Ongoing UK rail strike action thread

[Emeralds]

On 25/11/2022 at 18:23, alison said:

 

The lifts have been out of action recently: I don't know whether they still are?

The Green Park lifts for Jubilee line were working on Saturday, but just to let everyone know the station (and Kings Cross station also- the alternative switchover station for London Bridge train arrivals) is packed and Piccadilly Line platforms were even more crowded than at  rush hour. I didn’t get a chance to check the Piccadilly line lifts though.

 

NB Covent Garden station was also very crowded to get into and exit from (and that’s with some young commuters opting to take the stairs- even then the lift queues and the queues to get in were still jammed). I’ll be taking the bus from City Thameslink next time if Southeastern/Charing  Cross are out of action again. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Emeralds

[LinMM]

Yes but wasn’t there some sort of tube strike on Saturday? Coupled with the usual Christmas shopping rush etc so imagine that would have made it extra busy. Also the day after a strike can get extra busy too as people have to put things on hold for a day. 
London is always exceptionally busy generally speaking from the middle of November onwards most years and always try to avoid that junction at Oxford Circus in particular and find a way round on the back streets though around Covent Garden can be pretty horrendous from now on as well! 

Quite a few buses are also on diversions in the central London area at the moment for various ongoing (never ending) roadworks 
Always best to leave at least 30-40 mins extra for any journeys at the mo. 
 

 

[MJW]

There seemed to be some indication that things might be moving towards a deal - clearly nothing so far:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63867226

[bridiem]

In the meantime, the RMT has announced another train strike is to take place on Christmas Eve: the strike will take place from 6pm on Christmas Eve and last until 6am on 27th December.

[LinMM]

I know it’s a bit disappointing as yesterday it looked like things might be looking up and they might get cancelled but today it all seems to have gone downhill again 😥

Looks like the three day stint in London next week is back on! 

[Sim]

34 minutes ago, bridiem said:

In the meantime, the RMT has announced another train strike is to take place on Christmas Eve: the strike will take place from 6pm on Christmas Eve and last until 6am on 27th December.

That’s so cruel.  🤬😥

[alison]

Well, given that there are hardly any trains on Christmas Day and Boxing Day anyway, it may not make much difference. Are they just making a point?

[bangorballetboy]

Mick Lynch is really Mick Grinch

[JNC]

No Nutcrackers this year for me due to the rail strikes! Christmas doesn’t feel the same without that lovely Sugar Plum music…

 

I understand it’s all about being disruptive but for ordinary people who don’t have cars and just want/need to see family for Christmas it seems very unfair. I can see the rationale of hitting commuters as annoying as I personally find it but around Christmas feels like punishing the wrong people to make the wrong point. 
 

@alison the problem probably will be increased demand for reduced trains the days before and after the actual strike days as there are always knock on effects. People with mobility issues or other who need to book a seat will be unable to reserve one as in my experience even if the train is running the days before/after they cancel them due to increased demand. It’s usually standing room only, and that’s if you’re lucky - with Christmas luggage many people will be left behind on platforms.

[Lizbie1]

18 minutes ago, bangorballetboy said:

Mick Lynch is really Mick Grinch

 

He has been very clever about keeping a lot of the public onside (e.g. cancelling strikes for HMQ's funeral and when they clashed with Remembrance Day), but this feels like a mis-step.

[Dawnstar]

1 hour ago, JNC said:

the problem probably will be increased demand for reduced trains the days before and after the actual strike days as there are always knock on effects. People with mobility issues or other who need to book a seat will be unable to reserve one as in my experience even if the train is running the days before/after they cancel them due to increased demand.

 

That's what's worrying me about nexy week, when we're supposed to be coming back from York on 15th. Still awaiting timetable confirmation from LNER as to whether the train we have booked will even be running & if it is 2h20 of playing sardines is deeply unappealing. I can probably manage to stand for that long, if I don't have a panic attack, but I don't think my mother will be able to if we lose our seat reservations.

