Ballet school pecking order?!

[thewinelake]

Probably heresy to ask and the inevitable "it's complicated" is probably the right answer, but is there a kind of league table of full time ballet schools in the uk? Maybe an old thread?

[2dancersmum]

I've never seen any sort of official league table.  I think that is one of those questions that cannot really be answered as it is so subjective and I am sure that people would not be in agreement with each other.  As you say 'it is complicated' what may be best for one child may not be best to another and I have yet to come across any school that does not have its negatives as well as its positives..

[Living the Dream]

There's an old thread on this topic.  Here's the link http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/1322-ballet-school-ranking/?hl=%2Bleague+%2Btable#entry16054

Hope this answers your questions. LTD

[sarahw]

My observation as a non dancing Mum is that this is a bit of a taboo but I have observed (and I am happy to be corrected) that for Lower Schools RBS and Elmhurst seem to be rated highest in terms of graduate employment in classical jobs. But is that because they get the most talented students so they should come out top?

 

However it is of course much more complicated than that! For example there have been conversations here about RBS 'acquiring' students from elsewhere so where should the credit really be attributed in terms of their final employment?

 

At Upper School level additional schools enter the fray.

 

Also, different schools may suit different children at different times. ....The style of each school is quite different. And for MT the answer will be different. ......

 

Clearly the competition is fierce and there are very talented dc at all schools..... Most of our dc would love tobe at any of them and getting an MDS is a massive achievement.

 

Now I'll duck for cover. .......!!!!!

Edited March 16, 2015 by sarahw

[Stirrups36]

The timing of this question is probably a little delicate, given auditions and results are happening as we speak!

 

The Bolshoi (yes, I know it is not UK, but if you are wanting league tables, then you cannot ignore overseas schools or students) then has a good reputation... In some respects. Same with Laine, Northern, Paris, RBS, bird, Elmhurst, Central, enb, RCS, YDA, Hammond, Hamburg, ballet west and so on.

 

All are different and the number ending up graduating from Bolshoi is small. But the number graduating from others and getting great jobs, in whatever field, gives you a wide choice. So look at the graduate destinations. Look at the teachers, at the facilities and try for what your child wants to do and is best at.

 

And make up your own mind, as everyone will have different opinions. At some point you will almost certainly think it was the wrong choice. Your and others opinions will change almost year by year, as the teacher is SO important. (Just as in academic education, the teacher is sometimes more important than the the school. If you have a teacher who is wrong for you in one of the best schools, That is probably worse then having a teacher who is good for you in one of the 'lesser' schools). And you will find at least one person who hates something about any of the schools! And sometimes all!

[thewinelake]

Ah, yes, that other thread is quite a warning, but interesting.

 

Just for the record, I'm only asking out of academic curiosity - none of my family have any intention of taking up ballet professionally (although it does strike me as odd that they and loads of others seem to do these "vocational exams" just because they can!).

 

I'm surprised only 4 were listed (what's an MDS?) although some mention of Northern Ballet School and YDA (what's that?!). I suppose a crude way of assessing a pecking order would be "how hard is it to get into?" although I do understand that this is misleading. I should also state that I'm a passionate skeptic when it comes to school league tables, so my question is knowingly simplistic...

[Picturesinthefirelight]

MDS is Music & Dance Scheme funding. It is a government scholarship scheme available at 4 independent full time music schools from age 8 & 4 full time dance schools from age 11.

 

royal ballet school have all their places funded by the scheme on a means tested basis, elmhurst all or nearly all. Hammond & TRING have less awards so some students pay fees in the normal way.

 

YDA Is Young Dancers Academy - a ballet school for children up to age 16 with a very good reputation. But no MDS Awards so students have to pay fees.

