hfbrew

At one talk some years ago giving audition advice for full time training applicants, I well remember the comment " we can always tell the festival children"..

This statement was followed by the observation that many (but not all) were all show and no substance!

 

Doing well at festivals does not necessarily equate to being suitable for full time training or a future professional career. Nor for that matter high exam results.

I take your point about numbers- but this is not asking for a 20 page essay- a few lines perhaps. Or they could have a system where preliminary auditionees dont get feedback but surely they could manage feedback for those who make it to finals at very least?

 

Also not giving feedback because its too cruel? I'm not sure I agree that the answer is not to get any feedback at all. Years ago patients weren't allowed to see their medical notes and Dr's wrote all sorts of horrible subjective comments about their patients which adversely impacted on the way other clinicans treated them. Now they don't because they know the notes are publically visible. Perhaps audition panels could be trusted/expected to be capable of giving feedback in ways that don't include comments like 'you are simply too fat and ugly to ever be a dancer'. And maybe if they knew they had to justfiy their decision a bit more carefully they would be a bit more careful about making that decision....

 

Yes there is sometimes a situation where they have 20 places for 24 students, but even a gut instinct decision can be justified if you think it through. And maybe auditionees would like to know how close it was and that the differences were only minor, as this could have a very positive impact.

 

As for taking criticism as a reason to give up, well we all have to deal with criticism in life through any job we do, as well as in school from a very young age, and deal with not being as able in academic/arts or sporting areas as we might have liked. And we have to learn to use the constructive criticism to improve our work, and try not to take unconstructive criticism too much to heart. This is a life skill for everyone, not just dancers. I do understand and sympathise with what you are saying hfbrew, I just personally feel the risk is outweighed by the benefit...

The life skill about taking criticism is indeed crucial , something my ds and his fellow full time students learnt from a very early age. A dancer has to take it every day.

 

But my point in one of my earlier posts was that some got feedback that was stated at the time as "fact". "Facts" that supposedly would prevent classical careers. Can't go into too much detail at risk of identifying individuals.

 

At least one of these individuals nearly lost the chance to training elsewhere because the parents took the feedback so seriously they were unsurprisingly reluctant to fund more training. My own dh also expressed an opinion that ds should therefore discontinue, luckily this changed when the yesses started to arrive.

 

There have been many posts on this forums about "nos" at auditions and the resulting feeling of discouragement. How many times have we advised that no is not necessarily never!

 

In these cases, whilst feedback may be useful,it could simply compound the disappointment rather than just moving on. And where there are a large group of auditionees how pertinent to each individual would they be?

 

And as others have pointed out, this is the reality of what happens in professional auditions. You can travel miles only to be turned away at the door before even one pile!

Sometimes it is possible for a teacher who asks, to get feedback. I got this about students on JA/MA waiting lists.

 

It can also be helpful to get advice from approachable teachers at summer schools. They can sometimes suggest or give insight as to why a student may or may not be suitable for a particular place, especially if they have taught at said schools.

I'm sorry but I don't agree that feedback should be given. Firstly, it would be a logistical nightmare as there are too many at finals but most importantly, the reasons that schools don't take some candidates are as simple as: too fat, too short, not flexible, no turnout, head too big, boobs too big, no musicality etc etc. Now try explaining that to an impressionable, sensitive young girl/boy. So much better to be told that THIS time it's a no but please try again next year. Then mum can comfort and reassure and the child can pick herself up and try again. What if the reason is that her feet aren't right for ballet? There's not very much that can be done about that, therefore, a devastating thing to hear. The schools know what they're doing. This isn't the job market which deals with adults. It's the world of ballet where sensitive young souls may well have their dreams shattered with the wrong feedback. CeliB, I would hate my daughter to be privy to the discussion made by the panel at her audition. I want to be able to tell her that she was fantastic and beautiful at the audition but the competition was too fierce without her turning round to me and saying, actually mum they said it was because I have flat feet.

And it would still be a subjective view too. But someone getting such feedback could take it as an absolute truth and then give up trying elsewhere.

