The Royal Ballet: Frankenstein, March 2019

[capybara]

Just now, Richard LH said:

 

Sorry Saodan, but what is this curfew exactly?

 

Overtime kicks in for certain categories of staff, including, especially,  the orchestra.

Apparently, the cut-off for the orchestra is when the conductor, with the cast, walks forward to acknowledge them and they can then get up and go.

Stage Managers have to make notes on these exact timings.

[Richard LH]

Thanks capybara. I have  certainly noticed a mass exodus of the orchestra after their stage acknowledgment! 

Edited March 17, 2019 by Richard LH

[jmhopton]

I've never understood this time restriction on the orchestra especially as I wouldn't have thought it could apply to opera given how long some of them are. So why should it apply to ballet? I didn't realise it was still ongoing. Rightly or wrongly I seem to remember blaming it on why some of my favourite choreography was omitted from Bayadere back in the 1980's as the extra act made it difficult to finish by 10.30. (sorry this is a bit off topic for Frankenstein!) 

[ninamargaret]

25 minutes ago, jmhopton said:

I've never understood this time restriction on the orchestra especially as I wouldn't have thought it could apply to opera given how long some of them are. So why should it apply to ballet? I didn't realise it was still ongoing. Rightly or wrongly I seem to remember blaming it on why some of my favourite choreography was omitted from Bayadere back in the 1980's as the extra act made it difficult to finish by 10.30. (sorry this is a bit off topic for Frankenstein!) 

I think overtime is payable to the orchestra after 2230, and this is costed into the costs for longer operas, hence the increased prices for opera. Sometimes there are earlier start times - can't understand why they don't fix this for ballet.

[FLOSS]

Lengthy operas have an early starting time to avoid the overtime issue. I seem to recall that years ago, at some point during the early years of Dowell's directorship, when the company was still dancing the de Valois production of the Sleeping Beauty,  we were told that we were to be charged more for its performances than other full length ballets. The reason given was that the text that was then danced meant that the ballet's finishing time was a lot closer to 10:45 pm than 10:30 pm and this resulted in additional costs in the form of  overtime payments. In later seasons the ballet was cut  to ensure that its performances finished before 10:30 pm and did not attract overtime. The main victim was the Hunting scene, where among other things we lost the Farandole danced first by the peasants and then by the peasants and the courtiers and I think that some of the panorama music was cut as well. The unimproved opera house had the machinery needed to stage the Prince's journey to find Aurora  using nineteenth century technology in the form of a panorama. This is something which the improved opera house cannot manage, which is a great pity as although it was very low tech it was a lot better than the current solution of having the Lilac Fairy's boat weave about among the hanging cloths which are supposed to represent foliage. But then perhaps its just that I find low tech Victorian stage effects such as the ship leaving the harbour and the storm in Ondine far more effective than the shipwreck which  ends the Bolshoi's Le Corsaire which I am sure the machinists of the nineteenth century Bolshoi and Mariinsky theatres would have found toe curlingly embarrassing. I don't think that computer generated effects could  solve the problem of how to stage the boat ride in the Sleeping Beauty. They produce a very unsatisfactory effect when it comes to the destruction of the temple in La Bayadere.

[Guest]

I love the effect of the the departing ship in Ondine! 

[Mary]

12 minutes ago, FLOSS said:

But then perhaps its just that I find low tech Victorian stage effects such as the ship leaving the harbour and the storm in Ondine far more effective than the shipwreck which  ends the Bolshoi's Le Corsaire which I am sure the machinists of the nineteenth century Bolshoi and Mariinsky theatres would have found toe curlingly embarrassing. I don't think that computer generated effects could  solve the problem of how to stage the boat ride in the Sleeping Beauty. They produce a very unsatisfactory effect when it comes to the destruction of the temple in La Bayadere.

This is a very interesting new thread in itself perhaps?

It seems to me, and many posts on the forum over the years persuade me, that successful stage effects are those which are imaginatively and artistically right- it has very little to do with how much technology is available.

 

[capybara]

Whereas, previously, I have been pleased for the students sitting next to me who have got a cheap ticket, I now find the Frankenstein debacle somewhat alienating in that I have paid for a full-price ticket when 99% of the audience has got in  so cheaply and has had several opportunities to do so.

[Dawnstar]

12 minutes ago, capybara said:

Whereas, previously, I have been pleased for the students sitting next to me who have got a cheap ticket, I now find the Frankenstein debacle somewhat alienating in that I have paid for a full-price ticket when 99% of the audience has got in  so cheaply and has had several opportunities to do so.

 

I'm feeling a bit like that too. Do I really want to pay £43 for a row C side stalls circle rush ticket next Saturday, & sit there missing what I gather will include important parts of the action, while knowing that probably half the people in the stalls will have paid only £5 for a full view?

