annekh510

Hi, I would like to offer some encouragement from my child having taking an unusual path, but not dance.

You are able to apply with “special circumstances”, I don’t recall the exact process (e.g. whether it was generic via UCAS, or each university, I know she did have to do a separate special consideration form for Cambridge but that wasn’t surprising as you also have to do a separate application form), but it was a lot of extra form filling in to explain the circumstances. She does now have three A-Levels, but only in two subjects (Maths, Further Maths, Physics), which would be fine if she was going for Maths or maybe Physics/Engineering/Computing, but she wasn’t. Also, a year ago, when applying, she was three weeks into attempting to do that in a year, so, dropping the Further Maths was a strong possibility.

She applied to Cambridge, 3 other Russell Group universities and Lancaster, all for some variation of Linguistics (Lancaster is actually second ranked for Linguistics, so it not being Russell Group probably has no impact on how applications were handled in this subject). She was pooled at Cambridge, but not taken out of it, got unconditional offers from two universities (including Lancaster) and ABB from the other two. I’ll be taking her up to Lancaster on Sunday.

13 months ago we were frantic, we didn’t even have a school organised for last year, but we actually discovered there were many options, she probably could have got on a foundation year without taking a year to do some A-Levels, or she could have started out on a traditional 2 year A-Level course, or she could have been homeschooled by the method of doing A-Levels online. A-Levels online were surprisingly cheap (under a thousand) and included everything.

I think that if you apply with special circumstances things like the requirement for them all to be taken in one session can be removed, what can be more important is how recent it is, e.g. graduate medical course require Chemistry A-Level to have been taken within the last 7 years. 

Hope this helps.

6 minutes ago, Medora said:

But what about partnering? I know the Russian schools in Russia have a maximum weight limit for partner work, to protect the men from injury. It’s not just about having a certain look, it’s also about functionality ? Can someone more knowledgeable weigh in?

This is a mixture of things. A dancer gets herself a lot of the way up in lifts, the man catches her and carries it on, kind of like the second stage of a rocket. The challenge at schools is that boys develop a little later than girls and also put on more muscle over time, so a 21 year old male dancer doesn’t look like an 18 year old one.

When you’re learning, whilst for basic lifts the girls technique is quite straightforward, when and how to catch is a bit more complicated. It’s definitely going to help the boys if the girls are lighter, but not much, 51kg is only 2% more than 50kg, a girl can add that amount with a strong plié. Also 50kg is unrealistic for over about 5’6”. 
 

So functionality is a concern, but if we look to broadway and other dance forms, plenty of slim but not 50kg ladies are getting lifted and not injuring their partners, but their partners are full grown men, not developing teens.

1 hour ago, Ondine said:

Kathryn Morgan's story is worth reading / watching.  She's in the US.  If anyone thinks this issue is a British one, it isn't.

 

As far as I can recall KM has never mentioned any talk about her body in school, or in her early NYCB days. Even when she had weight problems at NYCB, she doesn’t seem to have issues with the company over that. I think that it was a clear illness may have helped both her perception and their management. Her only issue with NYCB is possibly them not taking her back in 2014.

This is from someone who never was extremely skinny. Even other NYCB dancers who have spoken about issues within the company don’t seem to have mentioned issues within the school. 
 

It’s definitely not a UK only problem, but US culture is so different in general, including how schools are run - no top ballet school attempts to provide academic education as well. Additionally, although many schools have dorms, that’s also typically partially separate from the school.

That said I’ve heard plenty of bad things said about US ballet schools, just not the big name ones.

On 23/08/2023 at 18:25, bridiem said:

Fascinating! And I'd no idea there were so many companies in the USA.

An important thing to consider when looking at companies in the USA is that none (I think that’s still the case) employ dancers full time. The most is about 48 weeks of the year. Of course the ballet world loves its guest performers, but with summer layoffs the need to guest perform is even greater. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of these companies don’t employ any dancers that aren’t also employed at one of the other companies.

