Adult beginner - how far can an adult who is new to ballet progress?

[ldthomas]

Welcome to the forum ldthomas! I have moved your post into the appropriate area, Doing Dance. Sim (moderator)

 

 

Hello everyone!

 

I'm a 31 year old woman and I'm quite new to ballet (as in, only a few months). I attend 3 classical ballet classes a week, and 4 cardio dance classes a week. I'm also a certified yoga teacher. I've found a new passion in ballet, and the hour I spend in class every day is what inspires me in life, in work, in everything. I'm dedicated and passionate about advancing my skills as a dancer (although, I admit to having no skills quite yet, but you get my meaning). I want to progress and maybe, one day, be able to go en pointe.

 

After reading many blogs, articles, and books about ballet, the consensus seemed to be that adults can certainly train to go en pointe, it just takes a lot of time, dedication, strength, and flexibility. Every single article I read had the same advice, "talk to your teacher and they can help direct you toward the kind of training you'll need to go en pointe."

 

Well, I did exactly that. I spoke to two different teachers in my city, and they both had the same answer: "we do not train adults to go en pointe due to the health risks."

 

Which is why I'm coming to you.

 

I feel discouraged and confused. It seemed that eventually going en pointe was a possibility for me, but no one I talk to here agrees with that. Does anyone have any advice? Is it true that adults can go en pointe after enough training? Have I been misled? Or are the teachers who told me that adults can't/shouldn't go en pointe misled?

 

Don't get me wrong - I understand that there are challenges associated with adults who are new to ballet. I hold no delusions about that, I guess I'm wondering just how far I'll be able to take this before I hit a wall and I'm forced to stop?

 

Does that make sense?

 

Anyway - thanks for your time. I appreciate it!

[Jan McNulty]

Hello ldthomas and welcome to the Forum.

 

A number of our members attend adult ballet classes and there are plenty of topics on the subject of adult ballet.  Here are a couple to get you going and it is worth searching around the Doing Dance Forum:

 

http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/5031-simply-adult-ballet/?hl=%2Bsimply+%2Badult+%2Bballet

 

http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/8883-rad-adult-ballet-repertoire-workshops/

[Thecatsmother]

I think this is a tricky one to answer generally as in my opinion it really is on a case by case basis and finding a teacher who is willing to teach adult pointe work. There is a basic anatomical factor of whether an individual's feet and ankles are flexible and strong enough to physically be able to reach the correct alignment upon pointe. By that I mean there needs to be enough mobility and strength to be able to get fully over the block of the shoe. It may well be that this is why people respond with the ask the teacher comment as they will be able to tell you from looking at your feet and ankles. That would be my first question to any teacher- If I was considering trying pointe work when my feet are strong enough, do I have feet and ankles which would allow me to reach the correct position en pointe? If the answer is no, which it can be for adolescents as well, then you probably risk injury as you are forcing your body to do something which it anatomically cannot do.

If the answer is that you could get the correct position en pointe then it is a case of strengthening the feet and legs and getting to a stage technically where you are ready and then with the right guidance you may well be able to do pointework.

Perhaps have a look at the Lisa Howell-perfect pointe material on the ballet blog. I believe she has some free articles which also discuss this.

Hope this helps.

[LinMM]

I very much agree it is a very individual thing.

 

You are still comparatively young at 31 but first things first.

 

You have only been dancing a few months and even if you are very fit(sounds like you are though) you need to give it time before thinking about pointe work.

 

In my opinion and actual experience it is not just the feet and ankles but the whole of the back muscles and core must be strong enough so as to prevent the body weight sinking into the feet when on pointe.

 

I do see adult learners on pointe who in my opinion should NOT be!!

 

However there are teachers who will teach you especially if you live anywhere near London UK or other major cities in the world which have some ballet tradition there.

And you yourself could become proficient on pointe ........even just being able to do some bourrees correctly across the room will feel great.....but you may need to have some patience.

Again every individual is different slightly but as a general rule I would advise doing ballet for a mimimum of two years before considering pointe work. If you're really hooked you'll still be doing it in two years time anyway!! But that's just a guide.

 

When much younger people are learning (who because their feet are still growing so even more important to do safely) they usually have to get to an RAD grade say .... of grade 6 ....before pointe work is introduced so that means for most at least five or six years of ballet learning first!!