[JohnS]

I can appreciate there’s an irritation paying full price when neighboours may have very heavily discounted tickets but having been delighted to buy my favourite tickets as soon as booking opened, I’m just hoping there'll be a fullish  house.  I think it would be very disconcerting if the house were only half full.  I know Ludwig II of Bavaria might have preferred private performances but a full house with an appreciative audience can massively add to the experience, particularly if also well behaved.  That said, it would have been better if the ROH had thought more about pricing and more actively marketed the performances so that there were fewer discounted tickets.

[penelopesimpson]

You are right John, but it is a hard call.  I think when there is a 'problem' of this magnitude, it would be nice if ROH recognised its frequent flyers and made a gesture of recognition of their regular attendance and purchase of full-price tickets.  It does seem to me grossly unfair that a real ballet fan without limitless funds ends up sitting in a not-so-good seat whilst students or other selected groups pay a ridiculously low sum for a top-end seat.

 

I think this is a problem that needs to be looked at.  But will it?  No chance.  ROH assumes that its regulars are all elitist money bags whom it despises, even as it exhorts them to spend more.  The disconnect between management and regular attendees is now extreme.

[FLOSS]

At one time the ROH used to sell unsold tickets for both ballet and opera at reduced prices to Friends in the last hour or so before curtain up on production of a valid membership card. I bet if you asked why they don't  re-establish the practice or set up a modern day equivalent such as allowing Friends to buy unsold tickets a day before Students are allowed to buy them the ROH would deny that they had ever done such a thing in the past. Corporate memory is a fragile thing as it depends on the long term retention of staff who know" how things are done" and a willingness on the part of senior management to maintain established systems which have the effect of making people who provide a regular source of income feel valued however small their overall contribution to the organisation's funds may be. I can't help thinking that the ROH suffers from the presence of too many "new brooms" most of whom would be much happier if they were dealing with a much more standardised clientele than the one they currently have and that the corporate aim is force the audience to conform to their expectations of how their audience  should behave which seems to involve systems which require the ROH to do as little as possible to meet the audience's expectations about the services which the organisation should provide for it.

 

At one time I used to think that it was very odd that a man whose previous professional experience had been in running a department store had come to be the first General Director of the Royal Opera House, I don't today. Today it makes perfect sense that a man who had wartime experience of running concerts and other cultural events but whose career was largely spent in selling goods to the shoppers of Liverpool and meeting their expectations should have been given the job of running a theatre which was for the first time to be the home to permanent ballet and opera companies. I think that his professional experience gave him a much better grasp of what "accessibility" and "affordability" really mean than an Arts Council apparatchik can ever hope to have. I don't think that he would have countenanced changes which have the effect of reducing services to his audience apparently without looking for effective alternatives or that he would have allowed the theatre's pricing policy and the allocation of tickets to become so horribly wrong. But then his professional experience was in commerce selling goods to ordinary people. A world in which someone who wishes to be a success starts from the position that the customer is always right rather than one in which the customer is wrong and an inconvenience.

 

 

[penelopesimpson]

Floss.  So brilliantly put.  It is all so sad.  I used to feel special at the Opera House and I hoped that everybody else who entered got that same little flutter of anticipation, that lifting of the spirits and thrill when you entered the auditorium - even if you'd done it a hundred times before.  Now I feel that I enjoy the evening in spite of the many petty trials and tribulations that have to be negotiated along the way.

 

When I think of what we all went through (and I include many of the staff in this) during the Open-up rebuilding, what was it all for?  So that people with no connection or desire to have any connection with the Arts could wander in off the street and use free facilities whilst those who paid for said facilities were expected to share them with those who hadn't.  Was that really the sum total of the plan so that management could demonstrate their green/inclusivity/diversity/ and a thousand other types of right-on credentials?

 

Okay, we get that nobody cares that the regular attendees are feeling unloved and pinched in the pocket.  But I forsee other problems ahead of which I suspect Frankenstein is just a harbinger.  The Ampitheatre restaurant is slowly dying since the refurb.  Drinks consumption in the bars is notably down, particularly champagne, since the exorbitant price rises and staffing levels have been adjusted accordingly.  It won't be long before whoever has the catering contract asks for re-negotiation.  When summer comes, how will those who have spent hundreds on tickets and dinner feel about not being able to get a seat on the Ampi Terrace because its full of people enjoying their own refreshments?

