DD Driver

so can I add.... The reason a 16 year old needs to travel overseas e.g. from Australia to a top ballet school is that the top schools are the primary filter system into the top companies. There are very limited companies and apprentiships out there no matter where you live.

Viv - I hope the girls that you know who are 'desperate' to access training at the level of British students are 16 and over (?) Before 16, I think Australian students can access excellent training locally if they set their mind to it. Many teachers in top studios are ex-principals/soloists from around the world - retiring in the sun maybe. There is access to the broad array of local workshops with international visitors and of course overseas intensives, comps with master classes, summer schools and short-stay opportunities at top schools. Queensland Ballet pre-pro program is on the up. The success of so many students in getting into top schools around the world indicates that the local training in the early years is at the required level if you have the talent. I know of several girls who have come back from top overseas schools pretty broken. There is great value in learning in an environment where you have a strong support system around you and working with talented teachers who are personally invested in your success and happiness.

It is possible for a talented Australian dancer to compete at big comps such as YAGP over a number of years and also go to other comps such as Prix de Lausanne AND attend RBS Summer schools over a number of years. By the time such a person is made an offer of a place at a top ballet school (e.g. at a YAGP event) they may be well known to the school. One way that a student may be doing 40 plus hours pw is through Rhythmic Gymnastics. The schedule for this is usually before and after school hours. If you have talent then you might enter an elite program for a few years and even aim for World comps and the Olympics. The hours do not necessarily conflict with one's school day or a ballet full time program. A ballet school may not approve of the workload but allow the student and their family free choice subject to monitoring by a dance physio. Another ballet school might even recommend RG in the early years after seeing some previous successes.

ha ha Ballet 😂

I expect that the recent advertising of international auditions by The RBS is mostly forewarning that they will not be at YAGP in 2018/2019. Concerns about comps may have led to a greater focus on creating more audition/intensive + audition opportunities. On their website page where audition opportunities are detailed it spells out: 'The School will also continue to recruit students at selected competitions that align with our own teaching ethics, best practices and that we consider to have healthy and age-appropriate criteria, such as the Prix de Lausanne, Switzerland.' https://www.royalballetschool.org.uk/2018/07/20/the-royal-ballet-school-expands-its-international-search-for-talent/

Which countries offer substantial funding for their teenagers to train in the UK? I had not heard of that. The only Australian options I know of - for example - are some Arts scholarship that usually go to musicians or artists going to overseas specialist universities. Ballet vocational schools don't fit the mold. Harrison Lee won a scholarship last year but that was from The Marten Bequest. Only administered - but not funded - by the Arts Council.

Given the changes that occur in our bodies from 11 yrs on, it seems a bit of a leap to think that this advantage - of having the right aesthetic at that age - will be enough to see you through long term. And I believe body type ('potential') plays a very large part in selection at this age over and above say flexibility or being able to demonstrate your performance ability/musicality as you would in a competition. Maybe 20 years ago, if you were chosen at 11 and then trained at vocational school then the unsuccessful candidates (or those not applying so young) could not so easily access quality training elsewhere. The Australian Ballet ITP (Interstate/International Training Program) students appear to be selected in a similar way to the UK, Canadian etc junior associates. Various skills are tested at auditions - for 9 yrs and up - but aesthtics seem to play a large part in selection at the younger years i.e. not just facility in terms of turn-out but having the desired look/body type. The result is that at the young ITP training workshops the range in dance ability is wide. Not exactly an elite crew. Some serious culling then starts to happen at 13/14 years old. Unkind people might say that it is a money-maker up to that point. In their defence, you are not being forced to play the game!

Well they say it is an international search but the board would not move the company to Sydney either! Tax reasons I imagine.

I don't know about the best candidates for this role and at this time.... but it is great to see current dancers like Steven McRae preparing themselves for these kind of roles in the future. I know he did a degree in Business Management & Leadership whilst working full-time. He is now doing a post-grad degree in Marketing through Exeter Uni online.

ha ha - I don't think so but thank you! You apologised and I hope no one feels a need to review the detail of that. ONWARDS >>>>

