La Fille Mal Gardée at Palais Garnier, Paris

[Missfrankiecat]

59 minutes ago, Amelie-DALP said:

Hello to the BalletCo forum!

A brief explanation about the absence of the pony: a pony was indeed planned! But the rehearsals didn't go well, he didn't like the stage at all. So it was decided, for animal welfare reasons, not to put him on stage... And there was no replacement available.

I wasn't able to see the duo Bleuenn Battistoni/Marcelino Sambé. But all the "balletomanes" whom I know were thrilled by this duo. 

Thank you @Amelie-DALP for clarifying the pony absence!  If he wasn't happy on stage it was completely the right decision.

[Emeralds]

^^thanks, @Sim,  that title looks clearer now that there are additional performances discussed 🙂 👍 

[Sophoife]

23 hours ago, Emeralds said:

For those who attended the performance/s of La Fille mal gardée this month, what was Marcelino Sambe described in his artist biography in the souvenir programme as - etoile or premier danseur? (The website doesn't have a description yet.)  If he's described as premier danseur, I can understand why an audience member might be confused and think he was eligible for promotion.

 

On the Opera de Paris Twitter feed, they describe him simply as "the dancer"

 

 

[Estreiiita]

I happened to see "La fille mal gardee" in Opera Garnier  on the 27th of March. It was the first time I watched this ballet live and I liked it enormously. 

  Clara Mousseigne danced Lise, and she was charming, flawless turns, impeccable jumps - light like a feather! Also her acting was superb. Her Colas, Antonio Conforti, danced and acted well but somehow didn't leave any remarkable impression, something was lacking. I liked Aurelien Gay as Alain a lot, there were many funny nuances in his performance, and Florimond Lorieux as Mother Simone was both a woman of character and a loving mother wanting the best (according to her ideas) for her child. Jean-Baptiste Chavignier played Thomas, Alain's father and was quite believable in his performance.

  And of course Le Coq (Aurelien Hoguet) and the four chickens were very funny through the whole performance. 

  The whole ensemble did their best to create a very enjoyable ballet and I left the theater wishing to watch "La fille mal gardee" again!

[JNC]

@Emeralds my assumption always was “etoile” is equivalent to RB’s principal dancer class surely, and the “premier danseur” is first soloist. 
 

While “etoiles” hold the title for life and have to retire at a certain age I think those are quirks of the Parisian system not indicating a totally different rank. 
 

I would have expected Marcelino Sambe to appear in the programme as “guest artist” or something like that, when Roberto Bolle appears in the RB programme I think he’s given a title of “principal guest dancer” or something along those lines. I guess they can’t call Sambe an “etoile” as that title is indicative of the French system but I wouldn’t expect him to be a premier danseur either, so “guest dancer” or something thereabouts is quite neutral and doesn’t indicate a rank, and in the bio I would imagine they’d say he is a Principal Dancer at the RB that is their highest rank etc. 

 

Not that it needed further whetting, but this has very much whetted my appetite to see BRB later this year in La Fille! 

[Sophoife]

24 minutes ago, JNC said:

While “etoiles” hold the title for life and have to retire at a certain age

 

All dancers of the Paris Opéra can retire at the age of 40 (legal retirement age) or at 42 (with full pension without reduction), because of the "hardship" of the profession, the risks of injury and the level of skill required to dance the great ballets. For singers, the eligibility ages are 57 and 60. For orchestra members it's 60 and 62. For stagehands 53 and 55.

 

I believe similar provisions apply at the other state ballet companies (opéra national) in France.

[alison]

5 hours ago, Estreiiita said:

  The whole ensemble did their best to create a very enjoyable ballet and I left the theater wishing to watch "La fille mal gardee" again!

 

That was exactly my reaction the first time I saw it   Preferably immediately afterwards, too.

[Emeralds]

1 hour ago, JNC said:

@Emeralds my assumption always was “etoile” is equivalent to RB’s principal dancer class surely, and the “premier danseur” is first soloist. 
 

While “etoiles” hold the title for life and have to retire at a certain age I think those are quirks of the Parisian system not indicating a totally different rank. 
 

I would have expected Marcelino Sambe to appear in the programme as “guest artist” or something like that, when Roberto Bolle appears in the RB programme I think he’s given a title of “principal guest dancer” or something along those lines. I guess they can’t call Sambe an “etoile” as that title is indicative of the French system but I wouldn’t expect him to be a premier danseur either, so “guest dancer” or something thereabouts is quite neutral and doesn’t indicate a rank, and in the bio I would imagine they’d say he is a Principal Dancer at the RB that is their highest rank etc. 

