Age Requirements for RAD Exams

[balletqs]

"The mediocre teacher tells, the good teacher explains, the superior teacher demonstrates, the great teacher inspires!" William Arthur Ward

[Dancer Sugar Plum]

"The mediocre teacher tells, the good teacher explains, the superior teacher demonstrates, the great teacher inspires!" William Arthur Ward

 

I like the quote balletqs, however I think for ballet it's not necessarily true that 'the superior teacher demonstrates'. You can have a current or former professional dancer teach a class and they demonstrate perfectly but they may not be able to explain how they make the shapes and positions they do, probably because they were built for ballet and never had to think about it. By the way, I am not saying that former or current professional dancers can't be good teachers, just pointing out that excellent ballet dancers are not guaranteed to make excellent teachers, that's all.

[hfbrew]

"The mediocre teacher tells, the good teacher explains, the superior teacher demonstrates, the great teacher inspires!" William Arthur Ward

And I sadly have to bypass the demonstration bit these days oh cursed arthritis!

[taxi4ballet]

Maybe that's a weakness in music training that could be improved, or is that just something that one has or hasn't got? IMHO Elton John is one example of a high achieving classical pianist who could probably do without thinking what your husband finds that many people can't. And how about Jules Holland? I wonder what route he took as a child learning the piano? Probably best off pondering this on a different forum. Sorry! ; )

Funnily enough, the best pianist DH has ever been in a band with did their training at the same place as Elton John!

[balletqs]

I don't entirely agree with quote wording but was interrupted with two emergency incidents before I had chance to add anything. I agree I wasn't given a perfect perfect body and only walked on in roles not under contract. I always feel that the things I found toughest I teach the best. But miss Adams and Madam and Pamela May and Maria Fay amongst others, demonstrated in heels in their eighties plus and conveyed the most exquisite meaning behind their movements so demonstration can be done in varying degrees. I'm afraid after two children and a horrendous back injury my demonstration is not as it was but I do what I can to get my meaning across and the eyes are key to everything. Watching Anita Young flashing her eyes in class is incredibly inspirational. She is no spring chicken but can show dynamics, musicality co ordination artistry the list goes on

[balletqs]

And def agree with everything you say dancer sugar plum

[hfbrew]

I don't entirely agree with quote wording but was interrupted with two emergency incidents before I had chance to add anything. I agree I wasn't given a perfect perfect body and only walked on in roles not under contract. I always feel that the things I found toughest I teach the best. But miss Adams and Madam and Pamela May and Maria Fay amongst others, demonstrated in heels in their eighties plus and conveyed the most exquisite meaning behind their movements so demonstration can be done in varying degrees. I'm afraid after two children and a horrendous back injury my demonstration is not as it was but I do what I can to get my meaning across and the eyes are key to everything. Watching Anita Young flashing her eyes in class is incredibly inspirational. She is no spring chicken but can show dynamics, musicality co ordination artistry the list goes on

My ds was very privileged to have been taught by Miss Young, a truly fabulous teacher. It is true about her eyes, she can convey more with a turn of her head than a whole class of students can with their whole bodies. Watching her teach always made me feel like dancing again myself...

[youngatheart]

If you were learning an instrument and had reached a certain grade, would you begin to get rather bored and stale if you only ever played the exercises and pieces contained in your book, over and over again, ad infinitum?

 

Of course! I learned music as a child and that would have been a nightmare. Between exams, my teacher had me learn a wide variety of pieces at the LEVEL of the grade, then I learnt the pieces for the exam after I had reached the right standard of proficiency.

 

Doesn't that sound a lot like the ethos of the new RAD syllabus?

 

To respond to some of the earlier points - I completely agree that doing freework alongside syllabus exercises is an essential part of training, and hope nothing I have posted implied otherwise - it certainly wasn't meant to! By "push through" the grades I meant approaches such as, for example, doing a Grade 4 class alongside grade 3 and a grade 5 class alongside grade 4, so that the student was ready to start IF by 10 after having passed their Grade 4, iinstead of starting IF in Grade 3 and doing one grade at a time alongside it; or alternatively (only in these exceptional times of syllabus change and definitely NOT as a general approach!), to forget about IF & do 2 or 3 Grade 5 classes a week for one term & get the exam done, then have a term completely away from syllabus, maybe do a show etc to make up for it.

 

Only having sessions once a year (or every 2 years) need not be any kind of barrier as exceptional students can always be entered at HQ or at other centres in between the main sessions.

