Who is Terpsichore and how do your pronounce her name?

[Jan McNulty]

He had an article in the Times yesterday asserting he never said such a thing and has been misquoted, also that he personally is very keen on these American books.

 

I don't read the Murdoch press so wouldn't have seen the article.  Thanks for reporting back.

[Melody]

It's in the Telegraph and HuffPo too (not seeing it in the Guardian yet).

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/10857133/Michael-Gove-Kill-a-Mockingbird-Id-never-dream-of-it.html

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05/27/michael-gove-to-kill-a-mockingbird-gcse_n_5395409.html

[Jan McNulty]

Let's face it - if I read any newspaper at all, it is the Liverpool Echo!

 

It must be serious enough that a number of my friends are absolutely up in arms about it!  I don't get on very well with American classic literature but I do believe schools should be encouraging their pupils to read as widely as possible.

[bangorballetboy]

Let's face it - if I read any newspaper at all, it is the Liverpool Echo! It must be serious enough that a number of my friends are absolutely up in arms about it!  I don't get on very well with American classic literature but I do believe schools should be encouraging their pupils to read as widely as possible.

Then, with respect, your friends should calm down. An incorrect non-story sensationalised by, would you believe it, the Murdoch press.

[Jan McNulty]

Then, with respect, your friends should calm down. An incorrect non-story sensationalised by, would you believe it, the Murdoch press.

Friends who are English teachers who have presumably been informed of the proposals by more conventional routes than the Murdoch press.

[bangorballetboy]

Friends who are English teachers who have presumably been informed of the proposals by more conventional routes than the Murdoch press.

 

I doubt it, given the non-story was a leak of something that's not yet been published.

[John Mallinson]

It seems impossible to know whether Mr Gove has been traduced or whether there's some truth in this story. As often, we may never know. Enough said maybe.

[aileen]

Well, perhaps it is time for a change. I know parents who studied To Kill a Mockingbird, Of Mice and Men etc whose children are studying the same book(s) for the GCSEs which they are taking this year and next year.

[loveclassics]

I too attended a northern comprehensive school and latin was never on the curriculum and I have to question the importance of Latin in terms of learning other languages, computer programming and the decline in childrens ability to code.  From Terpsichore's first post on this thread it would appear that most people under the age of fifty would be part of this 'decline in ability' and linked with the rise of UKIP - offensive to say the least!

 

Learning other languages - my degree is in modern foreign languages - fluent in three and I have a grasp of another two and can get by as a tourist in another few languages.  I think only 2 off my course had done any latin.  I don't think it is necessarily latin itself that is the key to learning other languages so much as actually learning another language in the first place.  For example learn French and the other romance languages like Spanish, Italian, Portuguese become so much easier.

 

Computer programming - the strict teacher no doubt was the catalyst to learning.  I doubt many if any of the people we would consider to be a 'computer genius' in the world today actually learned Latin in the first place so it has not held them back.

 

And as I said before I find it rather patronising and insulting to use the wording 'decline in our children's abilities to code'.

 

 

Re ability to code - when I was at school in the 60s we were told that in the future a knowledge of computers would be essential and so we were all taught binary math.  I found it interesting at the time but in many years in IT I have never had to use it.  Also, we learnt Latin for 1 year (then required for a career in medicine) and I did find it quite useful later in picking up a bit of tourist Italian & Spanish.   But my younger sister never did Latin and now she's a professional translator.  Make what you will of that!

 

Linda

[Huddsballetmum]

Well, perhaps it is time for a change. I know parents who studied To Kill a Mockingbird, Of Mice and Men etc whose children are studying the same book(s) for the GCSEs which they are taking this year and next year.

To Kill a Mockingbird is one of the great books of our time, and provides an academic requirement within a text which is accessible to the 14-16 age group.  

My understanding of the article is that it is a proposal to teach English Literature, rather than Literature written in English, and also to remove more modern classics in favour of pre-20th Century.  Hopefully Mr Grove will come to his senses and realise that we need to educate children in the world beyond our shores to stave off an insular existance, and that Shakespeare, Chaucer and the Brontes are not the only generation of fabulous authors.  We need to move with the times.

