Neverdancedjustamum

Thank you, Jan! I think that’s where we will be arriving actually. All the train stations also confuse me but I just checked out tickets and it is indeed Moor Street. We will check out Millennium Lounge for sure 🙂

I also think it will largely depend on what kind of dance-related job she would like in the future. Is it a career in classical ballet or a more varied/multi-genre one? My DD about 3 years ago was contemplating a future career in dance (to be fair, amongst other possible careers) but the last 2 years have been extremely eye-opening for us. My DD loves diff genres of dance but admittedly takes more ballet classes and even dabbled with the idea of applying for full time over couple of years ago. However, when we both saw the time and finance commitment it would take, both of us just slowly lost interest. She has been dancing since she was 5 but it was only in the last 2-3 years the full extent of what it takes to successfully apply for a full time place in top ballet schools dawned on us. I am sure a lot would have diff experiences and I do think it’s a bit diff for boys and girls but we have witnessed a lot of cases of DCs who successfully get into full time places by doing lots of classes, multiple associates, sometimes attend multiple schools/teachers, private lessons, Pilates, conditioning, workshops, intensives - just witnessing these first hand made us feel exhausted. We didn’t have the commitment, focus, financial means and time to even get close to what these other kids were doing. My DD decided then and there she just wanted to enjoy dance for how it is and how she first fell in love with it. With no pressure or any immediate goal. She wanted lots of time to devote to school work and friends and her other activities such as art and sports. There was just no way we could invest that much money and time (nor would we have wanted to) especially since she was also preparing for important academic entrance exams at the time and this for us would always be priority. However, this is more classical ballet. I have seen numerous DCs succeed in multi-genre even if they started getting serious later on. They attend “normal” school until Year 11 and then successfully get into vocational schools for 6th form and on to varied employment. It would very much depend on what your DD wants as a dance job.

Thanks so much everyone! I’m literally taking note of the suggestions on my phone and will try and work our way through them tomorrow. We have pretty much the whole day. We are taking the train in (v early start for us) then walking to Nicholson to drop off DD. My DS (15yo) would love all the suggestions above although Cadbury World is something my DD would love more. DS and I have always loved aquariums from when he was a toddler so that may well be top of our to-do list. I now need to Google how to get to these places from the City centre. No doubt I’ll get lost again (my history has proven this time and time again) but my DS has great navigation skills and only needs to go to a place once to remember directions to it again.

Hi Jan, it will be in Nicholson studios x

Hi, I’m a first time Associates mum and was wondering if anyone else is going to the MA workshop in Birmingham on Sunday? Not familiar at all with Birmingham, the handful of times I’ve had to go there for work I’ve gotten lost every single time (once spent a good 10 minutes walking around one of the main train stations being failed by my iPhone maps before swallowing my pride and mustering the courage to ask someone for directions). Is Nicholson fairly easy to walk to and find from Moor Street Station or are we better off taking a taxi? How many DCs usually show up to these workshops? I think this is the first time they’re holding it in Birmingham, which I admit I was quite gutted about because I am personally quite lazy travelling far for anything. I’ve roped in my (non-dancing) DS to keep me company while DD is at her workshop - it’s going to be a long wait! Any tips on where to spend a few hours in Birmingham?

I have pm’d you x

You don’t have to, the audition class is very simple. However, some DCs who who attend the insight day find that it is the scheme for them and this will motivate them to do well in the audition. Conversely, there are some like my DC who decided during the insight day that’s it’s not for them. If that is the case, it will save you money on application fees.

Sorry can’t help with your question but MAs have also been told their leotards will be changing from September. And I, too, am very curious already about what it looks like.

Hi! We have never put in a normal application but yes, definitely, I know of lots who got a place via the normal route despite not attending the scholarship audition or attended it but didn’t get a scholarship. I would assume that this would be the case for most people as the number of scholarships is quite limited in relation to those who actually attend the summer course. So absolutely go for it either way. I’m afraid our experience of YBS is extremely limited (to basically two scholarship auditions). My DD has never attended the actual summer course or any of the pop ups, but I’m sure lots on this forum would have and would be happy to give feedback

