maryrosesatonapin

4 hours ago, Colman said:

Didn’t we have this discussion recently? 

After reading this, I had another search through and found an interesting old thread (from 2012) in which @Jan McNulty listed the numbers of English vs foreign dancers in the RB, ENB etc at that time... and the numbers of English dancers were considerably higher than they are now.  So the situation seems to be becoming more extreme.

I honestly didn't mean to cause controversy by opening this topic, but am genuinely puzzled as to the state of affairs.   We still get to see good ballet, so it isn't really a problem for the audience, but I do wonder if it is a problem for would-be dancers here, and if so, what can be done about it.  The old thread did mention that maybe teaching isn't competitive or strict enough here.  I have  no idea if that is a reason or not.

@toursenlair wrote:  Stuttgart Ballet: 2 from Germany, 23 from abroad

Royal Danish Ballet: 5 from Denmark, 17 from abroad

Dutch National Ballet: 2 from the Netherlands (soon to be 1), all the rest from abroad.

I only looked at the largest companies, although I know the above three have a good reputation too.

@alison Scottish Ballet is a smaller company, much as I love them.  I  was thinking of the 'big fish'.  I didn't have time to investigate every little company that exists.

@Ian Macmillan wrote: 

If the UK is able to offer top-flight dancers from around the world job opportunities that they are keen to take - presumably as being better offers than anything available to them at home - does it matter?  Ought we not to rejoice in such a situation?  And if not ...........?  

By and large, it's not an issue I'd lose sleep over.

I'm not suggesting anyone should lose sleep, I am just curious about people's opinions.  And I am not particularly happy that these top-flight dancers are getting better offers abroad than at home, no.  I can understand a certain amount of movement - which can only be a good thing - but this seems extreme.  Take Xander Parish's case, for example. He was overlooked at RB but has now blossomed.  I don't think we, as a country, can afford to lose too many male dancers in particular.  We are obviously doing something different and I wonder what, and whether it is by design or accident.

@Sim I am not sure that most would agree with you about the English football league, but that's another story altogether.

England seems exceptional in that the majority of dancers at principal/soloist level in the main companies here do not come from the home country.  Now I am not saying this is a bad thing as it is great to be able to see, frequently and in-depth, some great dancers from abroad.  But it puzzles me.
 

Current figures, from company websites:
Royal Ballet – 17 from UK 27 from abroad (total 44)
ENB – 3 from UK, 21 from abroad (24) – making one wonder if English National Ballet is the correct name
BRB – 13 from UK (one even from Birmingham!), 15 from abroad (28)
Northern Ballet – half from UK and half from abroad (20)
 

Contrastingly, the Paris, Milan, and Russian companies are comprised of an overwhelming majority of home grown dancers with very few ‘imports’.  The same applies to ABT, Australian Ballet etc. Why do you think this is?

1 hour ago, Jan McNulty said:

 

 

Have the boxes been developed to their current state because they are healthier for the dancers' feet?  In which case how can we complain?

It would be healthier not to have pointe shoes at all.  It would be healthier not to have ballet at all, for the dancers.  I am grateful to them for the sacrifices they make, whatever shoes they wear.

On 24/08/2019 at 13:10, jmhopton said:

When you see a season like this you realise how far the Bolshoi have fallen repertory wise since then. 

I don't think it is fair or accurate to suggest the Bolshoi repertory has 'fallen'.  If you look at what they put on at home it is varied and full of interest.  The thing to question is the demands of the London public.  Although I myself am happy with regular helpings of Tchaikovsky,  I'd like to see more variety here too, of course, but not if it means the organisation makes a loss and jeopardises future tours to our shores.

Re the earlier discussion about the development of pointe shoes, I came across this in a magazine interview from a couple of years ago.  The incomparable Tsiskaridze states:
'..the boxes on Western pointe shoes are wide, they're huge, and that bears no relation to ballet. If you visit the Academy's museum and look at old shoes, the boxes are tiny, but they turned 32 fouettés on them.  To do the same in Western boxes today, that's a sport... the Russian method is one of beauty, not of sport. It's dance - and that beauty is created with difficulty.'

