Significance of Diploma For Ballet Company Hires

[BaffledBalletMum]

How significant is the diploma (e.g. Professional Dance Studies) earned in European upper schools to European ballet companies when making professional contract offers? Assuming the talent, ability and skill of the dancer is paramount and that age is also a significant factor, generally how important is it to the company AD, that a dancer has completed some kind of Professional Dance Studies diploma? 

 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by BaffledBalletMum
sorted

[LinMM]

My feeling is that when dancers attend auditions to dance with a particular ballet company AD’s are mostly interested in how well they can dance and how they might be a current fit for the Company (or not) rather than what Diploma they may have. 
Having a diploma could be more relevant if were planning to teach down the line possibly. 
It may depend on how much individual companies screen for the right to attend audition though.
Whether it’s just done by in person or video by all ….or whether they only look at certain dancers videos or invite them to attend audition by already vetting them by where they have trained. 
Im sure then it’s the prestigious nature of certain schools dancers have trained at which count for more than whether a dancer has gained a diploma or not even though it may be given some consideration. 
But sheer dancing ability is going to be the main criteria I think when employing dancers. 

[Pas de Quatre]

I don't think having a Diploma will be affect the AD'S choice of dancer. It might help the dancer to be offered an audition if there are too many applicants. e.g. in UK to audition for Matthew Bourne you have to have studied for a Diplma or Degree at a recognised dance institution to apply, but you are still not guaranteed an audition.

[academicdancer]

It depends where, I'm pretty sure that in Eastern Europe they will only consider dancers with diplomas. They want proof of professional training. 

[Farawaydancer]

Some of the adverts for auditions mention that they want dancers who’ve completed diploma level education, so I think some companies use it as a screening. 

[BaffledBalletMum]

12 hours ago, Farawaydancer said:

Some of the adverts for auditions mention that they want dancers who’ve completed diploma level education, so I think some companies use it as a screening. 

Agree, and I think that trend is becoming more common. However, it is just one factor in the bigger picture where dance ability (and suitability within the particular company) is the most critical factor. It likely signals maturity in managing the academic responsibility as well. 

[Peanut68]

A recognised qualification may also help towards getting working visas or right to residence eg. In countries with a points system such as Australia. Useful where perhaps a dancer chooses country first before job so not relying on sponsorship by one job which would end when that job ends

[batmanballetshoes]

Yes I hear it is necessary for gaining sponsorship in a country if you need a work visa. A few friends have needed to show some form of qualification to get a visa in Europe where they only hold UK passports. They were classical dancers going into classical companies, some even had top school training and were clearly strong dancers but still need to show some form of qualification to be granted a visa to work by the various authorities.

[meadowblythe]

13 hours ago, batmanballetshoes said:

Yes I hear it is necessary for gaining sponsorship in a country if you need a work visa. A few friends have needed to show some form of qualification to get a visa in Europe where they only hold UK passports. They were classical dancers going into classical companies, some even had top school training and were clearly strong dancers but still need to show some form of qualification to be granted a visa to work by the various authorities.

 

 

As we fill in yet more paperwork this is very true - and if only our education qualifications mapped on to those of Europe/rest of the world!  It's actually high school level education that they are interested in rather than ballet qualifications.

 

[BaffledBalletMum]

14 hours ago, Peanut68 said:

A recognised qualification may also help towards getting working visas or right to residence eg. In countries with a points system such as Australia. Useful where perhaps a dancer chooses country first before job so not relying on sponsorship by one job which would end when that job ends

Yes. Knowing the country you want to dance in makes it easier to evaluate how to put together the best application. 

[BaffledBalletMum]

1 hour ago, meadowblythe said:

 

 

As we fill in yet more paperwork this is very true - and if only our education qualifications mapped on to those of Europe/rest of the world!  It's actually high school level education that they are interested in rather than ballet qualifications.

 

Do you think the "professional dance diplomas" add any special value? Or is it really just showing some level of academic completion at a prestigious school? 

Edited August 11, 2023 by BaffledBalletMum

[Lifeafterballet]

Most U.K. upper schools offer the Trinity Diploma in Professional Dance level 6.

It is completed over the duration of the 3 years and is 18 months of a degree that can be topped up later. Both my children did it. It sounds better than it is. The dissertation they submitted in 6:3 didn’t even have to be referenced 😳 

Now Dd is at University we realise that it wasn’t particularly of a high standard. 
That’s just our opinion, others may disagree 😊

[Allwrong]

So would an academic degree in a non-dance subject be acceptable for a European visa application for a classical ballet contract, in anyone's experience? Seems strange if so, but would cause some jubilation in this household.

[BaffledBalletMum]

2 hours ago, Lifeafterballet said:

Most U.K. upper schools offer the Trinity Diploma in Professional Dance level 6.

It is completed over the duration of the 3 years and is 18 months of a degree that can be topped up later. Both my children did it. It sounds better than it is. The dissertation they submitted in 6:3 didn’t even have to be referenced 😳 

Now Dd is at University we realise that it wasn’t particularly of a high standard. 
That’s just our opinion, others may disagree 😊

Yes. DD is in the same program. The real heavy lifting for academics is in A-Levels, while the classroom PDS work is academic lite.  Just wondering what aspects, if any, European companies (or other countries) want to see for classical contracts - if only for visa processing purposes. 

[BaffledBalletMum]

2 hours ago, Allwrong said:

So would an academic degree in a non-dance subject be acceptable for a European visa application for a classical ballet contract, in anyone's experience? Seems strange if so, but would cause some jubilation in this household.

Would love to know the answer, as well. For example, is a high school diploma (US, Canada) enough? 

[Farawaydancer]

1 hour ago, BaffledBalletMum said:

Yes. DD is in the same program. The real heavy lifting for academics is in A-Levels, while the classroom PDS work is academic lite.  Just wondering what aspects, if any, European companies (or other countries) want to see for classical contracts - if only for visa processing purposes. 

It’s made clear though that the PDS work is not the entirety of the diploma, it’s just one part of it. The dancing itself forms most of the actual ‘work’ for the diploma.

 

I think companies want to know that you’ve finished formal (compulsory?) education, and would expect something to show for that from a dance school. 

[meadowblythe]

This is what my son is needing to provide 

 

Valid passport (I think 6 months remaining)

Proof of health insurance

Proof of travel insurance

Copy of work permit application, provided by employer

Evidence of accommodation

Criminal background check (Accro)

High School Diploma (he used degree certificate I think)

 

All translated into appropriate language and certified.

 

Just to complicate things he can only be in the country 90 days on temporary visa (including finding aforementioned accommodation) - and it typically takes 45 to 70 days to complete the paperwork.  

 

This is similar to the list for a previous job offer he had in a different country.  Both are outside the EU.

 

Visa requirements are nothing to do with dance ability!  They are the legal side of things.  All that is required is evidence that compulsory education is complete.

 

 

[Allwrong]

Thank you meadowblythe!

[BaffledBalletMum]

On 11/08/2023 at 14:17, Farawaydancer said:

It’s made clear though that the PDS work is not the entirety of the diploma, it’s just one part of it. The dancing itself forms most of the actual ‘work’ for the diploma.

 

I think companies want to know that you’ve finished formal (compulsory?) education, and would expect something to show for that from a dance school. 

Agree! 80% of the PDS diploma is done in studio. 

[BaffledBalletMum]

23 hours ago, Allwrong said:

Thank you meadowblythe!

Yes! Thank you!