 

Had some of ds friends taken to heart some of the feedback they got given after preliminary auditions for US about why they weren't cut out for US or a even classical Ballet career then audiences today would be deprived of some lovely dancers who are now dancing professionally in well known companies.

 

Also, although feedback can be useful, sheer numbers of those auditioning would surely impact on length of time getting results out and costs. Auditions cost enough as it is. And in the case of places who get hundreds of applicants there is no guarantee that the feedback would be pertinent and personal to each auditionee.

Another good performance tonight at Croydon.

 

I went on spur of moment and was glad to add to the regrettably small audience who all seemed to enjoy it nonetheless.

Croydon matinee

Aladdin Rudolphe Giacolone

Princess Sarah Mortimer

Genie Pedro Santos

Slave of the Ring Natalie Cawte

Sorcerer David Brewer

 

Evening

Aladdin David Brewer

Princess Ines Ferreira

Genie Philip Tunstall

Slave of the Ring Jessica Hill

Sorcerer Vincent Cabot

 

Have also put this on the thread in performances seen (its where I've put casts before!)

Croydon matinee

Aladdin Rudolf Giacolone

Princess Sarah Mortimer

Genie Pedro Santos

Slave of the Ring Natalie Caste

Sorcerer David Brewer

 

Evening

Aladdin David Brewer

Princess Ines Ferreira

Genie Philip Tunstall

Slave of the Ring Jessica Hill

Sorcerer Vincent Cabot

(Same as Bishops Stortford)

Thank you for the lovely review last night Anna, so glad you enjoyed it.

So sad that there are still no programmes but it seems there just haven't been enough advanced sales to fund this tour.

 

Ds said in an all too brief call today the pas de deux was "interesting" and that they had to change it! He quickly reassured me that it wasn't through injury but he would tell me more another time and that was it, end of call! (Beware parents of dancing sons, communication doesn't necessarily improve with age.)

 

I must say that the dancers appreciated the applause!

 

Will post Croyden casts later.

Just to stress that this year's dates are 24th-28th August.

 

It's been pointed out that the online table still has last year's dates although the correct dates are also on the flyer.

 

Am endeavouring to getting it changed asap! But will accept forms as they are, have received a few already.

 

Helen Brewer

Cast for Bishops Stortford (Rhodes Theatre)tonight.

Aladdin - David Brewer

Princess - Ines Ferreira

Genie- Philip Tunstall

Slave of the ring- Jessica Hill

Sorcerer- Vincent Cabot

 

Do go if you can, it's a lovely Ballet to watch and the dancers would really appreciate the support!

I think I'm a bad influence as I have encouraged sensible and knowledgable posters to talk about cake and biscuits....I have lowered the tone...

Lowered the tone? Crumbs.....!

That really takes the biscuit.

Didn't you get the cake hfbrew?

Believe me I was nearly first in the queue for the cake! Very nice it was too!

oooo no we havent looked at that one!  thank you!

I look forward to your updates   I did think of you yesterday at Tring when i watched the children descend on the bourbons at break!

So that's where the bourbons were. I was at a teachers conference at Tring yesterday and we just got boring shortbread!

 

(The conference was good though!)

Good luck. Hope that you have a comprehensive list of questions with you.

I remember paying £9.99 for my shoes, year's ago, sigh!

This year's forms are finally available on our website,www.harpendensummerdanceschool.co.uk

 

Dates 24th-28th August, our 10th year!

 

Please don't hesitate to contact me with any queries.

 

Have had a few enquiries already so please don't delay booking!

 

Helen Brewer (co director)

Yes how about a different theatre.

LAB is performing at the Bloomsbury Theatre in Gordon Street ......walkable from both Euston and Kings Cross stations.

It's a reasonably sized stage and the people there seem very nice.

There's also a good theatre at Wimbledon which might work for them.....and what about Richmond?

Such a shame they had to be cancelled.

When I looked on the Lilian Bayliss site they weren't mentioned there either. Do you think that BTUK needs to promote itself a bit more too though?

