ROH autumn public booking 2019

[alison]

Quoting Bruce's post as it's relevant here too:

 

36 minutes ago, Bruce Wall said:

I had a smooth purchase on the ROH site this morning for a large number of tickets for which I was keenly grateful - although I don't remember spending quite so much in the past.  (I see that as a good thing.  So much to choose from and so much I'm eager to see.) 

 

My purchases went smoothly this morning, too, although like Bruce I don't remember spending so much in the past - and certainly not on so few tickets!  I couldn't get nearly everything I wanted, either - although that's partly due to the fact that tickets I might have bought in the past are now outside my budget - so I'll keep my eyes open nearer the time for the "missing" performances.

 

I do find it frustrating, though, having to remember to allow an extra "safety" 5 minutes to do the credit card details by hand each time - I was on-site for around an hour in total, and quite frankly couldn't be bothered to go round and do it all again for a third time.

[Rob S]

I can hardly believe I bought so many Stalls Circle Standing places 😮

[Dawnstar]

I had a look this morning at a few performances where I hadn't been able to get what I wanted during the Friends booking, expecting there to be more availability because of the extra 20% of tickets. However none of the performances I checked seemed to have any more tickets available than last night. I am very puzzled by this. Can anyone who has been looking at both Friends & public booking for a while confirm if there are usually visibly more tickets available when the latter opens?

[alison]

4 minutes ago, Rob S said:

I can hardly believe I bought so many Stalls Circle Standing places 😮

 

Oh, it's all your fault, is it?  I was going to say there were hardly any left, except in some cases the most restricted ones nearest to the stage.

 

I held off buying any rear amphi standing until we have any clarification as to whether the Powers That Be have acted on the complaints about the effect of having to pay a £4 admin fee to return a £5 ticket.

[bangorballetboy]

38 minutes ago, Dawnstar said:

I had a look this morning at a few performances where I hadn't been able to get what I wanted during the Friends booking, expecting there to be more availability because of the extra 20% of tickets. However none of the performances I checked seemed to have any more tickets available than last night. I am very puzzled by this. Can anyone who has been looking at both Friends & public booking for a while confirm if there are usually visibly more tickets available when the latter opens?

 

Don't know about the main stage but we were able to get tickets for insight events that were sold out back on premium 2 friends booking day.

[ElleC]

2 minutes ago, bangorballetboy said:

 

Don't know about the main stage but we were able to get tickets for insight events that were sold out back on premium 2 friends booking day.

That's really odd because I couldn't get any of the insights - all showing as "sold out" and I was online  and through the "queue" within 2 minutes - all very frustrating.  And it seems ludicrous that these are sold out at your level of booking, BBB - just who DOES manage to get all these seats, then???  Equally, when I have managed to get a ticket, there are so often a lot of empty seats (on average around 10-15 each time) dotted around, which I find absolutely infuriating …  Feeling very grumpy about the whole thing, I'm afraid.  :-(

[alison]

Having carefully applied my filter for the autumn booking period, I went onto the Ballet Studio Live page (for a January date), only to find that booking doesn't open for that until sometime in October, which I guess is probably the (public) Winter booking date.  So what was it doing in the Autumn selection, then?!

 

(And I still hate those filters - they take far too long to scroll up and down, or you risk overrunning whatever it is you want.  Plus you can get to the "bottom" of the page, think that's everything and then find more events loading after that, which you might miss out on if you weren't careful)

[RHowarth]

I was surprised I managed to get stalls circle standing for both Sleeping Beauties I wanted. I normally don't even bother looking for them when public booking opens as I'd got used to not being able to find any. 

[Dawnstar]

1 hour ago, bangorballetboy said:

 

Don't know about the main stage but we were able to get tickets for insight events that were sold out back on premium 2 friends booking day.

 

I was looking at main stage performances rather than Insight events. I never go to the latter as I don't feel I can justify a trip to London for them.

[SusanR]

I haven't bought any tickets! The cheap stalls circle seats are now ridiculously expensive. Looks like I will have to rely on the live relays at the cinema. So disappointed with ROH.