 

Not that it needed further whetting, but this has very much whetted my appetite to see BRB later this year in La Fille! 

Hmm, JNC, that's always what I assumed too- that etoile was the same as principal dancer and that premier danseur/premiere danseuse must mean first soloist. But Tamara Rojo indicated that wasn't the case and some etoiles at the Paris Opera have in the past stated in interviews that premier danseur/premiere danseuse is already principal dancer and etoile is extra, like Senior Principal or Leading Principal, something like that. Perhaps the real answer is that there is no equivalent. I think in Vienna State Ballet their principals are called first soloists. 

 

I was assuming that the Paris Opera might just make a transliteration of "principal dancer" or "dancer principal" in his bio, but refer to him as Guest Artist. Curious to see if any members who bought a souvenir programme would have the answer though! I visited the Palais Garnier and Opera Bastille for ballet years ago and really liked their colourful, high quality and informative programmes (very damage resistant too). Haven't been there for a long time.

 

The other unusual practice that the Paris Opera has is that to get promotion from artist to first artist to soloist etc (although they have more junior ranks than just three) they have to perform a solo on stage like a competition or exam in front of a panel (artistic director and senior coaches I believe) and get awarded marks by each panel member. Marks get taken off for slips, stumbles, wobbles, being out of time with the music etc.....like a real exam, and more unforgiving than many performances in front of paying audiences.

 

If they earn a high combined score they pass and get promoted. (Etoile promotions do not depend on or require the exam.) Mathilde Froustey has spoken of how nerves used to get to her during these exams and she never made it past sujet- but she had artistry, danced very well in real performances, and was even cast frequently in lead roles, but could not be promoted. She was later offered a principal dancer contract at San Francisco Ballet so she accepted it. I suppose the system is to avoid favouritism preventing technically skilled dancers from being overlooked for promotion. It has its advantages I suppose. 

 

The question about equivalent ranks just came up because of the audience member's comment about why Sambe wasn't promoted like Battistoni (clearly a misunderstanding as Sambe is already a principal at another company) so it made me wonder. 

[FionaM]

I prefer to have no animals on stage … I’ve come to see ballet, and not have to worry about poop or other mishaps of live animals on stage.  I find it an unwelcome distraction.  
 

My heart sank when Ratmansky introduced a pony and cart into his reconstructed Giselle for the Bolshoi.  Thankfully that production is no longer.  
 

Wild animals are banned from circuses.  Why should we treat domestic animals differently? Hmm.   I deplore domestic animals being coerced (even if it is done in a kind manner) to be performers.  
 

I’m in sympathy with the French pony’s stage fright and re-assure him/her that it is wholly unnecessary for the plot !!
 

 

[Jan McNulty]

18 minutes ago, FionaM said:

I prefer to have no animals on stage … I’ve come to see ballet, and not have to worry about poop or other mishaps of live animals on stage.  I find it an unwelcome distraction.  
 

My heart sank when Ratmansky introduced a pony and cart into his reconstructed Giselle for the Bolshoi.  Thankfully that production is no longer.  
 

Wild animals are banned from circuses.  Why should we treat domestic animals differently? Hmm.   I deplore domestic animals being coerced (even if it is done in a kind manner) to be performers.  
 

I’m in sympathy with the French pony’s stage fright and re-assure him/her that it is wholly unnecessary for the plot !!
 

 

 

 

Is it Sir David Bentley/Galina Samosa's Giselle that originally had the Countess riding on a horse with 2 salukis.  The horse soon went I think but the salukis stayed for a while.

[Tattin]

As I understand it the other factor involved in the "concours" system for promotion at the Paris Opera is just how many places are available at the next level as they are always limited. So even if a dancer does brilliantly with no slips or wobbles, if another one or ones gets/get higher marks he or she doesn't get promoted because the places will already be filled.

[Emeralds]

15 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said:

 

 

Is it Sir David Bentley/Galina Samosa's Giselle that originally had the Countess riding on a horse with 2 salukis.  The horse soon went I think but the salukis stayed for a while.

