ROH 23/24 season announced

[alison]

I think what frustrates me, standing in the Stalls Circle once again, is wondering *just* how cheaply they're selling them, and whether they couldn't have got more money for them by targeting different people.  But I suppose it ticks a lot of Arts Council accessibility boxes  

[JNC]

On a totally different topic I see Melissa Hamilton has posted a lovely photo of her on Instagram in Balanchine’s Serenade - 9 years ago today it was at the ROH.

 

Given Balanchine has been woefully neglected over the past year (only three diamonds performances) and completely ignored next season, let’s hope for something in 24/25. Failing that if ENB and BRB could maybe pick up some more Balanchine rep…

[OnePigeon]

I’m not sure anyone is griping at the youngsters, merely the unfairness of the scheme giving the stalls seats at hugely discounted prices to people on the scheme while the rest of us who don’t have a spare £190 sit far away whilst spending more for the ‘privilege’ because we’re old(ish).  I would certainly be taking full advantage of it if I could and lay no blame at their door.  
 

They already have Friday Rush tickets - why not free up some of those unsold stalls seats for that purpose?  It would at least give everyone the opportunity regardless of demographics.  I know of some museums who offer discounts to those on Universal Credit and Wild Card tickets are a great idea too.  There are lots of other ways of making it more inclusive and I don’t mean they should get rid of the young person scheme, but acknowledge that there are other groups out there who are being increasingly excluded and find a way of opening it up a bit more.

[AnnabelCharles]

If you're lucky enough to be able to afford to go to ROH regularly, even if it means sitting in cheaper/restricted view/amphi seats, spare a thought for those on this forum who can only go a couple of times a year or who can no longer afford to go at all. (Then maybe spare another for those who are struggling to make ends meet, let alone have a night out at the theatre.)

 

Dynamic pricing is everywhere - the chances are that someone has paid or will pay more or less for the sweater/plane seat/house you bought yesterday. Discounts for those who are likely to be earning less/on a lower income/have a disability seems pretty fair - though of course it's not going to cover everyone in that situation and sometimes people do miss out. 

 

Life often seems a bit unfair - you have to get over it - but real unfairness is when people are born into terrible situations, have multiple health issues or face hideous tragedies.

 

If you're really sitting in the gorgeous ROH auditorium, waiting to watch a wonderful ballet or opera, and feeling bothered that the young person in front of you might have paid less for their ticket, I have to ask - do you think you're living your best life?

[CCL]

Is it ok on this thread to ask what the pricing is like for Das Rheingold? 

[OnePigeon]

36 minutes ago, AnnabelCharles said:

If you're lucky enough to be able to afford to go to ROH regularly, even if it means sitting in cheaper/restricted view/amphi seats, spare a thought for those on this forum who can only go a couple of times a year or who can no longer afford to go at all. (Then maybe spare another for those who are struggling to make ends meet, let alone have a night out at the theatre.)

 

Dynamic pricing is everywhere - the chances are that someone has paid or will pay more or less for the sweater/plane seat/house you bought yesterday. Discounts for those who are likely to be earning less/on a lower income/have a disability seems pretty fair - though of course it's not going to cover everyone in that situation and sometimes people do miss out. 

 

Life often seems a bit unfair - you have to get over it - but real unfairness is when people are born into terrible situations, have multiple health issues or face hideous tragedies.

 

If you're really sitting in the gorgeous ROH auditorium, waiting to watch a wonderful ballet or opera, and feeling bothered that the young person in front of you might have paid less for their ticket, I have to ask - do you think you're living your best life?

No, I’m not living my best life -  if I was I’d be in the stalls! 😆

 

[Bluebird]

27 minutes ago, CCL said:

Is it ok on this thread to ask what the pricing is like for Das Rheingold? 

 

Stalls £240 - £325

Stalls Circle £25 - £325

Grand Tier £310-£325

Grand Tier Boxes £193-£310

Balcony £25-£294

Balcony Boxes £87

Slips £14-£43

Amphitheatre £14-£146

 

Edited to add that I've only quoted the lowest and the highest price for each area.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Bluebird

[Dawnstar]

Interestingly, the side block of the stalls I'm overlooking this evening does not seem to be predominently inhabited by people in the Young ROH age range. So unless people on the scheme are allowed to buy lots of tickets apiece & bring several generations of their family with them then at least some of the tickets showing as unsold a couple of days ago must have been disposed of by other means.