[LinMM]

Sometimes Dawnstar ...but not always...the insights run quite early so you can then follow on with a performance the same evening. There was a Romeo and Juliet insight that was followed by a performance.... so may be worth checking.

As I was in London I called in person to the box office ...didn't get there till 11 expecting to see some long snaking queue and there were only about ten people there.

I only booked for Manon and the triple but got the performances I wanted and end of row seats in the Amphi which I like! So in and out very quickly without all the hard work online!!

Still haven't booked Beauty as just cannot decide which cast to see  🤔 

 

[zxDaveM]

the pre-performance Insights (there are a few for Sleeping Beauty in the autumn for example) are usually just chat. The full Insights dedicated to a production, run from 7.30pm to about 9pm tops, and has a rehearsal element in it (which is obviously the big draw). Fortunately, they do seem to be streaming most of these nowadays, which is always better than nothing (though can't beat being there)

[Dawnstar]

5 hours ago, LinMM said:

Sometimes Dawnstar ...but not always...the insights run quite early so you can then follow on with a performance the same evening. There was a Romeo and Juliet insight that was followed by a performance.... so may be worth checking.

 

I did have a look but they all seem to be mid week, so even the ones that could be fitted in before a performance aren't before any of the performances I'm going to, as I'm mostly booked for Friday/Saturday performances.

[LinMM]

Okay a shame sometimes it works sometimes not. 

Events on Fridays are the worse for me as am usually in London mid week most weeks and don't mind sometimes coming up again on a Saturday ( for matiness etc)and  it's cheaper to travel on Saturdays and Sunday's but usually have to miss anything on a Monday or Friday!  

[J_New]

As Manon doesn't seem to be selling very well, do people think that there might be offers nearer the time? I'm trying to decide whether to buy seats for a friend now, or wait and see what comes up!

 

Jacky

[Minxette]

Please can someone open a thread on Spring 2020 Booking as casting is up for Swan Lake and Onegin.

[bangorballetboy]

2 minutes ago, Minxette said:

Please can someone open a thread on Spring 2020 Booking as casting is up for Swan Lake and Onegin.

 

Swan Lake and Onegin are in the Winter booking period and there’s a thread about that here.  

 

Just a reminder that members are free to start threads as they wish (within AUP of course), except in the links forum.

[JNC]

10 hours ago, J_New said:

As Manon doesn't seem to be selling very well, do people think that there might be offers nearer the time? I'm trying to decide whether to buy seats for a friend now, or wait and see what comes up!

 

Jacky

 

I personally wouldn't wait. Others who have been going to ROH longer may be able to provide more info but over the last year/year and a half I haven't seen any offers for any ROH productions. 

 

If ROH productions don't sell well, ROH offer £10 tickets to students as part of their standby scheme, which shifts quite a few. Usually they are offered the day before, but sometimes they can be offered for performances a week or so in advance if sales are that bad. I think this is the preferred approach as the ROH get to increase their 'sold x tickets for under £20 or whatever' statistic is, putting a positive spin on it and also benefitting those with less means. Doing special offers I think looks a bit desperate and worrying re reputation/finances and I just don't see ROH wanting to give that impression. 

 

In the past year for ballet, the only productions that have not sold out for every production (from my own memory rather than actual statistics so this may be wrong!) have been Frankenstein and the Two Pigeons mixed bill. People thought Romeo and Juliet and Don Quixote wouldn't sell but a lot of people got tickets a month or so in advance. Ok, Manon may be less popular due to being in the rep relatively recently, but a lot of people don't buy tickets until a few weeks before so I expect to see a lot more tickets sold around September. This is probably exacerbated by the fact it's now summer so a lot of people may be away and spending money on summer holidays. Come September with routines back I expect a lot more tickets to shift. 

 

In short, if you are definitely going to go, want to see a particular cast (or can only make certain dates) or get 'best value' seats (i.e. best seats in a certain price band) I would book now. If you aren't fussed about seeing a particular cast and or going on a certain day or missing it altogether if an offer doesn't materialise then by all means wait and see. But I think you'll find a lot of tickets will shift in September (maybe not at sell at rates but it also depends where you want to sit) and I highly doubt Manon will sell less than Frankenstein despite it being on recently. Others may disagree! 

