balletmummy Posted March 4, 2015 Share Posted March 4, 2015 Has anyone else experienced difficulties with their dc's dance teachers, if their dc has successfully auditioned for a JA or other Associate programme? We are finding that there is very little recognition of dc's achievement and commitment in the eyes of the teachers and wonder if this is normal? We are not feeling encouraged by the situation right now! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi4ballet Posted March 4, 2015 Share Posted March 4, 2015 We had this (with dd's previous teacher - not the school she's at now). She was never encouraging and got quite cross when we told her that dd had successfully auditioned for English Youth Ballet. So - we kept quiet when dd got into an associate programme, and she'd been doing it for two years when we left that school for another. I told her then! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletmummy Posted March 5, 2015 Author Share Posted March 5, 2015 your experiences are very interesting, taxi4ballet. I must say, we have been quite shocked to find this. I assumed (wrongly, I guess!) that dc's teachers would be delighted-after all, dc's achievement is a reflection on their hard work and great teaching! Surely having JAs / Associates in your dance school is a positive thing? Why is it seen as such a negative? Yes, the child might have to reschedule their dance timetable, but given that these Associate programmes are so hard to get into, is it not a huge achievement to have JAs / Associates in your school? Or am I just being too positive here(!) I am fascinated in the psychology of this! Replies please! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circe Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 My dd went completely out of favour when started associate schemes..( later than your dd, mine was 13) she was never the big favourite anyway but it has been hard ever since and a regular battle to get the right classes and exam entry etc despite the fact my dd gets the highest results for the school. We have had to battle on as it is the only accessible school at the right level. I'd say change school if you can...i have just had to keep polite and persuasive for 3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitingmum Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 How difficult for you all. Our school has been supportive and encourages all appropriate students to apply for all these things and then puts successes in the local paper- definitely see it as a positive. Does mean Dcs may miss some classes though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletmummy Posted March 5, 2015 Author Share Posted March 5, 2015 It is good to hear we are not the only ones who have completely fallen out of favour , but hard when your dc is following their passion, loving the programme and getting so little, if any, recognition for all their hard work. Harder still, when your dc is only 9. It does not give them a very good perception of the adult world, particularly the dance world! Are there any dance teachers out there who can explain why the JA / Associate experience can create this negativity? Surely the vocational schools involved would be horrified if they knew that children involved in their programmes were being treated in this way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi4ballet Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 I don't really know the answer to this one and I too would be interested to hear the reasoning behind it. The only things that crossed my mind were that some teachers can be quite proprietorial about their 'better' students; or that maybe they prefer their students not to audition in case they don't get in and the dissatisfied parents decide to move them to another school, and they lose their income. The situation with schools that do festivals/competitions might be different, as they want their students to be able to commit to those rather than something else. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t_rose Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 We've experienced this too - there are a few kids that are congratulated / in paper etc for every achievement and others (my dd included) whose achievements are largely ignored - can be difficult and upsetting when dc's are young, but dd used to it now & knows it's a reflection on school/ teachers not her ability. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thecatsmother Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Sadly I think some teachers get a little too possessive of their students rather than viewing the bigger picture. You must do what is right for your child at the end of the day. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lilacfairy Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 We experienced this with my dd teacher she did not want her to do associate classes , afraid other classes would mess up her technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi4ballet Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 We experienced this with my dd teacher she did not want her to do associate classes , afraid other classes would mess up her technique. It was at associates that it was pointed out to dd that her previous teacher wasn't giving her the right level of corrections, and was one of the reasons we moved her to another teacher! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa O`Brien Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Yes,I find it hard to imagine that ANY Associates programme would "mess up her technique",and find that an extraordinary thing for a teacher to say. If a student is being well trained locally,the Associate classes must surely enhance the good groundwork the local teacher has done with the child already? Seems to me,the teacher might be concerned her own possible shortcomings might be picked up by another teacher,rather than any technique being messed up. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siconne50 Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 My dd teacher did not watch any of her JA classes and rarely asked her how about the classes & her progress! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circe Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 In some cases it may be purely financial- some associate schemes offer significant number of hours training so a dancer may drop a significant number of hours from local school in order to be able to do the associates and just keep up essential exam classes locally. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa O`Brien Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Well personally if the reason is financial loss for the local teacher,then I think this is petty and selfish. Yes,they may lose a couple of pounds a week,but surely if they know one of their students is serious about ballet they would understand that that student needs the best possible training,and possibly an increase in the number of hours of training also? You would think the best interests of the child and training for potentially their future career would be more important to them than the loss of some money every week. It`s not as if every single student they had would be on these schemes.I doubt very many are,so they would still generate an income from the rest of their students anyway. Honestly,what`s their problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busymum Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 We encountered the same problem. Hence why it is my DC's old school! Wouldn't allow any of their students to attend Associate classes. It was stifling. It definitely seemed to be what the school wanted came before what was best for each individual student. Crazy. I can't and wont ever be able to understand the selfishness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harwel Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I have known the school you refer to busymum for at least 35 years. They are unbelievable! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balletmummy Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 thank you so much for all your replies-they make fascinating (but depressing) reading. I just wonder how this can be happening to our youngsters in the modern world of transparency we live in now? I am glad to have brought it up in this forum and hopefully the more people who know what goes on, the better! What a shame these undercurrents exist. I suppose that dance schools are not regulated as such and the owners can basically call the shots? Of course they can be affiliated to the RAD/ISTD/BBO etc, but I guess that is all? Do keep the comments coming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifeafterballet Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Our experience is quite the opposite ! Dd did one ballet class a week until she was 10 and would not be at vocational school if it wasn't for her dance teacher firstly pointing out to us that she wasn't bad at ballet and encouraging us to audition her for associate classes, at year 6 entry, and then supporting us all through the audition process ! My Ds, also her pupil, has finals for his 2 favourite 6th forms. He has only been doing ballet for 4 years ! I wouldn't have ever known about the ballet world if it wasn't for her help. The dance school has many pupils in associate schemes and there are children who also do classes with other dance schools if the classes they want are not available or the timings aren't right ! IMO it is difficult for teachers to show recognition of achievements without it being interpreted as favouritism by some ! Most parents and pupils will celebrate and enjoy the children's successes others will never speak to you again ! They are no loss ! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vonrothbart Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 The teacher at my grandaughters dance school has been really helpful, ever since she, along with her friend were first year JA's, and now Mids. When GDD was just falling short of a place at WL, she encouraged her to try other schools such as Elmhurst and Tring, not that she did mind. I too would have thought it would be good publicity, for one of the dancers taught at her school, to gain these places. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harwel Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 You are of course correct Vonrothbart. But ballet teachers reflect the whole personality spectrum, not all people are sensible and reasonable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vonrothbart Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Yes that's true Harwel. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeliB Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 My DSs teacher all but pushed him out the door once she felt he needed a male teacher and more hours than she was able to provide. As a result the first thing he asked about coming home for spring break (which he doesn't usually do) was if he could fit in some classes with her. He finds even her adult class worth attending despite now being at almost professional level. If it wasn't for her, DS would never have considered a ballet career or known how to realise this dream.... We are very lucky I think 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macnatt Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Unfortunately we have experienced the wrath of a ballet teacher scorned and it can be a terrible experience. All the trust both you and your child had in the teacher is destroyed. Our daughter was a favourite in her studio until she was accepted into post 16 vocational schools. There is no other way to describe what happened over the following few months as systematic bullying from a once loved and trusted teacher who seemed to determined to undermine our DD in every way, including sabotaging her exam syllabus. We left the studio when it became unbearable 8 weeks prior to her RAD advanced 2 exam to find out that she had not been taught large chunks of syllabus even though she had been entered for it. Fortunately were able to find a private teacher and DD got her Advanced 2 with distinction in the end. I will never fully understand the mentality behind this, the same teacher demanded that she also turn down the places in the the vocational schools as she claimed she wasnt ready to deal with life on the other side of the world. Well she was very wrong on all counts. I am so proud of how DD has handled herself, not only in the transition to Vocational School and living in another country with a host family, but also how she has assimilated this very negative experience into her psyche. DD understands that it was not a reflection of her at all and it has given her a greater understanding that teachers are human and flawed like the rest of us. I think the experience has actually given her a resilience that is going to stand her in good stead for the future. I have spent alot of time trying to make sense of it, and all I can come up with is that a small percentage of dance teachers have an underlying narcissm and it is their own fragile egos and perhaps their own unfulfilled dreams that fuel this kind of behaviour towards their students. There is an element of financial impetus as they feel other studnets will follow on a path that ultimately leads to students leaving for better training. I have discovered that in our case there is actually a long history of this kind of behaviour and a whole community of children who were treated badly by this teacher and unfortunately some have been turned off ballet for good. I am really grateful that we came through relatively unscathed in the longrun and have taken whatever positives we could from it. We have found many beautiful teachers who helped prepare our daughter for the move to London and have also helped once she got there, so my faith has been restored in the kindness and generosity of most of the dance community. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millie3 Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 From my experience it is purely financial reasons that some teachers discourage dance outside of their own dance school. DD attended a local dance school and non of her achievements were ever mentioned or publicized, until after she left for vocational school at 16! Although they supported her - it was made clear they did not want her to mention associate schemes, holidays schools or the fact that she attended another dance school to others. They had the monopoly on dance in the area anyway and I really don't think they would of lost students - as only those really wanting to take their dancing further would bother to drive the 1 1/2 hour round trip to the local city where their nearest competition was located. They would have lost money though - with children deciding to take part in EYB, holiday schools etc rather than the dance schools own productions (where all costumes had to be bought through the school and extra lessons paid for!). It's a shame that some schools don't encourage their students to experience ballet outside of their own "dance school bubble". The teacher at dd's other school was absolutely fantastic - extremely encouraging and taking pride in all of her student's achievements. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circe Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Oh dear macnatt, your situation sounds similar to ours. All a bit baffling and glad it hasn't put your daughter off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 How is your DD finding life in the UK, macnatt? Am I right in thinking that she has come from Australia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hfbrew Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Surely its a dance teachers job to act in the best interests of their students? Only today I was advising a young lady to continue Ballet at another school now she can no longer attend mine.Another student is now going to extra Ballet lessons at another school at my recommendation as I dont have the facility in my new school yet to accommodate this. Id much prefer to know what extra lessons my students are doing rather than them go behind my back especially as there are a few unqualified teachers operating in our area. Some schools/teachers though are actually just a bit ignorant about associate programmes rather than against them. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macnatt Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Yes Aileen she has come from Australia. She couldn't be happier, she is completely immersed in the London ballet scene now, so many opportunities in UK to participate in Ballet and watch performances. The school she is at is incredibly supportive and nurturing and she is so happy to be surrounded by like minded souls. It is not an easy thing to send your 16 year old daughter off to another country so far away but is was absolutely the right decision for her. She is even picking up a bit of an English accent although I am sure most of the girls in her class would not agree they think she sounds very Australian. I do know she is looking forward to the end of winter... I think that has been the biggest challenge 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzpaws Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 DD was at a local school who mainly focused on their show and festivals until she was 13. She had a very wonderful elderly ballet teacher (83), but 1 lesson a week was just not enough. it was a hard decision to leave for both DD and her teacher, who we are very fond of, and we felt just awful about it ( many tears shed ) However, her next teacher, who is just amazing, saw her potential and brought her from just having passed RAD grade 5 to Advanced 2 in just over 2 years, plus seeing her successfully gain a place in RBS SA2 and a full time place at Central - we are so thankful that we found her, and DD wouldn't be where she is today without her !!! It was a very hard decision to make, but the right thing to do. We will always love her first teacher too as she certainly taught her to love ballet . 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aileen Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 I'm glad to hear that your DD is enjoying vocational school in London. Moving to the other side of the world at 16 is a big step. The weather in London has been beautifully sunny the last couple of days (I think that this January has been one of the sunniest on record) and today the temperature is a mild 16 degrees Centigrade. Lots of spring flowers are blooming in London parks and gardens and there is blossom in some of the trees. London is warmer and drier than many other parts of the country but what Brits from the south of the country who go to Australia comment on is how dark the winters (in the UK) are. Currently, it's dark around 6pm and this makes a big difference after gloomy or dark late afternoons and early evenings between the hour change in the middle of October and latter part of February. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzpaws Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Well, British winters are always a bit miserable and we haven't even had the prettiness of snow this year, but Spring is in the air now - bring it on 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzpaws Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Looking back, it would have been so much easier to leave DD's first school if her teacher was horrid or unreasonable, but the right decision was made and her first teacher is very pleased that DD has done so well (looking back is easy sometimes isn't it ). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now