Poor old ROH

[penelopesimpson]

This seems a significantly different tack to the one you took when Osipova was unable to perform, Penelope.

I don't really think so.  I think I voiced wonder that she was unable to dance throughout the autumn season for the RB, but was available to fulfil guest appearances.  I can understand the thinking behind it, but that doesn't necessarily preclude me thinking its a bit off!

[penelopesimpson]

Yes, when I met him I was 'up' from Sussex and so didn't have to face Victoria coach hell station. I had his first c.d. with me and went round to the stage door before the performance just in case. This was the first time I had been to the stage door for years and I remember the guy on the desk was really friendly. He was very helpful too, as I asked if he knew if Mr Kaufmann was on the premises and he replied that Mr Kaufmann was indeed present and was standing right behind me, having just come through the inner door while I was asking.  What excellent timing! Mr Kaufmann didn't seem to mind being stopped for some chitchat - which was interesting for me as I asked him where he thought was the best place to sit at the ROH for opera. He signed my c.d. cover and mis-pelled my name and wrote 'sorry' with an arrow pointing to the error.It was all very lighthearted and exciting for me, as it was also my first trip to the ROH for many years.  He could have signed it blahblahblah if he liked, I was totally awed and babbling like a starstruck eejit. I will treasure that c.d. forever, spelling mistake and all. Really nice guy and wonderful voice.

 

Yes, when I met him I was 'up' from Sussex and so didn't have to face Victoria coach hell station. I had his first c.d. with me and went round to the stage door before the performance just in case. This was the first time I had been to the stage door for years and I remember the guy on the desk was really friendly. He was very helpful too, as I asked if he knew if Mr Kaufmann was on the premises and he replied that Mr Kaufmann was indeed present and was standing right behind me, having just come through the inner door while I was asking.  What excellent timing! Mr Kaufmann didn't seem to mind being stopped for some chitchat - which was interesting for me as I asked him where he thought was the best place to sit at the ROH for opera. He signed my c.d. cover and mis-pelled my name and wrote 'sorry' with an arrow pointing to the error.It was all very lighthearted and exciting for me, as it was also my first trip to the ROH for many years.  He could have signed it blahblahblah if he liked, I was totally awed and babbling like a starstruck eejit. I will treasure that c.d. forever, spelling mistake and all. Really nice guy and wonderful voice.

What a lovely story.  Lucky you.  I can't help it but I am really disappointed about tomorrow.  I blew a big slice of my ROH budget on the ticket and it was a big thing for me.

[Lenore]

I don't think it was at short notice, was it? Was this the one resulting from the concussion she sustained in Tetractys? If so, I thought the ROH did give a reasonable amount of notice, but since I don't think I'd actually booked for her I can't be sure.

 

Actually, now I think about it some more, I think the ROH may have been late in announcing *who* it was who would be replacing her, but not the fact that Osipova wouldn't be dancing?

If I remember rightly this wasn't the concussion - I believe it was a soft tissue injury? O'Hare announced it in person just before the performance, and the cast change was announced on their website for her following performances. So it was really only the first night where there hadn't been anything announced beforehand.

[ENBlover]

http://www.roh.org.uk/news/cast-change-olivia-cowley-to-dance-in-tetractys-the-art-of-fugue-on-11-february

[FLOSS]

What we all need to remember is that the contract with the ROH is that there will be a performance of the ballet or opera concerned not that Mr X Miss Y will perform in it.As long as there is a performance the company has fulfilled its contractual obligation.The only time that you are entitled to get your money back is when the contract with the theatre is frustrated because it does not provide a performance of the work concerned.The ROH is under no obligation to compensate anyone as long as it provides a performance.

 

It might be nice to think that the company would exercise its discretion and make a refund representing the individual ticket holder's contribution towards the difference in fees that it would have paid the star and what it has in fact paid for the performance in question. The argument against that is that the company does not charge us extra when a last minute substitute is a performer who commands much higher fees than the artist being replaced.

 

It can be very disappointing when the dancers or singers you have booked for don't appear as a result of injury or illness but it is the risk we run when we book for live theatrical performances. If a performer takes advantage of management by providing evidence of illness and then performs elsewhere management can terminate its contract with the performer concerned or not book them again. There is at present an eminent Verdian soprano who never seems to get beyond the press night and perhaps a second performance before she is obliged to withdraw.I would be very happy if the opera company stopped booking her or at least advertised all performance after the second performance TBC.