 

I really hope this latest announced strike doesn't get extended beyond 27th. If I can't get to London on 28th to see Dias/Richardson's only public performance I will be incredibly hacked off!

[MJW]

Details of upcoming timetables (subject to any further strike dates presumably):

 

The National Rail Enquiries Journey Planner is not yet showing the strike day services for the national industrial action dates. Timetables are expected to be showing the correct strike day service levels by the following dates:

• For travel from 12 to 16 December, the Journey Planner will be correct on 10 December
• For travel on 17 and 18 December, the Journey Planner will be correct on 14 December
• For travel on 24, 26 and 27 December, please check back here closer to the time of travel
• For travel on 3, 4, 6 and 7 January, please check back here closer to the time of travel

[alison]

2 hours ago, JNC said:

I understand it’s all about being disruptive but for ordinary people who don’t have cars and just want/need to see family for Christmas it seems very unfair. I can see the rationale of hitting commuters as annoying as I personally find it but around Christmas feels like punishing the wrong people to make the wrong point.

 

I couldn't agree more.  The upshot is now that I'm unlikely to see family before/at Christmas OR around my birthday, because the latter trip has been rescheduled until later in the month   There's not always next Christmas.

[DanJL]

Isn't it the case that trains usually stop running early on Christmas eve and don't start again until the 27th? There are no other strikes on Christmas week itself so it seems that they have deliberately kept that travel period clear. If they were on strike from 6am on the 24th that would be a different matter! 

[Lizbie1]

23 minutes ago, DanJL said:

Isn't it the case that trains usually stop running early on Christmas eve and don't start again until the 27th? There are no other strikes on Christmas week itself so it seems that they have deliberately kept that travel period clear. If they were on strike from 6am on the 24th that would be a different matter! 

 

But if so I don't understand their reasoning in announcing a strike for these dates - they would be causing little additional pain for the train operating companies while making themselves look like villains to some people who hitherto have been supportive.

[Jan McNulty]

47 minutes ago, DanJL said:

Isn't it the case that trains usually stop running early on Christmas eve and don't start again until the 27th? There are no other strikes on Christmas week itself so it seems that they have deliberately kept that travel period clear. If they were on strike from 6am on the 24th that would be a different matter! 

 

Am I missing something here?  I've just had a look at the National Rail website and strikes are not listed for over the Christmas period.  I can only assume that the "plan your journey" information relates not only to strike days but also to the Christmas bank holidays (including 27th December this year).

 

Our local train service has operated a limited service on Boxing Day for a few years now.

[DanJL]

36 minutes ago, Lizbie1 said:

 

But if so I don't understand their reasoning in announcing a strike for these dates - they would be causing little additional pain for the train operating companies while making themselves look like villains to some people who hitherto have been supportive.

I think it will affect planned engineering works so perhaps the idea is strike action that inconveniences the rail companies more than passengers? 

[DanJL]

13 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said:

 

Am I missing something here?  I've just had a look at the National Rail website and strikes are not listed for over the Christmas period.  I can only assume that the "plan your journey" information relates not only to strike days but also to the Christmas bank holidays (including 27th December this year).

 

Our local train service has operated a limited service on Boxing Day for a few years now.

Possibly the new information hasn't been added yet? 

 

I hadn't realised that about Boxing Day services - a bit more effect than I realised then. 

[Jan McNulty]

1 minute ago, DanJL said:

Possibly the new information hasn't been added yet? 

 

I hadn't realised that about Boxing Day services - a bit more effect than I realised then. 

 

I've just seen the news about this extra Christmas strike.  

 

6 minutes ago, DanJL said:

I think it will affect planned engineering works so perhaps the idea is strike action that inconveniences the rail companies more than passengers? 

 

Of course, if engineering works are disrupted or over-run it has a knock on effect on the train services.

 

I can't comment on all the rail services but on Mersey Rail services on Christmas Eve end around 8pm and there has been a very limited service on Boxing Day (so people can get to the sales!).  Usually an extra Bank Holiday such as 27th would have a Sunday service.