[ninamargaret]

Floss's comments make sense, as always. There is such a thing as 'brand loyalty'. I do most of my shopping on line and find that most companies i deal with do everything possible to keep me happy and recognise the fact that I spend reasonable sums of money with them. And little perks like the odd bottle of wine, vouchers etc . The small theatre i support offers me ticket discounts, free events, although some are paid events and I feel a valued member . I realise the ROH cannot offer the same sort of personal service as a small theatre, but if  It 'on line suppliers can do it why not the ROH? It's not that difficult these days to identify your regular customers and value them - they are important!

[alison]

2 hours ago, FLOSS said:

At one time the ROH used to sell unsold tickets for both ballet and opera at reduced prices to Friends in the last hour or so before curtain up on production of a valid membership card. I bet if you asked why they don't  re-establish the practice or set up a modern day equivalent such as allowing Friends to buy unsold tickets a day before Students are allowed to buy them the ROH would deny that they had ever done such a thing in the past.

 

Yes, they used to have a Friends' standby phone line or something, didn't they?

[ninamargaret]

I certainly remember receiving emails offering cut price tickets for opera to Friends a couple of years ago. They were still a bit pricey, but certainly cheaper.

[FLOSS]

A cliché which is trotted out at regular intervals is that you learn from your mistakes.I can't help wondering what lessons, if any, those in charge at Covent Garden will draw from their failure to sell many tickets for Frankenstein at the price they originally set for them. Will they recognise that they misjudged the likely demand for seats and that they got the pricing completely wrong or will they decide that the fault lies with the ballet company? As they seem incapable of admitting their mistakes I suspect that much of the blame will be attributed either to the director's decision to  programme too many performances of Frankenstein or to the fact that he programmed it at all. I hope that the financial hit that the  company has suffered as a result of this Frankenstein  revival does not lead to the AD losing the degree of autonomy he currently enjoys  about which ballets to programme and the number of performances each ballet and mixed programme is to have. The simplest way of making money for the company would be to adopt the balletic equivalent of the  programming policy pursued by the resident opera company which every season stages umpteen performances of crowd pleasing starter operas such as  La Traviata, La Boheme and Tosca, although I think that by now it must have exhausted its potential audience for them as everyone within a hundred miles of London who wishes to hear them has done so. I hope that the Marketing Department will take some responsibility for the part it played in all of this as I, for one, do not look forward to a season with a range of repertory almost entirely restricted to the nice little earners in the company's repertory. The thought of wall to wall performances of Swan Lake and other equally popular money spinners does not fill me with any enthusiasm.

[aliceinwoolfland]

I'm hoping that the takeaway from this is that prices should be slashed by about a third to 50% depending on the seat, and that a shorter run with sold out performances is preferable to a longer run with hundreds of empty seats per performance. 

[TheaG]

just got an email confirming Kish as the creature on the 20th and 23rd March

[JohnS]

31 minutes ago, TheaG said:

just got an email confirming Kish as the creature on the 20th and 23rd March

 

And I see the website has also been updated.

[penelopesimpson]

I echo your sentiments, Floss, although I think that the number of performances of Frankenstein was overly ambitious.

[Dawnstar]

1 hour ago, JohnS said:

 

And I see the website has also been updated.

 

Finally! I've just seen it & found myself actually applauding! I was hoping it'd be Kish so I'll definitely get a rush ticket for Saturday now (I would usually say if I can manage to get one but that's unlikely to be an issue with this!).

[JennyTaylor]

On 16/03/2019 at 14:11, bridiem said:

 

That was an awful decision, I presume borne of a sort of panic because the applause had stopped. Really really wrong.

I don't think the applause had really stopped - it had been very good for the cast bows, and I was startled when that was it.  The lights on the curtain came on briefly to anticipate the red run and then went out again. It's true that everyone was leaving at that point, but I'm sure that if Alex and Meghan had appeared, there would have been well deserved applause. I wondering if there were so many newcomers in the audience that they didn't realise this was the norm - but I have no actual facts to back this up. 

I also don't think we were that close to the 10:30 threshold. My husband picked me up and when I got to the car he commented that I was early - and I'd told him 10:25 pick up. 

All very odd and a shame - whatever one thinks of the ballet. I've never seen this happen in all my visits to the ROH. 

[JennyTaylor]

21 hours ago, ninamargaret said:

Floss's comments make sense, as always. There is such a thing as 'brand loyalty'. I do most of my shopping on line and find that most companies i deal with do everything possible to keep me happy and recognise the fact that I spend reasonable sums of money with them. And little perks like the odd bottle of wine, vouchers etc . The small theatre i support offers me ticket discounts, free events, although some are paid events and I feel a valued member . I realise the ROH cannot offer the same sort of personal service as a small theatre, but if  It 'on line suppliers can do it why not the ROH? It's not that difficult these days to identify your regular customers and value them - they are important!

Mmm, I find that if you are a "valued" member of the ROH, all they do is ask for more money, including inviting you to special events and then asking you to pay for the refreshments. 