 

My complaint is that (contrary to what you have all said about teachers being able to use the approach that works for them!) the RAD have made it completely impossible to work in the way that I have said. This is why we see absurd situations such as: Grade 4 & 5 students going back & having to learn the new Grade 2 so that the new syllabus progression can be followed; students doing New Grade 3, Old Grade 4 & New Grade 5; and New Intermediate; Old Advanced Foundation; New Advanced 1 (all these are real stories that I have read about on the net, not things I am making up!).

 

If a switch had to have been made, the best place was at the lower levels (i.e. a student who had passed Old Grade 1 being then taught New Grade 1 (quickly - just the work, not the exam) and then remaining on the new syllabus. The gap waiting for New Grade 4 could have been used to do freework or a show.

 

In my criticism of the "peer group" approach I also did not mean that all students should be forced to do the exams - rather that before being moved up, all students should be at a level where they were CAPABLE of passing the exam, and preferably when they had mastered the work to the best of their personal ability. IMO that is what the student (or their parents) are paying the teacher for - not to just take their money for them to be ignored in class as a "no-hoper" & not taught properly or corrected, which is what was happening in the school I was referring to.

 

It is a real pet hate of mine to see people with very poor technique or lack of experience being put in a higher level class just because of their age. And of course the teen/adult beginners class should be a temporary measure used as a "catch-up" so that the student can join their peers when they are ready, if that is what they want - or alternatively to start in Grade 1, if they would prefer to do that (or anythng in between). I would never ever prevent a student from joining a class, or move them out of it before they were ready, just because they were "too old"!

 

And lastly, syllabus classes may not be the right place for certain types of student - if they are not interested in doing the exams and just want to be in a class with their friends, a freework class would seem a more appropriate option to offer them (I stress "option" - the final choice should come from the student/their parents).

Edited September 5, 2014 by youngatheart

[Dancer Sugar Plum]

I don't entirely agree with quote wording but was interrupted with two emergency incidents before I had chance to add anything. I agree I wasn't given a perfect perfect body and only walked on in roles not under contract. I always feel that the things I found toughest I teach the best. But miss Adams and Madam and Pamela May and Maria Fay amongst others, demonstrated in heels in their eighties plus and conveyed the most exquisite meaning behind their movements so demonstration can be done in varying degrees. I'm afraid after two children and a horrendous back injury my demonstration is not as it was but I do what I can to get my meaning across and the eyes are key to everything. Watching Anita Young flashing her eyes in class is incredibly inspirational. She is no spring chicken but can show dynamics, musicality co ordination artistry the list goes on

 

It's fascinating to hear you talk about these amazing dancers and teachers from the past. I feel the very best teachers are the ones who can verbally explain how they achieve the technique. These teachers are able to think of different ways to explain how to achieve the technique if a student is struggling with something. They don't need to demonstrate to get their point across. Maybe you are one these teachers?

 

I think the best teachers are the ones who are able to teach without demonstrating much, because they are able to explain the technique and physically correct your placement, if required. These things don't require the teacher to demonstrate. For example, if a student was doing penches incorrectly, a good teacher can tell her what she is doing wrong and physically correct her placement without the need to be doing close to 6 o'clock penches herself/himself.

 

 

Of course! I learned music as a child and that would have been a nightmare. Between exams, my teacher had me learn a wide variety of pieces at the LEVEL of the grade, then I learnt the pieces for the exam after I had reached the right standard of proficiency.

 

Doesn't that sound a lot like the ethos of the new RAD syllabus?

 

To respond to some of the earlier points - I completely agree that doing freework alongside syllabus exercises is an essential part of training, and hope nothing I have posted implied otherwise - it certainly wasn't meant to! By "push through" the grades I meant approaches such as, for example, doing a Grade 4 class alongside grade 3 and a grade 5 class alongside grade 4, so that the student was ready to start IF by 10 after having passed their Grade 4, iinstead of starting IF in Grade 3 and doing one grade at a time alongside it; or alternatively (only in these exceptional times of syllabus change and definitely NOT as a general approach!), to forget about IF & do 2 or 3 Grade 5 classes a week for one term & get the exam done, then have a term completely away from syllabus, maybe do a show etc to make up for it.

 

Only having sessions once a year (or every 2 years) need not be any kind of barrier as exceptional students can always be entered at HQ or at other centres in between the main sessions.

 

My complaint is that (contrary to what you have all said about teachers being able to use the approach that works for them!) the RAD have made it completely impossible to work in the way that I have said. This is why we see absurd situations such as: Grade 4 & 5 students going back & having to learn the new Grade 2 so that the new syllabus progression can be followed; students doing New Grade 3, Old Grade 4 & New Grade 5; and New Intermediate; Old Advanced Foundation; New Advanced 1 (all these are real stories that I have read about on the net, not things I am making up!).

