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Simply Adult Ballet: the progress of one adult dancer who took up ballet later in life


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But that is the nub of the question.  Healthy people don't use them, but how do you know you are healthy unless you have just had a negative test.  One of the major problems is that there are so many asymptomatic infections.

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2 minutes ago, Pas de Quatre said:

But that is the nub of the question.  Healthy people don't use them, but how do you know you are healthy unless you have just had a negative test.  One of the major problems is that there are so many asymptomatic infections.

 

Don't tar everyone with the same brush.

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I suspect the rise in Spanish infection rates has more to do with the number of British tourists who went to Spain on holiday before the 14 day quarantine was introduced - ditto France.  I don’t think you can assume that Spain’s R rate has risen *because* masks are mandatory.  

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20 minutes ago, bangorballetboy said:

 

Don't tar everyone with the same brush.

Sorry I don't undestand why that is offensive to anyone - it is a fact that many sufferers are asymptomatic and it is frequently mentioned in Governement health bulletins and newspaper articles.  

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Has anyone tried wearing a neoprene (wetsuit looking material) mask? Specifically to exercise in? I do worry a little about these “fashion” masks as I’m not convinced they are made from the best material. 

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On 28/07/2020 at 19:25, Michelle_Richer said:

For what its worth, I did some initial tests today the first was with Trumask a Nano fibre filter face mask with a multi layer replaceable filter, this was supplied by Vista print. I did half hour of Cecchetti barre, it was quite hot but bearable and I was confident I could have gone on for a full hour of barre exercises, room temperature at that time was around 25ºC.

 

I had a break between the two tests as Adrian came home for lunch.

 

The second mask was a Jiandi KN95 respirator which provides 5 layers of protection, it was well fitting and felt sealed around the edges but reasonably breathable too. I repeated the barre test with the remaining barre for approximate the same period, however it was afternoon and the temperature in my studio had risen to 27ºC, rather than turn the air conditioning on, I thought it would be a more severe test for the mask. As I was still able to continue I started on the centre work for another half an hour without a break, still at an elevated temperature too, although it was uncomfortable, it certainly wasn’t unbearable and I could still dance in it. However one thing I noticed but may not be related to the mask, I needed to go to the loo more often.

 

The reason I noticed it, my teacher messaged me to tell my the water at our studio is being checked for legionnaires and the loos and changing rooms are out of bounds, she wanted to know if was ok to go for 3 hours. Somehow I don’t think we will be wearing masks.

One of our Ladies for the Body Conditioning class has suggested we do it outside in the playing field and that is the plan if it doesn’t rain.

 

Although I have a couple of other masks I could try, I have one of Bloch’s B-Safe masks arriving tomorrow which is supposed to be designed for dance. I will check that out as soon as I get the chance.

 

Conclusion so far, I found the Jiandi KN95 is far more comfortable for exercise and more suited to dance than the Trumask was.

 

 

 

Michelle has been testing different masks.  If you look back up a couple of pages you may find more detail.

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37 minutes ago, Pas de Quatre said:

Sorry I don't undestand why that is offensive to anyone - it is a fact that many sufferers are asymptomatic and it is frequently mentioned in Governement health bulletins and newspaper articles.  


You said: “healthy people don’t use them”, which is not correct (I didn’t say it was offensive). Most people are complying with the guidelines. Some are not (and others are exempt), but (certainly in my experience) it’s a very, very small minority.

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Anyway Pas de Quatre my post was referring to PRE PANDEMIC times in some Asian countries nothing to do with UK and current times. 
I said in those countries more used to mask wearing the healthy people don’t wear them...those that may have cold or flu symptoms wear them and on other occasions because of pollution ...people who are well there don’t just don a mask! 
At the moment we are ALL having to wear masks because of the pandemic and only if we ARE healthy as those who are not should be at home and not going out. 
This is why it’s an unusual situation right now as the vast majority walking around will actually be healthy.

