Thecatsmother

How does an adult interact with teachers in a way that best enhances their learning and creates a positive learning environment for all within a class? Self awareness would seem to me to be a key component?

Not sure where you are getting a temps de flèche in the act 1 solo or petit jetes in cygnets?

I think everyone has different needs for warm up so there is no correct way to do this and needs to be adapted to your own body. People also need different things at different times according to perhaps where they are experiencing stiffness and the nature of what they are warming up for. A beginners level class is likely to be fairly basic but foot strengthening exercises are always useful at this level along with gentle stretches. I have never had a set warm up even during my professional career. It just involves listening to your body and preparing for what it needs. If you are about to begin barre in many respects this serves as part of the warm up for class anyway.

Try steaming them over a kettle to soften the inside and take them out side and bang the base of the shoe on concrete as this reduces the sound. Noise is something would certainly have had to be addressed by whole corps de ballet at ENB swan lake. Can you imagine consequences if not....

I am not sure how old your daughter is as uncertain if junior or senior associates. I am assuming the former. In this case she is still young and growing. You will notice that muscle tone varies a bit amongst dancers but this can be due to many factors. With one so young, learning to work the correct muscle groups so she is engaging her core muscles and inner thigh muscles should help to encourage muscle development in the right places. Stretching of the quadriceps and calf muscles will also help. With one so young it is probably something which will develop over time plus she is still growing. Practicing exercises such as tendus up a wall or mirror can help to train the muscles in a static manner but I would not place too much emphasis upon the comments with your daughter at this stage. I would just continue with basic exercises which she has no doubt been taught. There is always a risk that comments made about muscle bulk can lead to issues relating to body image in later life. Some children naturally have more defined muscle tone than others. It is also likely if she is a JA that she will go through subsequent growth spurts so everything may change through the process of physical development anyway. I am not sure if she is of average height for her age and the height and build of other members of the family?

Lisa Howell discourages any deep stretching before class and says this should be done afterwards as it can reduce muscle power. She also has a number of free articles which give good advice due to her experience as a dancer and dance physio. You can also post questions on her website. Warm up for adult ballet classes is likely to involve a 'gentle' mobilisation of the muscles and joints prior to class. That being said, some people attending class may be on the hyper mobile spectrum so a warm up needs to be personalised to the needs of an individual. Massage of any stiff areas can also be of use. If you are feeling pain before class or consistently when doing an exercise in class then it is usually best to discuss with a teacher. Adult ballet should be about enjoyment so you should not be required to work through the pain of injuries and this may set you back in terms of ability to engage with classes. Whilst it may 'look' impressive to see individuals doing splits before class it is unlikely to be in the best interests of an adult beginner to attempt this cold when the body has not experienced it in the past. Warming up is about the individual and what their body needs and not intended to be a spectator sport For beginners whose feet tend to need a lot of strengthening, foot exercises with a theraband can also be incorporated into a warm up. .

Lisa Howell's website has useful information re stretching.

Given that there has been considerable debate around what is not helpful/helpful to an adult learning ballet, I thought it might be interesting to address this from a different angle and ask teachers and those attending adult ballet classes what they had found useful in understanding and enhancing training. Not intended to be a post about named people's classes just more on the specifics of what enhances learning such as the way steps are taught, learning to use the right muscle groups, developing fluidity, flexibility and all the other facets of ballet that may be challenging to an adult. Hopefully by sharing there is something for everyone to learn whilst being respectful that there are different learning styles and no hard and fast rule about how things 'should' be.

Perhaps part of a beginners experience of adult ballet is also learning about the way in which the ballet world operates. There often need to be last minute changes for good reason. It is true that life on stage is unpredictable but that is part of a dancer's training. There is a clear wisdom behind sayings such as 'the show must go on'. It can only enhance learning to observe rehearsals and ask why things are carried out in a certain way. There is very often a rationale. Trying to align ballet with structure of other professions is like trying to force a square peg into a round hole-it does not fit. This is not to say that ballet does not evolve over time as there have been major changes in terms of training, nutrition, choreography and other aspects of sports medicine which have been integrated into the profession.

With life inside the ballet world revolving around its own axis it can be a challenge to engage with intense training whilst leaving space for the individual to process emotions. I remember the pain of being ostracised for several days after I was awarded a scholarship in my final year. All I can say is that it helps if you can harness the emotions evoked and use dance as a non verbal outlet. Many dancers who stop dancing have said how much they miss the non verbal form of emotional expression which dance can provide. When existing in a world where so much is dependent upon external decisions and events it can be useful to draw upon some of the dance psychology research into self determination theory and dance. In short, finding ways that a dancer can achieve a sense of competence, autonomy and relatedness in their training. This can involve things like setting personal achievable goals, remaining connected with peers inside and outside the world of ballet and doing things which act as an escape from the intensity of dance training. Some professional dancers have found even doing external pilates training or something else dance related in a different environment can re-energise. Sadly, the issues of competition/rivalry come with the territory. I am not saying that it is right just that it happens. Perhaps the challenge is to think what can I learn from this experience to make me a stronger person. With the passage of time painful experiences can be transformed into opportunities for growth.