 

I definitely think it could at least be a possibility for you though. It's just a case of "not running before you can walk" as the saying goes

[Dance*is*life]

Yes I agree - you really need to be patient! You can't run before you can walk and you can't do pointe work before you know enough correct ballet technique. Maybe you will reach that stage in a couple of years - perhaps it will take you longer, but you must be aware that pointe work is a lot more than learning how to tie the ribbons and managing to balance on the tips of your toes. Ballet is beautiful abd professional dancers make it look very easy, but it isn't - it takes years of hard work. I am not trying to be discouraging and I really hope that you will fulfill your dream and dance on pointe one day. However, it is not something that I would recommend for an adult who is an absolute beginner. Work hard and be patient and I am sure you will get there in the end!

Edited March 8, 2015 by Dance*is*life

[LinMM]

I also have an aesthetic thing where if someone is on pointe they've got to look good.......obviously as well as properly strong enough!

 

To be honest who wants to see someone with knees all bent hobbling along in the centre(when they should still be at most on the barre still) just to say "I do pointe work" pointe work does look beautiful......but only if done correctly and with enough general training in ballet etc.

 

I know I'm going to bore everyone who reads this thread regularly but there is just so much more to ballet for me at any rate it's NOT JUST ABOUT POINTEWORK!!

 

I'd rather see someone actually dancing with real style and conviction NOT on pointe than someone hobbling around in the centre when they are not really strong enough or ready to on pointe. Sorry if this is not a very popular view but it's only my take on it all.

 

This not to put you off. I hope you will make it one day but try to enjoy all the other aspects of classical ballet first.......Then you will look more beautiful on pointe eventually!!

[aileen]

I can understand the aspiration of any student dancer to want to dance on pointe. Pointe is what separates a ballet dancer from every other type of dancer. I can't advise on this but what I can say is that there is a huge amount of beautiful and technically demanding choreography which can be danced in ballet slippers.

[Thecatsmother]

Here is the article I referred to

http://www.theballetblog.com/article/how-old-is-too-old-to-start-pointe-work/

[toursenlair]

Hi ldthomas and good for you for taking up ballet. I am 55 and have been doing ballet since I was 13, and I can tell you there's plenty enough to think about when you're dancing in soft shoes without adding in the complications of pointe, which I did briefly as a teenager and, um, it hurts (don't know if anyone has mentioned that to you!).

I know some adult late starters who do pointe (I don't know how long after they started taking class, but as stated above, it would have to be a few years, but I think it's possible to get in touch with your inner ballerina without doing it. Every so often I wear a tutu and a tiara to class to fulfil my ballerina fantasies. They don't hurt.

All the best with your ballet studies!

[toursenlair]

also as I recall, pointe class consisted of doing a zillion rises through demi pointe to pointe and back down again, followed by a zillion releves to pointe. I'd rather spend my ballet class time working on something dancier, like perfecting my adage or my pirouettes or my jumps.

I know this sounds like the blase reaction of the "been there, done that, got the bunions" ballet student, and that pointe has an almost mystical attraction for someone who's never done it. But there is a bit of a "be careful what you wish for" phenomenon with pointe, I would say.

[aileen]

I know of several teenage girls who started pointe work but then stopped it but carried on with their normal grade classes. It's very exciting to get your first pointe shoes but the novelty soon wears off!

[LinMM]

Yes I can understand that attraction to get on pointe once you've started ballet ......whatever your age! There is something mystical/magical about it.

 

And I suppose I too have already earlier in my life in my 20's and 30's dancing as an amateur done a fair bit of pointe work

I must say in the end I got fed up with it ......sometimes very sore feet and in growing toe nails and the like etc ......and in the end it was a relief to say bye bye to my pointe shoes!!

 

The problem is when starting as an adult (I had also first learnt this between 12-15 as well) .....is that to get any good at all on pointe it would take ages. And if you are trying to learn a really nice enchainement AND worrying about staying on pointe etc it's really hard to concentrate on dance quality at the same time. The Professionals can do it so easily because of the YEARS they have spent doing it.

 

But for an amateur starting as an adult.......and especially if they did not do ballet as a child.....I would say the best thing once you are ready .......and a responsible teacher won't hurry this just because the pupil is in a hurry .......so find a teacher who is cautious (not against) about pointe work I would say......is to do a SEPARATE pointe work class ......which may start out as only 30 mins initially though.....so you can use other classes to concentrate on dancing and other aspects of ballet. (Sorry about this sentence structure!)

 

I said in the earlier post that I'd rather see someone who is dancing with real style and conviction and I might add musicality .......well that is a big enough challenge as it is for an adult beginner or older returner to ballet!!

[alison]

I think it may also be worth mentioning that a number of places won't actually countenance their adult students doing pointework, but cite health & safety concerns - they seem to be more worried about a pointe shoe-related accident, or possibly a dancer injuring themselves by doing pointework, than anything else, and it's just easier to apply a blanket ban.