Thank you @FionaE - how interesting!  That 'scenery' is perfect for the story and the venue.  We shall have to await developments....

My sincere condolences on the loss of your mother.  I am so glad the ballet was a comfort and distraction for you - thank you for the interesting write-up.

@FionaE thank you for your description of the event. I really appreciated hearing about this.  It sounds like a 'mixed bag' with more positives than negatives, a brave adventure that will no doubt lead to greater things.  What an experience you have had!

9 minutes ago, LinMM said:

Is the O2 arena bigger than the RAH? 

Probably not too big an arena but ballet has been performed successfully at these two places though of course with Swan Lake and Nutcracker etc one can hire more dancers to fill the space without it looking too out of place.

I suppose with R and J one could hire extra villagers etc. Could be a terrific sword fighting scene! 

I hate the acoustics in the O2.  Mind you, with recorded music it wouldn't matter so much....

1 hour ago, FionaE said:

 

I will repost - it was my account and was private.  Johan’s words should not be missed. 

 

 

This is so moving!  Thank you @FionaE.  Enjoy your travels and we look forward to hearing more from you in due course. 

You need to remember to look into visa requirements too, which can take some time.  Have you considered the Mariinsky?  Moscow is well worth visiting, but St Petersburg is more beautiful and has the added attraction of the Hermitage.  You should definitely buy ballet tickets before booking the rest of your travel.

4 hours ago, FionaE said:

Beautiful words from Johan Kobborg from the programme

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/B1s2KcgAQ2JyV0jqie9U1V8aFufQjrsmNcVXmE0/?igshid=19vw1yqngp6a1

Fiona - this link didn't work, for me at least.  I'd have liked to read what Johan had to say as he is an artist I have admired and respected for decades.  I feel he is always worth listening to.

8 hours ago, redshoesgirl2 said:

a video on instagram shows so many empty seats! 

 

Verona arena capacity is 30,000 people although only 15,000 are allowed due to health and safety reasons apparently.  cf ROH less than 2,300.  Or did you mean Belgrade?

…. by any other name would smell as sweet.  Or would it? The most famous example of name transformation is, I think, Peggy Hookham – aka Margot Fonteyn.  Would she have been as great a dancer had she not changed her name?  Of course she would have had the same physique, the same unique gift, but I am sure she would have felt more ‘ordinary’ with her real name, and her stage name would have helped inspire her rise to stardom.  She embodied the ‘Margot Fonteyn’ persona just as she did the roles she danced. 

Some people are simply born with a suitable name for ballet.  If you are Russian it helps! But there are a number of other famous people in the dance world who wisely changed their names.  They include:

Marnie Crittle

Berta Springbett

Cyvia Rambam

Sydney Kay

Edris Stannus

Mabinty Bangura

Roberta Sue Fickell

Anver Bey Abdullah Jaffa Khan

Jerome Rabinowitz

Iris Cohen

Lilian Marks

Can you think of any others?

(Pic shows Berta Springbett)

According to Wiki, Esmeralda is also in New Jersey Ballet's rep.  In spite of having lived in NYC for a while (some time ago) I have never seen them dance - are they any good?

By the way (please excuse if not appropriate here) but I have a spare copy of the RB Acosta version of Don Q if anyone would like it.  (Duplicate gift.)  This isn't a sale. No charge if it's being posted in the UK - just don't want it to go to waste.

@Two PigeonsI completely agree about lack of recordings for some artists.  And what pains me more is that some even greater world-class dancers have very poor quality film (eg some legendary Bolshoi and Kirov stars, and of course Fonteyn).  It would be so good to be able to watch them for ever, even if just on a small screen.  But we can't change what is past - however we can hope that there will be a greater variety of dancers captured on film now that it is comparatively cheap and easy to capture good images.

Viviana Durante was perfect as Aurora - she seemed like an innocent princess through and through, and her musicality/timing was so beautiful to watch.  Some dancers just seem to get more attention from the media, and once that happens it is self-perpetuating.  They bring in more revenue so are touted by the management, who are always having to bolster funds.  The general public who maybe just go to ballet occasionally, or watch it on screen, only want to see people they have heard of - not realising these dancers aren't necessarily the best.  At least the situation here isn't as bad as in America.