 

As far as I am aware Mr Kauffman is not known for last minute cancellations unlike Pavarotti who was notorious for cancelling at Covent Garden.But as the late Ann Ridley said loudly at a group of occasional opera goers who were complaining about Pavarotti's non appearance in Tosca "At least tonight we shall be able to listen to the opera."

 

As far as I can see one of the reasons that O'Hare appeared on stage at the performance after Osipova's injury in the MacGregor ballet was because the company was not able to provide a performance of all three ballets. The audience was given the choice of leaving there and then and receiving a full refund or watching the two ballets and receiving a partial refund.If there had been a substitute dancer available and the company had been able to perform all three works in the programme the question of a refund would not have been raised.There are now notices on the desk in the box office referring ticket holders to the terms and conditions set out on the tickets which make it clear that the management reserves the right to make cast changes.That means you have no right to compensation if they do change the cast.

Edited November 13, 2015 by FLOSS

[capybara]

When Alina Cojocaru was injured early in a performance of Manon some years ago, there was a long 'interval' during which Monica Mason was calling up Jamie Tapper. At the point that the replacement was announced, audience members were given the opportunity, if they so wished, to leave there and then and give both their tickets and their names to the Front of House Staff on their way out. Those making that choice were to be compensated (I don't know the details), one of the issues being that Manon would not therefore conclude until an hour or so later than anticipated. Those electing to stay and watch the show were regarded as having no basis for subsequent complaint.

 

I have mentioned on here before the need to convince nearby ticket-holders to stay when it was announced that Darcey Bussell and Zoltan Solymosi were to be replaced in Manon by Viviana Durante and Irek Mukhamedov. I think that that substitution helped many people to appreciate that Darcey was not the only (or necessarily the best) show in town!

[Fonty]

I know they used to put premium prices on Fonteyn and Nureyev performances abroad, but did they do this at ROH as well for their tickets?

 

I think it is fair that if I have paid extra to see a particular star, and that star is indisposed, then I should get a refund on the difference between the price of a ticket for their performance and the price of the person I am actually going to see.  People are bitterly disappointed not to see Osipova, but the price to see her is the same as any other Principal, isn't it? 

 

Edited to add that I have never actually checked whether prices for certain dancers are more expensive, but I've always assumed they are the same!

Edited November 13, 2015 by Fonty

[A frog]

I know they used to put premium prices on Fonteyn and Nureyev performances abroad, but did they do this at ROH as well for their tickets?

!

If I remember the Royal Ballet 75 Years book correctly, it was indeed the case.

 

FLOSS if the soprano you're alluding to is the one I'm thinking of (I understand she still somewhat reliably performs in Munich and Vienna), Holten has somewhat publicly said she would no longer be booked at Covent Garden.

[John Mallinson]

Ticket prices for the ballet at the ROH vary from production to production but not from cast to cast.

 

Relevant points on the conditions of sale are:

 

1. Refunds cannot be given unless a performance has been cancelled.

 

2. The Royal Opera House reserves the right to to make alterations in the published programme without prior notice.

[Fonty]

Ticket prices for the ballet at the ROH vary from production to production but not from cast to cast.

 

Relevant points on the conditions of sale are:

 

1. Refunds cannot be given unless a performance has been cancelled.

 

2. The Royal Opera House reserves the right to to make alterations in the published programme without prior notice.

 

Thanks, John.

 

As a matter of interest, have any ballet stars other than Fonteyn and Nureyev ever commanded higher prices?

[Melody]

I think people would have more of a right to a refund if the cancelled performances by these international superstars cost significantly more than performances by regular company members. But if it's just a matter of being unlucky with the dates on account of injury or industrial action and the tickets cost the same as for the other performances, then the situation regarding refunds and whatnot should be the same as for those other performances.

 

If we have a situation where a superstar is booked and then pulls out for avoidable reasons, that's largely between the performer and the organisation. Presumably if that happens on a regular basis, as I think it did with certain high-powered opera singers in the past, the company might want to consider whether the resulting ill will from disappointed audiences is worth the risk when making casting decisions in the future.

Edited November 13, 2015 by Melody

[Fonty]

Does this sort of thing happen quite regularly in the opera world? 

 

I think I remember a few years ago, that a whole run of a new production of an opera was cancelled because the star was unwell, and unable to appear?  Not their fault, of course, but I remember thinking at the time that surely it would be better to get a substitute, even if they lost some money, rather than cancel the whole lot. 

[FLOSS]

Yes "A frog",it is that lady. I thought that it took the opera company rather a long time to work out what was happening and take action.