 

If a switch had to have been made, the best place was at the lower levels (i.e. a student who had passed Old Grade 1 being then taught New Grade 1 (quickly - just the work, not the exam) and then remaining on the new syllabus. The gap waiting for New Grade 4 could have been used to do freework or a show.

 

In my criticism of the "peer group" approach I also did not mean that all students should be forced to do the exams - rather that before being moved up, all students should be at a level where they were CAPABLE of passing the exam, and preferably when they had mastered the work to the best of their personal ability. IMO that is what the student (or their parents) are paying the teacher for - not to just take their money for them to be ignored in class as a "no-hoper" & not taught properly or corrected, which is what was happening in the school I was referring to.

 

Just speaking from personal experience, the RAD syllabus schools I have come across only cover syllabus work. I don't know if they have changed their ethos since the new syllabi have come in. In these schools, even if there was a class called 'free' class, the teacher would just set syllabus work using different music. To me, that is not free work. The teacher would say to the class, for example, 'It's just allegro 1..' but some students would struggle doing an exercise they know just because it's with different music. I wondered if they would struggle in an audition for vocational school, just because they almost never do real free work. If you're not in the habit of picking up real free work, how can you suddenly aquire the skill for an audition?

 

However, I don't know if all RAD schools are now 'forced' to teach 'real' free work because of the way the syllabus has changed.

 

There was one RAD school where I noticed students moving through the higher grades very quickly. At this school the students always took less than a year to learn Grade 7 and do the exam. If you weren't put for the exam within a year, it meant that the teacher had given up on you. One student said she didn't want to do the Grade 8 exam yet because she 'would have nothing to do after doing the exam' (her words). So it looks like this school is teaching ballet for the sake of passing exams and the students do ballet just for the sake of passing exams. Just my opinion, but I think it's a real shame.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Dancer Sugar Plum

[youngatheart]

Sugarplum, I couldn't agree more!

 

The RAD have made it abundantly clear that this is not how they intend the new syllabus to be taught. The idea is to first teach the vocabulary and technique and then put it together in the exam combinations later (particularly the centre work).

 

The point of a freework class is ( a ) to regularly give the students something fresh to do so they don't get bored ( b ) challenge them a bit and give those students who are quicker at picking up combinations than refining their technique their chance to shine ( c ) break down any steps from in the syllabus combinations that the students are struggling with & work on them individually ( d ) start on the build-up for steps to be included in the next grade.

 

Also IMO every single class should include at least one unset combination (either at barre or in centre), so that students regard learning to pick up combinations quickly as a normal part of their training.

 

It horrifies me that so many teachers don't do this - but when you regularly see timetables on the net allowing 30 or 45 mins for a Grade 5 class you can start to see why.....! All you could do in that time is a couple of barre exercises and a few in the centre, so that by the end of term you have at least covered everything in the syllabus.  Aargh!

 

Grades 6-8 are meant to be taught over 2 years each to allow the maturity of the performance to develop (perhaps alongside the vocationals for those doing them). To be rushed through these in a year suggests either several hours of class time per week (unlikely!) or a focus on learning the sequences of the combinations & not a lot else. Very sad.

Edited September 5, 2014 by youngatheart

[Dance*is*life]

Why do you think it "unlikely!" that Grade 7 students would have several hours of class time per week, youngatheart? Or that they would have to do nothing but syllabus work in order to learn it?  I have to admit I'm curious about that. I would say that it depends on the school and the way the timetable is built.  I actually prepare students for Grade 7 in about 6 months!   I teach it in the year between IF and Inter. It's a wonderful syllabus that enriches them artistically and really allows them to move and dance. In addition, it widens their vocabulary and teaches them about the romantic ballet era.  I am so pleased the RAD hasn't phased it out. 

 

Our Grade 7s are usually about 12/13 years old and have three 3 x 90 minute ballet classes a week.  One non-syllabus, one pointe class combined with free work in soft shoes to start preparing them for Intermediate,  and one purely syllabus class.  Nearer the exam, we concentrate more on the syllabus of course. Our exams are once a year in March/April,  so plenty of time left after that for non-syllabus classes and preparing the end of year performance. By the way, the examiner last session commented on the fact that they really seemed to understand the Romantic style and gave very high marks, so it is possible, youngatheart! 

[sarahw]

Hi all

Danceislife's set up sounds great. If you are at a dancing school that is unable to offer such a fantastic amount of teaching you are limited to syllabus only.

