JNC Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, bridiem said: The discussion about marketing and ticket prices last year also got into the papers (and Twitter) and no-one was banned. This problem is entirely of the ROH's own making. Quite. If they don’t want the bad press they should have held back some (more) tickets. (I am still confused as to whether there will actually be tickets available now today...) the email push that went out with the ‘sell out to friends like you’ also seems ill advised if they didn’t want it to go public! Any one of thousands of friends could have shared their concerns with the press so I wouldn’t worry @Dawnstar! And banning ‘whistleblowers’ (ie those with valid concerns/questions over accessibility and curious about ROH policies) would certainly not look good for ROH!! I am pleased the press coverage has happened. This highlights the importance of availability of tickets for all - for a time I wondered if I should resign myself to the fact that friends may get all tickets going forward for population production but glad to see the push back on this. Edited October 23, 2019 by JNC 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnS Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Congratulations penelopesimpson and others for raising this issue and pushing for full responses. I hope you are successful in getting full answers and securing changes so that further Forza/Fidelio/Ring Cycle shenanigans are avoided. Not good for the Royal Opera House and the confused/conflicting information and partial answers are spectacular own goals. I recall some time back the ROH conducted some research on why people took out Friends’ membership and my impression was that they wanted to push the philanthropic advantages but the reality was that Friends paid for membership in order to secure priority booking. But priority booking and access to performances by the general public are not mutually exclusive. The ROH knows well what performances are going to be in very high demand and should be able to limit the numbers of tickets available to Friends. I think there may be difficulties in ensuring that 20% of tickets for all performances are available for the general public (there were only 4 Netrebko/Kaufman performances in the Forza run and if Friends were limited to just 2 tickets for that run of 4 performances, I think there’s a possibility that most seats could be sold before public booking - I thought there were several 1,000 Patrons/Friends) but a great deal more needs to be done. And the ROH should state explicitly what its policy is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 Precisely JohnS. Those of us who love opera and ballet fully respect the need for ROH to sell privileged access through Friends and Patrons schemes. We accept that these people are providing invaluable financial support and deserve some real goodies in return. BUT you simply cannot spend millions building coffee shops to demonstrate that opera is not elitist, whilst at the same time allowing certain productions to be restricted access. This is sounding a bit like what I’d be saying to Harry and Meghan if they asked me why their PRis so bad, but you get the drift! What is so sad about this spectacular own goal is that it really didn’t need to happen and ROH will not have gained anything from it other than a black eye. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 The troubles of the ‘new’ ROH website (see discussions elsewhere on the Forum) are not helping matters. This morning - using super-privileged, elite, Friends membership - I have just checked on the ticket situation. At the moment (just past 7am) every performance except one shows some (limited and expensive but still) availability on the main page for this production: https://www.roh.org.uk/tickets-and-events/fidelio-by-tobias-kratzer-dates But clicking through to buy tickets reveals that no tickets at all are available for any show in the run. Not for the first time, the ROH website is contradicting itself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 Well, guess what - Alex Beard's statement that 'we have held seats for Fidelio across all dates and price ranges which will be released for public booking tomorrow', turned out to be a mirage. At 09.01 I found 5 tickets for the first night and nothing else at all! Two other nights showed there were 2 tickets in Balcony and Stalls respectively, but clicking on revealed there were no tickets. Well, well, well. Here we go again. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I've spent the last 15 minutes wandering around the Fidelio page of the website & various tickets have been popping up. I wouldn't say hundreds but up to about 20 per performance. Mostly £100+ but a couple of SCS tickets did briefly show up for one performance. So they evidently have held some back, in contradiction of what I was told yesterday but not the levels they are quoted as in that Telegraph article either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 Well, I've found a few but certainly not 20 per performance. And did you try clicking on them to see if they existed? I did, and there was nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangorballetboy Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Have you ever thought that other people may just be quicker than you? And don't forget the booking page will say nothing is available if tickets are in people's baskets but not yet bought, but the landing page will still say tickets are available until those tickets in baskets are actually bought (and this is the same with most booking systems, including things like Ticketmaster). 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Even when I got in the queue before booking opened, there were still 1400 people ahead of me. Is it not possible that some of them snapped up some of those tickets before you got there? (As they probably did with all the ballet standing I was hoping for). After all, with all the additional publicity, possibly more people will have been alert to the fact that it was public booking than might normally be the case. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Perregrino Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) it's 9.45 and there are tickets available for all performances of Fidelio. Starting price GBP 55. i bought one so i'll be able to hear what people are raving about....... i also just got a ticket for the Insight on 24/2 so by the time i hear the performance i'll have a better idea what to listen for. Edited October 24, 2019 by prs59 additional information 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 26 minutes ago, penelopesimpson said: Well, I've found a few but certainly not 20 per performance. And did you try clicking on them to see if they existed? I did, and there was nothing. Yes, I did go into the seating plans & checked there were seats showing. (Obviously I didn't actually try to buy any tickets, as I don't want one.) This was at a few minutes after nine, at 9.01 I wasn't getting any showing up, so maybe they were a bit late releasing them or did a bit of drip-feeding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNC Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I’m not sure of ticket availability today as I wasn’t able to be online at 9am. What I will say is that it’s good that some tickets are available. Without knowing exactly how many though it’s difficult to say if there were enough - if only 20 a performance I would say no (this perhaps tallies with 100 tickets only being released for La Forza)... What I will add is tickets starting at £55 is not great. When I talk about ticket availability for the general public I think tickets should be available across all (mainly cheaper) price ranges. Keeping back some more expensive tickets is not really helpful in my opinion, £55 is out of my price range, and it would be for others too. (But perhaps others will argue we don’t want to go enough if we don’t have £55 to spare...I don’t think it’s that simple but hey ho.) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, JNC said: What I will add is tickets starting at £55 is not great. When I talk about ticket availability for the general public I think tickets should be available across all (mainly cheaper) price ranges. Keeping back some more expensive tickets is not really helpful in my opinion, £55 is out of my price range, and it would be for others too. (But perhaps others will argue we don’t want to go enough if we don’t have £55 to spare...I don’t think it’s that simple but hey ho.) I did spot a pair of £22 stalls circle standing tickets pop up briefly for one performance of Fidelio (although I think £22 is too high a price for having to stand through a reasonably long opera!). I've just emailed the ROH again asking why they told me no tickets were being held back but told the Telegraph there were "hundreds". Whatever policy they have adopted about holding or not holding tickets back I feel they should at least be telling everyone the same thing. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 8 minutes ago, prs59 said: it's 9.45 and there are tickets available for all performances of Fidelio. Starting price GBP 55. i bought one so i'll be able to hear what people are raving about....... i also just got a ticket for the Insight on 24/2 so by the time i hear the performance i'll have a better idea what to listen for. I'm sorry to contradict you but there are not any tickets available and I have been on constantly since booking opened. Several of the nights show 'last few tickets remaining' and Tickets available, but when you go to purchase, they are not there. To those who think I have the speed of a tortoise on the internet, when I signed in, I was 128 in the queue. So, presuming all those people bought two tickets and there were between 20-30 left when I got my chance, that would mean there was a total of 286 tickets available across all six nights. I can assure you that national newspapers do not print articles without checking their facts. They certainly do not rush into print on the say-so of one person who is pursuing what she sees as an important issue. A great deal of telephoning and checking will have gone on behind the scenes. I I have my tickets for Fidelio. I am doing this because I feel that what is happening is wrong and that the principal needs to be established regarding the ticketing policy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNC Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Yes I agree @penelopesimpson - thank you for following this up. Same to you @Dawnstar. All of these mixed messages need to be clarified once and for all! Re the website - I’ve had issues with where you click through to tickets. You click on the ticket. I will immediately click ‘add to basket’ and then it tells me it can’t process my request because the ticket is not available. I go through this again...this time with fewer choices of tickets...third time lucky! Speaking as someone who is relatively quick off the mark (subject to internet speeds which I think are reasonable but not super fast) they literally disappear before your eyes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penelopesimpson Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 JNC there are four tickets £39- 54) showing for the last night if you are quick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, JNC said: What I will add is tickets starting at £55 is not great. When I talk about ticket availability for the general public I think tickets should be available across all (mainly cheaper) price ranges. Keeping back some more expensive tickets is not really helpful in my opinion, £55 is out of my price range, and it would be for others too. (But perhaps others will argue we don’t want to go enough if we don’t have £55 to spare...I don’t think it’s that simple but hey ho.) As I suspected, the £55 is the first "proper" seat price, discounting the slips - i.e. the front side amphi seats With the ROH's re-pricing, I now no longer have any idea what is a viable price for anything, particularly opera. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, alison said: As I suspected, the £55 is the first "proper" seat price, discounting the slips - i.e. the front side amphi seats With the ROH's re-pricing, I now no longer have any idea what is a viable price for anything, particularly opera. Have they reduced the prices slightly? When I booked, the lowest “proper” seat prices were £39 (rear amphi) and £57 (side front amphi), apart from the 5 very restricted view seats at the very rear of the amphi which were £22. There were no seats at £54 or £55. Edited October 24, 2019 by Bluebird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alison Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Yes, I wondered. The PDF says £57. Thanks for the reminder that there are cheaper seats than side amphi at the rear - even if I can't sit in any of them! Of course, some at least of the public allocation will have gone on the package bookings, presumably? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Perregrino Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 57 minutes ago, Bluebird said: Have they reduced the prices slightly? When I booked, the lowest “proper” seat prices were £39 (rear amphi) and £57 (side front amphi), apart from the 5 very restricted view seats at the very rear of the amphi which were £22. There were no seats at £54 or £55. apologies for my typo GBP 57 not GBP 55. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebird Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, prs59 said: apologies for my typo GBP 57 not GBP 55. Thank you for the clarification. An earlier post had also quoted a lower price (£54) so I couldn’t help but wonder if the prices had been adjusted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNC Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I have gone back to ROH customer services with five questions: 1. I have asked them to confirm the number or percentage/proportion of tickets that were available to be bought today for general booking. 2. I have asked them to confirm their policy (if they have one) about the availability of tickets for the general public on booking day (ie how many/what proportion of tickets at held back, if any). 