Yes.  the BRB Bintley & Samsova Giselle has a horse that Bathilde makes her entrance on!  The horse was still present when they performed Giselle at Sadler's Wells in Nov 2019. The horse seemed happy. I don't think we had salukis or other dogs. Maybe it depends on the dogs'/horse's availability and some runs will have neither. I understand that San Francisco Ballet's Giselle has dogs as well (just to illustrate that nothing strange about Ms Samsova and Mr Bintley's choice!) 

 

35 minutes ago, FionaM said:

I prefer to have no animals on stage … I’ve come to see ballet, and not have to worry about poop or other mishaps of live animals on stage.  I find it an unwelcome distraction.  

However I can also see @FionaM'a point that maybe the stage should just be for human performers. Rather like Cirque du Soleil. There are pros and cons to both views.  The main thing is to ensure no performer is or feels exploited or distressed, whether animal or human. 

Edited March 30 by Emeralds

[JNC]

@Emeralds I’m not an expert but based on numbers alone etoile has to be the same as RB’s principal level - otherwise you’re looking at something more like “prima ballerina assoluta” akin to etoile that is far more rare. Also by the theory that etoile is “higher” than principal dancer is there an inherent assumption that Paris thinks its dancers are better than all other dancers in companies worldwide? (I’m being a bit silly of course but they must see etoile as equivalent to the highest rank of other equivalent companies). 
 

I think Paris just like to do things differently (or rather given the history of ballet I suppose maybe they are the “originals”?). I don’t think etoile is any different to principal dancer, if anything because it’s based on a “special something” not the concours exam it’s more akin to promotions at RB on subjective decisions made by the seniors of the company. 
 

I find the concours system has a lot of merit for fairness and transparency. It’s unlucky if you get nerves (but do they not get nerves for performances, maybe because they know it’s not experts watching them!) but whilst it’s unusual and rare because of the etoile category you could in theory have someone at soloist level that gets promoted up to etoile bypassing a rank (or there are no “rules” to say that they couldn’t bypass more ranks although it would be very unusual). 
 

And yes, of the ballet programmes I have POB is the best. You have a guaranteed selection of good articles, on stage photos and behind the scenes photos, and lots of them. With RB sometimes you get rehearsal photos but you often don’t. POB generally seem to have more content in the way of articles as well. Compared to say ENB’s programmes though I’d say RB’s are very good, but I’d love I’d RB could adopt guaranteed rehearsal photos as well as photos on stage from the previous run because its always nice to see a behind the scenes look with those who are cast in the production you are seeing! 

[maryrosesatonapin]

9 hours ago, JNC said:

@Emeralds I’m not an expert but based on numbers alone etoile has to be the same as RB’s principal level - otherwise you’re looking at something more like “prima ballerina assoluta” akin to etoile that is far more rare. Also by the theory that etoile is “higher” than principal dancer is there an inherent assumption that Paris thinks its dancers are better than all other dancers in companies worldwide? (I’m being a bit silly of course but they must see etoile as equivalent to the highest rank of other equivalent companies). 
 

I think Paris just like to do things differently (or rather given the history of ballet I suppose maybe they are the “originals”?). I don’t think etoile is any different to principal dancer, if anything because it’s based on a “special something” not the concours exam it’s more akin to promotions at RB on subjective decisions made by the seniors of the company. 
 

I find the concours system has a lot of merit for fairness and transparency. It’s unlucky if you get nerves (but do they not get nerves for performances, maybe because they know it’s not experts watching them!) but whilst it’s unusual and rare because of the etoile category you could in theory have someone at soloist level that gets promoted up to etoile bypassing a rank (or there are no “rules” to say that they couldn’t bypass more ranks although it would be very unusual). 
 

And yes, of the ballet programmes I have POB is the best. You have a guaranteed selection of good articles, on stage photos and behind the scenes photos, and lots of them. With RB sometimes you get rehearsal photos but you often don’t. POB generally seem to have more content in the way of articles as well. Compared to say ENB’s programmes though I’d say RB’s are very good, but I’d love I’d RB could adopt guaranteed rehearsal photos as well as photos on stage from the previous run because its always nice to see a behind the scenes look with those who are cast in the production you are seeing! 

'My' Colas, Guillaume Diop, was promoted directly from Sujet to Étoile, bypassing Premier Danseur completely. I think they do undergo a kind of test really, in that it has been nearly decided to make them Étoile but they are watched at a particular performance and then, if great enough, it is announced on stage. But that's just a guess from me.

