Sim Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I don't disagree, Bill. Of course we are all very pleased that she has made a quick recovery. However...even this is speculation. We assume it to be true, but some kind of official confirmation, just saying something along the lines of "We are very pleased to announce that NO has made a much quicker recovery than originally expected and has therefore been able to accept invitations to dance in Milan and Novosibirsk. With regret, she won't be dancing in London until after the New Year as this would prove too disruptive to cast changes made in light of the original cancellation of all her London shows for the remainder of 2015" would be most welcome to her fans and would, I expect, stop the chatter and hopefully assuage some of the annoyance that fans are feeling. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Yes, a statement along those lines was what I was thinking of Sim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigo Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 The fact that Natalia's personal circumstances changed and she is able to perform elsewhere before her next scheduled performances in London is to be celebrated. I think this is what I'm trying to say in a clumsy way. You're right, but it doesn't appear to be the case that all her fans are feeling this emotion. This is why I feel some form of communication would be prudent - to change the mood, bring back the buzz / excitement / anticipation for RB audiences who are Osipova fans. It seems to me the modern world is all about shaping & managing public perception. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAB Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 As a fan of Osipova, I very much look forward to her return whenever that may be. She won't be the first dancer to cancel due to injury etc. As I travel a lot to watch ballet, I've suffered several disappointments when injuries and pregnancies have occurred between booking a flight and setting off. On one occasion a short Kirov season in Basle that I had planned to see was completely cancelled at short notice. I always thought these things are par for the course, apparently not. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 There is more joy in heaven..... Aileen and Nina G - Welcome to Natalia's fan club! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Bill, I'm not a member of Osipova's fan club but many people are and, whatever my feelings about her are, she is undoubtedly a star in the ballet world and many people book for her before anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Aileen - I think her fans can speak for themselves. They don't need a non fan to speak for them. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) I'm not speaking for her or her fans. I'm just discussing the PR aspect of her performing at another venue at the same time as her cancelled performances are taking place. I don't need to be a fan to contribute to this particular discussion. Edited October 29, 2015 by aileen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 But, you are manufacturing a problem that is not there. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capybara Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 The situation with Natalia Osipova is nothing like the above. Natalia Osipova's Autumn performances with the RB were cancelled for very good reason and immediate replacements made. It was not a situation of Natalia's own making. No-one could be more disappointed than Natalia. The fact that Natalia's personal circumstances changed and she is able to perform elsewhere before her next scheduled performances in London is to be celebrated. The problem is, Bill, that you (and maybe one or two other posters on here) appear to be privy to information which others don't have access to. Almost every audience member I speak to (many of whom bought tickets specifically to see Natalia) seems to be thinking that there is something here which doesn't quite add up. I agree with those above who feel that, in view of how events are unfolding, a further statement from the RB would be timely and represent good PR. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I didn't start this discussion but it appears that there is some potential awkwardness about a company dancer performing elsewhere during the period in which her performances at the ROH have been cancelled. It's strange that you don't understand this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melody Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) I understand that it's hard to know how long an injury will take to heal, but maybe cancelling her entire Autumn schedule was a bit premature? Just announcing she's injured and cancelling her earlier performances, with the possibility of later performances being cancelled if things take longer than expected to resolve, would have given everyone some wiggle room. I can see why she might be wanting to dance elsewhere if she's feeling up to it and her RB performances have all been cancelled, but I think it could have been avoided by being more flexible in the first place. As it is, we have a situation where one of RB's in-house principal dancers was injured while guesting with one company, is missing an entire RB season, but is, during that season, guesting with another company. I think RB audiences do have some justification for feeling a little aggrieved, while of course hoping her recovery continues to go smoothly. I understand that Osipova fans are maybe going to see this a little differently from RB fans, but that's just the way it is. Edited October 29, 2015 by Melody 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 RB audiences are not aggrieved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melody Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Judging from the posts here, some of them most certainly are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 May I suggest that those who feel aggrieved contact Kevin O'Hare and report back here with his response. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melody Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Maybe some of them will. There have been several posts already from people suggesting that RB make some sort of statement about the situation so that people who paid for tickets to see Natalia Osipova, and who aren't able to see her because she's both injured and dancing elsewhere, will have a somewhat better idea of what's going on. Perhaps some of those people will contact RB to suggest that they make a statement, and, like you, I'd be interested in RB's response if anyone does contact them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Melody - I'm not looking for a statement from the RB. I accept the situation. I am suggesting that those who are aggrieved take their grievance to Kevin O'Hare - rather than repeating it here. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melody Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 This is a discussion forum, why on earth shouldn't people be able to express disappointment at this situation here? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Are you disappointed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Aileen - Are you disappointed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 This is a discussion forum, why on earth shouldn't people be able to express disappointment at this situation here? Precisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Discussion, yes, but this is getting extremely counterproductive. It's just turning into a moaning thread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 penelopesimpson - Are you disappointed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 What's counterproductive about suggesting that the RB issue a short explanatory statement? That's what PR departments are for. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Precisely. Clearly there is a communications problem. I can totally understand why RB found it necessary to cancel all Osipova's performances for the autumn. They couldn't simply bank on her being well again and have other dancers on standby on an ad hoc basis, and I think that, however, disappointing, they took the right decision and recast all her performances. However, for those people who have spent their precious funds on tickets to see this wonderful lady dance, it is irritating to read that she is performing elsewhere. Of course, if you look into the nuts and bolts you can understand what is going on, but most ballet lovers do not have this sort of information and are therefore just likely to assume that Osipova is putting guesting commitments before her RB role. If I was the RB Press Office, I would have seen this potential problem looming and issued a statement saying how delighted RB are that Natalia has made a good recovery and how much they are looking forward to her returning to ROH in January. Of course La Scala and wherever else she is performing will want to maximise publicity so no blame attaches to them, but RB should have seen this one coming and got in first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 And it has been stirred quite enough. I'm locking this thread for a while 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 As you will have noticed, this thread was locked whilst the moderators considered it. We have decided to unlock it, but we would ask that any further discussion on here remains civilised. Everybody has a right to express their opinion, ask questions and raise issues without the fear of being harried or subject to aggressive, rude or offensive posting. This will not be tolerated and any future postings deemed to fall under any of those categories will be hidden, and we reserve the right to suspend or ban the perpetrator. On behalf of all the moderators, thank you for your adherence to the above. Simonetta Dixon Chair BalletcoForum Committee 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billboyd Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) I wish to put on record that I stand by all my above posts. I will happily meet anyone to discuss my posts. Edited October 30, 2015 by billboyd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capybara Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 There is a lovely long interview with Lauren Cuthbertson in the November edition of Dance Europe. As her first question, Deborah Weiss asks Lauren about replacing Natalia at the last minute in Connectome and Lauren replies, “Well, I was probably the only one not thinking, “Poor girl, having to replace Osipova”. It’s funny, there’s a bit of that mentality around that suggests that, if you’re not Osipova, then you need to apologise for being on stage. It’s a shame because we’re all completely different. She brings amazing things, but other people bring wonderful qualities to ballets that she doesn’t do – there is space for everyone.” 24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuthE Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 There is a lovely long interview with Lauren Cuthbertson in the November edition of Dance Europe. As her first question, Deborah Weiss asks Lauren about replacing Natalia at the last minute in Connectome and Lauren replies, “Well, I was probably the only one not thinking, “Poor girl, having to replace Osipova”. It’s funny, there’s a bit of that mentality around that suggests that, if you’re not Osipova, then you need to apologise for being on stage. It’s a shame because we’re all completely different. She brings amazing things, but other people bring wonderful qualities to ballets that she doesn’t do – there is space for everyone.” Somebody needs to tell this to the appallingly rude woman who shouted at the cast change announcer from a seat in the Stalls Circle to demand a refund, on the night when Yuhui Choe replaced Osipova in The Sleeping Beauty... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnneMarriott Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 I know this is off topic, but I remember the dreadful groan that went up at the Swan Lake pre-performance announcement that Sylvie Guillem was unable to appear (a rare event indeed!) and would be replaced by Yoshida Miyako. "Who's THAT?" said the woman to my left. "Don't worry, you may not be disappointed" I replied. At curtain call the woman to my left was on her feet, cheering, along with lots of others. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sim Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 Just like when Yuhui replaced Osipova in Sleeping Beauty at short notice a couple of years ago. She must have been terrified, but she got a huge ovation when she came onstage, and an even bigger one when she went off, and deservedly so. She was wonderful! 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLOSS Posted October 30, 2015 Share Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) Anyone who goes to the ballet with any degree of regularity knows that buying a ticket for a particular cast is a bit of a lottery. If we are sensible we accept that dancers get sick and injured.As far as the ROH publicity department is concerned I think that they are damned If they leave it to the last moment to make an official announcement about Osipova not dancing because people will say that they knew for a long time that she wasn't going to appear and damned if they make the announcement well ahead of time,as here.I think that everyone should just accept that cast changes are an inevitable part of the average ballet goer's experience.There are some dancers who are never off and some who have persistent problems.It's much harder for the dancer concerned than it is for any of us. Perhaps we should take a more grown up and balanced view of dancer's injuries and how management deals with them? Edited October 30, 2015 by FLOSS 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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