I did buy a couple of “pretty” masks but also have six Bloch straight plain black masks which are actually very comfortable and decided ...probably perversely ...that I’m mainly going to wear them ....as in mourning for when we can return to non mask wearing lol!! 
Where Spain is concerned Brits were on holiday there yes but they were having to wear masks ...I saw on some sites lots of moaning as it was 40 degrees in the shade! I didn’t feel too sorry for them but at the same time wearing masks everywhere outside even on the beach seems overkill to me. Also don’t think it’s Brits spreading it there so much as their own young people. 
Just as in UK Teens to 30’s are mixing much more and in larger groups. A part of me doesn’t blame them ....well not yet as the death rate is still falling and hardly any hospital admissions not even in Brighton where we had the beach invasions. 
It’s up to individual families to remind their younger members that if they are out partying then please don’t go and see Granny and Grandad for a while!! 


 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, LinMM said:

Anyway Pas de Quatre my post was referring to PRE PANDEMIC times in some Asian countries nothing to do with UK and current times. 
I said in those countries more used to mask wearing the healthy people don’t wear them...those that may have cold or flu symptoms wear them and on other occasions because of pollution ...people who are well there don’t just don a mask! 
At the moment we are ALL having to wear masks because of the pandemic and only if we ARE healthy as those who are not should be at home and not going out. 
This is why it’s an unusual situation right now as the vast majority walking around will actually be healthy.

I did buy a couple of “pretty” masks but also have six Bloch straight plain black masks which are actually very comfortable and decided ...probably perversely ...that I’m mainly going to wear them ....as in mourning for when we can return to non mask wearing lol!! 
Where Spain is concerned Brits were on holiday there yes but they were having to wear masks ...I saw on some sites lots of moaning as it was 40 degrees in the shade! I didn’t feel too sorry for them but at the same time wearing masks everywhere outside even on the beach seems overkill to me. Also don’t think it’s Brits spreading it there so much as their own young people. 
Just as in UK Teens to 30’s are mixing much more and in larger groups. A part of me doesn’t blame them ....well not yet as the death rate is still falling and hardly any hospital admissions not even in Brighton where we had the beach invasions. 
It’s up to individual families to remind their younger members that if they are out partying then please don’t go and see Granny and Grandad for a while!! 


 

 

 

 

 

Actually, in countries where mask wearing is also commonplace I believe a lot of mask wearing (pre-Covid) is to do with air quality (or lack thereof).  There was a ludicrous meme on FB a couple of weeks ago saying that mask wearing has been mandatory in China since 1984, implying that it gave more control for the government over people's lives) and that was just plain nonsense because went I went to China on holiday in 1991 no-one was wearing masks (but there was still lots of bikes and less traffic).  Even before the pandemic emergency I had seen people wearing masks on the streets of London (albeit probably holiday makers from countries where mask wearing is common place).

 

The fact is that the wearing of masks in indoor public spaces in England is now a legal requirement unless an individual has a medical exemption or, most bizarrely, in places like gyms.

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2 hours ago, LinMM said:

At the moment we are ALL having to wear masks because of the pandemic and only if we ARE healthy as those who are not should be at home and not going out. 
This is why it’s an unusual situation right now as the vast majority walking around will actually be healthy.

 

Well, we’ll have to agree to disagree on these points, Lin - a study showed that 40% of people in one Italian town had asymptomatic COVID-19.  New symptoms and more people with “Long COVID” which grumbles on for months and shows itself in atypical symptoms are being discovered all the time.  So people may think they’re COVID-free and “healthy” when they’re not.

 

Plus not all “non-healthy” people can stay at home 24/7 for 5 months and counting.  

 

Wearing a mask is hot and can be uncomfortable and inconvenient, no question.  But for non-exempt people, it’s necessary, mandatory and really, not that big a deal.  