Re the concours system: I suppose one should expect the top rank dancers to be able to perform anything technically, but to be honest one of my favourite RB dancers probably wouldn't pass the concours system in Paris but is beautiful in other ways.  

Paris is very strict in its selection of dancers - from Wikipedia:
 

The hierarchy of the Paris Opera Ballet is very strict. For a dancer, it is virtually compulsory to enter first the Paris Opera Ballet School.... The competition for admission to both institutions is extremely fierce, as well as the competition for the highest ranks in the ballet company.

More than 90 percent of the candidates don't pass the Ballet School entrance examination, and 20 percent of its pupils have to leave at the end of the year after failing the annual competitive examinations ("les concours annuels") in May. Only 5 to 20 percent of the Ballet School graduates are accepted in the Paris Opera Ballet, initially as dancers on trial (the "stagiaires").

To become a regular member of the Paris Opera Ballet as "Quadrille" (fifth and lowest rank in the hierarchy), you have to pass the annual competitive examination in November. Promotion to the next rank depends exclusively on success in the following annual competitive examinations ("les concours internes de promotion") in front of a board of judges.

[Sophoife]

I wrote this comment about entry to POB back in 2018. It's definitely an advantage at the concours externe to have competition experience, e.g. Prix de Lausanne or YAGP.

 

For promotion, each class (quadrille, coryphée, sujet) is divided into male and female. It is announced how many positions at each level (coryphée, sujet, premier(e) danseur/se) for each gender are available, e.g. two female and one male coryphée, two female and two male sujets, one each for PD.

 

Each class is given a compulsory solo, plus a list from which to choose a second solo.

 

Each entrant at each level must dance both solos in front of an invited audience and judges.

 

Each class is ranked by consensus, with only the top six (or less, some years - Bianca Scudamore was promoted sujet and was the only one "classified" that year!) listed as "classified".

 

The top one or two or very occasionally three are the ones promoted.

 

Nomination as étoile is by recommendation of the Director of Dance to the Director of the Opera - not considered a promotion but a naming.

 

It is possible to zoom up from quadrille to PD in three years, Sae-Eun Park and Hannah O'Neill being prime examples.

 

Germain Louvet had passed for premier danseur, contract to take effect from January 1 2015, so technically nominated étoile from sujet on December 28 2014.

 

Guillaume Diop had already danced Romeo, Basilio, Solor and Albrecht before being nominated, as a six-month-old sujet, to étoile.

 

Both Diop and Louvet were 23 at the time.

[Jane S]

Last night's Lise, Eleonore Guerineau, was injured during Act 1 of Fille last night and had to be replaced by Hortense Maurin Millet in Act 2. There is a touching  message from Guerineau on her Instagram page.

[art_enthusiast]

11 hours ago, Sophoife said:

Guillaume Diop had already danced Romeo, Basilio, Solor and Albrecht before being nominated, as a six-month-old sujet, to étoile.

 

Both Diop and Louvet were 23 at the time.

Interesting. I’m really eager to see Diop live: I had to miss Fille unfortunately due to timings. I’m hoping to make it to Paquita in December or Onegin in February. Does anyone know when casting might be announced?

[stucha]

15 hours ago, Sophoife said:

I wrote this comment about entry to POB back in 2018. It's definitely an advantage at the concours externe to have competition experience, e.g. Prix de Lausanne or YAGP.

 

For promotion, each class (quadrille, coryphée, sujet) is divided into male and female. It is announced how many positions at each level (coryphée, sujet, premier(e) danseur/se) for each gender are available, e.g. two female and one male coryphée, two female and two male sujets, one each for PD.

 

Each class is given a compulsory solo, plus a list from which to choose a second solo.

 

Each entrant at each level must dance both solos in front of an invited audience and judges.

 

Each class is ranked by consensus, with only the top six (or less, some years - Bianca Scudamore was promoted sujet and was the only one "classified" that year!) listed as "classified".

 

The top one or two or very occasionally three are the ones promoted.

 

Nomination as étoile is by recommendation of the Director of Dance to the Director of the Opera - not considered a promotion but a naming.

 

It is possible to zoom up from quadrille to PD in three years, Sae-Eun Park and Hannah O'Neill being prime examples.

 

Germain Louvet had passed for premier danseur, contract to take effect from January 1 2015, so technically nominated étoile from sujet on December 28 2014.

