rowan

I was surprised to receive an email from the ROH asking for my opinions of this production. For how long have they been doing audience feedback surveys? I haven't seen a ballet at the ROH for ages, so perhaps I'm out of the loop. I saw the Saturday 29th evening production.

Are the people who are running this the same ones who were involved in the Abergavenny Ballet School? There was a thread about it.

Are you looking for a whole school day's worth of ballet lessons in RAD method or syllabus? I would think that might be difficult to find. DD's school once offered her a reduced curriculum when they discovered how much ballet she was doing, which took us by complete surprise. They apparently get a lot of requests from football-playing boys, which they usually turn down, but as long as she stayed on top of her schoolwork, she would be a good candidate. As we'd gone to talk to the head of year over something completely different, this offer was a shock, and not one we took up - we wanted her to be keener on the school work and less keen on the ballet, I'm afraid! You could try approaching an RAD teacher for private lessons during the day, when usually they are not so busy. (edited to add last sentence)

Glowlight, I have very much appreciated your wise and sensible comments as an experienced "ballet parent" on this forum, and the old one! You could wean off gradually as opposed to going completely cold turkey!

I think Gingerbread's point about funded places is interesting; it's something I haven't thought of. Could a child's funded / means tested / bursary place be removed if a school discovered that a child was secretly having paid private lessons elsewhere that parents clearly were able to fund? Again, I hope no one takes offence; I completely understand all the reasons that have been mentioned why children take private lessons but I'm just interested in what the vocational school policies and rules are. Has anyone ever been "told off", or worse, for taking private lessons?

Tutoo2much, I mean by "gilded cage" that some children at some vocational schools might feel trapped, even in very prestigious institutions that other children are clamouring to get into, If people feel they can't or shouldn't or mustn't tell the school that a child wants private lessons or indeed is having private lessons elsewhere, I think that's a concern. I've no doubt that this might be an issue in "outside" dance schools too, but a school in which a child is living, having their dance education, their academic education and which is responsible for their pastoral care has a lot of power. I must emphasise that I have no personal knowledge of the vocational schools; I have never set foot inside the door of one. These are just my impressions from reading the forum! ;

So, in addition to the "under the counter" private lessons, exactly how does a child audition elsewhere without a school's permission or knowledge if they're at vocational school? Or do the schools happily sign forms, take photos or write references? Audition application forms need a teacher's signature at the very least. Is part of the reason for private lessons to get another teacher on side who can help? I am beginning to get the impression from reading this thread that the vocational schools are gilded cages!

I've known of children taking weekly private lessons outside their top vocational schools, unbeknownst to the school; I was really surprised when I first learned this. What would the penalty be if it was discovered? Why would some children get permission and not others (if permission was sought)? Do the schools know this goes on and they just turn a blind eye? I'm not criticising anyone at all for doing this, I'm just curious about the schools' attitude.

But do you have to get permission from the school? Is the school OK with it?

I'm no expert, but I suspect people won't like to admit that they're doing this, or have done this, apart from the very few on this forum who have mentioned it. I would guess that most of the schools will have policies that don't allow extra private lessons outside their establishment, unless with their permission... And do the schools give permission? I'd be surprised. But I'd be happy to be proved wrong.

It's probably worth remembering that for many young people, being a cruise ship dancer is not their Plan B, C or D; it's their Plan A. A couple of months ago I overheard two teenage girls on a train, who were clearly intensely involved in musical theatre training, talking about how their greatest desire was to dance on cruise ships, and just how fierce the competition was.

Yes, that article is definitely not happy reading. These dancers are graduates from top schools too. Do NEBT dancers just get a one-year contract, and then they have to move on elsewhere, so new graduates can get a chance with the company the next year? Have I understood it correctly?

Ah, what's in a name? In the days when I knew absolutely nothing about ballet and had only ever seen one "access" production for ballet newcomers, I really thought that ballet and ballet theatre were two very different beasts. "Ballet theatre" of course might attract people who would be put off at the thought of seeing a "ballet". I just assumed ballet theatre was a lesser form of ballet. I had never heard of Northern Ballet Theatre or knew anything about them. Even the major American company ABT I assumed must be of this weird fusion mix...

I think this is not uncommon, especially with any ballet company that is called XX Theatre. People think it's part theatre, with speaking roles, and part ballet. When Northern Ballet were called Northern Ballet Theatre I'm afraid I'll admit to thinking they couldn't be a proper ballet company, and their productions must be an odd fusion of theatre and ballet... Oh, the shame!

Sorry, Pups_mum, I think I led the thread astray! I think if you regard tights as extra-long knickers, you wouldn't see it as going commando - just a different mindset!

I don't think the teachers would be pleased if DD turned up in dance shorts either! I think that's a no-no too.

I thought no knickers under leotards was absolutely normal, time of the month or not. The tights are the knickers, just ones with long legs! One of my other teenage daughters is into diving and you don't wear knickers in that sport, and I don't see much difference between a swimming costume and a leotard. Nevertheless, I will ask DD if she wants any invisible knickers!

Thanks for posting the Elmhurst video. I've heard of this programme but I've never seen it before. I had no idea Elmhurst was so modern!

The best invisible knickers are no knickers at all! Just wear tights under the leotard.

I'm feeling a bit dense here and am mystified by much of this thread. How do you know whether your feet, or a child's, need orthotics or not? I'm not sure what orthotics are - I feel a bit of intense Googling coming on! What problems are people having with their feet? Or is it something to do with how your shoes wear down? Is it something a doctor can diagnose?

When DD's first ballet teacher wasn't able to teach her any more and we needed to find a new school, we were given the advice, "Be guided by the child. She will know."

I've used tea to dye white elastic for shoes very successfully!

Can you dye tights that have lost their colour? We seem to be drowning in tights which are, apparently, too faded or grey to use.

Daniel de Andrade's blog (above) was very interesting. This TV programme is called Arts Troubleshooter and of course it has to focus on the man who is parachuted in for that role and make it appear that it is he alone who spots the faults, has the ideas and effects the transformation.

My point about the standard graded exams is that I think they're misleading to young people if they think that's the indication of the amount of hours they need to put in and the standard they need to be to get into an upper school. I know that Grade 8 in a music exam isn't an indication of professional standard, but it is does indicate a basic minimum standard (often gained at a relatively young age) that seems more generally accepted in the music world for entry into their "upper schools" or university.