[penelopesimpson]

When Alina Cojocaru was injured early in a performance of Manon some years ago, there was a long 'interval' during which Monica Mason was calling up Jamie Tapper. At the point that the replacement was announced, audience members were given the opportunity, if they so wished, to leave there and then and give both their tickets and their names to the Front of House Staff on their way out. Those making that choice were to be compensated (I don't know the details), one of the issues being that Manon would not therefore conclude until an hour or so later than anticipated. Those electing to stay and watch the show were regarded as having no basis for subsequent complaint.

 

I have mentioned on here before the need to convince nearby ticket-holders to stay when it was announced that Darcey Bussell and Zoltan Solymosi were to be replaced in Manon by Viviana Durante and Irek Mukhamedov. I think that that substitution helped many people to appreciate that Darcey was not the only (or necessarily the best) show in town!

Oh my goodness.  What a substitution!  I always far preferred Viviana to Darcey and her Mayerling with Irek was superb..  Does anyone know why she left?

[penelopesimpson]

Despite being disappointed I'm not one of those calling for a refund.  You have to accept that this sort of thing can happen and then just suck it up.  However, having just taken at look at the ROH bookings online, it seems I may be in a minority.  The two Kaufmann appearances sold out on the day.  Now there are a lot of seats available for tomorrow and 100+ for Monday.  Box office must be having a terrible time.

[Lenore]

Meant to edit my post but completely forgot. O'Hare announced the cast change pre performance for Sleeping Beauty (because of a soft tissue injury to Natalias back after a fall during rehearsals - been doing some googling). Not sure if it was clear in the way I answered. Apologies.

 

Out of interest, are ballet tickets priced similarly around the world as they are at the ROH? Or do other companies charge more for particular, higher profile dancers? I've just always taken it for granted that prices are the same no matter who is dancing.

[Coated]

They only offer the regular exchange/resale policy

The regular exchange policy requires a ticket return 3 days prior to the performance, Kaufmann ticket holders were able to exchange with less notice

[alison]

They would presumably only have been able to exchange - for what, I wonder?  To just put things back on re-sale, with such large numbers, would have been accepting that your ticket wouldn't get re-sold and you would lose out.

 

If it wasn't Carmen, I might be tempted to hoover up a cheap ticket myself.

[Scheherezade]

..... Kaufmann is off so we're talking about Osipova again.  If Pappano were to resign tomorrow would we also talk about Osipova and Bolshoi?

 

If Pappano were to resign tomorrow I, for one, would hope that we would be talking about the wonderful Semyon Bychkov!

 

Of course I am disappointed about Kauffman because I would like to hear him sing just once before I die(!)

As for Jonas Kaufmann, I was lucky enough to see him at the ROH in Tosca.

 

Me too. The 'dream team' of Kaufmann, Gheorghiu and Terfel. And again with Gheorghiu in Andrea Lecouvreur and Don Carlo with Harteros. Like Sim, I was also at the Winterreise recital and I saw him in Carmen some years ago with the fabulousAnna Caterina Antonacci. It's an odd thing with Kaufmann, he isn't the best tenor ever (Bjorling, Wunderlich, Gigli anyone?) or even, to my mind, the best tenor right now but he is, without doubt, the most consummate performer. What's more, he seldom cancels so I'm sure you will hear him before you die, Penelope.

[Scheherezade]

There is at present an eminent Verdian soprano who never seems to get beyond the press night and perhaps a second performance before she is obliged to withdraw.

 

FLOSS if the soprano you're alluding to is the one I'm thinking of (I understand she still somewhat reliably performs in Munich and Vienna), Holten has somewhat publicly said she would no longer be booked at Covent Garden.

 

 

I am assuming that her last two, somewhat truncated, engagements at the ROH were in Otello and Don Carlo, both of which I was lucky enough to catch. The problem is, of course, that she is rather superb! And Gheorghiu's form on the cancellation front, at least until recent runs, was every bit as bad, if not worse, without the excuse of an ailing spouse.

[Naomi M]

 

Out of interest, are ballet tickets priced similarly around the world as they are at the ROH? Or do other companies charge more for particular, higher profile dancers? I've just always taken it for granted that prices are the same no matter who is dancing. 

 

At ABT, they do charge different prices per casting and date of the week, Osipova performances are always expensive. And now they apply dynamic pricing, which is based on how well the tickets are selling. So if Osipova cancels there is a similar groaning heard (I am not sure about how they refund this, someone in NY could explain)

 

In Japan, for instance at K-Ballet Company Tetsuya Kumakawa performances are much expensive than the other male leads. So if he cancels you can get refunds. Also usually the price is different when you have a guest artist. 

