Going Back to ballet continued...

[Michelle_Richer]

Rejane at City Academy has never included point work in her rep workshops that I have attended. She really is a fantastic teacher focused on making her classes enjoyable and usually applies the easy/harder options for the dances to choose for themselves.

 

I'm trying to find out about a Cinderella rep workshop tomorrow at Northern Ballet as its going to be a very long day, leaving home a 6.30am and arriving back home just before 1am, and I'm not even including London in that one yet.

 

Change of plan with my pointe-work, it starts this week, not next as the ROH class is fully booked and I cannot get in this week.

 

Stand in Teacher at Stamford class today, very uneventful, no cabriole this week. Lincoln only 4 girls including me this week. Hope it gets back to normal soon as we need to start our rehearsal. It may even be the Giselle friends dance (Not the Cuban one taught by City), as I have popped that in the melting pot for review by my teacher.

Edited September 23, 2013 by Michelle_Richer

[LinMM]

Well it's been rather an expensive day as decided to definitely book the City Academy Swan Lake workshop in December and have bought ticket to see Osipova in Giselle for January as well! Plus have just had to pay up for Spanish Evening classes!!

Luckily right on the Academy weekend I get my once yearly double pension payment......for those a way off pensionable age yet...when you do get there and if its the same as now....it's paid every four weeks rather than monthly so that once a year you get this extra payment as it works out a payment right at the beginning and end of the month! Or rather it appears that way. If you retire near your birthday then it seems to always come about then...at first anyway!

 

Have also just filled in a questionnaire for Franziska about her workshops so she is obviously planning on more for 2014.

 

Looks like its time to go out and get another job then!!

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Lin

 

Please will you to tell me where Natalia Osipova is performing, as she is the one in the clip I have been rehearsing. I’d love to see her performance of that ballet.  

 

Had a really nice day at Northern Ballet, I got invited out for a coffee with three ladies from the morning classes, we went to a café near the BBC in Leeds, it was a bit like Jerwood space as it had an art galley as part of it.

 

I did the Intermediate/advanced class tonight, that was really good, however I was a bit stupid. We were doing quite a complex sequence across the room where we traversed it a couple on times in two’s, our teacher said we could do our own ending, so you can guess what I did. Yes I dropped those leg switching pirouettes in, however the music was quite fast and when I dropped into the curtsey, I went down quite hard, thank goodness it didn’t hurt anything, only my pride.

 

That last class is a bit of a problem with train times, as it involves a change at Doncaster with quite a wait. My evening class ended at 8.15pm, it was just before 9pm when I got to the appropriate platform, but I did stop for a wee on the way. The journey on its own from Northern Ballet to the Station is 15mins with a brisk walk, but the extra time also involves changing after class etc. The train left at 9.20pm for Doncaster arriving there at 10.07pm, Doncaster to Peterborough was 10.42pm to 11.45pm, finally getting me home at 12.40am.

 

Another couple of weeks and I will try the 500 mile round trip taking in 5 classes, but its likely I will put Northern Ballet on time share, that way I still have some access to Pineapple.

 

OK about booking Swan Lake, I will see you there; I hope she includes Odette’s solo like she was originally, as that’s another one for my repertoire.

 

I emailed a local teacher for rep work, but I haven’t yet had a reply, I’m beginning to take a dim view of these non responses, if they are uncomfortable with doing either adult work or repertoire, the least they can do is email back declining.

[LinMM]

Natalia Osipova is performing Giselle with the Royal Ballet at Covent Garden in January. As far as it says on their website there are only three performances by her on the 18th, 22nd and 27th January. There are others doing this role including Nunez who is also in the above clips. All the info is on the ROH website.....go into "what's on" then " all upcoming performances" and you can see what the Royal are doing right up till next summer!! Including Giselle.

However public booking for all the Giselle performances doesn't open until 22nd October at 10am.

 

The reason I already have a ticket is because I am a Friend of Covent Garden and you do get priority booking and a chance to see rehearsals and classes etc but at a price. I won't go on here about my complaints about the Friends as in the end I personally don't think it's that good value for money. On this site (balletco) however you can keep an eye on the ticket exchange thread as well and you may get a ticket this way too. Good luck!!

As we don't really know how long Osipova will be with the Royal Ballet I think it's worth catching her performances this year. There's also some clips on Youtube especially one with her and Semyon Chudin in the second act of Giselle which are lovely.

