capybara Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 4 minutes ago, FionaM said: I did like to see Aud Jebsen recognised for all she does to support ballet. Frankly without her money (sponsorship or donation might be more elegant words but let’s be real here), a lot of ballet organisations in the UK would be floundering much worse than they are. This effort rather lost meaning with the awards all being given in a rushed and perfunctory way. She should be recognised in a specialist one-off way IMO Couldn’t agree more about Aud Jebsen. A National Dance Award or some other more prestigious recognition seems long overdue. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSR101 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 There were definitely people who left half way through in the stalls - presumably got their picture for social media and taste of some ballet and then off somewhere else. 43 minutes ago, FionaM said: I agree they were pretentious. As though they had to offer them in order to secure those dancers attending ??? (Bolle, Lacarra, Bernal, Abbagnato, Osipova, I can’t remember who else). To be honest, I thought that they looked surprised to be called out to come and get them - Bolle and Osipova particularly. 1 hour ago, capybara said: Giorgi Potskhishvili led me to expect to see something quite extraordinary from him not the ragged ‘tricks for tricks sake’ he produced alongside a seriously under-powered Osipova (despite her obviously new shoes!). I am not sure I would have described Osipova as underpowered, more ragged and lacking in her normal precision. It was all rather wild end of gala fare. Potskhishvili - I think slightly unfair to say tricks for tricks sake. The particular element is all about tricks and it is a gala! I am not sure what he would be like in a more nuanced ballet when he was trying to tell a story. 50 minutes ago, FionaM said: I am wondering about awarding one to Graham Watts, who advises and writes for the gala. Well its a nice way to reward your friend and get them up on stage lol 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Perregrino Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 1 hour ago, FionaM said: She should be recognised in a specialist one-off way IMO An honorary Dame or knighthood perhaps 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Q Fan Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 4 hours ago, Missfrankiecat said: She is often at Covent Garden - I've seen her multiple times for one production. She is still a very pretty woman and obviously a huge ballet fan. I love the novels of Anthony Trollope and always visualise her as Lady Glencora from the Palliser series (who she played in the BBC adaptation). I met her at ROH once and said I liked her in The Pallisers too! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
art_enthusiast Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 1 hour ago, TSR101 said: There were definitely people who left half way through in the stalls - presumably got their picture for social media and taste of some ballet and then off somewhere else. I find it bizarre that people like this exist - you can see them at the ROH as well. They clearly have more money than sense. I hope they get didn't any kind of discount on their tickets. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Q Fan Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 I have to say I was surprised Bolle came but then when he got his award at the end I thought 'aha is that why he came?'. He was quite off with fans at stage door he just pushed past everyone to meet his friends and left not a wave or pose for a photo nothing. Rather disappointing from him as usually he's quite amiable with fans. All the other dancers were very obliging. If I had to pick out dancers I would have to say Osiel Gouneo is one of the most charming in my book, every time I have met him he is charm personified. Also his colleagues Antonio Casalinho and Julian Mackay. Must be something in the air at Munich maybe?! Sergio Bernal is lovely too, but really they all are and all are very appreciative of fans' comments/praise for their work. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Dancer Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 36 minutes ago, art_enthusiast said: I find it bizarre that people like this exist - you can see them at the ROH as well. They clearly have more money than sense. I hope they get didn't any kind of discount on their tickets. Yes me too. I mean you either go for love (either of the work or the people you're there with) or you're paid to be there. In either case it's really rude to leave halfway through. I left once at the interval (and it was a very bad play with bad actors) and I felt terrible about it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Dancer Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 (edited) 3 hours ago, capybara said: Good to glimpse emerging stars like Antonio Casalinho but the hype which preceded Giorgi Potskhishvili led me to expect to see something quite extraordinary from him not the ragged ‘tricks for tricks sake’ he produced alongside a seriously under-powered Osipova (despite her obviously new shoes!). Don Q has been on the Icons programme for as long as I can remember and this rendition was just about as bad as it gets. Yes I was surprised. I normally love the classic highlights like Don Q and Corsaire and they were my least memorable bits. I actually likes the Sergio Bernal and Roberto Bolle works better which was rare for me. I also definitely thought Nela and Vadim do Swan Lake much better. I think they've spoilt me for others. Is it me or is the RB choreography of that sequence more complex than last nights? I'm not an expert but I did wonder. Edited March 18 by Tango Dancer Autocorrect changing Vadims name to Basin 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 5 minutes ago, Tango Dancer said: Yes I was surprised. I normally love the classic highlights like Don Q and Corsaire and they were my least memorable bits. I actually likes the Sergio Bernal and Roberto Bolle works better which was rare for me. I also definitely thought Nela and Basin do Swan Lake much better. I think they've spoilt me for others. Is it me or is the RB choreography of that sequence more complex than last nights? I'm not an expert but I did wonder. Basin?? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Dancer Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 Sorry for Basin read Vadim - I hate autocorrect sometimes. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capybara Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 16 minutes ago, Don Q Fan said: I have to say I was surprised Bolle came but then when he got his award at the end I thought 'aha is that why he came?'. He was quite off with fans at stage door he just pushed past everyone to meet his friends and left not a wave or pose for a photo nothing. Rather disappointing from him as usually he's quite amiable with fans. All the other dancers were very obliging. If I had to pick out dancers I would have to say Osiel Gouneo is one of the most charming in my book, every time I have met him he is charm personified. Also his colleagues Antonio Casalinho and Julian Mackay. Must be something in the air at Munich maybe?! Sergio Bernal is lovely too, but really they all are and all are very appreciative of fans' comments/praise for their work. I think it would be unfortunate if we came to ‘judge’ dancers on one Stage Door appearance after an exceptionally long and heavy day but, on the other hand, the Icons Gala could be regarded as a ‘one off’ meriting special ‘after-care’. And what you describe does mirror what I’ve seen from some of those artists following their shows elsewhere - both positively and negatively. I was amazed that, after his “……and Friends” show in Florence in 2022, a shouting Bolle led the dash with his colleagues from the stage into a nearby building never to emerge to acknowledge the 100s of fans who nonetheless waited to salute him. In contrast and in more everyday circumstances, we (the fans) are extremely lucky to be treated with patience and courtesy by the majority of our favourite stars - and I am so grateful to them for that. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missfrankiecat Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 14 minutes ago, Tango Dancer said: Yes I was surprised. I normally love the classic highlights like Don Q and Corsaire and they were my least memorable bits. I actually likes the Sergio Bernal and Roberto Bolle works better which was rare for me. I also definitely thought Nela and Vadim do Swan Lake much better. I think they've spoilt me for others. Is it me or is the RB choreography of that sequence more complex than last nights? I'm not an expert but I did wonder. Skylar Brandt did not do the full fouetté sequence - she replaced part of the music with chaine turns. Misty Copeland gets roasted when she does that sort of thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 4 minutes ago, Tango Dancer said: Sorry for Basin read Vadim - I hate autocorrect sometimes. Would you like me to change it? I thought it was rather funny!! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missfrankiecat Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 11 minutes ago, Sim said: Basin?? I wasn't keen on his new hairdo either!! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2 minutes ago, Missfrankiecat said: I wasn't keen on his new hairdo either!! 😂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Dancer Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 4 minutes ago, Sim said: Would you like me to change it? I thought it was rather funny!! No it's fine, it doesn't matter. Glad it made you laugh. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linnzi5 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 44 minutes ago, Tango Dancer said: Sorry for Basin read Vadim - I hate autocorrect sometimes. 🤣🤣 I love autocorrect when it makes corrections like that! Basin??!! I could work out who you meant though. Almost as funny as the subtitles on YouTube that go alongside the RB Insights. They absolutely crack me up! 🤣 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Q Fan Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Missfrankiecat said: Skylar Brandt did not do the full fouetté sequence - she replaced part of the music with chaine turns. Misty Copeland gets roasted when she does that sort of thing. Yes but I felt it was because she lost her flow with the fouettes, saved herself from "falling out" of them so she did about 28 fouettes then made the rest up with the turns as you say. Fumin Kaneko also lost her flow in hers on the Grand Pas which was a pity, but it's no mean fear for even experienced dancers to do the fiendish full 32! We did get 35 off Goudanova I think it was though! (I include doubles and triples) My favourite move for difficulty is the Italian Fouette but none were in the choreography last night. Done right they are wonderful! Edited March 18 by Don Q Fan 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizbie1 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 1 hour ago, art_enthusiast said: I find it bizarre that people like this exist - you can see them at the ROH as well. They clearly have more money than sense. I hope they get didn't any kind of discount on their tickets. I've left a gala at the interval before, and a couple of other performances, not many. If it looks like it's going to overrun significantly - as I understand last night did - train anxiety kicks in; sometimes also you might not really be feeling it or you've had a long day, or tomorrow is a working day, etc. Of course I'm not paying anything like stalls prices, but if you're not enjoying something should that really make a difference? You're simply paying more to be unhappy! