SissonneDoublee

To take only this year’s intake of one school, and only one gender within the Year 7 class as a sample, is hardly a representation of the children accessing vocational training. To claim that they all come from the south while discounting any reference to previous year groups ‘because we are talking about this year’s intake’ is absurd. Looking at such a tiny sample can only observe coincidences. Several posters have pointed out that this is not a pattern over time.

When talking about students accessing huge amounts of training and having a massive online presence, you have to also bear in mind the huge number of children that do both these things without securing a place at any of the vocational schools. Having lots of classes with ‘big name’ teachers and posting photos on Instagram doesn’t lead to a vocational place. Hard work sometimes includes these things, particularly the additional training, but there are many other factors. Any child in a ballet class is capable of asking for additional exercises to do at home and practicing daily. That will make more difference than a dozen online tutorials. Lots of posters have said that they know of DC who had very few lessons apart from a couple of ballet lessons and a good associates programme each week. Again, you can’t look at only part of one cohort and try to make any conclusions, ignoring all references to previous year groups.

Every year we comb through the ‘yeses’ trying to find an explanation or a pattern. It’s only natural to look for answers, especially when faced with a disappointment. But to try to put it down to privilege or geography rather than talent, hard work and physical suitability, is insulting to the children that have worked so hard to get there.

14 hours ago, alison said:

 

Erm, Corrales?

Shouldn’t this be Sambé? I’m absolutely on board with Francesca Hayward for Tita, less so with Sambé for Pedro, but only because I like Marcelino so much, and Pedro is fundamentally not a likeable character.

This is the most excited I have been about a new ballet. Like Water for Chocolate is stunning, and so rich emotionally. Wheeldon’s flair for the quirky will lend itself really well to the magical realism. I cannot wait!

2 hours ago, Motomum said:

Without MDS, yes places are then full fee paying.

Not sure about scholarships, I haven’t heard that anyone has been awarded one.

Scholarships can vary, full, partial, just for certain aspects of the training.

A MDS place means that all costs are fully covered for the child.

MDS parent contributions would be calculated on the same sliding scale regardless of which MDS school is attended. In order to pay nothing at all towards fees the household income needs to be very low. There is a good fees calculator on the RBS and Elmhurst websites.
 

A family with full fees covered would also possibly get a contribution towards formal uniform and travel expenses, and may have been on free school meals at a regular school. How much is covered by the MDS funding varies a bit from school to school, but can include a dancewear bursary, healthcare costs and music tuition.

There are extras that need to be paid for, and wouldn’t be included in the MDS bursary: boarding house activities, theatre trips (not at the moment!), taxi fares, any extras for academics like workbooks etc. It runs to about £150 extra per term, although quite a bit less at the moment.

It is manageable, especially if you work out what your annual contribution will be and start setting aside 1/12 of that each month from May onwards. We panicked when we first did the maths, but it is ok!

10 minutes ago, WrapsnBows said:

Unfortunately that’s common i once attended another of the top schools whilst my child auditioned for a year 7 place and the principle gave the ‘parent’ talk and a parent asked about ‘assessing out’ and that’s when it came out ‘unfortunately we don’t assess out! so unless somebody leaves  then we don’t have the space!!  It’s not fair at all,  the system isn’t fair at all 

Even in the schools that don’t assess out, there is still a lot of movement. We have seen lots of coming and going in DDs school. Sometimes circumstances change, not all children are suited to boarding, some decide the focus is not in line with their ambitions (ie too much ballet and wanting more ‘other dance’). Every year has seen new students join the school, despite not assessing out. Always apply, if that is what you and your DC want, and see what happens. It is definitely worth a try!

Don’t forget that a lot of children offered MA places will also have other vocational school applications. Almost all the girls in DD’s class at vocational school were also offered MAs, so there is a lot of movement on the waiting list. Once the vocational places are taken into account that takes maybe 120 children out of circulation! 😂

13 minutes ago, Dancermom said:

I think we hear separately about mids I could be wrong as everything’s a bit different this year 🤷‍♀️

Mids results normally come through a few weeks later. Ours were at the end of March when finals took place on 1-2 March or so. If you are offered a place at WL but don’t want full-time training, or if you are on the waiting list for WL you will definitely get a place though. There is a lot of movement on the SWL, as lots of children that get Mids also have offers of full-time training from other vocational schools.