My DD has been to two of these. For someone who doesn’t normally like auditions, she actually doesn’t mind these and said the teacher and panel are always very lovely. The ones we know who got these scholarships are all full time vocational students (or about to go full time), and all from one particular school although this is probably coincidence in our case as we don’t really know many people in the dance world. Not to say that no non-full time ever gets it, or none from other schools, just that we personally don’t know of any. I also think some can be awarded it a few times over the years, I might be wrong but I think that’s the case. They do always seem to have a good and friendly atmosphere according to my DD, even for someone like her who doesn’t really know many of the other DCs. However, I do think that in her case it helps that she goes in with literally no expectations whatsoever hahah! She just treats it like a good class. She knows she’s not full time and doesn’t really dance or train as much as others (and for some reason has a default dancing face that looks grumpy)…even when she’s happy. Because of this, she has always enjoyed it. She’s never asked me for the result, now that I think about it.

On social media, I think this is a question full time vocational students get asked a lot when they’re doing Q&A type stuff. It varies depending on the school but I saw a recent UK one (lower school student) and the schedule involved 2 hours of ballet class and 1-2 hours of other dance-related class (pointe etc). Approximately 4 hours of academics. The hours probably change as they go up years. I know upper school students seem do a lot more hours, some with Saturday classes too. Some schools overseas are a lot more intensive. They also do hours for competition preparation, show preparation, private studio time etc

Love this! I’m the same as you without the ballet feet and hyper mobility. In fact, I don’t think I have anything balletic about me. I only did ballet over two summers when I was a kid because my parents both worked full time and had nowhere to leave me or nothing to entertain me over the long summer holidays after the family vacation was over. I don’t remember anything from those two summers apart from taking part in shows at the end of it and getting to use hair gel for the first time to do my bun. It’s funny about feet, my teenage son has lovely ballet feet funnily enough but isn’t the least bit interested in dancing. I can’t even bribe him to accompany me to watching days or shows. Last time he did come with me to his sister’s watching day in ballet class as I had nowhere to leave him and he was still young, he complained he had a headache after!

It is possible, I’ve heard of a few, but would probably be very expensive and require extreme commitment not just from the child but from the whole family. I assume it would seriously impact time and finances (and maybe even DCs well-being and general family dynamics). I’m guessing it would require a lot of summer intensives, classes within the week of the required high standard (not just hobby), private coaching, multiple associates in the weekends, physio/Pilates/gyro sessions etc etc. - especially depending on where you’re looking at to go for upper school. Realistically, if you’re looking at the most popular ones, she’ll be against a lot of international students (just look at how actively schools are currently advertising auditions overseas), competition winners (YGP and PdL to name just a couple), kids who are most likely coached by a few different teachers, travel during school holidays to summer intensives not just here but overseas, willing to travel miles and miles to associates etc. Increasingly I find those who are seriously looking at upper school admission are home schooled. This affords them the time to squeeze in as much training as they can during the day and during the school term. When you think about it, and I’m only guessing this as I have no first hand experience, DCs in full time lower vocational school probably do no less than 8-10 hours of ballet a week maybe increasing as they go up years, plus other dance related classes (contemporary, pointe, rep, solos, choreo etc). Looking at my non-voc DCs timetable, and the times he/she comes home from school after activities and sports and all sorts of social things high schoolers these days do, there is no way we can squeeze in any hours close to that. I have nothing but respect and admiration for those who can manage to juggle a normal academic school and the training required to get to a top vocational upper school but I also think you need the serious financial means to do this.

No first hand experience but have done a bit of looking around. I found that even if we were to pay international student fees, European schools tend to be cheaper than UK ones (even with MDS). This would probably vary depending on the school but this is what I found overall, including schools in Germany and the Netherlands. We also looked at schools in Switzerland and I believe the two we looked at would also be cheaper than schools here. Amazing communications from schools too I find, quick responses and extremely organised. I accidentally sent an application to one school without realising my DD would be a few months too young for their intake and was contacted right away and told that the AD would like to see her next year when she’s of the right age because there will be no housing available for her age. With another school I received right away a pack from the academic school they have a tie up with requesting all sorts of information. I was very impressed with how organised and professional everything was, so easy to contact and responses super prompt and personal.