[TSR101]

1 hour ago, AnnabelCharles said:

If you're lucky enough to be able to afford to go to ROH regularly, even if it means sitting in cheaper/restricted view/amphi seats, spare a thought for those on this forum who can only go a couple of times a year or who can no longer afford to go at all. (Then maybe spare another for those who are struggling to make ends meet, let alone have a night out at the theatre.)

 

Dynamic pricing is everywhere - the chances are that someone has paid or will pay more or less for the sweater/plane seat/house you bought yesterday. Discounts for those who are likely to be earning less/on a lower income/have a disability seems pretty fair - though of course it's not going to cover everyone in that situation and sometimes people do miss out. 

 

Life often seems a bit unfair - you have to get over it - but real unfairness is when people are born into terrible situations, have multiple health issues or face hideous tragedies.

 

If you're really sitting in the gorgeous ROH auditorium, waiting to watch a wonderful ballet or opera, and feeling bothered that the young person in front of you might have paid less for their ticket, I have to ask - do you think you're living your best life?

 

I actually think the biggest problem with the Young ROH is that it creates an arbitrary cut off point which does not reflect economic reality. The millennial generation is the first in recent history to be making less than their parents. That takes in an age range of those under 42. If you are therefore trying to increase interest by younger, less well off attendees, then the scheme simply will not work - even if marketing a scheme for £25 tickets for 25s and under sounds good.  Why offer £25 tickets for those under 25 but then full price tickets at 26? I know lots of people who have take up offers on schemes such as this until the cut off point, and then never go again, they can't afford too. It would be more sensible (and better financial sense for the ROH) to have a tiered age arrangement (u30 & u35), with different discounts available, and increased discounts when tickets aren't selling. For example, the u35 could offer £50/75 last minute tickets thereby doubling or tripling ROH income whilst still meeting the goal of reaching younger audiences. 
 

[bridiem]

2 hours ago, AnnabelCharles said:

If you're lucky enough to be able to afford to go to ROH regularly, even if it means sitting in cheaper/restricted view/amphi seats, spare a thought for those on this forum who can only go a couple of times a year or who can no longer afford to go at all. (Then maybe spare another for those who are struggling to make ends meet, let alone have a night out at the theatre.)

 

Dynamic pricing is everywhere - the chances are that someone has paid or will pay more or less for the sweater/plane seat/house you bought yesterday. Discounts for those who are likely to be earning less/on a lower income/have a disability seems pretty fair - though of course it's not going to cover everyone in that situation and sometimes people do miss out. 

 

Life often seems a bit unfair - you have to get over it - but real unfairness is when people are born into terrible situations, have multiple health issues or face hideous tragedies.

 

If you're really sitting in the gorgeous ROH auditorium, waiting to watch a wonderful ballet or opera, and feeling bothered that the young person in front of you might have paid less for their ticket, I have to ask - do you think you're living your best life?

 

I don't detect resentment on this forum against young people who may have paid less for their ticket; the discussion is around the logic/rationality/effectiveness of the ROH's ticketing pricing and discounting policies (or lack of) including how they affect both regular attenders (who may still be on a comparatively low income) and those who come infrequently (for whatever reason/s). Of course in the whole scheme of things this doesn't rank as a major life concern; but then neither does the quality of a new ballet production or the inclusion or omission of a particular work in the repertoire or anything much else about ballet. So I don't think that wishing to discuss such things implies a lack of perspective about the unfairness of life.

 

 

[OnePigeon]

I couldn’t agree more @bridiem. I don’t hold much truck with telling people life is unfair and there are always people worse off, so stop whinging:  it’s such a negative and defeatist attitude. What is the harm in trying to find solutions to make ticket pricing more accessible and fair for a broader audience?  I know it’s not life or death  and it’s not making my top 20 concerns about life right now, but this is a ballet forum; if we are only allowed to care about the big things that really matter in life we may as well stop posting.  Surely it’s ok for some of us to raise concerns and discontent about the cost of tickets - it’s quite a big deal in the world of ballet and the arts if a vast swathe of the audience are being priced out of attending, though obviously trivial in the context of general life.  It’s not fair to make socio-economic assumptions about people posting here and belittle their concerns about ballet ticket prices on a ballet forum.  I’m sure we all have much larger problems and world concerns, but this isn’t the place we discuss them.
 