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26 minutes ago, miliosr said:

No need to apologize.

 

The State of Utah has long been the central home of Mormonism, which - historically - has been conservative in its cultural outlook. But, truth be told, there's never been any problem with ballet in Utah. William Christensen founded Ballet West in 1963 (as the Utah Civic Ballet) and the company is now 60 years old. Frankly, I think most state residents, whether they adhere to Mormonism or not, take pride in having a cultural institution of Ballet West's stature.

 

As for Salt Lake City, it is virtually indistinguishable from any other major US metropolis. You won't have any problems finding a hipster coffee shop if you go looking for one!

 

I’m a Brit, but lived in the US for five years - I didn’t know much about Mormonism, but it turns out that Utah is quite prominent in the dance world. Pick any season of “So you think you can dance”, they usually have 20 dancers, when there are 50 states, it’s rare not to find someone from Utah, usually more, as well as LDS members from elsewhere. Overall the influence of Mormons on entertainment/culture is higher than the number of adherents to the religion would indicate. Ballroom dancing also has a lot of links to Utah, one of the organisations always holds its national champs in Provo, Utah. The ballroom dance teams of BYU (Brigham Young University, the LDS university, in Provo), are world renowned.

Additionally Salt Lake City itself is considered quite liberal, akin to Seattle or San Francisco, the population is around 50% Mormon, but that’s not the dominant culture in Salt Lake. 

Ballet West was featured in a reality TV series a little over 10 years ago, when watching that I don’t recall any evidence of Mormonism in the company, though I suspect there must be some.

Megan Fairchild has said in multiple places that being her height (5’ 3” iirc) she knew she needed to find a way out of SLC and Ballet West, as they were known as a company of taller dancers. 

One thing I observed in the US is that the culture seems to lean towards picking one activity quite young and then pursuing that activity much more deeply. If Kindergarteners take dance, they take it three times a week! That leads to a much larger body of dancers who can step into a corps of a professional ballet company.

She's been interviewed in the latest edition of Claudia Dean's podcast. Exciting news in there, she's pregnant! Sadly she had a miscarriage in January (not her first), but then got pregnant after beginning discussions about leaving the Royal Ballet. Unfortunately her injury situation is pretty bad, she's still in a lot of pain and needs another operation on her foot. I wish her all the best with her pregnancy.

On 25/12/2020 at 11:45, Irmgard said:

ENB’s “Nutcracker Delights” is just that – a sheer delight from start to finish. 

I appreciate all the details, as ENBs Nutcracker is not a production familiar to me.

I felt mildly uncomfortable in the Chinese dance - I'm no expert and not up to date, but I'd got the impression that the pigtails on the men wasn't the preferred thing these days (in addition to other things). It was the dance in this production most capable of offending people of that nationality or heritage.

I think I get what you mean with Natascha Mair, her dancing was lovely, but the opening section didn't quite do it for me - though I'm happy to excuse that as it really not being the way to open the ballet!

23 hours ago, Odyssey said:

Moderators, please  combine with my previous post.

Forgot to add the wonderful pas de deux from the second movement of Concerto with Naghdi and Edmonds - sheer class.

I haven't viewed this yet, but I look forward to viewing it, I feel Nicol Edmonds is often under appreciated - he's an excellent partner. The mostly sticking to one partner thing due to covid is doing several dancers favours!

I think everyone has expected Corrales to make principal and a solid partnership with Hayward is going to help that.

Anna Rose O'Sullivan is clearly on that trajectory too, seems like her and Marcelino are getting talked about as the new star couple.

I'm quite happy seeing Osipova do solos, but I'd like to see her in partnering role too 😞

I thought it was interesting that Natalie was asking about the partnership between Marcelino and Anna Rose and basically saying it's the next big thing - I found that interesting that it came from within the company. Surely they are going to have to make her a principal soon even if it feels like there are others who should get there first.