 

Guillaume Diop had already danced Romeo, Basilio, Solor and Albrecht before being nominated, as a six-month-old sujet, to étoile.

 

Both Diop and Louvet were 23 at the time.

 

A recent change to the system sees promotion to première danseuse and premier danseur removed from the concours system,  and changed to recommendation by the Director of the Opera and director of Dance.

 

[Sophoife]

1 hour ago, stucha said:

 

A recent change to the system sees promotion to première danseuse and premier danseur removed from the concours system,  and changed to recommendation by the Director of the Opera and director of Dance.

 

 

I'd forgotten that! Thanks for providing the correct info.

[myrtle]

This discussion is very intriguing for me and now I'm even more keen to see Fille!   Will there be a performance streamed on the POB stream platform?    Don Quixote was just added yesterday--dare I hope Fille and then Giselle will also be on the POB stream?   If it will be streamed, is it already known which cast will be on the stream for Fille and Giselle?   Thank you all very much.   

[myrtle]

On 30/03/2024 at 15:30, Emeralds said:

Yes.  the BRB Bintley & Samsova Giselle has a horse that Bathilde makes her entrance on!  The horse was still present when they performed Giselle at Sadler's Wells in Nov 2019. The horse seemed happy. I don't think we had salukis or other dogs. Maybe it depends on the dogs'/horse's availability and some runs will have neither. I understand that San Francisco Ballet's Giselle has dogs as well (just to illustrate that nothing strange about Ms Samsova and Mr Bintley's choice!) 

 

However I can also see @FionaM'a point that maybe the stage should just be for human performers. Rather like Cirque du Soleil. There are pros and cons to both views.  The main thing is to ensure no performer is or feels exploited or distressed, whether animal or human. 

 

I hope that no performer need ever feel exploited or distressed!

 

Due to the SF Ballet incident of the amorous brother and sister Borzoi from years ago, I understand in 2023 there was only one dog.    ABT's Borzoi(s) are featured prominently on their social media.  

 

 

Edited April 3 by myrtle

[Silver Capricorn]

22 minutes ago, myrtle said:

This discussion is very intriguing for me and now I'm even more keen to see Fille!   Will there be a performance streamed on the POB stream platform?    Don Quixote was just added yesterday--dare I hope Fille and then Giselle will also be on the POB stream?   If it will be streamed, is it already known which cast will be on the stream for Fille and Giselle?   Thank you all very much.   

Fille was already transmitted only in French cinemas on March 21, not on the POB stream platform.  Giselle on the Play Opera Paris platform is available in probably the best possible cast - Dorothée Gilbert and Mathieu Ganio.

[myrtle]

8 minutes ago, Silver Capricorn said:

Fille was already transmitted only in French cinemas on March 21, not on the POB stream platform.  Giselle on the Play Opera Paris platform is available in probably the best possible cast - Dorothée Gilbert and Mathieu Ganio.

 

Thank you very much!    But do I understand correctly that there won't be POB platform stream of the Giselle performances in May?   I have already watched and re-watched the POB platform Giselle with Ms. Gilbert and Mr. Ganio.   Indeed they were magnificent, but I would appreciate seeing these same dancers again in a different performance, or indeed any other of the POB's many stellar casts and was hoping that one of the upcoming performances would be on the platform just like the recent Don Q!  

Edited April 3 by myrtle

[Silver Capricorn]

8 hours ago, myrtle said:

 

Thank you very much!    But do I understand correctly that there won't be POB platform stream of the Giselle performances in May?   I have already watched and re-watched the POB platform Giselle with Ms. Gilbert and Mr. Ganio.   Indeed they were magnificent, but I would appreciate seeing these same dancers again in a different performance, or indeed any other of the POB's many stellar casts and was hoping that one of the upcoming performances would be on the platform just like the recent Don Q!  

Giselle's May live stream has not yet been announced, so we'll see.  Recordings of performances are usually included in the permanent offer of Opera Play Paris after some time, now in April it is, for example, an evening of choreography by Jiri Kilian.

[Amelie-DALP]

On 31/03/2024 at 00:36, JNC said:

@Emeralds I’m not an expert but based on numbers alone etoile has to be the same as RB’s principal level - otherwise you’re looking at something more like “prima ballerina assoluta” akin to etoile that is far more rare. Also by the theory that etoile is “higher” than principal dancer is there an inherent assumption that Paris thinks its dancers are better than all other dancers in companies worldwide? (I’m being a bit silly of course but they must see etoile as equivalent to the highest rank of other equivalent companies). 