 

Worst case scenario, you buy tickets now and they do an offer down the line - you can pat yourself on the back for supporting the ROH/Royal Ballet, and you can treat yourself to an extra performance at the cheaper price if you feel like then you will still have benefitted in some way! 

 

EDIT - I do note that actually I now remember there was a special offer for Bright Stream this month. However I believe all of what I say above still stands as this offer only went out to ROH members/friends so I was only aware of it because a kindly person posted it on this forum (the post should still be in the special ticket offers section if you want exact details). So it wasn't intended to be a public offer for all. Also most/all of the cheaper tickets had gone anyway so you were still looking to spend a significant amount anyway even if on offer. And this was a Bolshoi production rather than an RB production so margins for selling were probably tighter, and the Bolshoi were only here for a short season. If ROH start doing offers for RB, people may start expecting this and not buying tickets waiting for the special offer which is not what I think the management would want.

 

I think ultimately it just doesn't 'look good' for ROH to have to do special offers; I like a good deal as much as anyone but I'm happy to pay a fair price for ROH deals and would be annoyed if they started doing last minute deals, as I believe would many of their friends/members. So no, I can't predict the future but I really don't see any offers coming up. But I may be wrong! Perhaps you could do a search in the special ticket offer section to see if there have been RB offers in the past. 

 

Edited August 20, 2019 by JNC

[J_New]

Thanks, JNC - that’s a really detailed answer. What you’ve said backs up my own thoughts - I guess it was just that as my friend is a ‘first-timer’ and doesn’t want to spend much I thought I’d just ask here. I got a great deal on Manon at the ENB when they were at the Coliseum. Thanks again, Jacky

[jm365]

The Bright Stream offer was by the Hochhauser organisation and was nothing to do with the Royal Ballet or the Opera House.

[alison]

I think it's pretty clear from the lack of public offers on Frankenstein and Two Pigeons earlier this year that the ROH currently would rather bite off its own arm than publicly discount tickets somewhat to shift them.  Offering them to students at an absolute pittance, though, appears to be a different matter.  Doesn't seem to make financial sense, but I guess they have their reasons.

 

They may of course change their minds ...

[Lizbie1]

28 minutes ago, alison said:

I think it's pretty clear from the lack of public offers on Frankenstein and Two Pigeons earlier this year that the ROH currently would rather bite off its own arm than publicly discount tickets somewhat to shift them.  Offering them to students at an absolute pittance, though, appears to be a different matter.  Doesn't seem to make financial sense, but I guess they have their reasons.

 

They may of course change their minds ...

 

I imagine it helps with the figures for younger people and first timers which it provides to the Arts Council.

[Rob S]

D'oh! Wrong thread!

Edited August 21, 2019 by Rob S

[Sim]

Duly hidden!

[capybara]

For the first time ever, I seem to be being besieged with ROH reminders to book for Manon even though I have done so.

Of course, ENB showed it for a week last January to significantly less than packed houses and the RB had it in their rep.as recently as April/May 2018.

I think that there was a similar problem with shifting RB tickets when Fille was on in April/May 2015 and opened the season in 2016 and when Mayerling was on in April/May 2017 and opened the 2018/19 season.

There must be a reason for this pattern of performances: the company being better prepared at the beginning of a season if they return to something they have danced relatively recently? dancers being given the opportunity to consolidate their interpretations of roles? 'new' dancers being given opportunities to be cast in leading roles? Either way, it doesn't seem to be making commercial sense and it is a pity that there can't be something like a 'Friends Offer' every once in a while.

 

 

[JNC]

3 hours ago, capybara said:

it is a pity that there can't be something like a 'Friends Offer' every once in a while.