The Junior Associate uniform list for RBS includes nude seamless knickers for under the white leotard. They definitely don’t mind knickers!

https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests 
free test kits available to any household with school-aged children

You can now order home testing kits that are posted to your home if you have a child at school (regardless of age)

https://www.gov.uk/order-coronavirus-rapid-lateral-flow-tests
They are free of charge, and the result is reported via the app.

1 minute ago, BalletPapa said:

Just wonder how realistic that is when they haven’t even said upfront what that procedure will be? Very stressed since we will not be able to attend in person and feels like it will be a pro-forma afterthought for all those who can’t attend to be seen via some other method after all selections have already been made

If your child is a JA, they may assess in class. A few years ago, when snow prevented the full cohort of finalists from attending, they delayed finals results until all the children had been seen. One of the children that could not attend finals was offered a place at WL.

Elmhurst often put letters in the post last thing as school holidays start, so don’t lose hope yet! Small envelope for a no, big one for a yes (although that might be finals results rather than prelims). Good luck everyone!

25 minutes ago, BalletBoyMumma said:

Thank you. So grateful for all of this info. Please tell us the good, the bad and the ugly aspects of vocational training and boarding. 😁 
 

What have DCs found down time to be like at each school? Do they get to spend much time outdoors? Can they bring their favourite things with them or is it very limited? 

Also, assessing out when it happens? How do the schools balance this with not disrupting formal studies too much? Is it done as kindly as possible or is it quite abrupt? 

 

(I hope you guys don’t mind all the questions 🙈 We haven’t really had any chance to find out about these things yet). 

I always get the impression that DD has more downtime than her non-vocational but serious dancing friends, as her classes fit into the school day whereas they are dashing from school to the studio and trying to squeeze homework (where teachers often don’t understand the demands on their time from dancing) and dinner. She definitely has time to relax every evening, and at weekends and school holidays too. (There is class on Saturday morning if not an exeat weekend, but by lunchtime they are done.)

At her school they are outside a lot, there is a big grassy area where they sit and chat, and they are encouraged to eat outside at picnic tables when the weather is good. 
This year they have been asked to take ‘essentials only’, due to increased cleaning and the risk of having to suddenly pack and return home, but normally she takes an absolute car load of her favourite things! The school encourages them to take lots of photos etc to make their living space personal.

The last assessing out point at all the lower schools (as far as I know) is in year 9. If they get into year 10 they are there until the end of their GCSEs. Similarly, they don’t assess out until year 8, to give children a fair chance at settling in and working with them. So it’s only really years 8 and 9 when they do, and not all the schools have a policy of assessing out at all. You would hope that the warning signs would be there beforehand, but I’m not sure that that is always the case. I have known a couple of families that have been completely shocked by the news. I think maybe always being prepared for the fact that it could happen is a wise approach.

Ask all the questions that you need to! We have all been there, and been helped by parents further down the line than us when it was our turn xx

1 hour ago, Darkbeans said:

Children are offered waitlist places for Whitelodge, but it’s a very short waitlist I believe! 😊

The year DD was on it, there were just 5 girls who were automatically given places in MAs in the meantime. DD went to a different vocational school, as she had other offers, so we declined staying on the list (we felt that the uncertainty would make starting at a different school feel very unsure, as the list remains open until the Easter of Year 7) but I believe some girls were taken into WL off the waitlist.

Heavy snowfall meant not all children were able to make it to WL finals the year DD went. They delayed the results to ensure that everyone was seen, and reassured parents that this would be the case so no one took unnecessary risks to get to Richmond. I’m sure they will do the same this year. The whole process was very fair, and communication was really good.

1 hour ago, Neverdancedjustamum said:

Quite a few schools overseas are opting to do prelims over Zoom or similar.  I know everyone is probably experiencing Zoom fatigue by now but  I actually think this would have been a good idea if prelims could not have been done in person.  No one would have an advantage of having more time to prepare or polish videos.  It would show students who pick things up quickly.  A panel could have watched even 20-25 students at a time, pinning those who they want to see closer etc.  It is more likely that students will be in the same situation at any one time (ie if in lockdown most would be at home although I know some have access to halls or studios).  I think overall it would have been a more transparent, equitable and accurate process than producing multiple videos.  Plus, it would have saved the panel sifting through hundreds of videos, which in themselves would have varying levels of being prepared (for example, some would have rushed videos to be able to access halls before lockdown, some would have had more time but would have had to film at home.  I've actually seen some hire professional studios and videographers).  I do feel for all the children, parents and teachers who've had to deal with the added stress of filming these videos in addition to the stress of auditions themselves.