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fonty Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Well, I have learned a new word reading this - undercrackers. Never heard it before, I will have to work it into a conversation at some point. Susan Hampshire is embedded in my memory as Fleur in the Forsyte Saga, a fabulous series that I have seen about 4 times in total and loved every time. It will remain one of the great mysteries as to why people are plugged in to their mobile phones while watching a live performance. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missfrankiecat Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 10 minutes ago, Don Q Fan said: Yes but I felt it was because she lost her flow with the fouettes, saved herself from "falling out" of them so she did about 28 fouettes then made the rest up with the turns as you say. Fumin Kaneko also lost her flow in hers on the Grand Pas which was a pity, but it's no mean fear for even experienced dancers to do the fiendish full 32! We did get 35 off Goudanova I think it was though! (I include doubles and triples) My favourite move for difficulty is the Italian Fouette but none were in the choreography last night. Done right they are wonderful! I was too far away to see Brandt's face but she was travelling quite a bit from the outset on the fouettés and I thought from her head movement she had lost it quite early on - better, of course, to pull out into simple turns than fall and a lot of people aren't any the wiser. I didn't feel nearly as alarmed with Fumi - she wasn't quite 'on' the music but I didn't ever fear she was going to come a cropper. You are right - it's easy to forget how fiendishly difficult these moves are 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Dancer Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 13 minutes ago, Fonty said: It will remain one of the great mysteries as to why people are plugged in to their mobile phones while watching a live performance. I don't get it either but an awful lot of people last night didn't seem engaged and were busy whatsapping or otherwise engaged, which is weird to me for something as visual as ballet especially when you have people doing something like a coda or manege. In contrast i went to a piano recital in Leeds conservatoire on Friday and nobody moved an inch, used their phones or breathed loudly while the pianist was performing. I wish last nights ballet audience were as attentive. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linnzi5 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Fonty said: Well, I have learned a new word reading this - undercrackers. Never heard it before, I will have to work it into a conversation at some point. I have never heard of the work 'undercrackers' either. Love it! I definitely need to use that! 52 minutes ago, Fonty said: It will remain one of the great mysteries as to why people are plugged in to their mobile phones while watching a live performance. I cannot understand why. It makes no sense to me. Someone in my row on Friday night kept checking her phone - surely, nothing can be that important that you need to constantly check it? Edited March 18 by Linnzi5 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSR101 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 1 hour ago, Missfrankiecat said: I was too far away to see Brandt's face but she was travelling quite a bit from the outset on the fouettés and I thought from her head movement she had lost it quite early on - better, of course, to pull out into simple turns than fall and a lot of people aren't any the wiser. I didn't feel nearly as alarmed with Fumi - she wasn't quite 'on' the music but I didn't ever fear she was going to come a cropper. You are right - it's easy to forget how fiendishly difficult these moves are I had forgotten this, but she was travelling a lot. Almost half the stage. The orchestra was clearly calling to her. 2 hours ago, Missfrankiecat said: Misty Copeland gets roasted when she does that sort of thing. In a gala or in the actual ballet? Personally I would think unforgivable in Swan Lake. Edited March 18 by TSR101 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan McNulty Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Fouettes do not a whole performance make! OK in a gala it may be unfortunate if something goes wrong with a party piece but in something like Swan Lake or Don Q does substituting a different step or coming out early but gracefully does it matter? 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSR101 Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 12 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said: Fouettes do not a whole performance make! OK in a gala it may be unfortunate if something goes wrong with a party piece but in something like Swan Lake or Don Q does substituting a different step or coming out early but gracefully does it matter? Yes there are other important elements to the role - can you embody both Odette and Odile for a start - but it is so iconic, and in a proper performance where you've have been picked by your company and had proper preparation and coaching, then personally I'd say it does matter. If you can't do it, when the role demands it, then you are exposing a technical deficiency regardless of how good otherwise a dancer you are. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan McNulty Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 22 minutes ago, TSR101 said: Yes there are other important elements to the role - can you embody both Odette and Odile for a start - but it is so iconic, and in a proper performance where you've have been picked by your company and had proper preparation and coaching, then personally I'd say it does matter. If you can't do it, when the role demands it, then you are exposing a technical deficiency regardless of how good otherwise a dancer you are. I'm sorry but I think that is somewhat harsh. Anyone can have a bad day at the office. Fouettés do nothing for me during a full length performance and if a dancer substitutes a different step for whatever reason it absolutely doesn't bother me. As a Friend of various companies over the years I have seen dancers in class perform immaculate fouettés that subsequently they have struggled with during performance. I would rather a different step or a neat ending. 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missfrankiecat Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 39 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said: Fouettes do not a whole performance make! OK in a gala it may be unfortunate if something goes wrong with a party piece but in something like Swan Lake or Don Q does substituting a different step or coming out early but gracefully does it matter? I totally agree with your first sentence. A whole performance constitutes much more than simply performing the steps correctly. And everyone makes mistakes occasionally - part of a great dancer's judgment is knowing when to push and when it is necessary to adapt to mitigate a clearly visible mistake or fall. But ultimately ballet is a technical art and an ability to perform the steps as choreographed is the baseline of a principal dancer for me. So I can't go along with the theory that performing 32 fouettés isn't integral to dancing Odile, so that an interpretation which doesn't contain those steps is as valid as one which does. Of course, I'm talking about dancers who regularly substitute easier choreography in classics, not someone dealing with the odd 'bad day at the office'. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan McNulty Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 13 minutes ago, Missfrankiecat said: I totally agree with your first sentence. A whole performance constitutes much more than simply performing the steps correctly. And everyone makes mistakes occasionally - part of a great dancer's judgment is knowing when to push and when it is necessary to adapt to mitigate a clearly visible mistake or fall. But ultimately ballet is a technical art and an ability to perform the steps as choreographed is the baseline of a principal dancer for me. So I can't go along with the theory that performing 32 fouettés isn't integral to dancing Odile, so that an interpretation which doesn't contain those steps is as valid as one which does. Of course, I'm talking about dancers who regularly substitute easier choreography in classics, not someone dealing with the odd 'bad day at the office'. It really wouldn't bother me if I never saw another fouetté. I don't count them and I prefer (if they are done) to see singles rather than doubles. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scheherezade Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 22 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said: I prefer (if they are done) to see singles rather than doubles. I totally agree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaM Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 There were plenty of fouettés over the evening. - Fumi’s in Grand Pas Classique were ok, but not her usual proficiency and control - Skylar as Odile came out of hers into a few pique turns and a nice grand jete en tournant to end with a flourish - Margarita Fernandes (Esmeralda) were the best in terms of less travelling than others. She did start with a complicated sequence which turned into singles. - I don’t remember Evelina Godunova’s fouettés … I think they were simple but complete. Maybe someone else remembers? - Osipova’s in DQ were the ugliest things I’ve seen. She started to full off balance early on requiring a double plie (which doesn’t sound bad when you write it) and then decided to crash on through them in any old fashion. I admire her will power. It was a gymnastic act. No finesse, no ballet technique. in previous years there have been strong and memorable performances of fouettés from Nicolette Manni, Maia Makhateli, Iana Salenko., Marianela Nunez. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 I must say, the sort of audience behaviour referred to here is certainly very reminiscent of what I remember from the balcony last time I attended one of these Icons galas. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSR101 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-13209177/Strictlys-Nadiya-Bychkova-showcases-endless-legs-dazzling-white-mini-cosies-star-boyfriend-Kai-Widdrington-star-studded-ballet-gala.html I feel for many of my temporary cohabitators in the stalls this was really what the night was about! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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