I think this is an important point. Against fierce competition from overseas, these top schools and companies have endured. Just challenging, I'm sure, at a personal level. By the way...On the RBS website, it states that the RBS will be at the Prix in Sept 2018 (video audition selection time) and IBStage Grand Prix in Nov 2018 But NOT attending YAGP this year. Not sure if that is a schedule conflict or change in direction https://www.royalballetschool.org.uk/train/apply/audition-dates-venues/#1532077195396-6fd45c38-712d

hmmm there are many confusing messages presented to parents. What it takes to be competitive at global comps is not necessarily the path followed at the vocational schools. Especially in the lower school age bracket. Many of these schools do not allow students to compete and do not aim to train them for that purpose. Maybe taking a slow boil approach rather than the more intense training offered elsewhere to get a student comp-ready by 14,15, 16 years old. The philosophy of elite schools selecting children at 11 and training them in their style over a long period of time e.g. through to 18yrs old....started in a time when there were less options for obtaining such high quality training elsewhere AND when there was less likelihood of students coming in from a global market. No easy answers! As an Australian parent the landscape is different again. It would be great if my dd was offered a place at The Australian Ballet School but that is just one pathway. Getting invited to the Prix de Lausanne or YAGP Finals is definitely a goal. It is notable that so few UK students attend the Prix. One reason that I have heard is that it clashes with the timing of their upper school auditions. Maybe more UK students will start to focus on this option in the coming years(?)

I note the latest instagram post from the RBS: 'We’re increasing our search for talent! We’ve announced that we will be holding more international auditions in 2018/19 as well as recruiting students at selected competitions. Competitions confirmed so far are @ibstage Grand Prix and the @prixdelausanne. Where will we see you? Visit our website to find out more about our 2018/19 opportunities.' July 2018

I was also surprised that full RB contracts were not given to Harrison Lee and Yu Hang. I am not sure what the reasons might be - but curious as to how this works! Maybe they are ok to see how things pan out rather than accept a contract elsewhere but I for one would have loved to see their talent and hard work rewarded with more of a commitment ( and presumably $$). It was great, for example, to see Shale Wagman gaining a contract at ENB after his Prix de Lausanne win.

-You find the current situation unacceptable.. You are the parent. You are the adult with life experience. You are paying for this. -Your dd is a child. She is talented. She has worked hard to get there. She sees a chance for herself and is prepared to soldier on in silence. A negotiated settlement is needed. Taking action - small first steps - immediately relieves some of the pain! I agree that exploring options and finding a counsellor/skilled third party are great first steps.. There are different ways to id a counsellor. For example: I have previously (a) gained my non-dancing daughter's agreement for her to see a counsellor. Or, in my case, we were off to see the head of her school. b) I emailed through my issues/her issues for that person to see in advance. Outlined my need for action steps. (b) Sent daughter along weekly ( or could be both of you). (c) See how it works and either continue or try another one that clicks. In my case we did this and still landed up visiting the Head with a view to fixing or leaving. Luckily I was massively surprised at how great she was at supporting this situation! All the best x

Thank you to you and your daughter, Kat. It is so important for us to hear these personal stories. I agree Millie3, that it would be great to see a thread on life after vocational training! I believe that a vocational school's focus on attracting the best and accompanying need to assess people out is a fundamental conflict of interest with a commitment to pastoral care. My dd is doing part-time training combined with homeschooling. Friends are doing Distance Ed. Luckily for me we were already into this style of education before ballet became a big factor in her life. I am viewing our participation in dance (intense) as just another alternative schooling path - that allows her to pursue her individual skills and preferred style of learning. Whether she joins a company or not is irrelevant to the value I see in the path we are taking. That is my bottom line. Boarding away from home is not an option for us. Her support systems are here. Great teachers are here. I could be tested on this when she hits 16 and certain ballet schools look to be the only way into certain companies. You sure have to be careful what you wish for! I hope my daughter will view herself as a talented dancer and performer plus , plus. Not 'a ballet dancer' fullstop Bravo to Kat's daughter who is someone that is able to: write, stimulate important conversations, share personal stories to help others and so much more.

Just one person's experience but....here are a couple of links to a blog by an Australian student who went to Perm (after the Bolshoi Ballet Academy) a few years ago. She had a tough time - and personal challenges that may not apply to others - but interesting insights to offer: https://balletschooldropout.wordpress.com/2016/12/02/surviving-sibera/ https://balletschooldropout.wordpress.com/2016/11/27/why-i-didnt-stay-in-moscow/