@Jan McNulty - I always think Alexander Campbell looks more like a cheeky schoolboy than a prince or lover.  And he seems kind of short to me and lacking in elegance for a Romeo!  But of course, that's just my silly opinion.  And he's very good in some roles.
 

@penelopesimpson - Yes, why no Watson?  I really don't like to think we won't see him on the ROH stage again.  That is too sad.  Bring him back, RB, even if just for a short while!



 

25 minutes ago, penelopesimpson said:

And Alina and Johann.  Now you saw them, now you didn't.  I arrived for Mayerling and was told it was their last night at RB.  Yes, I know there had been problems with management but this is one instance where KOH should have been big enough to bid them a proper goodbye.  Not for RB but for their many fans over the years.  It was a terrible way to let the top couple, two of the greatest dancers in the world, go.

They were understandably angry and hurt; it's difficult to understand!

4 minutes ago, betterankles said:

Guess it should specify under appreciated by?  Management? Press?

Underused?

When I started this thread I just meant 'who do you think should be remembered but might not be?' or something along those lines... just a general chat really, to fill the post-Bolshoi gap. So any answers are valid.

Oh I do hope I get the opportunity to see this!  I was recently watching a video of Scottish Ballet's 'Rite of Spring' and that too was very powerful and original.

Reading forum comments comparing the Royal Ballet’s version of Don Quixote with the Bolshoi’s I decided (with the Belyakov/Sevenard version fresh in my mind) to watch my video of the Acosta version, with Carlos himself as Basil and Marianela Nuñez as Kitri.  I have seen this version live in the past but with different dancers.
 

My thoughts are: above all, Nuñez/Acosta are a perfect couple for those roles.  They are both so ‘Latin’, flirtatious, passionate and of course great dancers.  And they seemed to have a genuine affection between them.  So when they were on stage it was a delight.  Acosta wasn’t as elegant as Belyakov but for this role, his warmth and presence were just right.  He always exuded such sheer joy of dance – I do miss him!  Nuñez’ expressive dancing was dazzling throughout, with many little characterful touches which are more easily appreciated on film. 

I did feel the choreography had been changed to suit the rest of the company, with more ‘filler’ and pantomime scenes and less demanding virtuoso roles.  The RB men in particular didn’t come up to the standard I had seen at the Bolshoi this month.
 

The scenery and costumes were of a roughly similar standard – both good.
 

I liked Acosta’s introduction of ‘noise’ on stage – clapping, maracas, even shouting – which made it more atmospheric, and I particularly liked the live guitar-playing during the gypsy scene.  (I wasn’t fond of the puppet show of the Bolshoi version although their windmills were better.)  I also appreciated Acosta’s introduction of Dulcinea at the beginning and later, which helped to clarify the story.

Overall I loved both versions, and was left with a warm-hearted ‘feel-good’ response to both.  Above all, this ballet is FUN.

36 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said:

I agree that "lesser" is not necessarily an appropriate description, IMHO, for any dancer.  I think TP's "under appreciated" sounds better.  If everyone else agrees we can change the title.

Please do change it!  I seem unable to.

45 minutes ago, alison said:

I'm slightly discomfited, though, at calling a principal dancer "lesser"!  I was thinking of lower-ranked dancers, and will have to put my thinking-cap on here.

I agree - bad choice of word although it was in quotes.  Maybe I should have said 'unsung'.

3 hours ago, Scheherezade said:

 

I absolutely agree, JNC. And having high prices at the lower end somewhat flies in the face of the supposed drive to banish cries of elitism.

But a ticket to a premier league football match is more than the cheaper ballet tickets which belies the 'elitism' argument.   Given that we are watching a lot of highly skilled artists and a live orchestra, I think the prices are reasonable.  

Just now, Two Pigeons said:

She deserved far more renown than she had, especially when dancing with Michael O'Hare

Yes, she was great alongside Michael O'Hare.  But I think part of the lack of renown was her lack of flashiness - she wasn't a diva, she just worked hard and gave of her sweet best without any self promotion.