The reason why they werent on Lilian Baylis website is that it was a private hire, so no help whatsoever promoting it.

Should have been Helen....

Sad news.

 

The Lilian Baylis performances are cancelled. I imagine that its too few advanced sales to justify outlay, for example accommodation for dancers and crew alone is a considerable expense.

 

Such a shame. Thanks to AnnaC for posting the link on this thread and I'd also flagged it up in performances seen too. It would have been a reasonably priced good night to a decent Ballet company too!

 

Oh well, hopefully Croydon will do better!

If it hadn't been for Anna's link I would not have known how to buy tickets for it or even that it was on. Its not listed on the Tour Dates page. I've seen this wonderful production already in any case. I was surprised also that there is no mention of it on londondance.com as they seem to list a fairly comprehensive list of dance performances across London for all sorts of styles and companies - not just ballet.

It was listed on the tour dates until yesterday and it is listed

on the flyers issued to each venue although these won't be at Sadlers Wells.

I can't imagine that tickets won't be on sale in the door as they desperately need an audience but I will try and find out!

 

Croydon won't be a problem by the way. It is listed on the website and there is a comprehensive page where you can link to videos about the making of the Ballet.

 

Edited to add that my boss has booked tickets for Thursday using the link that was on the website. I sadly can't go due to teaching commitments.

Well I think the princess should be named Helen after me as its my Birthday too!

But on the BTUK website the performances at the Lilian Bayliss are not mentioned which is also a little odd.

This is odd because yesterday it was still showing on BTUK website.

 

As Annac posted in OP tickets were available through BTUK website. The private hire conditions meant no help or coverage at all from Sadlers Wells. Which is why I've also posted about this elsewhere.

 

Unfortunately it looks as if only Thursdays performance will go ahead now because of the poor advance sales.My ds is certainly expecting to dance that day.

 

So upsetting for these talented dancers who work so hard, their touring schedule is pretty extensive. And as others have testified this is a British company well worth seeing.

Older (in the sense of when they were written) childrens ballet books include the 'Wells' series by Lorna Hill. They were written in the 1950s and 60s but have a real feeling for ballet (and also some horseriding too). They are probably out of print but possibly available secondhand on Amazon Marketplace, Ebay or charity shops.

 

My favourite ballet series written at roughly the same time is the Drina dances series by Jean Estoril. They follow the life of a small girl from learning to dance to becoming a ballerina (10 books) and are a really great read. I still read them! Yet again you will probably need to get them secondhand.

 

Veronica Tennant and Jean Ure also wrote ballet books for young teens in about the 70s or 80s.

 

Rumer Godden wrote the splendid Thursdays Children about a boy wanting to be a ballet dancer. Also Pippa Passes about a 17 year old in the corps de ballet on holiday in Italy.  Apparently, her autobiography A time to dance no time to weep, though I haven't read it, touches on her love of dance. She also wrote The Tale of the Tales about the adaptation of the Beatrix Potter books for ballet.

I still have some of my "Wells" books. And a very precious copy of The Tale of the Tales.

BRB fans over the past years to see two particularly wonderful Simones in (now retired) David Morse and Michael O'Hare. Rory Mackay and James Barton were also excellent. None of them ever shied away from hitting the dancers with the veg and we also got the point about the plant pot!

Janet, I once saw Michael O'Hare accidently throw the wig as well as the bonnet at Colas (Im afraid Ive forgotten who was in that role that evening.) The looks on their faces were priceless!

Ticket prices at Sadlers are extremely reasonable: https://www.facebook.com/BTUKcompany/photos/a.817065238318428.1073741828.815062185185400/960842247274059/?type=1&theater

Bumping this again as just over a week to go and sadly still low ticket sales due to no publicity on Sadlers Wells website ( on account of it being private hire.)

 

On another thread there is talk of high ticket prices. Well why not try a completely different, UK self funded company with lots of young talent for just £12?

 

Please, even if you cant go do tell folks about this opportunity to see a different Ballet, ideal prices for students!