[ninamargaret]

46 minutes ago, JennyTaylor said:

Mmm, I find that if you are a "valued" member of the ROH, all they do is ask for more money, including inviting you to special events and then asking you to pay for the refreshments

Totally agree. They just don't seem to have any idea of valuing customers.  People join organisations because they wish to support what they do, and they are willing to contribute either by donating money or attending performances, or both. But it's only human nature to like to be thanked, and to be shown that you are valued. And to me that means more than a glossy magazine, a bit of priority booking and a small shop discount, and all that only if you're a Friend. Regular customers are just as important, even if they are not Friends, and should be valued.

[John Mallinson]

Getting distinctly off topic here…

[Rob S]

Yay, they got a red run this evening!!! 👍

 

 

Edited March 19, 2019 by Rob S

[Douglas Allen]

11 hours ago, Rob S said:

Yay, they got a red run this evening!!! 👍

 

 

Sorry Rob S, That isn't an example of a "red runner" (or "red run" as some call it here). It's a front of curtain call. The red runner is when the front curtain is pulled back centrally a short way to reveal the red runner which provides a backdrop for the performers, soloists and leads, to take their calls. The runner is to enable the stage hands to strike the sets while the calls continue, something that wouldn't be possible if the cast continued with full stage calls. The front of curtain calls used to be only for the leads when their was sufficient continued applause after the red runner ones had taken place. All of the decisions about the calls are taken, usually, by the stage manager.

I'm trying not to be a pedant, though I think I'm failing...

[alison]

I probably asked this last time, but (since I was reminded by the costumes) why on earth is the Act III ball presented as being a cousin to the one in Cinderella or in Onegin?  What's with all the bowing and curtseying?  Frankenstein and his bride aren't royalty, are they?  (If they were, wouldn't there have been some indication of this in the birthday party in Act II?)

 

Oh, and I was very struck last night by the very major change in character in Henry from Act I to Act III.  I suppose he's had a chance to grow up, but even so it's quite a lot to swallow.

[bangorballetboy]

19 minutes ago, Douglas Allen said:

 

Sorry Rob S, That isn't an example of a "red runner" (or "red run" as some call it here). It's a front of curtain call. The red runner is when the front curtain is pulled back centrally a short way to reveal the red runner which provides a backdrop for the performers, soloists and leads, to take their calls. The runner is to enable the stage hands to strike the sets while the calls continue, something that wouldn't be possible if the cast continued with full stage calls. The front of curtain calls used to be only for the leads when their was sufficient continued applause after the red runner ones had taken place. All of the decisions about the calls are taken, usually, by the stage manager.

I'm trying not to be a pedant, though I think I'm failing...

 

I'm going to out-pendant you, as the RB dancers do indeed refer to the front of curtain calls as the red run.  I do note that the red runner is still brought in behind the curtain to allow the set to be struck whilst the calls continue, as some members of the audience can see through the held-open curtain to the stage behind.

[Rob S]

18 minutes ago, Douglas Allen said:

 

Sorry Rob S, That isn't an example of a "red runner" (or "red run" as some call it here). It's a front of curtain call. The red runner is when the front curtain is pulled back centrally a short way to reveal the red runner which provides a backdrop for the performers, soloists and leads, to take their calls. The runner is to enable the stage hands to strike the sets while the calls continue, something that wouldn't be possible if the cast continued with full stage calls. The front of curtain calls used to be only for the leads when their was sufficient continued applause after the red runner ones had taken place. All of the decisions about the calls are taken, usually, by the stage manager.

I'm trying not to be a pedant, though I think I'm failing...

 

Oh ok, in that case I’ve never seen a red run and will erase the phrase from my vocabulary 😊

[zxDaveM]

 

if you peek through the gap in the curtains (some poor soul has to heft the left one as we look at them, to keep open for the performers to get in front of the curtains), you can often see that red 'sub-curtain' (for want of a better description) behind the main curtain. Most people I know use 'red run' as a description for the in-front-of-big-red-curtains-at-the-front-of-the-stage-curtain-calls as its shorter...

[capybara]

1 minute ago, zxDaveM said:

 

if you peek through the gap in the curtains (some poor soul has to heft the left one as we look at them, to keep open for the performers to get in front of the curtains), you can often see that red 'sub-curtain' (for want of a better description) behind the main curtain. Most people I know use 'red run' as a description for the in-front-of-big-red-curtains-at-the-front-of-the-stage-curtain-calls as its shorter...

 

Precisely! Let's face it, all we're really concerned with is that the artists who have just given their all in the leading roles have a proper opportunity to be acknowledged by the audience. After any performance, I want to see them and applaud them whatever the 'technicalities'.