I certainly only afford to go these days if I can get a Friday Rush ticket and I have to be selective about what I choose to see, therefore it’s a little galling to know that some people are able to sit in top price tickets for a fraction of the listed price.  I don’t resent them per se, but I do resent the system that causes this situation.  I’m not living my best life by any stretch of the imagination, but attending the ballet is a moment of sunlight in a dark world and is actually very important to me - it that’s trivial, so be it.

[Emeralds]

3 hours ago, Jane S said:

I wonder if there's anyone here who was introduced to the ROH via the Midland Bank Proms? They seemed very popular at the time but I guess there's no way of knowing how many prommers became long term customers.

Ooh, now there’s a blast from the past considering Midland Bank is now HSBC!  Putting my hand up to say I went one year and saw everything, sitting on the floor of the stalls with all the seating removed and thoroughly enjoying it. I was already a ballet watcher but tried opera (again), watching every single opera they had in that week, having previously paid for Don Giovanni at full price and fell asleep halfway (sorry Maestro Mozart!) because it felt very lonnnggg compared to a ballet! (Funnily enough, I now like Mozart but haven’t actually got round to seeing another DG).

 

I really enjoyed the three operas and the singers seemed very energised by the buzz from the youngsters sitting on the floor (the rest of the house was priced at normal rates), but that wasn’t what got me booking to watch opera again - it was a documentary on tv presented by Rolando Villazon on tv, with Kaufmann, Florez and Villazon among the singers featured, plus YouTube and Facebook videos of Florez, Di Donato, Fleming, etc. (So, while I was technically a prommer just once and did go on to be a long term customer, it was really tv and YouTube that did it.) 

 

2 hours ago, Bluebird said:

 

Stalls £240 - £325

Stalls Circle £25 - £325

Grand Tier £310-£325

Grand Tier Boxes £193-£310

Balcony £25-£294

Balcony Boxes £87

Slips £14-£43

Amphitheatre £14-£146

 

Edited to add that I've only quoted the lowest and the highest price for each area.

Whoa, those are bold prices. I know Wagner/Ring fans are used to silly prices, but I’m just wondering who would pay £325. Basically, it will cost you £2.32 a minute. 😂. I’m not sure why opera prices always push me to calculate how much each minute costs (the intervals don’t count, and anyway, you won’t get one with Rhinegold) but they do. I’d be happy to pay that for one-off fundraiser for a good cause with a starry cast (whether ballet or opera) but I wouldn’t pay that for a repertory production, Wagner or no Wagner. Also, Kosky directing it is a big risk! It could be a huge triumph  (eg Agrippina) or the complete opposite (eg Carmen);.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Emeralds

[bridiem]

4 hours ago, Jane S said:

I wonder if there's anyone here who was introduced to the ROH via the Midland Bank Proms? They seemed very popular at the time but I guess there's no way of knowing how many prommers became long term customers.

 

As a Junior Associate I had already got hooked on ballet, but these Proms gave me my first opportunity to be very close to the stage which was so exciting. (I've still only very occasionally been as close to the stage as that, and only when someone else has paid for the ticket!). But yes, they were great, and the atmosphere was different and fun.

[ninamargaret]

2 hours ago, Bluebird said:

 

Stalls £240 - £325

Stalls Circle £25 - £325

Grand Tier £310-£325

Grand Tier Boxes £193-£310

Balcony £25-£294

Balcony Boxes £87

Slips £14-£43

Amphitheatre £14-£146

 

Edited to add that I've only quoted the lowest and the highest price for each area.

As is often the case with opera, there seem to be huge gaps in price ranges. I decided I might, at a pinch, be able to afford a side stalls circle at £113. But the next price in stalls circle is £193! Mobility issues mean that I am limited in where I can sit, so if, as I suspect, the £113 seats will have vanished by the time Friends booking opens I'll do without.

[Emeralds]

On 14/05/2023 at 20:14, JohnS said:

Many thanks @bridiem.