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One does have to choose ones words SO carefully! 
what I meant was that people who have Covid 19 should not be going out and staying at home!! I didnt mean anybody with other health problems 

The post was about us wearing masks to protect others against the current virus which can give you Covid 19. 
So most people out and about are healthy in respect to NOT having the virus

Yes some will be out not knowing they are either pre symptomatic or asymptomatic hence the mask wearing but people who do actually have it should be at home until they test negative. 
From my reading around this can literally be anywhere between 5 days and 3 weeks for the majority who catch it. There will always be some who get it really badly and may take months to recover and others who have some after lingering after effects. 
I know a family in Lewes where back in April the three of them had it. The parents are in late 40’s their daughter is 25

The parents are fully recovered and back at work but their daughter who is younger and had it the most mildly at the time has some ongoing problems still...has no energy and easily exhausted at the slightest exertion. She is still undergoing tests but so far don’t know why she is having this response. 
I’m assuming though that as it’s now 4 months since she had it she is not still infectious even though has these problems still, so should be able to go out and about..which she does ... as she is no longer infectious

Only infectious people who know they are should definitely stay at home. 
As there are for example as of last Friday only 4 people out of 100,000 people in Brighton and Hove who are new cases ...that’s 12 people and the whole of the Sussex Hospital trusts only had 3 Covid admissions to hospital in last few weeks I would say that the vast majority of people walking around are healthy and Covid free!! 
Other areas may vary of course some will be even better some worse. 
It’s easy to access information on exactly what’s going on in your local area so you can best assess your personal risks at any time. 

 

 

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Going back to Michelle I don’t think there is any problem in removing the mask if you feel dizzy, faint, unwell. I think there was a link to a study showing they can reduce oxygenation during vigorous exercise. I do sometimes ‘see stars’ in ballet class (maybe just me?) and not with any warning so it does happen and if you did faint it would cause far bigger problems and risk of infection anyway! I think legally there is a distinction between measures to be taken in your workplace (ballet company I’m presuming would be included) and measures at a recreational facility which you are attending totally of your own volition. I know Michelle has tested out several masks etc so was just wondering whether she’d chosen to wear one or whether some studios had chosen to make it mandatory. 

in normal times not everyone in an operating theatre wears a mask, it depends on proximity to the patient, a surgeon does take breaks in a long surgery, if they move away they can lower the mask, have a drink etc. Masks are alien to us and not particularly comfy to wear but exemptions are meant to be for people who could be very negatively affected by one, it’s a matter of conscience though and there are a minority who are just selfish. And yes, the latest masks are the in thing with teenagers. My worry is that the government have invested very little in actually teaching people how to use them. So if your teen wants the latest model which cost £15 are you going to buy 4 or 5 so that they can change them at school every 2 hours at school or replace with a new one every time they take them off. Probably not, they will all be putting the same mask on and off repeatedly for days at a time. Which is probably actually worse than nothing. Our government is actively encouraging people to go to school and workplaces, and to get public transport. If people have sat in schools or worked in factories all day with little/ no safety measures I don’t think you can be particularly surprised if they then don’t see the need to distance from people outside the workplace. 

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2 hours ago, LinMM said:

One does have to choose ones words SO carefully! 
what I meant was that people who have Covid 19 should not be going out and staying at home!! I didnt mean anybody with other health problems 

The post was about us wearing masks to protect others against the current virus which can give you Covid 19. 
So most people out and about are healthy in respect to NOT having the virus

Yes some will be out not knowing they are either pre symptomatic or asymptomatic hence the mask wearing but people who do actually have it should be at home until they test negative. 
From my reading around this can literally be anywhere between 5 days and 3 weeks for the majority who catch it. There will always be some who get it really badly and may take months to recover and others who have some after lingering after effects. 
I know a family in Lewes where back in April the three of them had it. The parents are in late 40’s their daughter is 25

The parents are fully recovered and back at work but their daughter who is younger and had it the most mildly at the time has some ongoing problems still...has no energy and easily exhausted at the slightest exertion. She is still undergoing tests but so far don’t know why she is having this response. 
I’m assuming though that as it’s now 4 months since she had it she is not still infectious even though has these problems still, so should be able to go out and about..which she does ... as she is no longer infectious