[Thecatsmother]

http://www.theballetblog.com/article/dance-injuries/dangers-teaching-pointe-work/

 

Thought this might be of interest to any adults doing pointe work. Enjoy!

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Lin

 

Thanks for the info on Natalia’s performance; I will definitely book that one, if only to see how the choreography to that first variation has changed, it’s really got me captivated. I’ve also added in to the melting pot for our performance at the Angles Theatre next year the Giselle Friend Dance so my teacher can review it.

 

I started at the new pointe class tonight, there was only 4 of us, one girl that did pointe at our show in July, a lady who had last done pointe 20 year ago, but did not wear her pointe shoes and another girl that had not done pointe before and has no pointe shoes yet, and me of course. I had at least had my shoes on and done a little prancing and plie’s that afternoon in my own studio, it soon began apparent that my right little toe became sore and needed a gelly toe tubular support which I cut and fitted, the rest of my toes was covered with the gel out pouches.

Only thing I hadn’t allowed for in class was, I was wearing my ballet tights and there was no access to my toes. Fortunately I had taken various bits and pieces with me including some scissors, so I cut a small hole near my little toe for the gelly toe and everything worked a treat. The class focused on strengthening exercises which made good sense, where I take exception to Lisa Howel’s video, is, I will continue to do strengthening exercises en pointe at home. It’s extremely inefficient not too, further more my teacher fully expects me too, and she knows my mind-set only too well. At the end of that half hour class my feet were very comfortable in my pointe shoes, and that did surprise me a bit.

 

My teacher is still in the process of rationalising her schedule; I’m still hoping she can find a slot to fit my repertoire coaching in.  

[Billyelliott]

I've been waiting with baited breath to hear about your first pointe class Michelle - I'm so glad it was a good experience for you ! I often look at my feet and wonder how I did it all those years ago - blisters and blood everywhere , damaged Achilles - I was not well taught ! Now there are so many comfort aids and good advice .

Maybe next year I will stop reading about your exploits and enjoyin it vicariously and go find a class myself ! ????

[LinMM]

This year this year Billyelliott !!!

 

Glad it went well too Michelle. I just remember the first few times as being very painful but I still loved my pointe shoes then. The nails on my big toe are still weird after all this time but only started to get like toughened steel (are still very difficult to cut) after pointe work started!

[Aurora]

Michelle - Lisa didn't say not to practice at home at all but not to try anything you haven't been doing in class, which is certainly sensible

[Fiz]

I felt really unwell yesterday afternoon and decided I wasn't going to class in the evening. I said so on Twitter. Somebody tweeted me saying she thought the fact that I did ballet was awesome and she really missed it. I said it had all come back to me and why didn't she give it a go? She replied that I had inspired her to try again. Having realised how lucky I was to be able to go at all, I swallowed painkillers etc and headed off to class anyway, and it was completely brilliant. No pointe or repertoire but the fact that my teacher and companions were thrilled when I said we had no moving date in prospect yet and were so pleased about us all being together and having a good class means a great to me. 

[Anna C]

Sounds as if Convertible tights would be a good idea for pointe class Michelle; have you tried them?

[Sheila Beelam]

Great news Michelle, congrats! Converters are great when on pointe as you can whip bits and bobs on and off your toes If you have properly fitting shoes and you are physically ready, pointe needn't hurt

Sxxx

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Aurora

 

I stand corrected, thank you.

However I am going to play devils advocate with this one and suggest the view of dancers practicing at home is somewhat incomplete. Firstly I could argue that I fall into that category as a long while ago I bought my first Pointe shoes on-line (Sansha), needless to say, they didn’t fit. Eventually I went to the Dance Box (Part of Lincolnshire dance) and had some fitted (Bloch Serenade’s), although at that time I didn’t get very far with them as I had no real strength in my ankles. They remained unused for a very long period. After I left work and started to get serious about ballet, I guess this was about the time I first joined this forum, something happened to my feet. Both little toes appears to extend out a bit further than they used to, I don’t know if that was the result of wearing ballet slippers for long periods or not, but I found I could no longer wear the shoes I used to wear for work. They chafed my little toes something terrible, I couldn’t even get into my Pointe shoes any more, it was agony. Slowly but slowly me feet healed, but it took several month, probably up to 9 months.