 

Oh, I think we can say that without joking

 

Sorry, I'm jumping in a bit late in the discussion. Just for some clarifications.

 

Some in Paris like to say that "Principal" equals "Premier danseur". It is just a Bla Bla Bla. 
 

In reality: Étoile = Principal, Premier danseur / Première danseuse = First soloist.
 

When you're a Premier danseur/Première danseuse, you only have one certainty: you will never go back to the corps de ballet. But you have no certainty of dancing lead roles. You are "remplaçant" for the lead roles and you dance supporting roles: Hilarion, the Queen of the Dryads, Myrtha, Gamzatti, Lescaut (some Étoiles can dance these last three roles as well), Effie, the three Shades, the pas de trois from Swan Lake or Paquita, Kitri's two friends, the equivalent of soloist roles (and not Principals) in Balanchine's ballets...
For me, it's really the equivalent of "First soloist."

If Marcelino was indicated as "Danseur" and not "Principal" on social media, honestly, it's just that the communication team at the Paris Opera is very bad and doesn't care about what comes from the outside. Two years ago, Alexandr Trusch was a guest. In the casting sheet, it just said "Guest Artist." The least courtesy would have been to add "Principal Dancer of the Hamburg Ballet John Neumeier" ... But well, it's the Paris Opera!

 

[Lizbie1]

13 minutes ago, Amelie-DALP said:

When you're a Premier danseur/Première danseuse, you only have one certainty: you will never go back to the corps de ballet. But you have no certainty of dancing lead roles. You are "remplaçant" for the lead roles and you dance supporting roles: Hilarion, the Queen of the Dryads, Myrtha, Gamzatti, Lescaut (some Étoiles can dance these last three roles as well), Effie, the three Shades, the pas de trois from Swan Lake or Paquita, Kitri's two friends, the equivalent of soloist roles (and not Principals) in Balanchine's ballets...

 

This reminds me of the one and only (chance!) conversation I have had with a POB dancer, before I knew anything about the ranks there. She said she'd just been performing in Swan Lake and was a Sujet. I asked "petit cygne?" and was politely but firmly corrected, "grand cygne."

[Emeralds]

13 hours ago, Amelie-DALP said:

 

Oh, I think we can say that without joking

 

Sorry, I'm jumping in a bit late in the discussion. Just for some clarifications.

 

Some in Paris like to say that "Principal" equals "Premier danseur". It is just a Bla Bla Bla. 
 

In reality: Étoile = Principal, Premier danseur / Première danseuse = First soloist.
 

When you're a Premier danseur/Première danseuse, you only have one certainty: you will never go back to the corps de ballet. But you have no certainty of dancing lead roles. You are "remplaçant" for the lead roles and you dance supporting roles: Hilarion, the Queen of the Dryads, Myrtha, Gamzatti, Lescaut (some Étoiles can dance these last three roles as well), Effie, the three Shades, the pas de trois from Swan Lake or Paquita, Kitri's two friends, th,  equivalent of soloist roles (and not Principals) in Balanchine's ballets...
For me, it's really the equivalent of "First soloist."

 

Here's why I think there is some overlap and Principal Dancer isn't exactly a clear cut equivalent of etoile and First Soloist isn’t definitely Premier danseur/premiere danseuse. 

 

In the UK system, Royal Ballet and English National Ballet are probably equivalent size wise to the Paris Opera. In the Royal Ballet and English National Ballet, first soloists do have to dance corps de ballet roles ie being part of the ensemble of wilis (not Zulme or Moyna but the rows of wilis), the Shades going down the ramp in La Bayadere, the rows of Dryads in Don Quixote. Likewise for the men, who could be cast as the unnamed rows of pirates in Le Corsaire, or the ensemble with no solos in Requiem, partners in the Act 1 waltz.

 

The only ones who are exempt from corps de ballet duties are principal dancers. Some principal dancers have only ever danced Myrtha, Gamzatti and the Shades,  but never Odette-Odile (or never Juliet), Giselle (or never Sugar Plum Fairy) or Aurora,  though they may have danced the leads in many contemporary works. And likewise some male Principal Dancers have danced Lescaut, Mercutio. Hilarion but never Romeo, Des Grieux, or Siegfried.