 

The ROH looks to demonstrate its accessibility in terms of making available ‘almost 40% of our tickets at £50 or under’ without specifying whether the tickets provide an unrestricted view or whether they’re seats or standing places. I think that’s perfectly reasonable as it’s covering all tickets put up for sale.
 

The horseshoe auditorium means that some tickets will inevitably have restricted views and at least the ROH readily provides the view from every ticket for sale albeit without showing the impact of audience members sitting in seats in front.

 

My major concern is that there seems to be an unfairness in pricing, particularly the pricing of cheaper seats for ballet which have seen very significant increases in recent years. That has occurred because the traditional pricing map (where prices for all productions were broadly a similar percentage of the top price) has been abandoned. 
 

I’m also very interested in just how close the ROH gets to achieving its ‘almost 40% of tickets are £50 or under’. And with 10% plus inflation it looks pretty impossible to achieve.

 

I meant to add a note of caution about the prices published in the magazine as there may be a few typos. Hopefully the pricing maps will be available fairly soon on line.

Just examining the wording carefully, I notice it says “tickets are £50 or under”, not “seats are £50:or under”, and “ROH” not “ROH Main Stage”, so the 40% are standing, upper slips, lower slips, back rows and side seats of Rear Amphi.....and Linbury Theatre.

 

For mixed bills with modern works and some new operas there are more seats under £50 (just!) in the very side view stalls circle, balcony and middle and side amphitheatre, so that bumps up the number to 40%. (The statement must mean 40% of all productions as a total and not 40% at every performance.)  But if a first time attendee is hoping to find a seat for Swan Lake (2024) or La Traviata (2023) under £50 that isn’t restricted view, he/she will need binoculars/opera glasses and a head for heights. (Unless they like seeing everything looking tiny!)

Edited May 15, 2023 by Emeralds

[Amanda Liu]

From the ROH website I understand that young ROH scheme is sponsored by a few individuals/families. Therefore, selling tickets at £25 does not necessarily mean loss of revenue for ROH as they may get the remainder from the sponsors (I might be wrong). And if the sponsors are happy with how their funds are used I don’t see any issues with this scheme. (P.S. I am not eligible for young ROH )

[Dawnstar]

1 hour ago, OnePigeon said:

I’m not living my best life by any stretch of the imagination, but attending the ballet is a moment of sunlight in a dark world and is actually very important to me - it that’s trivial, so be it.

 

Beautifully put. If I could like your post, and especially this last sentence, multiple times then I would. For me theatregoing is one of the things that makes life worth living.

 

1 hour ago, Emeralds said:

I was already a ballet watcher but tried opera (again), watching every single opera they had in that week, having previously paid for Don Giovanni at full price and fell asleep halfway (sorry Maestro Mozart!) because it felt very lonnnggg compared to a ballet! (Funnily enough, I now like Mozart but haven’t actually got round to seeing another DG).

 

So, while I was technically a prommer just once and did go on to be a long term customer, it was really tv and YouTube that did it.

 

It could be a huge triumph  (eg Agrippina) or the complete opposite (eg Carmen);.

 

I started regular operagoing years before regular ballet going & have seen several Don G productions but I can still find it feels long at times!

 

Oh, this makes me feel old: when I was getting into opera YouTube hadn't been invented! I had to make do with Radio 3, borrowing CDs from the library, & buying CDs on offer in HMV (after consulting the library copy of the Penguin Record Guide).

 

I think I might have to be paid £325 to book for a Kosky production sight-unseen! The only one of his I've seen live is The Nose and I would have left at the interval exceptlike Rheingold it didn't have one!

 

[Sim]

@Emeralds May I suggest the Joseph Losey film of Don Giovanni if you haven’t already seen it. It stars Ruggero Raimondi and Kiri Te Kanawa and is beautifully filmed in northern Italy, mostly in and around the Palladian villas in the Veneto and Vicenza. I never tire of it!

[JohnS]

7 hours ago, Emeralds said:

Just examining the wording carefully, I notice it says “tickets are £50 or under”, not “seats are £50:or under”, and “ROH” not “ROH Main Stage”, so the 40% are standing, upper slips, lower slips, back rows and side seats of Rear Amphi.....and Linbury Theatre.