[LinMM]

On Radio 4 this morning Mike Lynch said they had added the extra strike because the Rail Companies were going to start implementing changes which are under dispute anyway without consent from December 15th. 
This does sound like a very provocative move on the part of the Rail Companies who are also prevented from making improved offers by the Government (apparently) 

I have to say I stopped travelling on Christmas Eve years ago when in between cars etc. as can’t remember exactly when but trains started stopping earlier and earlier that evening. So unless could travel by about 2pm always went the day before when visiting family etc. 

These days down here in Brighton on Southern Rail and Thameslink there are ALWAYS engineering works going on over the Christmas and New Year so not very conducive to travelling. 
However there has always been a sort of Sunday service (albeit a tad unreliable) though on Boxing Day. 
And it’s usually a Sunday service on any bank holidays. It just depends how much you enjoy a replacement bus service for part of your journey …sometimes as much as half of it! 
But this extra action over Christmas will still affect things a little more than usual. 
Even if you do generally support the action (and I do) it doesn’t mean you can’t also feel annoyed about the effects on occasions especially when going on for so long! 

[serenade]

11 hours ago, Lizbie1 said:

 

He has been very clever about keeping a lot of the public onside (e.g. cancelling strikes for HMQ's funeral and when they clashed with Remembrance Day), but this feels like a mis-step.

I agree.  Literally all people want is not to have their Christmas ruined especially after the last 2 years of complete misery we have all been through.

 

I'm travelling home on Christmas Eve, luckily on the morning.  Usually I travel back to London on the 27th as I need to get back for work so anyone who does that trip- at least the Scotland-London LNER route knows it's often jam packed on the 27th so although their strike is finishing early in the morning there's still the knock on effect.   I think they should have picked other dates if they want public support but I guess they're the experts 😂

 

Next year I am going to do driving lessons so at least I could rent a car, I have had too many things ruined this year because of the strikes and I can only see it continuing or getting worse next year to be honest.

Edited December 6, 2022 by serenade

[postie]

3 hours ago, DanJL said:

Isn't it the case that trains usually stop running early on Christmas eve and don't start again until the 27th? There are no other strikes on Christmas week itself so it seems that they have deliberately kept that travel period clear. If they were on strike from 6am on the 24th that would be a different matter! 

 

Indeed. As per previous strike actions, it avoids as much public inconvenience as possible while exercising a legal right i.e. the Remembrance period, major sporting events, etc.

 

 

[Jan McNulty]

7 hours ago, serenade said:

 

Next year I am going to do driving lessons so at least I could rent a car, I have had too many things ruined this year because of the strikes and I can only see it continuing or getting worse next year to be honest.

 

If you are using LNER at least you haven't got the Avanti fiasco to deal with too!

 

The trouble is that when you hear about the changes the rail companies want to impose you have to start worrying about public safety too.  This is not only about aiming for a bigger pay rise it is about the changes to working practises too.  From a member of the public point of view that is what worries me the most.

[Dawnstar]

I don't understand why not having guards seems to be considered a big sticking point. The trains I take to/from London, both Great Northern & Thameslink, don't have guards, & haven't had them for as long as I can remember, & it never seems to cause problems. So why is not having guards apparently a safety issue on other trains?

[Jan McNulty]

3 minutes ago, Dawnstar said:

I don't understand why not having guards seems to be considered a big sticking point. The trains I take to/from London, both Great Northern & Thameslink, don't have guards, & haven't had them for as long as I can remember, & it never seems to cause problems. So why is not having guards apparently a safety issue on other trains?

 

It's not only the guards - they want to change the drivers' working conditions to enforce them to work rest days and accept mandatory overtime.  As far as I am concerned driving a train is as responsible a job as piloting a plane or driving a coach.  Would you want someone to drive a train you are on who might fall asleep at the train equivalent of a wheel? 

 

What happens if someone becomes seriously ill on your train?  Does the driver stop it to come and attend the individual?

[Dawnstar]

Yes, I can understand why drivers are against that. It's just the guards issue that I don't understand, so if anyone could explain that I'd be interested to know.