Only infectious people who know they are should definitely stay at home. 
As there are for example as of last Friday only 4 people out of 100,000 people in Brighton and Hove who are new cases ...that’s 12 people and the whole of the Sussex Hospital trusts only had 3 Covid admissions to hospital in last few weeks I would say that the vast majority of people walking around are healthy and Covid free!! 
Other areas may vary of course some will be even better some worse. 
It’s easy to access information on exactly what’s going on in your local area so you can best assess your personal risks at any time. 

 

 

 

But we don't know how many people have been tested for C-19 so we don't know how many asymptomatic or feeling better but still infectious people there are out there.  It should not be forgotten that the masks are to help save others from you not you from them.

 

When I had a recent outpatient appointment I asked the staff who were wearing non-medical grade masks how long they should be worn for.  They told me that they wore them for about 4 hours but less if they became damp.

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I chuck my mask and gloves when we come back from shopping and if I wear a cloth mask it goes to be washed. I love my cloth masks but eldest daughter who works in a hospital told me to wear the medical grade  masks as she doesn’t think my cloth masks are good enough. They are so pretty though!

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49 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said:

 

But we don't know how many people have been tested for C-19 so we don't know how many asymptomatic or feeling better but still infectious people there are out there.  It should not be forgotten that the masks are to help save others from you not you from them.

 


absolutely, even more so now that it’s younger age groups being affected as they are more likely to be asymptomatic (and less likely to be hospitalised). In some areas of the country there’s low take up of testing for many reasons- language and understanding barriers, inaccessibility of testing stations (not everyone has a car or a suitable driver!), financial pressures of potentially having to isolate etc

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Hi Peony
My take on the mask issue stemmed from my disappointment of when ballet studios were allowed to open or rather the delay, as I had already booked the slot with my rep coach subject to permission being granted, well it wasn’t as dance studio’s came under the same heading as indoor gym’s. The advice at that time for indoor gym was each participant had to a 100sq of space, eg 10 x 10ft, which would equate to around 3 metres social distancing between centres, which made sense at that time with 2 metres social distancing outside, and then of course face coverings came in for supermarket etc.

 

My thoughts are, if its necessary for supermarkets with air conditioning, then it really ort to be mandatory for dance studios.

 

However on our last on-line class, on body conditioning, which followed my ballet, our teacher ask all of us as to if we minded wearing mask during class, every one was happy to do so, I also ask my teacher if she had done a risk assessment prior to us going back, she hadn’t, and I forwarded her the pack of documents from the ISTD including the risk assessment template. So it really started there, for me it was to be a Tuesday 1 hour ballet class with another dancer who is a ballet teacher in her own right, then a 1 hour Wednesday one-to-one ballet class followed by an hour Body conditioning class with a small number of ladies. The first two body conditioning classes we managed to do outside. But now thing have changed I have no Tuesday class and have doubled up on Wednesday, plus I think it likely to be dark by the end of the body conditioning class now, so that will be indoors too.

I guess you also have to remember my teacher is wearing a mask for the three hours too. For me I guess I’m just hard core, if it’s possible I will do it, or at least I will find where the boundaries are. Just to say it’s unpleasant and I don’t want too, doesn’t work for me. At least I have found my boundary in the body conditioning class where the mask cannot deliver sufficient air for those exhausting cardio exercises that we do.

For me the search for a better mask continues.

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I would suggest that the reason you don’t get sufficient air in the stronger cardio exercises is there is probably more open mouthed breathing which starts to make the mask hot. It’s the same if you speak for any length of time wearing one because the mouth is open more the heat builds up. 
It’s then you get that suffocating feeling which is very unpleasant. 
Sitting on a bus or going round the shops (unless you are running everywhere) is  not too bad. 
I’m not going to endanger someone ...if a class demands masks I will try it and if it isn’t for me then I won’t attend. 
In classes where people are not wearing masks it shouldn’t be a problem as long as all are in agreement about it. 