I have been assured that the statement refers to main stage performances only. I specifically asked about Linbury/Insights etc. Where I haven’t had confirmation is how Schools matinees/NHS/Paul Hamlyn performances are treated. I included this assurance and discussion in my first post.
 

The ROH would put itself in a better position if it were precise in how it describes its target (ie main stage only) and reports its achievement (ie quote the actual figure rather than ‘almost 40%’ which is hopelessly vague). I’m sure it has a strong story to tell - schools/NHS/Paul Hamlyn/targeted discounting all extremely positive AND whatever it can say with precision about the bulk of its tickets actually sold to the general public.
 

I think it would have a considerably stronger line if it looked again at its pricing maps and returned to consistency in pricing for all performances, with all tickets priced as a %age of the maximum price for the particular production (with sensible rounding). For ballet that would tend to reduce the prices of cheaper/restricted view seats.

[DVDfan]

There seems to be some confusion about the aims of ROH discounts, though I get the feeling this is in the group think of ROH and not the minds of forum members.

Offering students or under 25s large discounts is presumably about building an audience for the future, on the assumption that they will keep coming any pay full price later in life. Whereas if accessibility were the aim, those discounts need to be offered to people on benefits regardless of age. No reason why they shouldn't do both, of course, if the balance sheet will stand it - but that's surely where the Arts Council should be helping?

[Emeralds]

11 hours ago, Sim said:

@Emeralds May I suggest the Joseph Losey film of Don Giovanni if you haven’t already seen it. It stars Ruggero Raimondi and Kiri Te Kanawa and is beautifully filmed in northern Italy, mostly in and around the Palladian villas in the Veneto and Vicenza. I never tire of it!

Thank you, Sim! I think I have seen an excerpt but not finished the whole thing. Must get round to it one winter night or something.....lol. Not sure why DG isn’t a big hit with me? Possibly because after DG and L’s big arias and the scene with Zerlina (can’t help being reminded of A Month in the Country in that scene now!) I can’t help thinking, “ok, it’s time to finish him off now!” Whereas I’ve seen Magic Flute three times, and with the right singer/s in any of the leads, could watch it again. 😁 Love Dame Kiri of course, and remember RR singing at ROH a lot.  I agree that’s an excellent film. 

[Emeralds]

6 hours ago, JohnS said:

I have been assured that the statement refers to main stage performances only. I specifically asked about Linbury/Insights etc. Where I haven’t had confirmation is how Schools matinees/NHS/Paul Hamlyn performances are treated. I included this assurance and discussion in my first post.
 

The ROH would put itself in a better position if it were precise in how it describes its target (ie main stage only) and reports its achievement (ie quote the actual figure rather than ‘almost 40%’ which is hopelessly vague). I’m sure it has a strong story to tell - schools/NHS/Paul Hamlyn/targeted discounting all extremely positive AND whatever it can say with precision about the bulk of its tickets actually sold to the general public.
 

I think it would have a considerably stronger line if it looked again at its pricing maps and returned to consistency in pricing for all performances, with all tickets priced as a %age of the maximum price for the particular production (with sensible rounding). For ballet that would tend to reduce the prices of cheaper/restricted view seats.

Thanks for checking, JohnS! I reckon it is still possible to have 40% under £50 tickets for just Main Stage, non-schools matinees, non-Paul Hamlyn type special performances if they add up all the premieres, contemporary works, standing tickets. But actually under £50 is not really a bargain when many venues eg RFH or Wigmore Hall has most of their seats (not tickets!) under £50! Over 70% of RFH are, and most performances in WH have £50 as  the top price. Maybe they mean it’s a good bargain compared to watching Coldplay or Beyoncé, or Champions League Final 😉 .

 

If you think about it, even £49, while technically below £50, when one buys two such tickets for a couple or for going with a friend/companion as many people tend to for meals/sport/leisure activity, £98 is just £2 shy of three digits, which isn’t affordable for a lot of people, especially in this current economic climate. 

 

 

Just to add also that ROH is quite “unique” among both U.K. and international venues that it has an awful lot of restricted view seats half blocked by rails, pillars and lamps that are over the £80 or even £100 mark. The theatre gets lots of complaints from first time buyers appalled that they paid over £90 or £100 for a seat where they couldn’t see half the stage. (I know where those seats are, and they never used to cost that much relative to all the other seats.)