On 26/10/2020 at 09:32, oncnp said:

Before either of the people involved, it seems.

Are you going to demystify us? 

On 20/10/2020 at 08:48, Jan McNulty said:

 

Surely that is down to whether the individual dancers want this on their biographies? 

 

One issue coming out of the pandemic is that most of the websites I look at have not been properly updated since before lockdown.  Usually there are people who can put on news items but as regards the rest we have just got to wait.

Yes, however this never seems to be something that gets put on their bios and though basic updates might be delayed, this kind of info is never there.

But also no, they are in a public facing performance role, I don’t think their potential audience isn’t unreasonable in wanting to know if someone is on maternity leave, taking a sabbatical etc. Admittedly it’s unlikely you wouldn’t buy a ticket because the first artist you are a major fan of won’t be performing, but I think most of us just want to know people are ok!

I think what I’m trying to say is that it would be a small amount of work for someone involved in the company in some way to maintain some kind of news stream of things that the dancers are sharing anyway - in the 21st century we are engaging with dancers in a different way to in the past, teenagers and young adults are much more likely to get interested in something when they can engage with the people behind it. It’s what something like World Ballet Day tries to do and I definitely feel that a greater connection between the company and the individual dancers’ social media would benefit the company and the dancers.

On 16/10/2020 at 10:40, Balletfanp said:

Also Leticia Stock is expecting a baby and Gemma Pitchley-Gale had one a little while ago (all public on their Instagram accounts).

How lovely - I don’t have much time for Instagram so only follow a select few, I dug a bit, but didn’t get through everyone. I feel like it would be nice to say this on their bios.

On 16/10/2020 at 10:22, Sim said:

Olivia Cowley is on maternity leave.

Ooh, congratulations to her.

I’m a bit behind the times, having not found the discussion in the upcoming performances thread and not wanting to start my own!

Most of what I had to say has been said. Though no one has mentioned Nicol Edmonds - it wasn’t dazzling, but it was a strong performance, which as a soloist deserves credit.

I thought everyone was sticking to one partner, so I was a bit confused by Akane appearing with three men!

Female first soloists were notably absent, well half of them, if anyone has shareable info on their well-being please share!

Elizabeth Harrod, Olivia Cowley, Leticia Stock and Gemma Pitchley-Gale were other absentees I spotted, I just hope they are all well and it’s minor niggles or other small things that kept them off the stage.

They also haven’t done any promotions, has anything official been said on this? I assume their is a joiners announcement somewhere, but I must have missed that.

1 hour ago, EmilyR said:

Thanks!

Do you know if they cover the full top of the foot so it looks like you have tights on?

probably not

It's probably your toes that make the difference, there is a hack were you cut the toe seam leaving just a tiny connection between the big toe and the rest of the toes so the tights stay down, I saw it on one of Kathryn Morgan's ballet hacks videos.

2 hours ago, valentina said:

My Dd does the same merciless taunting to her Dad. Finds it hilarious that his feet won’t bend one jot! One things for certain, no matter how hard he worked, with feet like his, he’d never make it in the ballet world! And after seeing what really goes on I think he’d be nothing but relieved!

Children are always more flexible than adults, I don't think it's really possible in retrospect to say he could never have made it, he probably wouldn't have had good feet, but that's less expected of men, partly because they are naturally less flexible than women.

3 hours ago, valentina said:

You’re right, Mummy to Izzy. Not so important to have those ‘ beautiful ‘ curves for contemporary or jazz/ musical theatre. But you would still need very  strong feet that can stretch enough to create good line. 

Yes, I would think that in all dance forms the necessity of using the feet on the floor, means that whilst a gorgeous arch isn't required, you feet need to work and be strong and at least somewhat flexible. You hear a lot about using the plie for jumps, but you can't use the plie without also using the feet and feet are crucial for turns. The foot work in Latin dancing is actually very hard.