Just by the by...some people expressed concern about excessive training and the impact on education. It looks like the options for schooling vary considerably between countries. Doing more ballet hours does not necessarily mean jeopardising your academics. I don't live in the UK, so my experience is not that of the vocational schools where everything is delivered in one place. In other countries there are high schools (both private and state funded) where students are able to take time off to pursue their art or sport programs. For example, the Master Ballet Academy, Arizona, students can go to the local school and leave around 1pm. At John Cranko Schule, Germany, many students go to the local school for most of the day. In most Australian states, there is the Elite Arts & Sport program whereby a state school principal can allow an exemption of up to 100 days away from school per year. In these cases, the parent and school work out how the student can access the classwork and homework etc in order to keep on track. If a child wishes to go into a full-time program (i.e. most of the day), then there is homeschooling or well-established Distance Education/online options. This puts the onus on the child and their family to make it work. It is not unusual however for homeschoolers to be studying a year above their academic grade level. Also, when your schooling is not done through your ballet school AND there is no equivalent of the DaDA or government funding schemes....there is more flexibility/power to take your child out of a top ballet school if you or your child is not happy there. My child goes to a highly regarded ballet school but I don't expect it to be the best place for everyone or the best place for her necessarily in 2 years or 3 time.

Ok so if you want to go there....Below is a link to an interview with students at Master Ballet Academy in Arizona. Some of the students are just 12 yrs old I think when this interview was filmed last year and many had enjoyed great success at Youth America Grand Prix (YAGP) comp. At 1:35 the head coach, Irena Wozniak, talks of students training 7 days a week for 5 to 6 hours every day. Sometimes up to 10 hours... I have seen on instagram that these kids do have periods off due to injuries but they seem to view them and the recovery time as part of the deal! Guess it is survival of the fittest. Some kids may not recover and return to training. Really it is like the world of competitive sports...but you also have to have artistic talent to make an impact in the top ballet competitions. Their goals may be to go to a great school and then company but probably Hollywood or ad contracts are more lucrative options. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY6LxdR_n4Q

You raise important concerns Danceforfun! I think as a parent it is vital to take 'ownership' of your child's hours etc. My daughter does more dance hours than her ballet school's schedule. She does additional private lessons and does modern dance at another studio and workshops. We firstly however discussed the research on recommended hours with a dance physio. Based on this we made sure that we gradually increased her hours over time and review each term. They say in gymnastics that if there are too many tears or tantrums - cut back the hours. We also aim to do more training through Pilates or Progressing Ballet Technique or Stretch classes etc rather than adding more dance hours. Work smarter. I am aware though that it is naive to do more hours than someone would for a hobby but less than the people you expect to compete with. My child is 'serious' about her dance so she knows that she can not have it all. Other interests tend to fall by the wayside. Having read this forum for a while I would say that if you fear retribution from a school for monitoring your child's training then a red flag is waving at you. There seems to be many sad stories of parents who feel powerless because their child is so lucky to be at an elite school. Each to their own but I see opportunities with many talented teachers out there - both in and outside of top schools. I only hand over money to the ones who care for and want the best for my DD.

Yes a bit vague on the detail. She says that she had her annual meeting with the director and hoped for a promotion that year (or the next). It was not forthcoming. I think she is a very ambitious person - as she says - and probably the heirachy did not suit her. Maybe some burn-out and home sickness there as she did not apply to another company but rather went home and quit ballet for a while. WIth Claudia Dean Coaching she is her own boss and runs a business where she has more control over her own success. She is now doing private coaching but also running intensive workshops across Australian and Asia - so has a lot of drive to keep building her brand.

Claudia Dean uploaded a YouTube video today about why she left the Royal Ballet Company. It is important I think for young students to know that even successful dancers may have a short company career, it is not for everyone and that they can go onto an exciting new phase in their lives. My dd had a private lesson with Claudia Dean and she is one of the most upbeat and supportive coaches I have ever seen in action.

No. They are not required. Still.....my daughter does a lot of Contemporary/Contemporary Ballet classes in addition to her hours of Classical Ballet training. This is out of personal interest but also her school views this genre as very important. Many big competitions award half the marks to the Contemporary solo and many companies have modern works in their repertoire. These classes, over a number of years, have helped to increase her flexibility and strength. As a result, she does one-handed and aerial (without touching the floor) cartwheels around the house. It is a hazard and annoys her sisters greatly. So far no interest in backflips or other tumbling skills.

ha ha sorry! I know we all have diverse opinions about different performers. I do see merit however in discussing 'how' we speak about people on social media. At work we say: if you would not be comfortable seeing your actions reported on the front page of the newspaper, then don't do it. To my children, I say: Anything you post you should be comfortable saying/doing in front of me and anyone involved.