 

During the spring of this year I started considering Pointe, by this time I could get my feet into the shoes without any real problems, but I was in no hurry, two of my teachers said they were happy to teach me. However I enrolled on the Chelsea Ballet Summer School, which had a beginner’s Pointe class each day. I explained I was a complete beginner on en Pointe and it was suggested I do the first class, and then see how I got on before attempting the remaining ones. By the time the summer school came round my ankles were extremely sore mainly due to the number of hours I was putting in on ballet, I decided at that time not to go en Pointe.

 

The ankle issue still persists to this day, but I just work through it. I believe it’s a combination of the amount of ballet I do, daily repetitions with resistance band and daily stretching with a foot stretcher. Once the ankle joint is warmed up, it’s perfectly flexible without any problem, but if it remains static while I’m asleep or on a long journey it becomes very stiff. So ballet activity certainly keeps it going.

 

But coming back to the original argument, If I hadn’t tried my Pointe shoes and done a little strengthening exercising in them before class, I would never have found I needed the gelly toe support and most of the first Pointe lessen would have been wasted.

 

As for girls trying to train themselves, ultimately they will end up with professional help. There is lots of evidence of this no matter how bad you think this is. Both myself and LinMM have seen girls attend Holistic Ballet’s workshops which has a pointe section, and go en pointe there, as they say for the first time. I personally think it’s inconceivable that a person, who initially goes en pointe unsupervised, will remain that way.

 

Hi Spannerandponey and JustBallet

 

Yes I realised how useful it would have been to have converters, I will definitely have to get some for pointe nights.

[LinMM]

Am not sure all,the people who were on pointe at Franziskas and who seemed like beginners were doing it for the first time on the Saturday courses.

Many of those attending her courses also go to her classes at Danceworks and so may have started pointe work in her classes there first. Would she allow people she had not seen before try out pointe work on such a course? If they were complete beginners I mean. I would be surprised at any rate.

[Michelle_Richer]

I'm only going by what some of the girls said on the course. Yes I was surprised too that she allowed it in that way. 

[LinMM]

Well yes on one of the courses the first one in February it does say the last 30 mins is an introduction to pointe work and I remember it was really basic and just at the barre.

As its a workshop she's giving she must assume that other teachers have given advice about fitting etc to the ones she doesn't know.

[Thecatsmother]

It does take years of training before young professionals are ready to go on pointe and even then it is a slow process.

[Anna C]

I have to take exception to this, Michelle:

 

"As for girls trying to train themselves, ultimately they will end up with professional help. There is lots of evidence of this no matter how bad you think this is. "

 

It's not a case of people "thinking" it's bad that young girls are trying to teach themselves pointework, it IS dangerous and could in fact lead to career ending injury. I see so many videos on Youtube of teenage girls wearing badly fitted pointe shoes at home, with the ribbons done up incorrectly and the drawstrings trailing on the floor. It's shocking. It only takes one slip to break an ankle.

 

As an adult dancer, you can choose whether to take advice or not. Young girls cannot - and should not - be allowed to try to teach themselves pointework. I'm very glad Lisa Howell has published that blog. Hopefully some of the girls on Youtube will find it and stop what they are doing before they do serious damage.

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Spanneandpony

 

I think to some degree we are at cross purposes, firstly the examples from experience I had quoted was for adults, usually with a minimum age limit of 18 and those of course did ultimately have some professional help from the workshops we were on.

 

I am also a little perplexed at an argument that suggest self trained youngsters doing pointe work but engaged in a career in ballet. That just doesn’t make sense.

 

As for the examples you mentioned on Youtube, I haven’t seen them so I can’t comment but they do sound horrendous and I’m not suggesting one follows a course of action that permanently damages feet. I would have thought anyone that was serious about perusing ballet; professional orientated or not, would have placed considerable value of their feet. I know I do, and I do tend to push my boundaries, hence why I’m in class but never the less with a little pre-class preparation. I just could not image life now with permanently damaged feet; it would be extremely difficult for me to come to terms with.

[Thecatsmother]

I think it might be worth you holding your last sentence in mind and asking a well qualified teacher who has substantial experience of putting adults on to pointe for professional advice. It is probably best actually to ask all who teach you whether you are ready for pointe work as then you should get an all around picture. Nobody can self teach pointe work as it is dangerous and a considerable amount of preparation work with the oversight from an experienced teacher is required. I am sorry but I have to come in strongly here as safety of all reading must be the primary concern. It's like asking me to comment on tooth extraction having read about it and watched operations. Even if I thought I knew what I was doing I would do damage or it incorrectly without extensive years of training. It's great that adults have so many opportunities but I just want anyone attempting ballet to remain safe otherwise they will not be able to enjoy it for long.