32 minutes ago, Dawnstar said:

 

Might that have been why they seemed to be having issues during the rehearsal with moves that involved him supporting her pirouettes? I did wonder while watching the livestream if the was the root cause was that he couldn't reach high enough relative to her reaching up.

I saw the same. I hope that rather than just not being tall enough that he was slightly off in his positioning so his arm was on a diagonal when it shouldn't be. They said they'd danced together before, just not in principal roles, so you'd think the AD would know whether he was tall enough or not.

However, on to other things - that jump - I'd go just to see that.

I remember doing this as a child, we had an especially big nursing home near to us, it was actually called a hospital at the time and some of the residents were on open wards. This did at least mean there was plenty of space for us to perform, I can't imagine trying to dance in the nursing home my grandad was in. It's wonderful if people can go into places like this and do any form of entertainment and I know lots of people do help out in this way. It does seem that homes for younger people with learning difficulties find it harder to get volunteers, a while back a group I was part of used to go and sing Christmas carols, we didn't rehearse or do anything fancy, we mostly tried to do familiar stuff and encourage the residents to join in. 

On 28/01/2019 at 19:22, rubyballerina said:

 

Thank you.

I haven't gone up the grades, my dance school is more focused on competitions and festivals, although some girls take grades alongside our normal ballet classes. 

The important thing is are you taking regular technique classes - the Royal Ballet School doesn't do exams and the dance schools are looking for a solid foundation in technique, not showmanship and tricks (sorry if I seem down on competitions - blame Dance Moms). Depending on where you live you may find it helpful to find a big/reputable school and take some classes there. Some places have open classes or it might be possible to take a class with the associate program of a school which has one, it will give you more idea what things are like in the wider ballet world. There is DanceWorks in London and the Northern Ballet School in Manchester and there must be other places. 

You are both on the slightly late side whilst also being plenty soon enough, in an ideal world you'd have done an easter and a summer course this year, and had to turn down some offers, but you still have plenty of time to explore options and audition next year.

You might want to think about what plan B is. If you'd like to dance in anyway you can, then you want to be at a school that has classical ballet but offers a wide syllabus either a musical theatre or a general dancers course. Or if you really want to throw everything in ballet then you'll want to look at schools that have a heavy focus on that, RBS, ENBS, Elmhurst etc. your plan B can still be dance, but maybe your plan B is dance teacher, or something completely different, so for some people being able to continue academics and do 3 A-levels alongside ballet is important.

Good Luck 

3 hours ago, ImgyA said:

I'm not sure they're that comparable - my DD is currently studying Grade 5 Cecchetti (exam in July) and has just started RAD in January - her new teacher has entered her for her intermediate foundation exam in March as she has the technique. 

With Cecchetti, after grade 6,you can't take the next exam until you're 16 apparently? 

Actually grade 5 to intermediate foundation is roughly what I'd expect, typically people branch to vocational levels after grade 5 RAD, mostly to intermediate foundation, some to intemediate, though with no age limit on intermediate foundation anymore, there isn't much reason to do that, but I know people do skip it.

I shall have to tell my dad about Flirty Dancing, he's been enjoying The Greatest Dancer, which I've not watched yet, I keep meaning to watch it on iplayer and keep failing to get around to it. I did see one bit on youtube where a ballet dancer just missed the required 75%, he was good, so that was disappointing.

2 hours ago, ImgyA said:

Out of interest, at age 15,what grade Cecchetti is your daughter currently studying? Mine does Cecchetti too x

This will give some people here a very good idea of her standard, given you said she got distinctions in all of them - I've no idea of the Cecchetti levels.

I'm a little surprised that a different teacher is taking the pointe class (do later cecchetti exams involve pointework?), that's a class where it's even more important to have a good teacher, otherwise you're risking both acute and chronic injuries.