[LinMM]

It has just occurred to me of a confusion that may arise with beginners ballet and pointework etc

 

If one sees a "beginners pointework" class advertised then one could assume this is aimed at "beginners ballet"

 

The difference is that the pointework class will be aimed at people who have been doing ballet for quite a while ........some may think that pointework is introduced at the beginning of ballet learning not realising that some experience is required first!

 

Just a thought as adults new to ballet and the ballet world may not realise this and then wonder why a teacher is reluctant to teach them pointework as a "beginner" if they think the two go together right at the beginning.

 

Hope this clarifies......but on reading above hope it doesn't just add to the confusion!

Must be a downward phase of the moon

[Moomin]

I agree with the points above. The vast majority of adults don't show the commitment required and either take classes sporadically or take multiple classes but burn out quickly. If you can show the same amount of dedication that you are now over 2 or 3 years I'm sure your teachers will be much more willing to consider pointe. In the meantime you definitely don't need pointe to enjoy your classes! As a minimum I think you'd have to be in the 'healthy' weight range, have enough flexibility in your ankles and feet and be strong enough to balance on 3/4 pointe in various positions for a reasonable amount of time. I think an example is releve into retire for 10 seconds which is quite difficult although will also depend on your physique & whether you are hypermobile etc. if you are enjoying baller I'd say just carry on enjoying it, don't worry about the pointe for now but keep in the back of your mind that there are teachers who will teach adults.

[Gargouillade]

I started ballet as an adult and I have managed to go on pointe. I did 2 years of ballet, at least 6 hours a week, before I started wearing pointe shoes in beginner pointe lessons. I then remained at the barre for about a year before I was allowed by my teacher to go into the centre. After a year in the centre, I learnt enough to dance variations on pointe with the guidance and instruction of my teacher (although there is a lot lacking with my artistry!!)

 

As everyone here has wisely said, it is a lot of commitment and work. I did at least 6 hours of ballet a week and am now up to 8 hours with weekly privates. I dutifully did my releves and foot strengthening exercises every day. Every moment on pointe is a struggle—you have to remember to pull up and out of your shoes, keep your core engaged, turn out, have a strong straight spine etc. Along the way I lost toenails and spent an inordinate amount of money in my quest for the right shoe. 

 

I think my experience proves what others have posted earlier: you need the correct anatomy, a teacher who is willing to teach you, and the patience to go veeeeerrrryyyyy slowly. It is something to aspire to, yes, but it is also something to work for.

 

All the best!

[Lisa O`Brien]

Just to put my two pennies worth in. The fact is that ANYONE can put on a pair of pointe shoes and go on the tip of their toes.Even men. There isn`t some divine mystery to it. But you only have to see photographs on the internet of girls on their toes who have clearly had next to no ballet training. It looks just ghastly and so so wrong. It`s not that we trained dancers are snobs and think pointe work is for some elite few. It IS for many women and girls to try,but if and when they have had a good few years training in the basics first. Otherwise it would be rather like someone doing a very fast trill on a piano with very little knowledge of the scales and music theory behind them first.

[ldthomas]

Thank you everyone so much!  This was all really encouraging.  After hearing two blanket "no, we won't train adults en pointe" I was feeling pretty discouraged.  The commitment is there, and absolutely I understand the hard work and patience involved (I'm not about to go out on my own and buy a pair of shoes and do this). My goal is to at least give it a try in two-three years, but only if my body is anatomically ready.

 

Also, you're all very correct - there's so much more to ballet than just going en pointe.  So for now, I shall work hard, train hard, have a ton of fun, and see where it takes me.

 

Thanks everyone for your time!

[Jan McNulty]

Don't forget to keep us updated on how you are getting on! Good luck!

[LinMM]

Well I think dancedancedance's story should give you every encouragement!! It is possible for some amateur dancers to get proficient on pointe given enough time and commitment!!

 

Once you are ready I'm sure you will find the right teacher too.

I don't know where you are based but if in UK then I'm sure many here could point you in the direction of such a teacher and I do know a couple myself in London and London area.

 

Here in Brighton there is a BBO school for adults to learn ballet and the same rule applies here to adults as if to younger children.

If absolute beginners adults want to progress through the grades (though not necessarily taking the exams) they can attempt pointework when they reach Grade 6.

[Cara in NZ]

Just wanted to add that I started ballet (Russian) at age 19, having always wanted to but my mother was never keen. After 3 years of 3-4 classes a week, a few of us were allowed to get pointe shoes. I think the teacher assessed how strong/committed we were, and also how motivated. I enjoyed it, but she didn't give us any advice about shoe-fitting and it took years for the callouses on my toes to go away. Now my DD (age 11) has just got her first pair and I'm enjoying her excitement!