[Jan McNulty]

8 minutes ago, Jan McNulty said:

 

 

What happens if someone becomes seriously ill on your train?  Does the driver stop it to come and attend the individual?

 

6 minutes ago, Dawnstar said:

Yes, I can understand why drivers are against that. It's just the guards issue that I don't understand, so if anyone could explain that I'd be interested to know.

 

I've been on a couple of trains over the years where someone has taken seriously ill and the guard came to help and coordinate with the driver about the course of action to take...

[Dawnstar]

Sorry, when I posted my query your 2nd paragraph wasn't showing up. I can't recall ever seeing someone taken ill on a train so I'm not sure what would happen in that circumstance. Occasionally when there's been a train fault the driver has got out & looked at it, but then I assume that would happen whether or not there was a guard.

[Mary]

Not all trains and routes are the same though. Short commuter journeys are one thing :  longer haul or multi-stop routes, routes in more remote areas, especially those where stations have no staff-  all sorts of variations- make guards more necessary.

 

 

 

[AnneL]

Today I returned my tickets for the Nutcracker for the 14th - very disappointed. But just a point for those discussing drivers - it’s not their union that’s on strike this time. Personally I am unhappy about the government’s & employers’ proposal that ticket offices should be closed. Next week Southeastern are introducing a new timetable with a lot of spin about how much better it will be, when as far as I can work out, the service will be far worse. 

[LinMM]

The thing is we may get used to not seeing guards on some trains but that doesn’t mean it’s a step forward. Once the doors kept sticking on a new Thameslink train a couple of years back and every time the poor driver had to go dashing down the train to sort the individual doors out! By the time we got to Gatwick I guess enough was enough and the train got cancelled from there. If there had been a guard we would probably have got to London at least!! 
As one of the advanced economies in the World we don’t seem to be doing a very good job of supporting public services….about as much as I should say before going off on a political rant!! 

[AnneL]

Yes, at the end of the day staff are needed to run a safe and decent service. I have a disabled friend who has no end of adventures and difficulties with the train companies’ accessibility arrangements! 

[alison]

 

6 hours ago, Dawnstar said:

I don't understand why not having guards seems to be considered a big sticking point. The trains I take to/from London, both Great Northern & Thameslink, don't have guards, & haven't had them for as long as I can remember, & it never seems to cause problems. So why is not having guards apparently a safety issue on other trains?

 

It varies a lot from place to place.  For example, at some stations the platforms are on a curve, which means that the driver can't actually see all the doors of a train, and whether it's safe to pull away.  For that, you might need a guard, who can get off the train and check.  There was a situation a few years ago down one of my routes where - I can't remember now whether it was a fatality or a life-changing injury - but railway professionals seemed pretty convinced that it wouldn't have happened if there had been a guard on the train because he/she would have spotted the person concerned before the accident happened.  Yes, there are mirrors, but they may not always be effective.

 

5 hours ago, Mary said:

Not all trains and routes are the same though. Short commuter journeys are one thing :  longer haul or multi-stop routes, routes in more remote areas, especially those where stations have no staff-  all sorts of variations- make guards more necessary.

 

Yes, on the dreaded trip back from Southampton's Mayflower Theatre where the one-but-last train, my last possible connection, was cancelled and I needed arrangements to be made for onward transport from Clapham Junction there was nobody patrolling the train.  There should have been, and someone should have been available for passengers to speak to so that alternative transport could be sorted out.  There wasn't, and consequently I had a hugely stressful time at CJ after the last train had gone, trying to find someone to authorise a taxi for me.

 

3 hours ago, AnneL said:

Yes, at the end of the day staff are needed to run a safe and decent service. I have a disabled friend who has no end of adventures and difficulties with the train companies’ accessibility arrangements! 

 

Oh yes, Southern's notorious "give us 24 hours' notice if you want to travel and we'll send someone to the station to sort it", which I hope no longer applies.  But yes, if there's nobody manning the station how does the wheelchair ramp get to the relevant door?