 

I should add though, that if anyone has this restricted view problem with their seat and tells the head usher/front of house manager at the first opportunity, the staff are now really helpful at sorting out a seat with a better view. They can’t give you a Grand Tier seat if you only paid for upper slips, but they can find a similar priced seat where the view isn’t as bad. Perhaps they should just get rid of the bad restricted view seats or not offer them till the house is fully sold out, as many patrons actually don’t dare to complain or ask for help- they just don’t return at all, and spend their money somewhere else. So do ask for help.

 

I don’t think the quirky price rises in some of the middle priced or lower priced seats with issues (especially when they haven’t gone up for opera) are an accident. I think the management and finance staff, when trying to work out where to increase prices, have used an algorithm or software to analyse which seats always sell, and which sell the quickest. They’ve discovered that some cheaper seats that are uncomfortable/have limited sight lines (but not blocked by a giant object) seem to sell the quickest and the most reliably, so they have decided, “Aha! It must be a hot ticket or something!” and raised the prices of those stratospherically. It’s a bit like observing how the vegetables or bread that expire tomorrow are discounted 50% off at the supermarket so they sell the moment they go on the shelf, and concluding  you should triple their price because everyone is buying them, and ignoring the fact that they are popular because of the 50% off! Of course nobody will touch them at triple the price. I agree they should return to consistent pricing. (And if the prices quoted for Anemoi and Dante are what they are going to charge, I’m afraid there will be tons of empty seats.) 

 

For next season, it’s really essential to check the view and the picture of what the seat looks like before buying!  

 

 

[Lizbie1]

3 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

But actually under £50 is not really a bargain when many venues eg RFH or Wigmore Hall has most of their seats (not tickets!) under £50! Over 70% of RFH are, and most performances in WH have £50 as  the top price.

 

I don't think you can in any way make a fair comparison of Wigmore Hall prices with ROH. The operating costs are on a completely different scale. RFH pricing is perhaps a closer comparison but there are more differences than similarities to ROH IMO (it's not a direct employer of an orchestra/chorus/corps de ballet for starters).

 

Also: we complain *a lot* about lower level Friends and non-Friends having slim pickings when booking for popular productions, but the WH is notorious for selling out completely before even lower level Friends get a sniff at certain dates. (It's also probably the least diverse audience I've ever seen, for which it never seems to attract the public criticism that ROH does.)

[capybara]

@Emeralds Several times recently, including your latest post, you have written as if you have quite detailed knowledge of the ROH’s administration. Is that the case, please?

[jmhopton]

Just had an email from Sarasota Ballet about their Dance for All Day of Giving initiative which is today. if anyone is interested in accessing their website (didn't know if it was appropriate to post it and anyway my link is to my email account) They're running videos and asking for donations for six different areas of which the final one is Lectures, Tickets and Tours. Given that how many on the Forum are thrilled they are coming I thought some might be interested in donating, especially as they're having to raise a large sum just to come at all. You can specify which area/s you want your donation to go to. Someone has agreed to match fund any donations. I've already sent a small donation. I'd have liked it to be more but you know how things are at the moment... Hope nobody has already mentioned this but have been out of circulation with a tummy bug and haven't been able to check. Just coming round today !

[Lizbie1]

1 hour ago, Emeralds said:

Just to add also that ROH is quite “unique” among both U.K. and international venues that it has an awful lot of restricted view seats half blocked by rails, pillars and lamps that are over the £80 or even £100 mark.

 

By chance I've just been looking at the La Scala website and I would beg leave to differ!

[bangorballetboy]

1 hour ago, Emeralds said:

Thanks for checking, JohnS! I reckon it is still possible to have 40% under £50 tickets for just Main Stage, non-schools matinees, non-Paul Hamlyn type special performances if they add up all the premieres, contemporary works, standing tickets. But actually under £50 is not really a bargain when many venues eg RFH or Wigmore Hall has most of their seats (not tickets!) under £50! Over 70% of RFH are, and most performances in WH have £50 as  the top price. Maybe they mean it’s a good bargain compared to watching Coldplay or Beyoncé, or Champions League Final 😉 .