I have seen great results with Lisa Howell's approach. It is a new way of thinking about flexibility. It also works well for adults. When I see students using the exercises unprompted prior to or during class I think that gives good evidence that they find them beneficial.

I would question whether some of the posts in this thread should be withdrawn. Whilst every individual is entitled to their own opinion, some of these posts do potentially identify highly respected teachers as class levels and respected orgnisations are mentioned. As a teacher, I would find these comments offensive and unecessary if I were talked about in this manner. It also reflects badly upon the ethos of the forum.

I know of quite a few adults who have found teachers willing to teach RAD Grade 6-8. This really teaches an adult how to dance as well as do steps due to the choreography. Grade 6 is much more tricky than grade 7 though due to complexity of choreography.

I think it is important to listen to feedback of the dance schools to which she auditions. I have a number of colleagues who ended up going through vocational schools and into companies at that height. My sense it is worth taking a long sighted view on this as ultimately it's about getting a job the other side of dance school. Shorter dancers are often favoured for smaller companies which tour as the stages are not so big. I have also attended auditions in Paris where they have lined all the dancers in height order and cut the tallest and shortest dancers third of dancers before they even did a plié. I would say that for all dancers it is about building on your strengths as this is ultimately what gets noticed in an audition. I always think that a degree of strategic thinking is important as ultimately it is about getting a job at the end of it. If your daughter consistently gets feedback that height is an issue then this is something which should be taken seriously before going further down the vocational school route as it may be useful to ensure school gives training in a wider range of dance styles to increase employment prospects. All she can do is build on her strengths, keep an open mind and do some research. Best of luck.

Can I suggest you have a look at the work of Lisa Howell online. She has a blog called the ballet blog which individuals can sign up for free. I have been to her training and seen good results with this approach.

I do agree that adults who have danced earlier in life are able to progress quicker as they have some of the foundations of ballet from early life. It is often the case that with maturity they discover other facets of dance that perhaps they were less aware of at a young age. I believe ballet should be for everyone but with that comes the primary concern around physical safety of the student. In places such as London where there are a wealth of classes it is not a problem finding a class which is of the right level, I also agree that challenging self with an additional class which is a bit harder provides the chance of additional insight and helps dancers to make sense of what they are working towards. With adults who are learning from scratch they usually are pretty good at judging or asking for advice as to when to progress to the next level. In a few cases this is not the case so I guess it raises the question-how does an adult know when they have developed sufficient technique to progress to harder steps. Sometimes the availability of classes is the determining factor but on other occasions there is room for reflection. Many students starting ballet struggle with confidence. A caring and supportive teacher who has experience of teaching adults can enhance confidence of adult beginners so they reach a point of shifting out of the state of paralysis which fear can induce. There have been occasions when I have attended open classes and wondered what made certain individuals decide to do a class which is far too advanced. This makes me worry about the welfare of the student and the impact upon others in the class.

I have been reading this thread and it has made me think a lot about some of the key factors which I have seen in adults who have made good progress when coming to ballet for the first time. I always say practice does not make perfect, it makes permanent so it is important to focus on the key fundamentals of technique before pushing on to more advanced classes. I see many adults who for some reason seem to be so focused on quantity of classes and being in the highest level that they do not stop to think about whether this is really helping them become the best dancer they can be. The key elements which I would consider important for progress as an adult are:- -Gaining a sound basic technique before moving to harder classes. It is often useful to get the teacher's feedback as to whether they think someone is ready to progress. They can often give a more objective view. -Dance conditioning exercises to strengthen muscles combined with stretching. -Developing musicality. -Developing a sense of flow within exercises so one movement links to the next and is not just a series of steps. -Working on steps which are fitting with ability. It is not safe for an adult to progress to harder work unless they have a firm foundation. -Patience. -Quality not quantity. Doing one class focusing upon sound technique is far more beneficial than multiple classes which can encourage the development of bad habits. -Enjoyment-respect the teacher but also ensure they provide a class which allows you to dance and have fun. -Learning through observing others in the class. -Don't try to run before you can walk. Ensuring you develop the basics is key to injury prevention and progression in the long term. -Whilst teachers do not always know everything, a good teacher should advise students as to when they believe the classes they are attending are beyond their current level of ability. -If the teacher gives little feedback in class then filming movements at home should assist in getting a sense of what is working and what is not. -Most important is finding a teacher who respects the adults they teach and makes dancing fun as ultimately enjoyment of dance is the crucial factor which will enhance motivation. It takes years to train a dancer. For an adult this challenge is even greater. Enjoy the journey but building technique is like building the foundations of a building. If you do not have a firm foundation and allow the cement to set, whatever you place on top of this will be insecure and increase risk of injury. Ballet should be fun but the importance of the aspects raised should not be underestimated. Most of all do not become so fixated upon the intricacy of steps that you forget how to actually dance rather than do steps. Happy dancing...