[Katymac]

MDs's can also be accessed through CATS (Centres for Advanced Training) which are p/t dance school with different specialities (Contemporary, Ballet & a South Asian Dance) Look here http://www.nationaldancecats.co.uk/

 

My DD is doing Musical Theatre & her top 4 are Bird, Laines, Urdang & Performers so a completely different range - but there are more & more schools starting up or developing their courses to post 16 or post 18 so it becomes more & more complicated

[audsjcanuck]

Just curious, I notice ENBS not mentioned a lot in this (these) discussions. Is it because it doesn't have lower school? Or is not a serious consideration. I thought they had good record for employment also.

[aileen]

ENBS and Central do not have lower schools.

[Jan McNulty]

ENBS is Upper School only (as is Central). NB has taken in 5 or 6 dancers from ENBS in the last couple of years and they have all been terrific and 3 whom I think are spectacular!

[Jan McNulty]

Posted at same time as Aileen!

[meadowblythe]

A heartfelt plea - don't let the prestige of a place overtake your gut feel - or belief that a child may be better suited to a different institution.

 

If I could change one thing in my life (and believe me, it's a long, long list of things I would change ) it would be to not have believed that because a school was more prestigious, it was better for my child.

[Dance*is*life]

I do agree that it very much depends on the teachers you have and what suits your child, even in the best schools.  When I was in the RBS Upper School, I was put into a class with Pamela May (former ballerina) as my teacher and I totally adored her - hung on her every word and excused her for smoking and teaching in high heels!  For some reason after less than a month I and three other girls were moved into another teacher's class.  They claimed that the class was too full and that we were the youngest in it - really??????  Anyway, the second teacher was one of the most respected, admired and beloved of all teachers and I hated her and her classes!  I stopped working, cried most of the day and didn't shake out of it until my mother went up to the school and fought for me to be put back with Pamela May!  Nowadays I take classes with a wide variety of teachers and some I like and some I don't.  They are all very well respected and experienced teachers, but some just don't suit me.  Teaching is a very personal thing.

[LinMM]

Do you mind me asking why you choose to take classes with teachers today that you don't really like?!

 

I can see as a student you may not have quite so much choice in these matters but as an adult ......does one have to put oneself through someone's class who you don't really like?

 

Or

Is this some sort of discipline thing where you don't like the teacher that much but respect what it is they have to offer as a teacher?

 

I can think of just one person who I could take classes with (still teaching after all these years!) but who still fills me with a sort of dread who has a very very interesting take on ballet ......but so far haven't had the nerve!!

Edited March 19, 2015 by LinMM

[balletla]

I firmly believe that the teacher is more important than the school and the school is only as good as its teachers.

[LinMM]

Yes probably inclined to agree Ribbons.

 

There are certain teachers who just have had such an amazing influence on oneself and in the end I think you can only follow your heart with this.......others may be influenced by other teachers..... But you have to follow with what you are connecting with.

 

The teacher I was thinking of was super strict and ultra focussed .......and I was sort of fascinated but also terrified at the same time!

 

A part of me would like to re connect but another part of me thinks that as an adult I probably don't need to put myself through it any more (though by all accounts the teacher has mellowed too with time!)

 

But in general I agree whether ballet school or not a school is only as good as it's teachers in the end.

Edited March 19, 2015 by LinMM

[Dance*is*life]

I wouldn't deliberately take classes with teachers I don't like (!) but for several months of the year, in the centre where I take classes,  the regular adult ballet class on Tuesday mornings becomes part of an enrichment course for dance teachers - bit like the professional development courses that the RAD now insists upon for their teachers, except that for some wierd reason the RAD doesn't think that taking class adds to our ability to teach  . Anyway, the teacher changes every two, three or four weeks and I am not always familiar with the ones they choose.  So I take the first class or two to try them out and then don't come if I don't enjoy them or gain anything from them.  It's very interesting though to see how different they all are in their teaching methods and how each one finds some other aspect of technique or musicality to concentrate on.  I do have different needs nowadays as a rather old adult dancer and if I don't get warmed up properly at the barre, I don't manage the centre, so there are some teachers I just have to say - Well twenty years ago I would have loved your class, but not now, I'm afraid ............