3. I have asked them to make explicit on their website the possibility that productions could sell out to friends (excluding Friday Rush) if that is a possibly going forward. 4. I asked if a cap was put in place on the number of tickets people could buy, and if not why. 5. I asked what action they are taking about resold tickets - including screenshots from some on sale at viagogo as an example. It will be interesting to see if they give a more detailed response that answers the above questions or not (and if that contradicts any earlier statements). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scheherezade Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 This really is turning into ROH-gate, isn't it, with the axe falling more on the denials and contradictions than what may or may not initially have been done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuthE Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 57 minutes ago, Scheherezade said: This really is turning into ROH-gate, isn't it, with the axe falling more on the denials and contradictions than what may or may not initially have been done. And it speaks pretty well of ROH regulars, at least those of us on this forum, that we aren't TRYING to buy up all the tickets for ourselves or to sell on to our friends. We're challenging unfairness in the process because we WANT members of the general taxpaying public to be able to access popular productions. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizbie1 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, RuthE said: And it speaks pretty well of ROH regulars, at least those of us on this forum, that we aren't TRYING to buy up all the tickets for ourselves or to sell on to our friends. We're challenging unfairness in the process because we WANT members of the general taxpaying public to be able to access popular productions. Yes - I was interested to learn from Rupert Christiansen in the Telegraph that this has all happened because Friends are “constantly angry” and “always complaining that they don’t get enough access to tickets”! Edited October 24, 2019 by Lizbie1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninamargaret Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Without going into the rights and wrongs of the whole mess, I think a problem is that the ROH, and other theatres, need large numbers of Patrons, Friends whatever to swell their coffers. Inevitably, the more that give this support, the more tickets and benefits they want, and can justifiably expect. If I was a Patron paying several grand a year I would be pretty miffed not to be able to get tickets because some were being held back for the general public. You would have to be a particularly generous minded patron to say 'I don't mind foregoing my ticket so that Joe Bloggs can have it'. Some years ago the Donmar closed its' Supporters list because too many people wanted priority tickets - a very honest action, but I can't,see the ROH doing that. But I totally agree that greater transparency on the part of the ROH is needed, and a clear policy should be stated and adhered to. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zxDaveM Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I think it's the lack of clarity and transparency that is bugging most people, as much as the fact that lots of money lets you jump the queue, so to speak. The fine speeches and new cafes declaring non-elitism doesn't tie in with people paying thousands to ensure they get the tickets they want (which I don't have that much of a problem with - as that is life and all that). Tax payers (via the Arts Council) make demands that they should have access to tickets too, as they do pay a subsidy. The resolution of this clash of aims, is where the rub lies, and where ROH seem to be letting themselves down - with everyone. They need a practical, and clear, policy in place that everyone can understand, even if that means at times you may feel frozen out. At least you'll know why then 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnS Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I’m sure the ROH has in the past operated limits on the number of tickets that Patrons/Friends can purchase for the most popular performances and the limit varied depending on the level of membership. I don’t recall there being an outcry from Patrons/Friends that the limits were too restrictive, depriving them of their right to purchase all the tickets they wanted. And if tickets were available at General Booking and Patrons/Friends wanted extra tickets, they were able to join the queue. That seems fairer to me but as I said earlier, if there are just 4 performances (the Netrebko/Kaufmann Forza), then even with Patrons/Friends limits operating, there may be pretty restricted availability come general booking. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capybara Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 hour ago, JohnS said: I’m sure the ROH has in the past operated limits on the number of tickets that Patrons/Friends can purchase for the most popular performances and the limit varied depending on the level of membership. I don’t recall there being an outcry from Patrons/Friends that the limits were too restrictive, depriving them of their right to purchase all the tickets they wanted. There was something of an outcry about 3 years ago or more. Some Friends felt that the booking limits were too restrictive but I don't recall anyone suggesting that Patrons and Friends (for whom there are limits!) should have any "right to purchase all the tickets they wanted" ! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizbie1 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 5 minutes ago, capybara said: Patrons and Friends (for whom there are limits!) But only, I think, the standard 9 tickets per performance? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnS Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 I’m afraid I’m struggling with knowing what restrictions I have on purchasing tickets as a Premium 2 Friend other than for Rehearsals where restrictions are very clear. I don’t see ROH limits on the numbers of packages or tickets I could purchase but I may well be missing something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizbie1 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 When I asked the box office whether there would be a limit for the Fonteyn gala (I thought there ought to be but couldn't find any mention), they sent the following reply: "There will not be an additional ticket limit in place for this performance therefore the usual ticket limit of 9 tickets per person will apply." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnstar Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) Is the general 9 tickets limit only per performance or is it per production? If, for instance, someone wanted to buy one ticket for all 16 performances of the current run of Manon would that be allowed? Edited October 24, 2019 by Dawnstar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now