 

If you think about it, even £49, while technically below £50, when one buys two such tickets for a couple or for going with a friend/companion as many people tend to for meals/sport/leisure activity, £98 is just £2 shy of three digits, which isn’t affordable for a lot of people, especially in this current economic climate. 

 

 

Just to add also that ROH is quite “unique” among both U.K. and international venues that it has an awful lot of restricted view seats half blocked by rails, pillars and lamps that are over the £80 or even £100 mark. The theatre gets lots of complaints from first time buyers appalled that they paid over £90 or £100 for a seat where they couldn’t see half the stage. (I know where those seats are, and they never used to cost that much relative to all the other seats.)

 

I should add though, that if anyone has this restricted view problem with their seat and tells the head usher/front of house manager at the first opportunity, the staff are now really helpful at sorting out a seat with a better view. They can’t give you a Grand Tier seat if you only paid for upper slips, but they can find a similar priced seat where the view isn’t as bad. Perhaps they should just get rid of the bad restricted view seats or not offer them till the house is fully sold out, as many patrons actually don’t dare to complain or ask for help- they just don’t return at all, and spend their money somewhere else. So do ask for help.

 

I don’t think the quirky price rises in some of the middle priced or lower priced seats with issues (especially when they haven’t gone up for opera) are an accident. I think the management and finance staff, when trying to work out where to increase prices, have used an algorithm or software to analyse which seats always sell, and which sell the quickest. They’ve discovered that some cheaper seats that are uncomfortable/have limited sight lines (but not blocked by a giant object) seem to sell the quickest and the most reliably, so they have decided, “Aha! It must be a hot ticket or something!” and raised the prices of those stratospherically. It’s a bit like observing how the vegetables or bread that expire tomorrow are discounted 50% off at the supermarket so they sell the moment they go on the shelf, and concluding  you should triple their price because everyone is buying them, and ignoring the fact that they are popular because of the 50% off! Of course nobody will touch them at triple the price. I agree they should return to consistent pricing. (And if the prices quoted for Anemoi and Dante are what they are going to charge, I’m afraid there will be tons of empty seats.) 

 

For next season, it’s really essential to check the view and the picture of what the seat looks like before buying!  

 

 

 

Perhaps they should just knock down the building and rebuild it.

[bangorballetboy]

1 hour ago, Emeralds said:

Thanks for checking, JohnS! I reckon it is still possible to have 40% under £50 tickets for just Main Stage, non-schools matinees, non-Paul Hamlyn type special performances if they add up all the premieres, contemporary works, standing tickets.

 

 

 

I've just had a look at Aida and Wozzeck as they are on at the moment.  By my rough calculations, 41% of the tickets for Wozzeck (top price £160), and 36% for Aida (top price £230), are under £50.

[Jan McNulty]

Just as a comparison, and obviously exchange rates come into play, when I was looking at Zurich the top price tickets came in at around £175.

 

Also, not that I am sure but I believe it can be more expensive to watch a premiere league football match.

[Emeralds]

4 hours ago, Lizbie1 said:

 

I don't think you can in any way make a fair comparison of Wigmore Hall prices with ROH. The operating costs are on a completely different scale. RFH pricing is perhaps a closer comparison but there are more differences than similarities to ROH IMO (it's not a direct employer of an orchestra/chorus/corps de ballet for starters).

 

Also: we complain *a lot* about lower level Friends and non-Friends having slim pickings when booking for popular productions, but the WH is notorious for selling out completely before even lower level Friends get a sniff at certain dates. (It's also probably the least diverse audience I've ever seen, for which it never seems to attract the public criticism that ROH does.)

It wasn’t a comparison, Lizbie1- I was simply replying to the declaration/statement that ROH had made that attending the ROH (Main Stage shows, as they confirmed to JohnS, is an inexpensive night out compared to going elsewhere in the West End (by West End that would include Dominion Theatre, Barbican Centre, Sadler’s Wells, Wilton’s , Old Vic, Menier, Wigmore Hall, Shakespeare’s Globe and South Bank Centre, not just the theatres in WC2) but actually that’s not the case. 