DD has a lovely long neck and lovely arms. Very good Achilles too which is probably why every teacher comments on her jumps. However, feet aren’t “ballerina feet” and back is stiff. Physique overall doesn’t fit the ideal “ballerina body” of some countries and schools (although this is probably a statement that will spark a discussion all on its own). Last year, by some miracle, she was invited to a few finals including to the school I can just assume most everyone wants to go to in the UK (but for which DD has never shown interest in although to be fair, I don’t think she ever wanted to go “full time”). In one of the finals, her first comment to me when she came out was that she doesn’t think she was given nearly as thorough a physio check as others. She just assumed there was something/some things glaringly “wrong” with her and so they just gave her a cursory check. She’s since seen at least a couple of other physios (for other reasons, none of which audition related) who specialise in dance who told me they can’t see why DD would have been apparently discounted so quickly. DD isn’t too bothered thankfully as she considers dance as simply a serious hobby she loves doing.

I hope you don’t mind me messaging you. My DD is looking at a couple of SIs in FL and one is probably the one your DD went to!

Wow! That is a long summer! I believe my kids get about 6-7 weeks off school but that’s it. Even then I’ve seen my daughter’s peers hop from one summer intensive to another as they often just last 1-2 weeks at her age. Not my daughter though, she’s not a good gauge of the typical committed dancer here - she is terrible and has no qualms about not doing any training for the entirety of the summer. She actually doesn’t understand why most dancers her age go to multiple SIs (“when do they get to rest?!”). She actually agreed to audition for a particular American summer SI precisely because of its location (the weather being so diff from England!) and thinks it will be a holiday 🤷‍♀️. All the best to your daughter starting her year round programme in Europe.

Hi! Yes it is x

I think for quite a few of them it serves as an audition for the full time programme. I believe this is the case for places like SAB and Kirov, and also school in Canada like the NBS. In a way, perhaps a good thing as the students are seen over a longer period of time rather than just a day or two. At the same time, the students can get a proper feel of the place - whether they can see themselves there or not. Obviously still a lot of expense and commitment especially if coming from overseas. Lots of pros and cons as with anything.

Just to add quite a lot hold virtual auditions too, if you’re like my DD who absolutely hates having to do a video audition. US time is fairly doable given the time difference to the UK (it was Australia time that was a killer for us!). It does cost around £25-40 per audition, even for virtual ones. Just this week I realised I made the stupid mistake of losing £30 audition fee because the SI dates (pretty much all 5 weeks of it) are still within my DD’s school term. Costly mistake to make as auditions fees are non-refundable. And there I was already imagining myself tagging along for a sun-filled holiday in the summer…

If you can, I’d say definitely go for it. My DD usually hates auditions but found the American SI auditions fun yet challenging. They were quite fast paced and she told me after that they seem to look beyond the usual “feet and flexibility” and there was a lot of her favourites: jumps and turns!

No personal experience I’m afraid but from the information I received when DD was accepted to a few of them last year was that most were a minimum of 4 weeks (I think 4-5 weeks is the norm, always a factor for us as DD was only 11 then) and often start when the school term is still in session here in the UK. My DD does not go to a vocational school so I’m not sure if vocational schools here end their summer term earlier than other schools but I know that one of the factors why my DD could not attend was that some of them started as early as June/early July and there was no way she’d want to miss a single day of school to attend an SI. (Although I think quite a lot of European schools also start their SIs earlier, my DD also was not able to attend Dutch and ESB for the same reason). It’s a shame really as the American SIs’ timetables look intensive but have a wealth of other activities within the programmes too that sounds like a lot of fun. We also found that they are quite generous with scholarship offers.

Thank you so so much for this and I’m so sorry for the late acknowledgement. Been a crazy few weeks! I’ve actually saved the link to your post for the next time I need to sew a pair. I’m so grateful and thanks again. Hope you have a wonderful new year! X

Sadly, I think that a school that starts their students on pointe at such a young age will prove to be an attraction to some. As with a lot of things these days, there seem to be extreme competition and it’s almost always a race: who gets to go on pointe earlier, who trains the most hours, who has the most associates/teachers/genres/classes/intensives. I may be wrong but although top vocational schools start their students on pointe at some stage during year 7, I am willing to bet that most, if not all, year 7s have already been on pointe prior to starting year 7. With a particular school in mind, I would actually guess that a significant percentage would have been on pointe for more than a year. It’s more obvious these days because worryingly, a lot of these are in the public domain via schools and students’ posts.

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