 

 

 

Surely the problem with Friends Offers would be the vast majority of friends will have bought their tickets when friends booking opened, so if there were offers later down the line you could potentially end up with a lot of disgruntled friends who may want a (partial) refund, and/or leading to friends holding off from booking when booking opens in the hope of an offer, which doesn't benefit ROH in terms of (upfront) ticket sales and also leads to uncertainty amongst Friends for 'should I book now or wait till later' dilemmas. 

 

To be honest (a controversial opinion) I am rather glad they don't do offers or sales  - don't you get annoyed when you buy something 'full price' and then later see it reduced? I think by not doing sales/offers they actually reward people who commit to booking when booking opens by giving them the 'best' deal possible (in a sense of wider choice of seats earlier on etc). 

 

This is why I think the last minute student offers are a brilliant idea - granted I am biased as I have benefitted from them, but they allow for seats that otherwise would likely go unsold to be filled by a person who probably wouldn't have considered going, either due to financial means or perhaps not enough commitment/interest/knowledge/ability to forward plan! I think this can lead to a generation of committed ROHers (and ballet/opera fans) and through the scheme I have explored different works including mixed bills which I wouldn't have considered before, and now rather than 2/3 a year, I end up going 2/3 a performance! Of course this isn't going to be the pattern for all, but opera is prohibitively expensive and without the student standbys which introduced me to opera, I can certainly say I would still likely never have seen an opera. I also note that tickets can still be bought full price while the student offer is live, so anyone who is in the market for a last minute ticket can buy one, although at full price (i.e. they are not 'reserved' for students). 

 

I think personally as long as pricing is fair (with a range of tickets available across a range of prices) I am happy not to see any offers at ROH (with the exception of the existing package bookings). Considering most productions sell out, if they're not selling, clearly there is a problem and ROH needs to take something away from that - whether it's things should be programmed with at least a 2 season gap, or to give up on new works that have flopped (I think the recent run has shown Frankenstein can be dropped from the repertoire, and I would be surprised to see an Unknown Solider and Medusa return too, subject to all of the above being given a 'second chance' with a radical overhaul), or to think about the combination of mixed bills (for example, Two Pigeons didn't sell well but if you had a different piece with it, e.g. another Ashton, it may have? Or controversially perhaps Two Pigeons should be 'relegated' to the Linbury or had a shorter run?). Of course ballet isn't all about finances and making a profit, but I think now the Linbury theatre is there that is a good space for shorter runs and more 'risky' works, I'm happy to see a diverse range on the main stage but ultimately profit is what ensures ROH can keep doing what it's doing and take more risks/commission new works so I think it's a difficult balance to strike, but currently I do think management is doing a good job and 19/20 looks to be a very successful season with few duds in terms of sales (with the exception of Manon potentially). 

 

 

 

 

 

[alison]

4 hours ago, JNC said:

This is why I think the last minute student offers are a brilliant idea - granted I am biased as I have benefitted from them, but they allow for seats that otherwise would likely go unsold to be filled by a person who probably wouldn't have considered going, either due to financial means or perhaps not enough commitment/interest/knowledge/ability to forward plan! I

 

I'm not suggesting there should be Friends' offers as such, but it surely makes more financial sense to reduce prices by 50% or whatever for the general public somewhat earlier if tickets aren't shifting, rather than wait until the last minute and flog the tickets off to students for a tenner.  It may be an investment in the future doing it the latter way, but it comes at a high cost.

[JNC]

9 hours ago, alison said:

 

I'm not suggesting there should be Friends' offers as such, but it surely makes more financial sense to reduce prices by 50% or whatever for the general public somewhat earlier if tickets aren't shifting, rather than wait until the last minute and flog the tickets off to students for a tenner.  It may be an investment in the future doing it the latter way, but it comes at a high cost.

 

I think my overarching point is that often ROH sells out, therefore if they are not selling so well in order to do offers (we’re not talking the odd ticket here and there, more whole chunks of the amphi empty) then while an offer may be a stopgap to recoup to some costs, really there shouldn’t be the need for offers in the first places if programming was done better.

 

It is very rare for there to actually be a student standby - and it has often been for something I already have tickets for or something I don’t want to see (Frankenstein or some of the less highly reviewed operas). I therefore think the current system works quite well - clearly when you’re at the night before why not sell them to students for £10? If you start offering reduced prices earlier I go back to my previous point about frustrating those who booked earlier. 