I will only be expecting to get to a studio once a fortnight in next few months anyway so it’s not going to be  a big issue

People will have to go along with what studios decide and not attend if you’re not happy with whatever arrangement is in place.

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9 hours ago, LinMM said:

Anyway Pas de Quatre my post was referring to PRE PANDEMIC times in some Asian countries nothing to do with UK and current times. 
I said in those countries more used to mask wearing the healthy people don’t wear them...those that may have cold or flu symptoms wear them and on other occasions because of pollution ...people who are well there don’t just don a mask! 
At the moment we are ALL having to wear masks because of the pandemic and only if we ARE healthy as those who are not should be at home and not going out. 
This is why it’s an unusual situation right now as the vast majority walking around will actually be healthy.

I did buy a couple of “pretty” masks but also have six Bloch straight plain black masks which are actually very comfortable and decided ...probably perversely ...that I’m mainly going to wear them ....as in mourning for when we can return to non mask wearing lol!! 
Where Spain is concerned Brits were on holiday there yes but they were having to wear masks ...I saw on some sites lots of moaning as it was 40 degrees in the shade! I didn’t feel too sorry for them but at the same time wearing masks everywhere outside even on the beach seems overkill to me. Also don’t think it’s Brits spreading it there so much as their own young people. 
Just as in UK Teens to 30’s are mixing much more and in larger groups. A part of me doesn’t blame them ....well not yet as the death rate is still falling and hardly any hospital admissions not even in Brighton where we had the beach invasions. 
It’s up to individual families to remind their younger members that if they are out partying then please don’t go and see Granny and Grandad for a while!! 


 

 

 

 

face covering use   pre -covid in  east Asia was  more about  particulates and smog  more than anything to do with  diseases . 

it is important tonote that the  effect   of face covering with respect to covid-19 is to  reduce the number and /or distance that  droplets  travel on exhalation, as it  still appears to be primarily droplet spread 

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Thanks for the clarification michelle. If a teacher requested it, I would certainly give it a go. Of course some teachers (and their students) will be more vulnerable than others and so their risk assessment may be different. If it’s causing you problems I’d encourage you to feed that back if you haven’t already. It may be that they will need to adjust the class a little. Apart from the risk of injuries if someone does faint your teacher will have to give first aid, which would be classed as a higher transmission risk so best for everyone to avoid that scenario!

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Yes NJH I agree but also went on to say that in my post. Someone I know who lived in Hong Kong said that people do wear masks out of respect for others if they are slightly unwell but are still out and about and as I also said previously for pollution on bad days etc. 
Also understand the reason why we are wearing masks here too in UK etc at the moment. 

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I haven't danced with mine on yet, but I have done both heavy weight training and conditioning. Lifting heavy was a bit odd but nothing special, but 500 24kg kettlebell swings with a mask was distinctly strange. I seemed to be hyperventilating.

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500 swings 😱 I defo think I’d be hyperventilating around about 10 swings ...without a mask lol!! 
Seriously though have you ever experienced this hyperventilating before ...without a mask ...on an off day ..or similar? 

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A couple of days earlier I did the swings workout in just under 14 minutes, without a mask, outside my flat, and didn't feel anything like that.

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Sorry I seem to have posted a previous post again have NO idea how that happened🤔

In answer to TYR was going to say it could have been a one off occurrence but if it happens again you may have to consider not wearing the mask for that particular exercise. Does the gym you go to mandate masks or is it optional? 

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10 hours ago, LinMM said:

Sorry I seem to have posted a previous post again have NO idea how that happened🤔

In answer to TYR was going to say it could have been a one off occurrence but if it happens again you may have to consider not wearing the mask for that particular exercise. Does the gym you go to mandate masks or is it optional? 

 

I didn't see anyone else wearing one and the staff aren't, but it just seems sensible.