[Jan McNulty]

Thanks Naomi

[Jacqueline]

If Pappano were to resign tomorrow I, for one, would hope that we would be talking about the wonderful Semyon Bychkov!

 

 

Me too. The 'dream team' of Kaufmann, Gheorghiu and Terfel. And again with Gheorghiu in Andrea Lecouvreur and Don Carlo with Harteros. Like Sim, I was also at the Winterreise recital and I saw him in Carmen some years ago with the fabulousAnna Caterina Antonacci. It's an odd thing with Kaufmann, he isn't the best tenor ever (Bjorling, Wunderlich, Gigli anyone?) or even, to my mind, the best tenor right now but he is, without doubt, the most consummate performer. What's more, he seldom cancels so I'm sure you will hear him before you die, Penelope.

I saw Kaufmann, Michaela Carosi and Paolo Gavanelli (hope that is correct spelling). The first and third were fantastic. I have already said I am a fan of Mr Kaufmann. Paolo Gavanelli was terrific as Scarpia, full of menace and unpleasantness but beautiful voice, as it were . Miss Carosi was not really Tosca to my eyes. I am not hugely into opera and not qualified to comment on her voice, but she did not convince me that she was in love with Cavaradossi or of any other aspect of Tosca's character. She and Kaufmann appeared to have little or no chemistry. I recall reviews that her voice was fine but she is of the 'big gesture' school, which rather outdid the more subtle approach of Kaufmann and Gavanelli. I saw this amusingly referred to as the 'traffic direction' style. 

Because I got a late return ticket, I found myself sitting in the front row of the stalls. This was great at first, as it was so close to the action and felt like you were up on stage with them. However it didn't work for the final act where the action is elevated. When Tosca threw herself off the roof, it was something of an anti-climax as I couldn't see her from where I was sitting. I have heard stories about various Toscas jumping and landing on whatever is put there to soften the fall, only to bounce back and reappear to the audience. I have also heard this about Odette jumping into the lake at the end of Swan Lake and then reappearing, so I don't know if it is just a myth. Must be quite funny to see,if it has happened.

I watched Antonio Pappano's programme about Tenors last night, which was interesting given some of the comments here. He was conducting the orchestra for the Tosca I saw and I was sitting quite near him. I noticed because one could not help notice, that he made a lot of noise with his mouth while he was conducting. It sounded exactly like the noise Hannibal Lector made as played by Anthony Hopkins, when talking about the Chianti and fava beans. I am sure I didn't imagine this as it was quite distracting. Perhaps conductors generally make a noise or is it just him? I have never been aware of it before.

[Timmie]

Interesting comment on the conductor noises. I was in the ROH front row orchestra stalls recently, just a few seats away from the conductor, and he was singing along with the music at times – after some initial surprise I found it quite endearing.

[capybara]

Interesting comment on the conductor noises. I was in the ROH front row orchestra stalls recently, just a few seats away from the conductor, and he was singing along with the music at times – after some initial surprise I found it quite endearing.

 

I'm afraid I don't find a certain conductor's 'singing' endearing. It isn't even in tune and is unacceptably loud.

[annamicro]

Not just strike in La Scala: now it's possible Osipova will cancel because she doesn't want to dance with Coviello and asks to dance with Polunin.

I would not be happy to dance with Civiello too (I found him very promising a couple of years ago, but I don't fnd him interesting anymore: he was quite bad in the gala as Des Grieux and his "emptiness" was really depressing when he danced  Albrecht with Eichwald, my last two views of him), but I hope it's not a "Polunin or nothing" thing (even if I agree with Osipova and Sergei would be my foirst choice ).

 

http://milano.repubblica.it/cronaca/2015/11/14/news/polemiche_e_proteste_dopo_la_cancellazione_di_manon_ma_la_cgil_esulta_sciopero_riuscito-127303732/

[Fonty]

Is Osipova saying that she wants the theatre to pay for Polunin to come as a guest artist as well?

 

I am wondering how much power a guest artist would have in asking for these things.

[Beryl H]

They would presumably only have been able to exchange - for what, I wonder?  To just put things back on re-sale, with such large numbers, would have been accepting that your ticket wouldn't get re-sold and you would lose out.

 

If it wasn't Carmen, I might be tempted to hoover up a cheap ticket myself.

