just re-read the email from the ?ROH and I'm still not clear about it. They do still refer to the ROH as the building, but it sounds as if they're now calling the companies one name (the RBO) who both perform at the ROH. So, as @JNC asks above, does the RB no longer exist as a separate entity? Surely that can't be the case. Or do we have the RO, the RB, the ROH and the RBO, depending on context?

 

My head hurts.

[Rob S]

I hate that & already!!

[Rob S]

2 minutes ago, bridiem said:

I've just re-read the email from the ?ROH and I'm still not clear about it. They do still refer to the ROH as the building, but it sounds as if they're now calling the companies one name (the RBO) who both perform at the ROH. So, as @JNC asks above, does the RB no longer exist as a separate entity? Surely that can't be the case. Or do we have the RO, the RB, the ROH and the RBO, depending on context?

 

My head hurts.

 

I think I may have to snap up various Royal Ballet things from the shop on Friday!!

[Rob S]

And why does the R in Royal look different to the R in Opera?

[bridiem]

1 minute ago, Rob S said:

And why does the R in Royal look different to the R in Opera?

 

No doubt there's some fiendishly clever designer answer to this. 

[Lizbie1]

10 minutes ago, lady emily said:

That font for the new logo is dreadful. 

 

I don't love it but it looks familiar, maybe I've seen similar on a poster from the 70s or something! They change it quite often, I'll doubt we'll have to put up with it for long.

 

I didn't think much of the current one when it arrived but I've got used to it.

[bangorballetboy]

Well, the first R is beside an O, so there's room for a flourish that can't be included if it's beside an A...

[JNC]

I'm surprised that they've bothered to do a big name change announcement, logo etc and yet the logos on the ROH webpage, twitter, social medias etc remain the same. Maybe it will be rolled out in time for the start of the 2024 season I guess. As @Rob S has noted I think I'll do a good browse of the shop during the Ashton programme to see if I want anything with the current logo on before it goes! 

 

I obviously wouldn't expect the web address to be changed for example, as that is more structural and you lose people if you have a whole new webpage (and not sure the booking systems could cope!), but I would have expected the new logos to be ready to be embedded into the webpages, and the twitter/instagram/facebook picture icons are very easy to swap. 

 

Maybe I'm just too familiar with the old logo but the letters seem too close to me on the new one. 

 

At the end of the day I don't really care too much about the logo, as much as I've got an opinion on it! I'll still call the building 'ROH'. What is more important to me is what they are programming, and the fact that the Royal Ballet remains a 'thing' in its own right (obviously as part of a wider 'Ballet & Opera' company, as was/is the case). 

[Paco]

Like most of you, I don't know what to think about this new brand and logo. It only reinforces my feeling that the institution as a global entity is currently crossing some turbulences and uncertainties. Some things here and there have changed during the last few years and the management is perhaps trying to find and show a new strategic direction.

 

I do not have statistics, but I've had the feeling during the last five years (except Covid) that ballet performances were more numerous than opera performances, and this was not the case before. But perhaps I am wrong.

I also got the impression that ballet was selling out easier and faster than operas (though I know that titles like Dante were difficult to sell), which was not the case many years ago, when most opera performances at the ROH were attracting crowds of fans.

 

Since five years approx, I've been observing an obvious decline in the attractiveness of Royal Opera programming (I mean the operas seasons): average-level of casts (partly because of too many blacklisted stars), chiefly compared to Paris, Vienna, Munich, Milano and even some mid-size cities elsewhere in Europe.

Even the repertoire of Royal Opera has become "cash-machine"-like. In French we say "plan-plan". Only blockbusters, that they even do not manage to sell out because of the above average- only fair casts. Compared to the rich -and sometimes risky- repertoire of 10 ot 20 years ago, the decline is obvious.

 

In the meanwhile, the Royal Ballet has just been on the exactly opposite trend: fabulous, stellar Principals and soloists, glorious, shining, sustained by what is today probably the best ever corps de ballet in the World. Budget wise there have been obviously huge investments in productions like Swan Lake, Cinderella and the new full-length like Winter's tale, Alice, Woolf Works or Dante. So ballet has been apparently a strategic priority of the whole institution.

 

As a result, when I look at my French, Belgian, Italian, Dutch and German friends, I see more and more of them crossing the channel at huge, expensive prices, to attend several Royal Ballet performances every year, while the fans that once used to be faithful to the Royal Opera now do not have it in their radar anymore.

 

So, for me putting Royal Ballet & Opera instead of Royal Opera & Ballet makes sense, as it does reflect the current trend of the institution: the Ballet is really shining and acknowledged as a World-class leader, while Opera is in the shade.

 

It remains true when I look into next season: I agree that the total absence of classical ballet is a very disappointing (and worrying) point for the Royal Ballet program next year, but OMG when I look at the opera part of the program it looks even more disappointing. Just reaching the level of an average, provincial theatre in any European town, but absolutely not the level that one would expect from the Royal Opera.