[youngatheart]

Dance*is*Life, I meant "unlikely" in the context of the specific circumstances Sugar Plum was describing in her post directly above mine, i.e. in a "syllabus-only" school where the student in question was only doing the higher grades, not vocationals.

 

Of course there are lots of good RAD schools like yours where students are able to take several 90-minute classes per week with plenty of freework too. If the correct standard, technique & performance are already there, of course I agree that the actual exam sequences could be taught more quickly. Unfortunately there are also plenty of the "other kind" of school where the students take (if they are lucky) 2 x 45 min Grade 7 classes per week and never do anything outside the syllabus.

 

After my last post I did a trawl of the net & actually found one school offering 40-minute classes for Grades 5 and 6 (not sure which syllabus). OK so there were several classes on offer at each grade per week, but even so, you could barely get a class warmed up in 40 minutes. Sorry but I really don't see how the "Today we are going to work on the tendu exercise, the developpe exercise, the port de bras and the adage, and on Thursday we will do Rond de Jambe, frappes, pirouettes and the second allegro" approach can be sufficient to teach ballet!

 

IMO there should at least be time to run a full or nearly full barre and a variety of centre work in each class.

[Dancer Sugar Plum]

Dance*is*life, I am impressed that your schol is able to prepare students for Grade 7 in 6 months. I am also impressed that your students get the chance to do 3 x 90 minute ballet classes a week.

With the school I was referring to in my post, the students get 2 x 45 minute classes a week for Grade 7. Some students only make it once a week, but are still able to do the exam within a year. It felt like, to me, that towards exam time there is a big rush to cram in the syllabus. So the focus is on learning what step comes after what step.

Even at Advanced Foundation and Advanced 1 level, you get 2 x 45 minute classes. Again, not every student can make both classes.

 

I wish they had had a similar set up to your school, Dance*is*life, giving students 3 x 90 minute classes, etc.

[Picturesinthefirelight]

I'm impressed at 12 year olds doing Grade 7

 

Grade 4-5 would be more usual for 11-12 year olds at dds old dance school with IF starting (selected students only) at around the same time.

 

Grade 7s would be more like 15-16 ish.

[aileen]

I think that it should be remembered that not all students are 'serious' about ballet. Many do it as an enjoyable hobby but like to have exams as a goal. They are able to pass the higher grades, usually with a middle to high merit, taking one or two lessons a week and enjoy dancing in shows and ballets put on by their schools. Three ninety minute lessons a week is a heavy commitment and not everyone wants that, even though some teachers may regard it as the ideal. At my DD's school students were generally between 10 and 13 for the old grades 4 and 5 and are probably 15 or 16 for grade 7. The few that take grade 8 are generally sixth formers in their last year of school. I am talking about recreational dancers here.

[taxi4ballet]

Aileen is right - a lot of recreational dancers may well only do one ballet class a week, and several other classes in other styles such as jazz or tap. If the school offers tap, modern, jazz, street etc as well as ballet, there might be no room in the timetable to put more than one class a week at the higher grades - especially if there are only a few students at that level.

 

For students taking several ballet classes a week, with syllabus, free work and vocational, it is possible to take exams in less than a year. My dd (and others we know) have done just that, with both graded and vocational exams.

[Dance*is*life]

I have to say that I am indeed very lucky to be able to teach in a school where, in spite of the fact that we don't have selective auditions and take anyone who wants to join us, the class schedule is a rich one.  The girls (and the occasional boy) can take jazz, modern and flamenco as well as ballet.  What this means in practical terms is that our student body includes the full gamut of talented and non talented dancers, but, since they all commit to the full schedule, those that are talented are able to achieve high enough standards to eventually become professional dancers. Not always in ballet, as for that you need the physical attributes too, but we've had some of those too.  Similarly even the weak ones get enough hours to ensure that they can pass their exams with a respectable Merit.  Compared to the schedules I read about in the States on other forums, they still don't get enough lessons, but the older serious students often join the dance stream at the local high school and then they got many more hours of dancing there too.   

 

I have no idea how you can teach any ballet class in 40 minutes. Our Primaries have twice a week 45 minutes!  It astounds me that even at RAD Headquarters the vocational levels don't get 90 minute classes.  I suppose this is why it takes longer to prepare for an exam and means that the students are older.  What actually amazes me is the ability of the pupils I teach to juggle school and dance and do well in both.  I think it comes down to the fact that they are able to commit and so have developed work ethics to be proud of.  Dancing children always strike me as being a very special breed!