CouldDoBetter

Piepie

I agree with a lot that has been posted.

My DD went to a vocational school from Y7. Although she had an MDS we struggled throughout to afford it. She was bright and we had concerns throughout her time at the school with regard to the academics. A concern shared by a number of the other parents.

If you are convinced that she wants to be a dancer, and she has the ability, then you will probably find the money somehow.

My daughter did no go on to be a professional dancer so there have been some “what if?” conversations, but I am sure taking all things into consideration that she has no regrets.  She managed to reintegrate back into mainstream school in 6^th form without any significant issues.

If my daughter had gone to a local school I am convinced that she would have had better GSCE grades. This probably narrowed some of her options when deciding degree courses. But if she had not taken up the option to go to a vocational dance school then we probably still would have wondered “what if?” at times!

Good luck to you and your child whatever choice you make.

My eldest DD from a young age attending singing, drama and dance classes. We travelled to London for musical theatre classes at weekends. She appeared in many many local show with lead roles. For many years this continued up to the age of 16. Her dream to train in musical theatre. She spent one year at a performing arts school and then quit! Has returned to normal college to study and has completely turned her back on everything! To this day she still hasn't told me the real reason she quit. I feel sad and still dont understand how she can just stop something that she always loved!

Hi Lala

Something similar happened to me. It became a taboo subject. Whenever I tried to raise it I knew it would be an awkward conversation that would end in an argument. Finally I discovered that it was guilt. She realised this was not the path she actually wanted to follow anymore for whatever reason, but felt bad about all the sacrifices that had been made by others.

Your situation may be totally different. I am sure that your DD with have gained life skills from her performing arts training that will help her whatever she decides to do.

CDB

Personally I think that the government spend an incredible amount on dance training - the problem is that so many want the funding compared to the number of opportunities at the end of the training so many are disappointed. Unfortunately it costs a lot of money to train a dancer.

It is very difficult for anyone to make it without a lot of support from their families - and that is not just financial.

DrDance

I am sure you are right the children do not need to go away at 12 to succeed in ballet - but it is all too easy to get on that rollercoaster ride when they become JAs in primary school and so so difficult to get off once the ride has started. My DD is now off the ride and just a recreational dancer, pursuing other options.

I never danced myself so cannot give an educated answer to the many questions posed on this thread. But I do have a view that the students at my DCs school should have done more performing than they did - particularly classical performances. I understand that this is improving. And I do agree with you that children do not need to go to vocational schools at 12 but only if they can go to a particularly good local school.

CDB

I suspect that all of the top ballet schools have some funding available for students - obviously some will have more funding than others.

BankruptMum - you deserve a medal for supporting her that long! My DD is 17 and about to do her first festival for many years. she did not start until she was 6 or 7 and stopped at 11 or 12, she was never very successful. I do not think that she will do solos again, but she has decided to do a couple of group dances. I have not forgotten how stressful the experience was - I hope she is more relaxed than she used to be!

I think I'm just going to apply for the School of BTUK, because they've worked with me at associates and summer school, they know how much I love to dance and how determined I am, so if I don't get a place there I don't think I'll get in anywhere- advice on this theory would be appreciated!!!!)

 

Hi Swanprincess

Just a personal opinion but if you really want to dance then my advice would be to go for more auditions than just one. All schools are looking for slightly different things. Nothing ventured nothing gained, so what if you do not get offered a place you will be no worse off than you are now thinking that you will not get offered a place! I am sure that a little more self-confidence will go a long way, if you show your love for dance and self-belief at  auditions that will help. I hope it goes well whatever you decide to do.

CDB

Just reiterating what everyone else has said, when my DD had a similar problem my GP told me to use rice. I thought he had some strange alternative treatment but apparently it stands for rest, ice, compression and elevation.

This thread is a good example of why I wish I had read this website before I took my DD to ballet lessons when she was 3 years old!

I have not heard of this. My DD does a few festivals in the local area and that is expensive enough - I cannot imagine the cost of going to Portugal for a dance competition.

I am sure my DD would love it but it is not going to happen!

And while we are at it, why is nobody concerned about how many Elmhurst lower school school pupils got through to Elmhurst Upper School?

 

Is there reason to be concerned?

That is really good news that so many graduated to upper school - anyone know how many of them were the original intake in year 7?

Think performance is an essential part of our kids training and wish there was more of it. Very sad that for the last three years, all we get to see our year group perform is Character, Irish and Scottish, all very nice but would be nice to see them in a ballet piece, as that is after all what they went to vocational school to study. 

Sadielou, One thing that I never envisaged when my DD went to vocational school was that the amount of times I would get to see her perform would be so few - and in particular doing ballet. I do envy some of the parents of children who did not go away the number of opportunities they get to see their DC perform. If fact I have seen more of their children dancing than my own! I am sure that the schools could do more "closed" performances to give children those opportunities without the school having to worry about its external image.

Regarding Vocational school it depends on the year and ability of the child. My DD was in 3 dances last year but is in 6 this year. And one of two understudies in another.X

I can see both sides of this argument. It is good reward for better students to be in more dances, the school wnat to show off the school and it is an insight for the dancers into life after school competing for jobs. But parents of very good dancers (as all the children are that get places in these schools) who are only appearing in a couple of compulsory dances in the end of the year show get very little opportunity to see where all that money goes to keep their children in these schools.