You says she's in class 12 hours a week, so that's quite an investment and it really doesn't sound like you're getting your money's worth. I'd also consider dropping the acro, seen as she seems to enjoy ballet most, I always hear the mantra that gymnastics coaches liked it if you had ballet training, but ballet teachers don't like if if you take gymnastics - they do things like force extensions with no attention to technique, which transfers badly to ballet, you are just using your body in such a different way.

Does she do competitions? How often does she have the opportunity to do performances? The vocational ballet world in the UK isn't a big fan of competitions and in my experience having a private lesson to work on a solo doesn't help you improve anywhere near as much as a general private lesson, or even just a regular class. It's good to have the opportunity to perform, but not too often, I was quite frustrated around your DD's age that even though my school didn't perform that often we'd spend so long working on the show numbers and there was very little regular class, I think most parents wanted at least that frequency of performance, but the ratio of performance time to rehearsal time was all wrong, especially when I was quite good at remembering choreography and other than for ballet I was often in the back row despite being as good as if not better as people who were given more prominent roles. Dance school politics can get a bit crazy.

On 23/01/2019 at 19:23, thewinelake said:

Not sure if anyone’s particularly interested, but ISTR vague mutterings in the past!

 

This is a ballet show from the club that is not restricted to students - quite a few “townies” in it.

 

More here : https://adcticketing.com/whats-on/dance/don-quixote

That's a big change from my student days, I went to some of their classes at Kelsey Kerridge and the non beginners class had only 2 girls (including me) who had every done pointe work, so it clearly wasn't going to advance my ballet skills, so I took up other forms of dancing.

I shall keep this in mind, I'll have to check on blue badge parking, it's a long time since I've been in the West Road area - I did get a bit confused by it being adcticketing and it being at West Road not the ADC. West Road is bigger, but it's not exactly an ideal venue for ballet.

3 hours ago, Rein2019 said:

I have spoken to her and asked her what her aim is as she is very academic also. I think her studies will always come first but also suspect that if she was given the opportunity she would like to progress her dancing skills further. She just needs to guided correctly. I’m just her mum who wants her to be happy and succeed in all she does.

I think I’ll definitely find a way to get her assessed and then weigh the options up with her. 

To be honest with those aims I don't think you need an assessment. Clearly the current school is not big enough or serious enough if they keep adding new people, a mixed ability class is not appropriate for someone who has been dancing 12 years. 4 classes a week is about the most a small school can offer, most students aiming for vocational schools are taking extra classes in various ways. I was pretty similar to your daughter, a good dancer, wanting to take it seriously but not interested in professional or attempting to get into a vocational school. Fortunately my main dance school was a better starting point than you currently have, I was typically doing a midweek class at grade level and a Saturday class at grade level, separate pointe class and then depending on the time table I'd often join in at the back of either the grade above or grade below. So that's your first step, find a dance school that has graded classes, not mixed ability classes, if it's a different syllabus to what she's done they'll try her our in one class and move up or down as necessary.

Your area is not familiar to me, so I'm not aware of any big schools that could provide a complete course for someone who wants to get the most out of their dancing, for me, my teacher knew I was serious and knew that as I was in the top grade she offered that she simply couldn't provide all I wanted or needed, so she was very happy to facilitate other opportunities. Mostly this was writing letters to other teachers to say she was happy for me to take their class - in general respect between teachers means you get permission from the main teacher. So I took classes at Northern Ballet School (highly recommend something like this if you can find an equivalent) and I also took classes at other local schools that my teacher hooked me up with. I don't think I hit two (1.5hr) classes for 6 days a week which is roughly what full time students are doing and about the amount vocational school hopefuls are doing, but I was doing something 6 days a week, some days a double class other days not and I was also continuing tap and modern at the one class a week rate I was used to which was the right pace to have me finish all the possible exams in the syllabus we used, so that also equals less ballet, though a lot of ballet course will do something like modern or contemporary.