The issue with this is that if anyone’s technology fails, it then becomes much more stressful. Or if they don’t have access to a suitable space at the specified time... There are arguments for either method. With video submissions you have a bit more flexibility to resolve the issues. A professional videographer might make a video that looks excellent to the untrained eye, but the panel know exactly what they are looking for, and they won’t be fooled.

2 hours ago, BellaF said:

What does the means testing look at? Just income or does it look at other assets like property or company assets? Note that funding drops off completely after a certain amount. A place at any of the schools is a long shot but not sure we could afford to send DD anyway looking at the calculator. 

 

 

Ours is pretty much exactly what the calculator said it would be. Bear in mind there are other expenses, like boarding activities, trips, travel at exeat weekends and formal uniform. Probably averages about £150-200 extra per term or so. 
When thinking about affordability, we found it helpful to take the termly amount and split it by 4, which we then started putting away from the May before DD started. There is a boarding school fee scheme that helps you spread the payment without having anything up front (I think), but I assume you would pay a surcharge for this.

You are unlikely to find a piece that is the right length. DD’s ballet teacher always edits music to the required length, a this gives a lot more choice. DD’s last ballet solo (age 10) was to a beautiful piece by Einaudi. He might be a good starting point? Good luck!

Thank you, but DD has said no thank you.

2 minutes ago, cotes du rhone ! said:

I’m just about to advertise a Bloch Petite and they fit Dd the same, if that helps x

That’s really helpful, thank you!

7 minutes ago, cotes du rhone ! said:

Hello, what would you like to know ? X

I need to check with DD, if that’s ok? Which similar sized leos could I use as reference for the size, please?  Is it like a Bloch petite?

Hello, I’m interested in this. 

11 minutes ago, Crazylifecrazykids said:

Reading this has made me feel a bit guilty 🙈 my DC gives teachers a small Christmas pressie each year and a card, where the teacher is thanked for all the support given during the year. My DC has a privates too, mainly for festival solos and just to... well dance, we do make sacrifices but we are happy too.

There would appear to be no favourites at our studio, well not that I've noticed but it never occurred to me how it would look to the teachers with my DCs yearly gift and card. I don't have a dance background, so rely on their words of wisdom and advice, we like to thank them.. I can see how it could be misconstrued now 🙈

What i will say is my DC works so hard and loves dance, she sucks up any input given like a sponge and she's always grateful for any above and beyond the teacher may do... which I should imagine all teachers are going above and beyond for their students all the time ❤ I know ours do for all their dancers.

I really don’t think there is anything to feel guilty about! Lots of children give their schoolteacher(s) a card and/or present at Christmas. I receive lots each year. I don’t view them as an attempt at securing my favour, and I certainly don’t treat students any differently because of them!

Students that practise and respond well to corrections will make greater progress, and the work done in private lessons would be inappropriate in a whole-class setting (ie. preparing festival solos or getting ready for auditions) as it would be to the detriment of the rest of the class. Other parents would be very quick (and right!) to complain if an individual solo was being taught in a whole-class lesson.

Parents are naturally protective of their children’s rights, but I do feel sorry for the dance teachers that have to defend their every move!

Another thing to consider re. the teacher’s friend’s daughter being cast in very prominent roles... it is always possible that they know each other having danced together in their youth. In which case the teacher knows she is casting someone that will have support at home with practising. 
 

Private lessons do make a huge difference in the technique and confidence of a dancer too, so again this is completely justifiable. They will also be children that are keen, and likely to do additional practice at home as well as the private lessons.

And the children that bring gifts at Christmas etc may also be the ones that are absolutely passionate about dancing, and want to thank their teacher for the input they have had in a hobby they love. It is also possible, of course, that they are trying to buy favour, but I wouldn’t automatically assume that that is the case.

Having been accused of all three things that you mention over the years, and having always been completely genuine and just both really passionate about ballet, I think it’s important to see both sides.

They also carry child sizes. A 10A will likely be a better fit. My 13 year old wears a 12A.

I think the physio assessment shows potential for things like turnout and flexibility, as well as what they are currently working with. The children are scored on all areas of flexibility, including hamstrings. Has your DS’s teacher given him exercises to do?