[LinMM]

Well Michelle knows its a bugbear of mine too as am very cautious about adults going on pointe and get worried when I see even adults whose feet are already fully formed and are even with a teacher if I see they can't straighten their knees etc and are having to sort of haul themselves up with heavy use of the barre....because basically they're not strong enough. One knows these adults are never going to get very far with pointe work and wonder why they want to do it.....but they do want to apparently!! Perhaps they feel as its ballet they are doing the aim must be to get up on pointe!!

 

It's a bit of a problem where amateur ballet is concerned I feel.

How many adults will commit themselves enough to ballet to stay around long enough to really gain the required strength for pointe work and then progress enough to make it genuinely worthwhile. Not that many probably.

 

But they are adults and mostly well over 18 (the ones I see!) so as long as a teacher is willing to teach beginners pointe work to them then I suppose then its both their responsibilities regards safety etc.

Personally I think you can do most of the ballet repertoire NOT on pointe and thoroughly enjoy it but that's just my view.

[Fiz]

I think my feet almost strong enough for pointe but I would never go ahead and try it without being told be my teacher that this was so and was safe for me to try it.

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Balleteacher

 

Thank you, I note your comments but in reality they are somewhat impractical as: ”asking a well qualified teacher who has substantial experience of putting adults on to pointe for professional advice”, I really don’t know anyone that would fill that criteria, not even the two teachers that will be teaching me en pointe. Whilst both have substantial experience teaching pointe work to teens, I'm not aware that they have as you say substantial experience in teaching someone of my years and who is also doing it from scratch. Such teachers would be extremely difficult to find if they ever existed at all.

 

As for “It is probably best actually to ask all who teach you whether you are ready for pointe work as then you should get an all around picture”. I don’t believe that would be the case, as many would be influence by the policy of the schools not to teach pointe to member of adult classes especially someone of my years, god that makes me sound old.

 

In any case I will actively listen to what my teachers have to say, but the final decision will always be mine. As I made clear in my previous post and you picked up on, I place great value on my feet, but even with the best guidance in the world there is no guarantee of freedom of injury, so clearly one has to balance the risk and listen to ones own body to take great care, which is exactly as I am doing.

 

I note LinMM’s comment “but Personally I think you can do most of the ballet repertoire NOT on pointe and thoroughly enjoy that's just my view”, I would agree. However if I am able to dance en pointe then it will have been worthwhile. I have no wish to continually haul myself up the barre or hobble around en pointe in the centre, for me its about dancing and presentation whilst performing, that’s my driving force.

 

If it turns out that I cannot develop sufficiently en pointe then I will simply abort it, a its not all the world, but that again will be my decision.

[Anna C]

I'd bet money that most, if not all the teachers who teach adults are highly experienced at starting adults off en pointe.

 

I very much doubt that you are the first adult to start pointework and you sure as heck won't be the last. :-)

 

Nobody is ever too old or experienced to learn and glean valuable information from a teacher. If that were the case, you would never see Principal Dancers receiving corrections during their daily class.

 

Edited to add: I know I've mentioned this before Michelle, but as this is a completely public forum it might be wise to consider who could be reading.

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Spannerandpony

 

I am aware that it is a public forum and also the wide range of ages of those reading this. Believe me I have held back on a lot of my comments.

 

As to teaching adults en pointe I did qualify my statement “teaching someone of my years and who is also doing it from scratch”, which is somewhat different to teaching someone in their twenties and thirties from scratch or an older person who had done it before, which I guess is the more common.

 

Either way it academic as I AM DOING IT WITH THE GUIDENCE OF MY TEACHER(S), but I will be the custodian of my safety, if it feels unsafe to continue then I will stop, but conversely I am prepared to go the distance if my body says so, I'm not half hearted about this or in a hurry.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Michelle_Richer

[Sheila Beelam]

After 30 years of RAD syllabus work, our class has embarked on rep work and we have been working on "Big Swans" from Swan Lake, the RB choreography. It is soooo much fun!

 

Not only do my muscles ache, my brain aches after class!

 

Back today for extra lesson complete with practice tutu. ????

 

The choreography is nearly in my head, then I can work on performing it, something I've never really thought about before - shocking!

