Kerfuffle

Hi Tiaramum the results to the final audition came out quickly last year, after about a week. Unfortunately with waiting lists it’s hard to predict, factors affecting it include where you are on the list as well as timings such as deadlines for other places offered, plus Dada awards. I guess everyone has to weigh up which offers they want to take. Good luck !

Hi Proud Dance Dad I think that training abroad is still mostly a viable option, but there are a couple that have been affected such as European School of Ballet in Amsterdam (a visa only lasts six months if no EU passport so you have to alternate with six months here) and KHIO in Norway which has had to introduce fees for non EU passport holders. This is as far as I’m aware from my research last year - my DD is now training here post 16.

The reality is that you have to sort something out privately. It’s a long form of several pages and requires the doctor to sign off that the patient is in good health in their opinion. Considering the physical and mental health issues that young dancers can be suffering I think it’s probably not a bad idea.

I think in this case it has to be signed by a doctor, it’s very detailed.

My DD had this last year, we went privately as the GP was too busy and it’s a longer appointment than a regular one, very detailed. It’s annoying having to pay but one of those expenses that in our case was unavoidable.

Hi Teddy 24 I know of previous non vocational students going to both those schools so I would say he’s got a good chance at the finals. There is often a big shuffle around of students leaving lower schools for other upper schools with 16 plus intake in this country and also some going to train abroad. Don’t be intimidated by other students’ expensive dance training, in the end they are looking for those who have potential, good technique and the personal qualities that make a dancer. Good luck !

Definitely Luke!

Hi Where to Now we had the invitation to the finals 3 days later, so not much stalking time !

I guess it depends on the school but the one we had done had to be in person and involved blood pressure checks and things like lung capacity, much more in depth than just signing a form. Our local surgery couldn’t offer that so we went privately and it cost about £100. She was in year 11.

If the halls of residence have floors reserved for a certain school then those rooms won’t be let out until the results are out so hopefully you’ll be ok. This is a common practice amongst lots of universities - only current renting students are given first refusal. My DD’s halls has mostly well behaved scientists from nearby Imperial Uni, they are a quiet hard working bunch and don’t bother her with loud partying! (She’s at ENBS).

Maybe the schools with a lower school have a separate audition? My daughter never attended one either.

That probably is the case and would explain why finals can’t be done on another day.

It might depend if it’s finals or not. I don’t think it’s as easy to sort out at that stage - we had to choose between auditions to attend because they clashed last year 😬

That being said, gaining a vocational place at 11 does not necessarily mean the child will be any more successful than a child that gains a place at 16 for example. This is very true. Amongst those in my DD’s RBS SA class and in others there were many year 11s that got places at upper school, including the ones your daughter auditioned for. I don’t know all their journeys, whether they were JAs or not or even if they had auditioned at year 7 but I do know that a rejection at this stage doesn’t necessarily mean lack of success in the future. Getting accepted can also result in being assessed out or just burned out by the time your child is 16. There are benefits to being at home too, for your whole family. Boarding school does affect everyone, not just the parents and the child but their siblings too. I have been told by several parents that they wish they’d kept their child training at home for longer in hindsight. I’m sure that your daughter will find her way and the important thing is to enjoy the journey and remember why she loved ballet in the first place. Big hugs.🤗

Same here @LinMM it’s all so polished and safe looking, both in the classes and the variations. Natalie Steele’s technique has improved since YAGP but I don’t find her performance very engaging maybe she’s been doing it for too long! It would be better if there were pieces choreographed for the competition so that it really was a fresh performance and no chance for prior rehearsing. It could be more age appropriate for the 15 year olds. It looks to me like a lot of these dancers peak too soon, they don’t really understand the meaning of the variation or its context. It’s like watching virtuoso pianists/violinists aged 4 doing difficult pieces or 10 year old prodigies singing opera. Ballet like all top art forms take many years to really get good at and a lot of that is just hard graft in the studio, improving slowly and surely.

There is a large overlap between YAGP and PdL candidates this year and I think it’s likely that more than one of them performed the same variation in both competitions (Natalie Steele won YAGP with the same Aurora variation a couple of years ago). I think the reason why there are fewer Brits is because we don’t train kids either vocationally or non vocationally to enter competitions unlike USA and other countries that are old hands on the YAGP circuit. On Doing Dance forum it’s been mentioned that a lot of ADs have decided to leave their positions - not many recognisable faces were in the panel. It will be interesting to see who replaces them and what impact that has on ballet competitions - will a different kind of dancer become fashionable ? I noticed in the coaching that one of the younger dancers was being told to be more varied in her approach, to soften the performance between the flashy big jumps. This seemed to be emphasising the artistry which would be a welcome thing, over the tricks.

Remember that any choice made by a school when a child is 11 is a calculated guess and rejection now does not necessarily reflect your child’s potential. My DD is now at an upper school with those who were at prestigious lower schools including WL. She was rejected from JAs for year 6. Her route between 11 and 16 was unconventional but she got to the same place as others who seemed more successful at an earlier age . Don’t let these results define you, there are other options that open up if it’s meant to be.

My DD did RAD up until intermediate, which I think is the minimum grade if you want to go on and teach. This gave her a good grounding in the basics but at times it was repetitive. After this around 14 she learned Russian style for two years, increasing her flexibility and expressiveness alongside some great performance opportunities. The Russian method taught an artistic approach to the upper body and she really developed her response to music. She was also during this time attending RBS SA classes to keep up with her British training . Now she’s at upper school in UK and although they don’t do RAD exams I think she’s benefitting from both experiences so I think Ruby Foo’s advice is a very good one - RAD is a great foundation that can then be built on through experiencing other styles.

I think it’s very unlikely that those statistics from 2004 reflect the proportions of hyper mobility in dancers today. The lines that hyper mobility give go a dancer are visually the most desirable in ballet. It would be the same as saying that there are no dancers with banana feet. These kind of physiques do need more attention in terms of developing strength but it’s possible to be a principal with them, even in RB. Yasmin Naghdi has sway back legs and Melissa Hamilton has high arches and hyper mobile knees just to mention a couple of senior dancers in the Royal Ballet. Pirouettes and jumps can be easier with flatter feet and straight knees but there is more to ballet than that. Flexibility can be worked on but hyper mobility and turn out are pretty much what you’re born with. If that research is based on a much more serious end of hyper mobility (Ehlers Danlos syndrome) that is a medical issue. If it’s based on Beigton score that is different - it’s possible to score 7-9 and still only be marginally affected. My DD is a 7/9 but has a strong physique. I don’t think she’s unusual at her upper school stage of training, it just needs adequate care to build the support around the joints.

Interesting point Colman, I imagine it was a very difficult period to navigate so perhaps they need to move on.

Very interesting to hear that Fiona, I wonder if it’s a coincidence or a sign of change in the ballet world in general?

I don’t know if things have changed but my friend’s DC was a JA and they were all prepared for the audition in year 6 and had the teacher they were used to taking the class. Only a couple of non JAs were there and I would have thought that would put them at a disadvantage. This was outside London. When it comes to summer intensives that is different, it’s much more international altogether.

I would also recommend Luke, he noticed that my daughter needed to bring her weight forward. He can look at how she’s performing steps and tell you what needs to be done. He’s a lovely guy too. How old is your daughter ?

Ah I see this is probably something I have missed along the way, thank you for the explanation. I would imagine the curtsying was an old tradition dating back to De Valois’s era!

Are you talking about the abuse at ballet schools case? I was writing in a general sense about competition culture, how it affects school intake, nothing to do with Panorama or anything related to it.