 

Glad to hear the ROH have let people swap within a short time, that explains why there are so many returns available, they probably could swap for anything, ballet even, and make a decision later, Box Office must be pretty busy!

[penelopesimpson]

They are not offering tickets any cheaper.  I rang this morning and decided to upgrade my ticket as there are now much better seats available and I had to pay full wack.  And that is fine - it would be terrible if they started handing out cheap stuff to people who were wavering.  The young man I spoke to said they had been inundated but he still had a good sense of humour and handled everything brilliantly.  Well done, ROH.

[MAB]

If Pappano were to resign tomorrow I, for one, would hope that we would be talking about the wonderful Semyon Bychkov!

 

 

Me too. The 'dream team' of Kaufmann, Gheorghiu and Terfel. And again with Gheorghiu in Andrea Lecouvreur and Don Carlo with Harteros. Like Sim, I was also at the Winterreise recital and I saw him in Carmen some years ago with the fabulousAnna Caterina Antonacci. It's an odd thing with Kaufmann, he isn't the best tenor ever (Bjorling, Wunderlich, Gigli anyone?) or even, to my mind, the best tenor right now but he is, without doubt, the most consummate performer. What's more, he seldom cancels so I'm sure you will hear him before you die, Penelope.

 

I'm on my knees praying for Bychkov to take over when Pappano goes!

 

The fascination with Kaufmann puzzles me, far too baritonal for me and most other older opera fans.  Saw him recently in Andrea Chenier and thought him totally miscast, perhaps he would be better in helden tenor roles.

[MAB]

I am assuming that her last two, somewhat truncated, engagements at the ROH were in Otello and Don Carlo, both of which I was lucky enough to catch. The problem is, of course, that she is rather superb! And Gheorghiu's form on the cancellation front, at least until recent runs, was every bit as bad, if not worse, without the excuse of an ailing spouse.

 

As it is Harteros that has an ailing husband, I imagine that's who we're alluding to.  I already regard Holten as a t***er for the appalling  productions he oversees, but damn him to hell for such an uncharitable attitude towards a soprano of the calibre of Harteros.

[Douglas Allen]

All kind of events can conspire to cause cast changes - injuries / illness / traffic conditions / pregnancy and so on. It's called life. When we book tickets we always have to assume that changes may occur. For years I tried to see Beriosova dance Lady and the Fool. I booked to see her in an improbable range of theatres around the country and in more theatres in London than presently exist. For years I would turn up only to be met with an announcement "We regret....." I saw Vyvyanne Lorrayne and Barry McGrath more times than could be good for my health. Then, sometime in the 1980s I had booked to see a performance in Sunderland (I can't remember who was dancing) and there was an announcement that the dancer was indisposed and the performance would now be danced by Beriosova and MacLeary. My ghasted was totally flabbered.(She was marvellous, by the way.)

 

In a slightly different way, I rarely booked for Monica Mason Swan Lakes because she was rarely off and was  the go-to dancer if anyone else was injured. So I always booked for Sibley performances and in about 60% of the cases got Mason. It's a fact of life and not worth losing sleep over.

 

Incidentally, a question was raised about differential pricing for Fonteyn/Nureyev performances. Initially, the increased prices were for Fonteyn performances and were applied when she was moved from being a company member to being a guest artist (I believe it was done without her knowledge or agreement). Thus, when Nureyev came on the scene in the 1960s these prices applied to his performances when he danced with Fonteyn. They didn't apply when he danced with people other than Fonteyn. It wasn't, I think, until the very late 60s or early 70s that Nureyev performances without Fonteyn attracted increased prices. Even then, at first these higher prices only applied if he were dancing in a full-length ballet. When, for instance, he was in Dances At A Gathering or other one-acters, normal company prices applied.

 

Someone wondered if money was refunded in the event of cast change. I don't know, as it is important to remind ourselves that as well as being a great dancer, Fonteyn had the constitution of a shire horse. I never encountered a cancellation from her. The only ones I can think of are due to her illness in the 1940s at the time of Cinderella and in the immediate aftermath of Arias' shooting. She never withdrew from any

scheduled performance I was due to see. Did anyone on this forum have her withdraw from a performance?

[jm365]

No, I don't remember ever going to a Fonteyn performance and finding she was not dancing.  But does any other vintage ballet.coer remember the running gag of some of the early Bolshoi performances when the pre-perofrmance announcement nearly always said such and such a role 'will be danced by Kokhlov' - he must have been the perfect sub.  One never knew if the absent dancer had been taken out for reasons of injury etc. or just at the whim of the touring management.