 

We're not brilliant, we are a mix of ages 30-55 and heights 5ft to 6ft (on pointe) so we look a little strange, BUT we are doing what we love and enjoying every moment of it!!!

[Thecatsmother]

Just ballet. I think you are well instructed but you will wonder how I know????

[Sheila Beelam]

Oh mysterious! Is this well instructed in Southend or London? ????

[taxi4ballet]

Hi Balleteacher

 

Thank you, I note your comments but in reality they are somewhat impractical as: ”asking a well qualified teacher who has substantial experience of putting adults on to pointe for professional advice”, I really don’t know anyone that would fill that criteria, not even the two teachers that will be teaching me en pointe. Whilst both have substantial experience teaching pointe work to teens, I'm not aware that they have as you say substantial experience in teaching someone of my years and who is also doing it from scratch. Such teachers would be extremely difficult to find if they ever existed at all.

 

In any case I will actively listen to what my teachers have to say, but the final decision will always be mine. 

 

I'm quite sure that ANY teacher introducing pupils to pointe will know far more about it than any of their students (of whatever age); and if they feel that practicing at home would be beneficial, then they will give detailed advice about what should (and should not) be attempted without supervision.

[LinMM]

Are you going to perform it in Southend then Just Ballet? And is this repertoire going to be a now permanent feature of your classes?

 

I can't wait till December now for the City Academy's Swan Lake workshop....I think we're doing the waltz from Act 2 and "Little Swans"....ha ha!

 

It is quite tiring though isn't it....on the brain I mean....as you add more and more bits then wondering whether you'll remember the beginning!!

[Sheila Beelam]

Gosh no LinMM I could never perform, but I love dancing - we're just learning it for ourselves and I dare say once we've "mastered" it, we'll try something else, but mustn't lose focus from syllabus work!

 

City Acad workshop sounds fun, it's just such a busy time of year

 

It's very tiring on the brain and body, I've loss so much stamina over the summer, I may even need to resort to the gym to get me back on track!!

Sx

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi Taxi4ballet

 

I think you have completely got the wrong end of the stick, the point I was making is,  it’s unusual for someone of my years (retired) to contemplate going en pointe from scratch as I have never done it when I was younger.

 

Finding a teacher that had that experience I would have thought quite rare, as I would have thought there are special considerations to apply to a more elderly student and especially if they have never gone en pointe before.

 

I quite agree “that ANY teacher introducing pupils to pointe will know far more about it than any of their students”. However I am sure if I ask my dozen or so teachers, I will get twelve different views where their opinion range widely. I personally are only concerned with the two teachers that offer pointe work to adults.

 

As for practicing at home; Building strength isn't going to happen with one half hour class a week. As it is, I will be putting that class on time share, so I will only see them on alternate weeks. If I am to make any significant progress its essential that I do regular pointe work, in my case that will be every other day. I'm prepared for that and my teacher has bought into that too. After Christmas I will start my second pointe class which is not available at the moment.

 

You also have to remember that the both teachers concerned do know me very well and I hope trust me too, even though with my enthusiasm I can be a handful. I am already in too deep with ballet to put undue risk of injury due to inappropriate pointe work, so I wont be attempting pirouettes just yet, but joking aside, if I find I'm not progressing or I get a feeling that something in my body is giving cause for concern, then I will drop the pointe work. Preserving my ballet fitness has to be the priority.

[Michelle_Richer]

Hi JustBallet

 

Wow that’s fantastic, the waltz sounds very much like the one we used for “the Waltz of the Swans” at LAB SI, I still get emotional when I hear it. As LinMM said we are doing that one again at ROH with City Academy.

 

Tell me how do you do the Big Swan Dance as a class, do you take it in turns dancing as a duet or do you all dance together with half dancing the right hand duet part and the others the left hand duet part. Please don’t tell me you are stood at the side in a classic pose with your arms crossed.

 

So how are those high leg developpe’s and jete's. I assume the practice tutu was the long romantic one, two of the girls at LAB SI, had rhinestone on the front of their white leotards with romantic tutu’s they looked absolutely gorgeous. I found some similar sticky on rhinestones when I visiting the indoor market at Leeds following my class at Northern Ballet.

 

I assume you have a video clip of the RB choreography to get it in your head before class. I’ve just played the clip through a couple of times, awww I wish I could come, it sounds absolutely fabulous to be able to build it up week by week.

 

.