[Melody]

However, Britain is becoming more and more Americanised (my husband is by no means a Little Englander like me, but he gets really upset when we visit after a year or so of being away and find Britain getting to be more like here every time we come over), and there seems to be a positive stampede sometimes to drop British things in favour of American ones. It's been a year since we were there, and he still waxes eloquent that the golf course where he learned as a child is now proudly labelling itself "Home of American Golf!". I have a really hard time believing that there are no 20th century British authors worth studying, to the point where the vast majority of kids of successive generations are studying To Kill A Mockingbird and Of Mice And Men instead. I don't have a problem at all with books by non-British authors being in the list of books to study, but I don't see why we should be ignoring our own authors in the process. I mean, I know these days that expressing a preference for British things is likely to get a person labelled as a narrow-minded reactionary (especially after seeing some of the Facebook groups purporting to celebrate British things that are really just for anti-immigrant rants), but I think it's very sad that "we need to move with the times" seems to have turned into "we need to replace this old-fashioned British stuff with lovely modern American stuff." Surely modern British authors aren't that irrelevant.

Edited June 4, 2014 by Melody

[Anjuli_Bai]

Does it matter the nationality of the author if the book is a great one?

 

I don't think so.

[Melody]

That depends on what you're wanting to teach the children in your schools. If the message is, "we only want to teach great authors so here's a list of foreign authors because our authors don't measure up," fair enough. Personally I don't think that's a good message to be sending, if it isn't actually true, which IMO it isn't.

[Anjuli_Bai]

How about just a list of great authors?

[Melody]

I'm not sure how that would work in an exam context. In an ideal world the kids would go away and read all or most of the books on the reading list, but when it comes to studying for the exam there'd only be a small number of books on the exam paper, and then you have the temptation for the teacher (and pupils) to only concentrate on them during the year's coursework.

[Jan McNulty]

My favourite authors of fiction are currently Lee Child, Simon Scarrow, Lindsay Davies, Marina Fiorato and Sinclair Macleod (who self-publishes).  I find their books are well-researched, very well written and gripping but I bet none of them appear on a school curriculum.

 

I have attempted any number of books by various authors shortlisted for various literary prizes and have found most of the dull!

 

I think the curriculum should provide a variety of books and if not all the authors are British does it really matter as it is expanding the horizons of the readers.

[2dancersmum]

I think a lot of the newspaper comments are speculation and blown out of proportion from the facts - which aren't actually determined yet in terms of the new GCSE specifications.  They seem to modify the specs on a very regular basis.  I had one child do GCSEs in 2010, 2nd on new spec GCSE in 2012 and I know this summer the spec is different again.  For 2014 the first exam is on modern literature - novels, drama, prose and short stories - one question is on a set text from a choice of about 10, the other question is on modern lit from different cultures and this is where the American authors sit.  The next section is either controlled assessment or an exam and is on poetry and that is themed rather than country of origin.  The third section is on Shakespeare and English Literary heritage.  This is either controlled assessment or an exam - but the opposite to what is chosen by the school for the poetry.  Perhaps it is the question specifically on literature from other cultures that is being referred to .  I know in the previous 2 specs this was not a separate question within the modern lit section.  There is a large number of texts for schools and teachers to choose from and regardless of texts chosen, students are encouraged to read widely and be able to place their texts in social, historical and cultural contexts.

Edited June 5, 2014 by 2dancersmum

[2dancersmum]

For AQA the following texts are on the list for exploring modern texts1. Short Stories from the AQA Anthology Sunlight on

the Grass

My Polish Teacher’s Tie Helen Dunmore

When the Wasps

Drowned Claire Wigfall

Compass and Torch Elizabeth Baines

On Seeing the 100%

Perfect Girl Haruki Murakami

The Darkness Out There Penelope Lively

Anil Ridjal Noor

Something Old,

Something New Leila Aboulela

2. Lord of the Flies William Golding

3. Martyn Pig Kevin Brooks

4. Touching the Void Joe Simpson

5. The Woman in Black Susan Hill

6. Under Milk Wood Dylan Thomas

7. The Crucible Arthur Miller

8. Kindertransport Diane Samuels

9. An Inspector Calls J B Priestley

10.Deoxyribonucleic Dennis Kelly (AQA

Acid (DNA) recommended edition)

 

And the Exploring cultures texts are:

1. Of Mice and Men

(America) John Steinbeck

2. Mister Pip (Papua New

Guinea) Lloyd Jones

3. Purple Hibiscus Chimamanda Ngozi

(Nigeria) Adichie

4. To Kill a Mockingbird

(America) Harper Lee

5. Rabbit-proof Fence Doris Pilkington

[JulieW]

Hmmm, I went through secondary school in the early 80s, did Latin and didn't know how to "correctly" pronounce Terpsichore, and I've never read Of Mice and Men or To Kill a Mockingbird. Feeling quite ignorant now..... :-( ;-)