 

So I don't know where they are going. I do hope that 2024/2025 is a transition season for the Royal Ballet and that it will later resume with its classical DNA. I have less hope for the opera side, also because I am afraid that the current artistic director does not have the same visionary skills that Ms Padmore or Mr Holten had.

Edited April 30 by Paco

[Lizbie1]

I've often thought that when ACE spending allocations are announced the ROH gets a harder time than it should because the very conspicuous headline figure covers three entities (the theatre, the ballet company and the opera company). Perhaps one of the motives for the rebranding is making this a bit clearer.

[Richard LH]

It has been made clear that there is no change to the name of the building itself.  

The Royal Ballet and the Royal Opera remain separate parts of the umbrella organisation that used to be described as "Royal Opera House" but is now to be "Royal Ballet and Opera".

We wilI still be going to the Royal Opera House to watch the Royal Ballet (or the Royal Opera). 

I don't see the change as objectionable, rather I think it can  be welcomed.

The latest magazine I received today  includes  a Friends letter that explains that the changes to logos on publications etc. will be rolled out over the next few months, to be "as sustainable and financially responsible as possible".

[MJW]

I think referring to both opera and ballet as one company makes perfect sense though in practice everyone will still refer to the Royal Ballet.

 

The logo however is hideous - not sure what’s wrong with the existing typeface which is quite elegant. The new one looks as though it was chosen from the selection available in MS Word!

[bridiem]

5 minutes ago, Richard LH said:

It has been made clear that there is no change to the name of the building itself.  

The Royal Ballet and the Royal Opera remain separate parts of the umbrella organisation that used to be described as "Royal Opera House" but is now to be "Royal Ballet and Opera".

We wilI still be going to the Royal Opera House to watch the Royal Ballet (or the Royal Opera). 

I don't see the change as objectionable, rather I think it can  be welcomed.

The latest magazine I received today  includes  a Friends letter that explains that the changes to logos on publications etc. will be rolled out over the next few months, to be "as sustainable and financially responsible as possible".

 

Thank you, @Richard LH - I haven't received my magazine or letter yet but that's a relief. In that case I don't see the change as objectionable either, since it makes no difference in practice. However I'm a bit surprised that the ROH found it necessary to spend time and money on this particular change right now, unless they see some financial advantage to it. Perhaps they do.

[FionaM]

I think this is a very important step and maybe other opera houses of the world will follow.  
 

It raises awareness of the importance of ballet as an equal partner at any ‘opera house’.  Perhaps the name ROYAL OPERA HOUSE will be dropped at some stage.  I feel it should be dropped soon, as it does not reflect the performances on show in this building.  
 

Imagine if it had been the other way around, ie. Known for centuries as the ROYAL BALLET HOUSE.  How would the opera feel?  
 

 Some other opera houses also host classical music concerts, so they have a three way problem in their name. 

Edited April 30 by FionaM
Typo

[zxDaveM]

3 hours ago, FionaM said:

 

It raises awareness of the importance of ballet as an equal partner at any ‘opera house’. 

 

I wouldn't say it was an equal partner - if you look at metrics such as ticket prices, number of productions (I've not counted up the individual performances, though I dare say the 25-30 performances of some ballets will even things up a good deal). I always get the impression (just a persoanl one, I have to add) that the powers that be in 'classical' music regard ballet as the poor cousin to opera

[Fonty]

RBO?  My first thought was Royal Body Odour.  I wonder how much money was paid to some organisation to come up with that.  No doubt the seat prices will have to go up again to cover the costs. 

 

 

[FionaM]

25 minutes ago, zxDaveM said:

 

I wouldn't say it was an equal partner - if you look at metrics such as ticket prices, number of productions (I've not counted up the individual performances, though I dare say the 25-30 performances of some ballets will even things up a good deal). I always get the impression (just a persoanl one, I have to add) that the powers that be in 'classical' music regard ballet as the poor cousin to opera

agree.   Which is why this change is significant.  It positions ballet as an equal partner in many minds … from casual visitors to arts council.
 

Maybe the building will become known as ‘The House of the Royal Ballet & Opera’.

 

Or RBOH.   

[San Perregrino]

9 hours ago, zxDaveM said:

 

I wouldn't say it was an equal partner - if you look at metrics such as ticket prices, number of productions (I've not counted up the individual performances, though I dare say the 25-30 performances of some ballets will even things up a good deal). I always get the impression (just a persoanl one, I have to add) that the powers that be in 'classical' music regard ballet as the poor cousin to opera

 

9 hours ago, FionaM said:

agree.   Which is why this change is significant.  It positions ballet as an equal partner in many minds … from casual visitors to arts council.
 

Maybe the building will become known as ‘The House of the Royal Ballet & Opera’.

 

Or RBOH.   

