Royal Ballet - which way now?

[Lindsay]

Alison, I'm not blaming the moderators for the lack of such discussion.  I'm simply saying that any attempt to be critical or in any way challenging on here is usually greeted by an outraged chorus of "but I know what I like and you can't stop me liking it!!", kneejerk defences of people's pet favourites and accusations of being patronising or hostile.  Another reason I haven't posted here in a very long time is that my last contribution was promptly taken down for being "political".  Why anyone thinks dance can or should only be discussed in separation from the real world is beyond me but I am not intending to reopen that discussion. 

 

What I am doing is pleading for tolerant acceptance of divergent opinions and for thoughtful discussion without things being taken personally.  It wasn't aimed at you or anyone else in particular.  Just a general desire

[Fonty]

Was it X.N.Tricities (or however they spell the work) by Bigonzetti?  With a large domed mirror at the back?  (Actually, I think the tutus were dark brown)

 

And I really liked Act II of MWW too, just not the rest of it.

 

 

 

It could have been, Alison.  I think it did have a mirror at the back, but it was some time ago they did it, so my memory is a little vague.

 

Regarding musicality, I think this is what separates a good dancer from a great one, for me.   I hate to see a dancer playing around with the music.  For example, I have seen many dancers hold an arabesque for longer than the choregrapher intended, and then rush through the following steps slightly out of time in order to catch up with the music.  And all so that the audience can gasp with astonishment at how high they can lift their legs.  

 

It really, really annoys me!  So does shoving in a double or triple pirouette, just to show they can, when there is really only time in the phrasing for a single.  It isn't clever, it does not dazzle me, it just seems to make a mockery of the conductor and orchestra.

 

I am sure you can all think of other examples, but it is one of the things I used to hate about the visiting Russian companies, and one of the qualities I loved about the English style of dancing. Ashton's muse was Fonteyn, who must have been one of the most musically gifted dancers ever, and may perhaps explain why current dancers appear to struggle with his "simple" choreography.  .

[chrischris]

For me, ballet is about the story. I don't really enjoy non-narrative ballets and I tend to avoid them. I don't really care if somebody isn't technically sound, I just want to be moved. One of the reasons I didn't really enjoy DonQ is that I couldn't get involved in it, it didn't grab me, whereas I loved Mayerling, which grabbed me from the minute it started. I couldn't tell you whether Watson was technically more proficient than Acosta, or whether Pennefather executed steps more crisply than Soares etc, but each performance I saw moved me, and I was impressed with every performer, who each brought some unique nuance or shade to the character. I think it's the overall package (staging, music, characterisation, narrative, arc) that I need to really enjoy a ballet.

[JennyTaylor]

I'd just like to say that after some of my previous comments on this thread, I was invited by Bluebird to meet some Ballet.Co-ers at the ROH - which I did, last night.  Its amazing to meet people who you have only known by pseudo names in person and I was made extremely welcome.  So, thank you to one and all!

[bangorballetboy]

I'd just like to say that after some of my previous comments on this thread, I was invited by Bluebird to meet some Ballet.Co-ers at the ROH - which I did, last night.  Its amazing to meet people who you have only known by pseudo names in person and I was made extremely welcome.  So, thank you to one and all!

 

Lovely to meet you!  Again soon, I hope.

[Ian Macmillan]

Regarding "Which Way Now?" there's an interesting piece in today's New York Times that in strict terms lies outside our daily Links remit in that is exclusively about the same question as regards the Royal Opera:

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/30/arts/international/a-different-grandness-for-covent-garden.html?_r=4&&pagewanted=all

 

Nonetheless, a number of aspects could equally apply to the RB, also with a relatively new top management.  For example, picking up the 'tipping point' remark quoted, how much of the RB's brand can be said to be the work they do, rather than the stage upon which it's done - ie as live-streaming increases, when does the wider audience away from the theatre become more significant than that within the ROH?  My own impression is that both Opera and Ballet managements are pretty much in accord on these things.

 

And is everyone ready for more 'democratised' foyer spaces?  I've really no idea about just what that might mean but, in more general terms, as my visits to the ROH have recently become fewer, I've been struck each time I come back just how increasingly it has become a restaurant with auditorium attached - a "Different Grandness" indeed.

[Bluebird]

I'd just like to say that after some of my previous comments on this thread, I was invited by Bluebird to meet some Ballet.Co-ers at the ROH - which I did, last night.  Its amazing to meet people who you have only known by pseudo names in person and I was made extremely welcome.  So, thank you to one and all!

 

Sorry, Jenny, I've only just seen this.  I'm delighted that you now know that not all regulars at the Royal Ballet are unfriendly!  We look forward to seeing you when you come again.

[Beryl H]

Regarding "Which Way Now?" there's an interesting piece in today's New York Times that in strict terms lies outside our daily Links remit in that is exclusively about the same question as regards the Royal Opera:

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/30/arts/international/a-different-grandness-for-covent-garden.html?_r=4&&pagewanted=all

 

 

And is everyone ready for more 'democratised' foyer spaces?  I've really no idea about just what that might mean but, in more general terms, as my visits to the ROH have recently become fewer, I've been struck each time I come back just how increasingly it has become a restaurant with auditorium attached - a "Different Grandness" indeed.