As a parent with a DD that does not get many opportunities I have to admit it is very frustrating sometimes.

Why do schools do this ... last year my DD knew that another girl was in an opposite cast so we were able to come to an arrangement with the other family to buy tickets for different shows knowing we could swap if our daughters were in the other show.

But this year it is not so simple and I still do not know what end of year shows she will be dancing.

Coulddobetter, ideally top schools should monitor the progress and behaviour of recipients of awards.  However, as Tulip and Hfbrew mention earlier in this thread, I have also seen people with DaDAs at a top school who were misbehaving and not trying.  They said to other pupils they no longer wished to dance as a career, but were quite happy to be funded for 6th form, thus depriving others who would have been more deserving of funding.

I am sure that this is inevitable. I suspect that the school are often not aware that pupils no longer wish to dance as a career. If the school is aware that they have given an MDS or DaDA award to somebody that has no intention of pursuing a career in the performing arts but choose to ignore it and do nothing about it then that is a shame.

Some of my thoughts to some of the questions raised in this thread.

Are we training too many dancers? We are training more dancers than could possibly earn a living as professional dancers, but that does not necessarily mean that we are training too many dancers. If you knew at 11 who would be the best dancer at 20 then we would train far fewer! In any sport there are a lot of people that try for professional careers that never make it for various reasons. Dance is no different.

Is the funding working? MDS finding does seem more effective that DaDA. However I think MDS would be better if it looked at post-tax income as just looking at family pre-tax income puts single parent or families where only one parent works. But it works much better than DaDA which I suggest there should be less awards but adequate funding so that it helps the most talented.

Should MDS and DaDA award be scrutinised better? Possibly, I am not sure what scrutiny is placed on these awards. However, I thought all the top schools assessed students out if they were not doing well. Presumably this is not just related to dance ability, but also application and behaviour.

Surely DC at vocational schools will struggle to do festivals when they go to the school - especially if they board - as their vocational school will not choreograph dances for festivals.

Would they choreograph their own dance? Or go along on Sundays for private lessons with a dance teacher to learn/perfect the dances?

Either way, it seems unlikely that many, if any, would want to do this. They could keep doing their old dances for a while but they would soon outgrow them.

I have to agree Lucinda. My DD was offfered a full time place at vocational school for year 7 after attending an associate audition. It wasn't something we were ready for & we declined the offer but enjoyed 4 years at associates before leaving to concentrate on GCSEs. My DD will now be starting at the same vocational school in September on the Diploma course after being offered a DaDA funded place.

Only once in the years in between did DD say she wished she'd gone in year 7 but I know she would have struggled being away from home.

It now feels like we've come full circle & she's where she's meant to be. It also proves that if the talent is there it will still be there when you're ready to progress vocationally & staying at regular high school whilst attending high standard dance classes does no harm whatsoever.

Loulabelle

There is a lot to consider when deciding if your DD (or DS) should go away to vocational school at 11. Whether they are ready, the dance training available locally, the academics and the cost to name but a few.

It must have taken a lot of soul-searching to decide not to take up the offer. But I am sure that your DD must be amazingly talented to have been offered a full time MDS place at an associate audition so I am sure she will still have a number of options at 16. 

no therefore assume it's a no. DD being stoic!

I wonder if it might be that they are waiting on responses from the offers they have already sent out. Surely everyone will get a response, whether positive or negative, eventually.

We were there this Monday and the head told us that it may be delayed because of half ter!

When we were there at the end of January the principal said that the letters would go out at the end of the first week in February - but in fairness to him, he probably did not realise that there would be a half term in the month when he made the promise!

Another example that there is some funding out there for a lucky few ...

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/10798045.Strictly_judge_awards___20_000_scholarship_to_Swindon_dancer/

... sorry I have gone a little off topic.

Hello Red Shoes, How did you get on? I notice that Swindon has a number of other choices when you get to 16, Liberatus, Swindon Dance and Wilkes Academy. Unfortunately I have no experience of any of them so could not give a recommendation.

Hi Tulip. Nothing ruled out yet. We will need to see what options are available when she gets the results of auditions next year - but not optimistic at the moment. I am trying not to think too much about it now as I cannot influence anything - and trying not to stress out DD so that she can just concentrate on her dancing and GCSEs.

It is as it ever was ... we all want to give our children the best chance to succeed but most families have financial limits.

I was angry when I first heard the new DaDa funding arrangements. But I am becoming more philosophical as time goes by. Why should the government fund so many ballet dancers? I must admit there are a lot of things they do fund that make my blood boil - but there are clearly more children trying to become ballet dancers than the world really needs.

At a personal level, one DD is at vocational school (yr 10) and I really cannot see that she will have any options at the end of yr 11 to continue at ballet school as we simply will not be able to afford it. Does that annoy me? Yes. But would I have made different decisions at the start of yr 7 if I had known at the outset? I don't know but I suspect we still have gone down the same route. We have still not made any decisions yet - and she will audition for places next year. But my expectation is that she will come home and do A levels at a local college and dance at a local dance school for a couple of years. We have had a few difficult chats with DD so it does not come as a bolt out of the blue. I expect she is in denial - "they will find a way" - but it is just not possible on a DaDa as stands. My other DDs currently has a DaDa under the "old" funding arrangement which we clearly can afford - which makes it even harder. "You can for her but not for me!".

So I may be philosophical - but none of this is easy. But I am buying a lottery ticket every week so you never know.