rowan

I'm not sure naivety suggests a lack of drive and ambition. After all, if students are chugging on through the grades, even on one class a week, they are making progress. But getting Grade 8 ballet is just not going to be enough, is it, whereas getting Grade 8 in piano might be enough to get a student a place at conservatoire or university. I know the Qualifications and Curriculum Authority(?) say they're the same level, but I don't think I believe that. I've met young dancers who have no idea that the vocational grades even exist because their dance school doesn't teach them. I remember being astounded a few years ago when DD's dance school said she needed to be doing four classes a week, and that seemed a huge amount, and she does a lot more than that now.

I've added my thoughts on this on the other thread: "Press Release: Northern Ballet Documentary in May" in the Ballet/Dance News & Information section. But, yes, I agree with you, Norman S! Edited by Janet McNulty to say that I have moved Rowan's comments into this thread. Thanks

This was very interesting - thanks for mentioning it, Janet, because I probably would have missed it otherwise. I think Northern Ballet came out of it very well and it must have helped their campaign. I would have liked to have heard more from NB's own marketing team about their other ideas; it seemed obvious to me that "Sponsor a Dancer" would have much more appeal than "Buy Back a Dancer" because one is so much more positive than the other. I also felt somewhat taken aback at the mention of £50 being the amount they'd like individuals to give because that seemed a lot to me; the folk who'd given £30 along with a "sweet letter" might be a little put out to learn that their offering would be considered paltry - which I know it is in the great scheme of things, but surely every little helps. I felt a little sorry for the dancers at the first event, where they stood around in costume looking a bit awkward and, as was said, "decorative". The second event where they were all intermingled at the meal was clearly a better idea; I would assume that most people interested in ballet are actually interested in talking to ballet dancers too, The dancers interviewed (all British) came over very well indeed.

It's worth remembering that the Sansha shop offers a discount - 20%, I think - for dance students; this includes those on associate schemes. Tights are excluded from the offer, though. We've bought leotards and things from there, but never shoes. I have to say, I've never found the Sansha staff unhelpful at all.

Are you perhaps thinking of London Children's Ballet, Tomuchtallent? There are clips of the auditions for that on Youtube. I've no knowledge of London Junior Ballet, though.

The problem is that sports people do improve in technique and efficiency over the years, breaking records as they go. Compare what a gymnast now can do alongside one from 20 or 30 years ago; an Olympic-medal-winning performance then would be commonplace nowadays. However, how would, say, a top violinist nowadays compare with one from 20 or 30 years ago? Pretty much the same, I would suggest, though I've absolutely no knowledge of violinists - correct me if I'm wrong, anybody! Ballet is supposed to be a similar art form that uses the body, much as a violinist would use the violin. But I'm afraid that I think times have changed, and more "gymnastics" are expected in ballet and other dance forms nowadays, even if they are not classically correct.

I'm really taken aback to hear of this "Eurotrash" label referring to dance; I've never heard of it before. It's derogatory, isn't it? Or isn't it meant quite like that?

Even ordinary splits positions shouldn't be appearing in a ballet, technically, never mind the oversplit positions.

Is the "vocabulary" very different depending on what system of training is being used? While the French terminology is common throughout, the techniques that are taught will be different, surely, in precisely how the student does a cou de pied or a fouette for example. The RAD 5th position for arms is the Vaganova 3rd position; the Cecchetti numbering system starts with the corners and then the walls, the RAD starts with walls and then the corners, Vaganova starts at the front and goes round clockwise. I'm sure the ballet schools will be aware of these differences, but perhaps a student might be confused.

What a shame, Afab. Thank you so much for posting and telling us all about it.

Very interesting. Thanks for posting, Pups_mum. I find it hard to believe that Robert Helpmann was Australian after listening to him speak - an English accent last heard somewhere around the time of "Brief Encounter"! Were the dancers good? I've looked them up and I can see they had long-established careers, but I have to say... (whispering it quietly) ..I think I'd expect more from a ballet dancer today.

I think that there is almost a mythology surrounding ballet and suffering. It seems rare to read about a dancer who does not mention their bruised, bloodied, blistered and bunioned feet! In Tamara Rojo's recent interview in the Evening Standard (on the Links section) it was almost shocking to read how she thought ballet was lots of fun. I almost did a double-take at that because I think the suffering, pain and exhaustion tend to be what we get to hear about, almost certainly in the attempt t to keep proving how physically demanding (and worthwhile?) ballet is. The myth of the "suffering genius" too can be big in other art forms too - literature, music, art are full of tortured souls where the greater the suffering, the greater the genius - but this often just relates to mental suffering, not the physical suffering that dancers, especially ballet dancers, are "supposed" to undergo. There is something sadistic and masochistic about it all. Hopefully it's changing.

I also tried and failed to get tickets to this because it was sold out - the very short run at SW doesn't help. I don't do "pretty and pink" either, and the fact that I wasn't keen on one costume definitely wouldn't put me off!

I've just had a look on the clips of the ballet on Sadler's Wells' website, and it's clear that the costume is actually sewn like that, as opposed to it being caught up between the dancer's legs as she moves, as I first thought. I'm afraid it does give the appearance of an overlarge, yet all too revealing, nappy. But I haven't seen this ballet in the flesh, as it were. Perhaps the costume gives a different impression on stage.

And something else to think about: the 1995 ballet "Bella Figura" by Jiří Kylián is performed topless, for both the men and women...

Is there any information on the ritual that is the curtain call? The first time I saw a ballet I was surprised by just how long it went on for, the curtain going up and down and partially open, dancers emerging, all in a definite order, the presenting of flowers, the conductor coming on, the director, applause for the orchestra, etc...

Precise requirements are on the POB school website. I've just tried to import the table, but it lost all its formatting, so became a huge jumble of numbers!

US - Upper School Or Us - the members of Balletcoforum!

Ballet "superstar" Polina Semionova is an example of a ballerina who is definitely not flat-chested!

Is retaking a year common practice at all schools?

Wow, does Elmhurst have a special relationship with Vanemuine Theatre, Estonia?!

One that threw me recently on this site was CG, better known as Covent Garden, which, if you're not referring to an area of London or its tube station, is itself better known as the ROH, the Royal Opera House, the home of the RB, the Royal Ballet.

M for Musicality! Without this, is there any dance at all?

I would have thought that dancers used to soloist roles wouldn't fit very well back in a unified corps, despite the fact that they would have started their dancing careers there. Wouldn't their individual styles and personalities be too dominant?

I've wondered if corps dancers get to dance more than soloists. They will be performing every night of the production at least whereas the named artistes often share the roles between a few of them throughout the run, and might often not have a great deal to do. Is this true? I'm not entirely sure how the hierarchy of a company works either; is it normal for dancers to dance roles below their rank, or is that an absolute no-no? Or does it depend on the company?