 

 

Yes, the moment you step inside the atmosphere is now that of a restaurant, although I can ignore it I feel it is becoming elitist again, must put first-timers off.

 

 

 

 

[Fonty]

Er?  I wonder if someone could translate that in to plain English please?  What on earth is undemocratic about the current foyer spaces?  What is the opposite of a democratic foyer space?

 

 

What about: 

 

A Dictatorship Foyer Space:  Someone stands at the entrance, and bans anyone they feel doesn't match whatever criteria they have decided on for that particular evening.  An exciting one, because possible you could get in without buying a ticket. 

 

A Communist Foyer Space: In theory it is open to everyone, but in reality only those in favour with the current Management are allowed in.

[Jan McNulty]

I've been to ROH 4 times in the past 12 months but have only sat in the stalls.  I have always gone in the main theatre entrance and I must say that I find it quite welcoming.  I have found the foyer staff to be very helpful.  On two visits I did venture up the escalator to the piano and while the bar area was very busy it was not unwelcoming.  I haven't ventured to the restaurant areas.

 

How many people may be intimidated just because they are going on their own?  I used to go to London a lot for meetings and courses and was frequently on my own.  I was faced with staring at 4 walls of a hotel room or venturing out.  I took the bull between the horns and ventured out.  I soon realised that in London many people attend the theatre on their own because so many people are there on business and like myself venture out rather than sit in a hotel room.

 

I have felt more intimidated going to theatres outside London on my own, because there tends to be fewer people on their own.

[alison]

Okay, I'd better prepare to be intimidated, then: I'm in Oxford tonight!  Although I'm pretty certain I found someone to talk to back in the spring when I was last here

 

Janet, I totally agree: if I'd waited for someone else to go with me, I'd probably never have started my ballet-going career!  I only went to the ROH in the first place because I was entitled to standbys, and none of my friends were.  And boy, it took a lot of plucking up my courage back in the late 80s!

[patsomerset]

I agree with you Janet.  I do not go to ROH very often but I am nearly always on my own as I am usually on my way through London to  somewhere else.  I do not find the experience intimidating and the staff are very welcoming.  There are always other people on their own but the people who speak during the intervals are nearly always friendly couples or families.  I have never eaten on my own there mainly because I don't really enjoy eating out on my own.  I get no pleasure from it, but I can enjoy a ballet on my own.  In fact I think I concentrate better

[aileen]

I think that once you are inside the ROH is not intimidating at all. It's a shame that it does have this elitist image because the atmosphere is really very relaxed. The staff are exemplary: friendly, prefessional and helpful. There is a mix of people there wearing a variety of outfits, both formal and informal.

[Beryl H]

I don't feel intimidated at all at the ROH and agree the staff are very friendly, but I don't like the way the foyer spaces have been taken up by the catering, I don't feel I can enter the Crush Room just to look around anymore, too many waiters hanging around, the same goes for the Floral Hall, there used to be costume displays but now it's more tables and chairs, actually there's a new "informal" eating arrangement now, trays which you can buy (£18/£28) and eat standing in the Hall, the only place left to me is the outside amphi terrace which I love, I can sit there admiring the view in peace

[Fonty]

I haven't been to ROH for ages, a pity if the Floral Hall is geing gradually turned into a canteen.  i used to love looking at the costumes, and not everyone wants to pay £18 for a tray of food.  The food is pretty average going on boring, and I speak as someone who was treated to a "special" birthday meal in the Floral Hall balcony restaurant.  The view was wonderful,it was Christmas, and the tree was up, and lovely to have your table during the intervals as well as beforehand.

 

However, the food could best be described as up market school dinner. 

[Nina G.]

I do not find the ROH to be intimidating at all. The staff is wonderful and helpful, and the mix of people is so varied, some are wearing jeans and trainers, others are dressed-up (but no staff member will ever stop you because one is dressed like a Punk or Vivianne Westwood).

 

I honestly don't get it why people moan about the ROH , the Floral Hall turned into a "canteen" (?),... etc.

 

Costumes can be viewed throughout several areas, from the Bow Street entrance up into the Floral Hall, and photos are on display everywhere, and on the way to the Amphi. 

 

If one does not feel like spending on food or drinks (me), free water is provided for (and I grab an M&S sandwich after work before I go into the ROH). 

 

If the Floral Hall is busy I go up the escalator and onto the terrace to enjoy the lovely view, I wander into the Crush Room when I feel like it....Lots to see during the intervals without having to spend.

 

We are truly spoilt in London having such a beautiful and fully modernised ROH. I've been to many Opera Houses on the continent and I find the Royal Opera House to be the most welcoming, comfortable, democratic and civilised of them all (compared to many run-down European Opera Houses!).

[Fonty]

 

I honestly don't get it why people moan about the ROH , the Floral Hall turned into a "canteen" (?),... etc.

 

Costumes can be viewed throughout several areas, from the Bow Street entrance up into the Floral Hall, and photos are on display everywhere, and on the way to the Amphi. 

 

 

 

 

I did say I hadn't been for some time, Nina, and I was simply putting my own rather liberal interpretation of Beryl's post about the increased number of tables in the Floral Hall!

 

I have been going to the ROH since I was a child, (we used to be taken on school trips to matinees when we were in primary school), and I have always found the atmosphere as you describe. 

 

So what the original article is going on about is a mystery to me.