 

English National Ballet did create a title called Lead Principal which sounds like etoile- all female Lead Principals get to dance Juliet, Odette-Odile, Aurora, Giselle, Manon and all male Lead Principals dance Siegfried, Albrecht, Florimund etc. 

 

This could be why the Paris Opera didn't translate principal dancer ranking for Trusch and Sambe automatically to etoile. That said, I think Trusch and Sambe's seniority and level of experience in their companies (both dance Romeo, Albrecht, Siegfried etc) indicate that they have the same kinds of roles and skills as an etoile. 

[alison]

1 hour ago, Emeralds said:

In the UK system, Royal Ballet and English National Ballet are probably equivalent size wise to the Paris Opera. In the Royal Ballet and English National Ballet, first soloists do have to dance corps de ballet roles ie being part of the ensemble of wilis (not Zulme or Moyna but the rows of wilis), the Shades going down the ramp in La Bayadere, the rows of Dryads in Don Quixote.

 

I can't speak for ENB, but in the case of the RB I thought it was more that First Soloists might be asked to do corps work, but it would generally only be something of a last resort, in an emergency.  I don't think you'd expect to see them doing it night after night.

[Emeralds]

6 hours ago, alison said:

 

I can't speak for ENB, but in the case of the RB I thought it was more that First Soloists might be asked to do corps work, but it would generally only be something of a last resort, in an emergency.  I don't think you'd expect to see them doing it night after night.

I haven't seen them as an obvious last resort cover, but more in the first performances of a run, especially if that work is being filmed- I recall seeing Akane Takada in the Dryads corps in the early performances of Don Quixote while a First Soloist, Yuhui Choe and Valentino Zucchetti in the corps (not in the same run) of Requiem, just to name a few examples.

 

Their experience and skill enhance the overall look of the ensemble and if it's a new production, enables them to familiarise themselves with the work before being in the leading role (eg the case of Takada she danced Kitri later on). Towards the end of the run, the newer artists and some RBS students fill the corps ranks. We've had this "is it urgent cover or planned casting" discussion before 😉.  ENB first soloists do it very often throughout a run eg Nutcracker, Giselle, Corsaire etc. 

[Amelie-DALP]

9 hours ago, Emeralds said:

Here's why I think there is some overlap and Principal Dancer isn't exactly a clear cut equivalent of etoile and First Soloist isn’t definitely Premier danseur/premiere danseuse. 

 

 

 

Thank you very much for the clarification! I didn't know that. I understand that there's a bit of an unofficial hierarchy among the Principals.

 

[Lizbie1]

10 hours ago, Emeralds said:

In the UK system, Royal Ballet and English National Ballet are probably equivalent size wise to the Paris Opera.

 

This is not so. ENB has ~70 dancers on the payroll and the RB has ~100 (including Aud Jebsen and character dancers). Paris has about 150.

[Emeralds]

1 hour ago, Lizbie1 said:

 

This is not so. ENB has ~70 dancers on the payroll and the RB has ~100 (including Aud Jebsen and character dancers). Paris has about 150.

To clarify, they (RB and ENB) won't be the exact same size as POB as that must mean the UK is ridiculously rich to be able to afford to subsidise two massive ballet companies, but simply to illustrate that I'm not comparing POB with smaller companies like Northern Ballet where the dancers  share a lot of roles from character to lead to small group roles (the "Friends of Juliet/Giselle/Romeo" type roles) and corps roles quite often.

 

That said, your point about the difference in numbers demonstrates why POB's ranking system can't have exact equivalents in all but the largest companies eg Bolshoi Ballet, and that's probably the reason why first soloists in RB, ENB and similar companies will still have to dance in the corps ensemble from time to time, while premiere danseuses/premier danseurs at POB don't have to- due to the numbers available.

 

In fact in many medium and large ballet  companies around the world, the only distinction between principal dancers and other ranks is that a principal doesn't have to dance in the corps ensemble- it doesn't guarantee them Giselle/Aurora/Juliet or Romeo/Florimund/Siegfried type lead roles, which can be assigned to soloists and occasionally corps dancers as well. Hence that could be why many POB dancers regard premiere danseuse/premier danseur as equivalent of principal dancer and an etoile as a senior principal or lead principal. 

[Paco]

24 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

To clarify, they (RB and ENB) won't be the exact same size as POB

POB =around 150 dancers (154 officially)

RB = around 100 I guess?

Edited April 10 by Paco