I suspect that ballet has been bringing in more money and/or audiences than opera in recent times and may continue to do so going forwards. Giving greater prominence to the importance of ballet in the partnership has to be a good thing.

[MAB]

1 minute ago, San Perregrino said:

I suspect that ballet has been bringing in more money and/or audiences than opera in recent times

 

If the ROH still publishes its annual accounts that should be easy to find out.

[Lizbie1]

22 minutes ago, MAB said:

 

If the ROH still publishes its annual accounts that should be easy to find out.

 

As a registered charity they have to but IIRC they don't shed any light on this. (I've often thought it strange how little clarity charities have to provide compared to PLCs.)

[bridiem]

The Standard article about this (in today's Links) includes a photo of Oliver Mears and Kevin O'Hare. I don't know when it was taken but I have to say that KOH looks utterly miserable. I hope that's just the 'I'm a serious artist so I can't look happy' image that so many 'creatives' feel they have to project nowadays (though KOH is usually very smiley, in fact), rather than a reflection of his real feelings. Either way it's a strange choice of photo for what is supposed to be a good news article.

[Mary]

I think it's meant to look 'contemporary', 'edgy' or whatever......with the bit of old board in the background. We wouldn't want anything pretty!

 

Rather funny.

 

 

[jmhopton]

17 hours ago, Paco said:

Like most of you, I don't know what to think about this new brand and logo. It only reinforces my feeling that the institution as a global entity is currently crossing some turbulences and uncertainties. Some things here and there have changed during the last few years and the management is perhaps trying to find and show a new strategic direction.

 

I do not have statistics, but I've had the feeling during the last five years (except Covid) that ballet performances were more numerous than opera performances, and this was not the case before. But perhaps I am wrong.

I also got the impression that ballet was selling out easier and faster than operas (though I know that titles like Dante were difficult to sell), which was not the case many years ago, when most opera performances at the ROH were attracting crowds of fans.

 

Since five years approx, I've been observing an obvious decline in the attractiveness of Royal Opera programming (I mean the operas seasons): average-level of casts (partly because of too many blacklisted stars), chiefly compared to Paris, Vienna, Munich, Milano and even some mid-size cities elsewhere in Europe.

Even the repertoire of Royal Opera has become "cash-machine"-like. In French we say "plan-plan". Only blockbusters, that they even do not manage to sell out because of the above average- only fair casts. Compared to the rich -and sometimes risky- repertoire of 10 ot 20 years ago, the decline is obvious.

 

In the meanwhile, the Royal Ballet has just been on the exactly opposite trend: fabulous, stellar Principals and soloists, glorious, shining, sustained by what is today probably the best ever corps de ballet in the World. Budget wise there have been obviously huge investments in productions like Swan Lake, Cinderella and the new full-length like Winter's tale, Alice, Woolf Works or Dante. So ballet has been apparently a strategic priority of the whole institution.

 

As a result, when I look at my French, Belgian, Italian, Dutch and German friends, I see more and more of them crossing the channel at huge, expensive prices, to attend several Royal Ballet performances every year, while the fans that once used to be faithful to the Royal Opera now do not have it in their radar anymore.

 

So, for me putting Royal Ballet & Opera instead of Royal Opera & Ballet makes sense, as it does reflect the current trend of the institution: the Ballet is really shining and acknowledged as a World-class leader, while Opera is in the shade.

 

It remains true when I look into next season: I agree that the total absence of classical ballet is a very disappointing (and worrying) point for the Royal Ballet program next year, but OMG when I look at the opera part of the program it looks even more disappointing. Just reaching the level of an average, provincial theatre in any European town, but absolutely not the level that one would expect from the Royal Opera.

 

So I don't know where they are going. I do hope that 2024/2025 is a transition season for the Royal Ballet and that it will later resume with its classical DNA. I have less hope for the opera side, also because I am afraid that the current artistic director does not have the same visionary skills that Ms Padmore or Mr Holten had.

 

 

Thank you for this, Paco. I found it very interesting. Knowing nothing about opera or it's rep I just assumed from this season's evidence that the Opera's 17 (?) productions as opposed to the ballet's 8 (?) meant the opera were producing a much more diverse programme than the ballet; but apparently not. It's very heartening that our European ballet enthusiasts are coming over here to see the RB wonderful rep. and principals (though it must be a huge expense for them given the cost of London accommodation alone). Will be interesting to see if they continue to come for this years rather lacklustre offerings.

 

Re the name change I'm with others who much prefer the original typeface as being far more elegant and in keeping with the nature of the building. Having been on the ROH YouTube channel I see they are still maintaining the hashtag #ROH at least for now. I think it will be a long time (if ever) that I stop referring to the building as a whole as ROH. Still, it's good that ballet is now getting a mention in the corporate 'brand'.

 

 

[zxDaveM]

That new font is a bit chunky, isn't it!

At least they didn't use comic sans or papyrus... lol