 

Interestingly I was holding out for a student standby for Carmen (showing 100+ seats unsold the day before some performances) and it never materialised. (I wanted to see it but wasn’t sure the production would be my thing so thought £10 would be a good deal.) So I guess some things are deemed to ‘good’ to go to any offer, even students even for £10, and they would rather have empty seats then students in the stalls! It appears they will only do student standby for the amphi not anywhere else. 

 

I agree re your point that it makes more financial sense to do 50% or alternative offers for the general public but this is a short term gain, and comes with the risk of frustrating friends/loyal customers (which may materialise as a financial risk too!). Student standbys are an investment in subsided arts for those of lesser means and are curious about those things, I would even argue it could be extended to young people generally (a lot of museums now do schemes for under 25s) and or to those with less means (but this would be a bit of a logistical nightmare I imagine).

 

No one will ever be able to calculate for sure how this pays in financial returns in the long run, but I will now be a customer of the ROH for hopefully many, many years to come, paying full price tickets for multiple productions. The vast majority probably won’t do this yes, but even if 20 students each year follow my pattern, that investment in students will be something the ROH can reap financial rewards for for potentially 50+ years. Don’t forget we often bring friends and introduce them to ballet/opera too, so there’s also a ripple effect. (Also it’s a nice thing to do to give students the opportunity to try things that they wouldn’t try at full price I think.) 

[penelopesimpson]

I have always worked on the principle that ROH never discounts and, on balance, am happy with this. Penalising people who book early, giving RB the benefit of my funds in their bank account, would sit badly with me.  Giving free or heavily discounted tickets to students public service workers and that ilk should be the only exception.

 

I don’t really see it as a major problem because most performances sellout.  I think any regular ballet goer could have told KOH that Frankenstein would be a problem. He should have brought Woolf Works back.  Frankenstein should join Raven Girl and the WW1 tribute in the filing cabinet

[capybara]

50 minutes ago, penelopesimpson said:

I think any regular ballet goer could have told KOH that Frankenstein would be a problem. He should have brought Woolf Works back.  Frankenstein should join Raven Girl and the WW1 tribute in the filing cabinet

 

 When Kevin O'Hare last spoke to The Ballet Association, he mentioned that it was important for the dancers (who learned a lot from new creations) and choreographers (who sometimes made revisions) for new works to get a second airing - and he added that most new commissions do have a second run.

[penelopesimpson]

I understand that but there were rather a lot of Frankenstein’s!  Do dancers really want to return to a piece that hasn’t found anaudience?  I wonder - seems a bit of a stretch, not to mention bad for the bank account.  We should consider that empty seats mean raised prices.

[JohnS]

1 hour ago, penelopesimpson said:

Penalising people who book early, giving RB the benefit of my funds in their bank account, would sit badly with me.

 

I struggle with the idea that those who book early and miss out on discounts are ‘penalised’.  I am very happy to book early for the certainty of attending a performance, the greater range of seats available, and the chance to book favourite seats.  If my neighbour happens to pay less by booking the week before, good for them.  I’m just pleased if performers have a full house and audiences express their appreciation.

 

Has Woolf Works already been revived once although I’d be delighted to see it brought back again?  I’d also see Frankenstein and Raven Girl.  I’m afraid The Unknown Soldier I thought irredeemable but even then I’d probably book if Francesca Hayward were dancing as she’d clearly been heavily involved in its creation.

[Lizbie1]

Frankenstein sold strongly first time round so they may well have expected that to happen again.

 

The more foreseeable error IMO was to programme Mayerling so soon after the previous run. I understand that having the Ring on at that time limited the RB's options because of storage space for the sets but surely other ballets would have done. Or maybe those other ballets would have required more of the corps, fresh from their summer break?

 

As has already been mentioned, they may be repeating this mistake with Manon, and Fille also suffered - I don't understand why this lesson is so hard to learn. (The opera company is guilty of doing this too on occasion.)