 

I don’t actually mind ROH saying “we are expensive on the Main Stage (apart from new productions which can be much cheaper) because we are delivering productions with a high amount of artistic input of the highest quality” - call it what it is (emphasising the multidisciplinary nature of opera and ballet). The ROH should not feel coy about saying that they are expensive because they try to deliver, the best the world has, not just the best the U.K. has, and that’s why ticket prices are rising. But I don’t think they can or should claim that they are inexpensive or a bargain if they’re not. A more accurate and convincing declaration or statement would be to say that they aim to offer the highest quality at competitive prices for attendees. We don’t expect Garrard or Tiffany jewels to be sold at Argos prices, or a Rolls Royce to be as cheap as a Ford Focus, that’s clearly not possible, so the ROH marketing/PR teams shouldn’t try to compete with the less costly artistic venues, but to say “we can’t make it the cheapest ticket,  but we aim to offer you the best at as competitive a price as possible”. 

 

Not sure what diversity of an audience has to do with anything-people can’t help the skin colour they are born with! If lots of people from a certain demographic like something, why should they be pushed to see something else? If kathak fans like that dance form, why should they be made to watch Balanchine or Mozart if they don’t wish to? If one likes Petipa and Puccini, I don’t see the rap industry saying “you really ought to attend more rap concerts instead and not to watch only ballet and opera”. All the West End venues are welcoming. I don’t see Wigmore Hall treating my friends from different ethnic backgrounds differently- in fact, the staff are very welcoming and don’t make any audience members  feel different or excluded. 

Edited May 16, 2023 by Emeralds

[Emeralds]

4 hours ago, capybara said:

@Emeralds Several times recently, including your latest post, you have written as if you have quite detailed knowledge of the ROH’s administration. Is that the case, please?

I’m sorry if my concern (laced occasionally with sarcasm and despair) sound too convincing. No, I don’t work for ROH (if I did I’d have to refrain from taking part in these discussions). Of course, my suggestion that they use software or an algorithm is due to that simply being the easiest (it’s not difficult to write a programme to give you that information); many companies do it. It could easily be done with a pencil and paper too. 

 

Long long time ago, the box office staff themselves were the ones that told us where the bargain seats were- eg those with less leg room priced a little more cheaply, those which were uncomfortable benches but had a good enough view for certain shows (then told us which), etc etc  and that to make up for these flaws and inconveniences they were priced lower. But it seems now that the prices of these seats will be raised to increase income. 

 

Whether algorithm or pencil, whatever method they are or aren’t using, the message is that every seat and standing space will be maxed out next season to earn more income. At this point in time, unfortunately think that could have the opposite effect of not just not earning the increased income they hope for, but losing what they had in the first place. 

Edited May 16, 2023 by Emeralds

[Emeralds]

3 hours ago, Lizbie1 said:

 

By chance I've just been looking at the La Scala website and I would beg leave to differ!

I’m not rich enough to fly to Milan just to watch opera or ballet, but La Scala has never claimed to be cheap, a bargain nor competitively priced (at least in the languages I can read), other than having a long history and a formidable reputation. It’s simply an observation that compared to ROH, it’s much easier getting tickets for good seats in Paris (both opera houses), New York (both the Met and NY State Theater), Sydney, Singapore, Edinburgh, Prague, Barcelona - or indeed other theatres in Britain - without having to do extensive research on the theatre and seating first! 

[Lizbie1]

12 minutes ago, Emeralds said:

(by West End that would include Dominion Theatre, Barbican Centre, Sadler’s Wells, Wilton’s , Old Vic, Menier, Wigmore Hall, Shakespeare’s Globe and South Bank Centre, not just the theatres in WC2)

 

That's not a definition of the West End that I'm familiar with - I must be very out of touch. Some of them could be included by a broader definition (and the Dominion is definitely West End) but a few of them are definitely pushing it IMO! Where did you come by that list?

 

The point about diversity was in brackets because it was an aside, not part of my argument and it's probably best not to go down that rabbit hole. On the main point of comparing Wigmore Hall prices with ROH prices, the product isn't remotely similar - unless you're arguing that anything involving live classical music falls into one lump? - so I don't see how it's a valid argument to say "well the Wigmore Hall is cheaper", any more than it is to say that you could see a film in Leicester Square for less money.