Working abroad

[Tony Ballet Dad]

Hi everyone. Just joined the group and wondering if anyone can help with something. 
My daughter has been offered a short term contract with a company in France. 
The forms they require completing mention sending an “A1 Form”, (which shows you are ‘affiliated to the National Insurance system in the UK’) and therefore would not pay into the social security in France. When trying to apply for one through HMRC it seems she has to be already employed or self employed in the UK. Has anyone else come across this? How have you dealt with it? Can anyone clarify the requirements?

Many thanks

 

[Jan McNulty]

Hello Tony Ballet Dad and welcome to the Forum!

 

I suspect that this issue did not apply pre-Brexit but hopefully some of our members will be able to advise.

 

I thought that everyone had to be registered within the National Insurance system from the age of 16 these days.  Certainly my nieces were issued with NI numbers (and they are 31 and 29) from when they were 16.

Edited April 9, 2022 by Jan McNulty
Edited to correct detail

[Pixiewoo]

Both my children were sent a NI number through the post just before they turned 16. You used to be sent a little plastic card to keep, but now it is just a piece of paper!

 

I can't help on the 'A1' form though, sorry. Good luck

 

[Tony Ballet Dad]

2 hours ago, Jan McNulty said:

Hello Tony Ballet Dad and welcome to the Forum!

 

I suspect that this issue did not apply pre-Brexit but hopefully some of our members will be able to advise.

 

I thought that everyone had to be registered within the National Insurance system from birth these days.  Certainly my nieces were issued with NI numbers (and they are 31 and 29) from when their births were registered.

Thanks Jan, yeah we do have. NI number…. so I think that shows ‘affiliation’, but as she is not employed ( or self-employed) in UK, she is not actually paying any contributions. The application for an A1 form seems to be requesting details of employer of your own ‘self employment details. 
hopefully someone in the group will have had this experience in the last couple of years (yes, it appears to be since Brexit)

thank you x

[Mumofballetmaddaughter]

As far as I'm aware (although I'm not 100% sure) the A1 form is proof that an individual is making or has made NI contributions to HMRC and therefore wouldn't have to pay again when working overseas. My husband is self employed and works mainly in Europe (although often world wide) but makes additional contributions to HMRC to ensure he doesn't need to pay again in whichever country he is working in. Congratulations by the way on your daughter's contract and hope you manage to get things sorted and everything goes well for her.

[2dancersmum]

I've no direct experience of the A1 form but it sounds to me like your daughter will need to be registered as self employed  as it reads as if an A1 form is if you are already employed in the UK and being sent abroad on a temporary basis by employer or if you are self employed. If your daughter is self-employed, it means she herself is her business and on the tax return at the end of the year she will enter details of the company she worked for in France and pay etc and HMRC will ask her to pay NI contributions on those earnings. My daughter, registered self-employed, has done several contracts for a UK company but abroad and that is how it worked for her - though as I say a UK company and it was before Brexit

[Tony Ballet Dad]

17 hours ago, 2dancersmum said:

I've no direct experience of the A1 form but it sounds to me like your daughter will need to be registered as self employed  as it reads as if an A1 form is if you are already employed in the UK and being sent abroad on a temporary basis by employer or if you are self employed. If your daughter is self-employed, it means she herself is her business and on the tax return at the end of the year she will enter details of the company she worked for in France and pay etc and HMRC will ask her to pay NI contributions on those earnings. My daughter, registered self-employed, has done several contracts for a UK company but abroad and that is how it worked for her - though as I say a UK company and it was before Brexit

Thank you for your reply. 
Seems like we may go down the self-employed route. 
(can a person be self-employed AND employed at the same time… for example if they get a longer contract later down the line?

[Horsellian]

15 minutes ago, Tony Ballet Dad said:

can a person be self-employed AND employed at the same time… for example if they get a longer contract later down the line?

Yes, you can be both employed and self-employed at the same time, my DH is, and has been for many years.

[Tony Ballet Dad]

4 hours ago, Horsellian said:

Yes, you can be both employed and self-employed at the same time, my DH is, and has been for many years.

Awesome. 
thanks for your reply. 

[2dancersmum]

sorry for the delay, as Horsellian replies - yes you can be both employed and self employed at the same time. As I mentioned before, the unfortunate part of being self employed is the need to fill in a tax return every year - but in that you enter any self-employed earnings/expenses for the year and the PAYE earrnings will show on your account too so that the tax office gets an overall income for the year