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On 24/08/2020 at 23:42, Peony said:

Thanks for the clarification michelle. If a teacher requested it, I would certainly give it a go. Of course some teachers (and their students) will be more vulnerable than others and so their risk assessment may be different. If it’s causing you problems I’d encourage you to feed that back if you haven’t already. 

Hi Peony

 

I really doesn’t pose a serious problem of me fainting so to speak, just uncomfortable and a bit more challenging, however I think things may change since our class this last week. We were half way through our second hour working a piece of centre work from the syllabus and my teacher was complaining of getting hot under her mask. As there was only the two of us and we must have been around 3 to 4 metres apart, windows and a balcony door open.  I just suggested we take the mask off and we both did. We were fortunate with our body conditioning class as the weather was nice and still daylight, we were able to do that outside again. We may be able to just scrape it in before dark this next week, but I think that will be it, then I guess masks will most probably be on again for that class.

 

I'm hoping to persuade my teacher to allow me to drop my Tuesday class with the other dancer when she comes back and permanently stay with the 2 hours of one-to-one that we do at the moment, as I learn so much faster and to some extent on my own with the way she sets my homework, by selecting something from the syllabus that we haven't yet worked on, to go and study, I really like that. I have a new piece this week, but she has tasked me with only learning it so far, then doing it from the opposite side, she knows full well I will learn it all, the full length of the music, I just hope I can master it both side by Wednesdays class.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

When I asked my Cecchetti ballet teacher if I could drop the Tuesday class if and when the other student returns, and continue permanently with 2 hours one-to-one on a Wednesday, she said YES, whoopee. All I need now is for faculty of Cecchetti at the ISTD to release the new Advanced 2 DVD as they have promised for September, then me and my teacher can truly sing from the same song sheet so to speak.

 

Last Wednesday’s body conditioning class was perhaps the last outside without masks as it’s likely to be too dark this week, also as it was getting quite dusky by the end of class, where I was getting eaten by swarms of gnats, bites all over my arms and face, they lasted most of the week, not nice.

 

Most unusually I manage to join a beginner’s pointe class with Holistic Ballet, which was really scary. Firstly the info said it was beginning in September, so I enrolled, then I emailed the question as to when, the reply was “tomorrow”, oh poo, that doesn’t give me much time to prepare I thought . Especially as I haven’t done any proper pointe prep since the beginning of COVID, not only that but I have lost stamina too.

One questioned crossed my mind, “were we to start in ballet flats for strengthening first”, for some reason I was reluctant to ask, however one of the other students did, tjat was an half hour before the class was due to start. The reply was “we were to start immediately in pointe shoes.

The only thing I could do was get my pointe shoes and do what little bit of prep I had time for, fully expecting to be kicked off the course.

To be fair I struggled through the first session, I think on balance I probably did a little better than I had anticipate, although I had loads and loads of corrections. Again expecting an email throwing me off before the next session.

The second week seamed somewhat different, not easier, but I felt a little warmth from the teacher, I felt my second session was somewhat better than my first, but every little bit of improvement felt really hard won and only through sheer hard graft between the sessions. Fortunately even though the pointe course wasn’t planned as such, I had scheduled in 3 days of 2hours for preparation for pointe, so it wasn’t too difficult to accommodate and I use every minute of it. I’ve two more session to do, as I’m not sure if the class will continue or not, if it does I most certainly will, I cant let go now.

 

The only things that remain to be covered in my schedule now, is another body conditioning class taking me to 5, and a one-to-one class with a new rep coach, that will take me to around 30hours a week committed to ballet and related body conditioning, as part of body conditioning but not included in the 5, includes a weekly massage/ physio session with three different therapists on a rota as part of my team customized to my requirement. Never thought I would get this busy so fast.

 

One last thing I need to find is a ballet establishment that will host Adrian and my annual intensive for showcasing our own rep, as our ballet school in Scotland did.

 

 

 

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