Hours in the studio

[balletbean]

Morning all, 

 

Sorry could not think of an appropriate Topic title.

 

I am interested to know how many hours other children are spending in the studio for those that attend a regular academic school. Especially teenagers around and about 14/15 years.

 

With SS applications looming and then future Vocational school consideration I just wasn't too sure if there was such thing as an average.

 

Either pure ballet or other genres. Not sure If my DD is 'up to speed' with her counterparts as we live in a very small community and get wrapped up within that close bubble of her friends either from her school or studio to compare with.

 

Hope that all makes some kind of sense. Would love to hear from anyone either of that age and those that were successful at their auditions for vocational upper school. Schools appear to request certain RAD grades but no reference to the hours of training per week preferred 

 

Thank you

Edited September 13, 2016 by balletbean

[Anna C]

This is an oft-discussed subject! I'll see if I can find some previous threads.

[Anna C]

Here's one: http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/13186-how-many-hours-of-dance/?hl=hours

[Anna C]

This may be helpful too: http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/11455-abilitylevel-needed-for-upper-school/?hl=%26quot%3Bhours+per+week%26quot%3B#entry155094

[Anna C]

And http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/10322-advice/?hl=%26quot%3Bhours+per+week%26quot%3B#entry140940

 

http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/10232-progress-in-balletenough-training/?hl=%26quot%3Bhours+per+week%26quot%3B#entry137266

[taxi4ballet]

Schools appear to request certain RAD grades but no reference to the hours of training per week preferred 

As far as I know, the vocational upper schools don't have any particular requirement at all for certain RAD grades to have been achieved.

 

I think that maybe what has happened on this forum in the past, is that these grades have been discussed by us all as a convenient benchmark measure of approximating the level of training you need to be at when applying. For instance someone might comment: "DD said that the audition at school X was about Advanced 1 level, and harder than at school Y where it was only about Inter"

 

On the application forms they do ask for the genres of dance studied, and the number of hours/classes a week, and there's usually a space asking for the result of the most recent ballet exam taken (if any). Many applicants, particularly from overseas will not have done exams anyway.

[balletbean]

Thank you Anna C, Without a definite topic title it can be a challenge to find what I am looking for.   

[balletbean]

 

 

I think that maybe what has happened on this forum in the past, is that these grades have been discussed by us all as a convenient benchmark measure of approximating the level of training you need to be at when applying. For instance someone might comment: "DD said that the audition at school X was about Advanced 1 level, and harder than at school Y where it was only about Inter"

 

 

Thank you, that's rather reassuring. 

 

I have read several posts that DD are Adv1 or even 2 at my daughters age. I'm worried that she will run out of time to take the exams before the auditions come around. Due to commitments by her dance school and other students to consider. Without knowing the mark that some of these students are receiving (presumably very high) just studying a grade is no guarantee. Realistically it is only an indication of where the student is in their training and their knowledge but not their actual ability. If that makes sense.  

[taxi4ballet]

Thank you, that's rather reassuring. 

 

I have read several posts that DD are Adv1 or even 2 at my daughters age. I'm worried that she will run out of time to take the exams before the auditions come around. Due to commitments by her dance school and other students to consider. Without knowing the mark that some of these students are receiving (presumably very high) just studying a grade is no guarantee. Realistically it is only an indication of where the student is in their training and their knowledge but not their actual ability. If that makes sense.  

That's it - it is the level they are working at and not whether or not they have actually taken the exam in question.

 

During the audition, they may well be asked to do steps/vocabulary that are learned in the advanced grades, so you will be at a greater advantage if you are currently studying at that level. On the other hand, the panel will be looking for natural ability, facility and excellent technique, so somebody who has not yet taken Adv 1 but passed Inter with a high distinction might have an advantage over another who has already passed Adv 1, but with an average merit.

 

Golly - it's all as clear as mud isn't it?!

 

When it comes to hours, yes, you probably need to be doing a lot (maybe at least 12+ hours a week although other people will tell you different!!) and whether it is just ballet or ballet + jazz/tap/contemporary etc will depend on what their ambitions are, and where they want to audition.

[Loulabelle]

My 15 yr old DD is applying for vocational ballet school for Sept 2017. She currently does around 6 hours ballet a week at her local school (occasionally slightly more or less), she does a 2 hour associate program weekly and a 2 1/4 hour associate program fortnightly and she has a 2 hour private lesson fortnightly. 

 

This is the absolute maximum ballet we can fit in but she does another 4-6 hours tap/modern/jazz/body conditioning and festival work too. Something may have to give when its GCSE time and around auditions.

 

She will be taking her Adv 1 ISTD in Oct and Adv 1 RAD in Nov/Dec. I very much doubt she will get through Adv 2 exams in anything but tap before next September, but she does work at that level now.

[meadowblythe]

My son never took Advanced 2, he is now a professional ballet dancer (still love writing that!)  Most of his year have employment, of those I know of that don't both have advanced 2.  Most of the rest who found jobs don't have more than Intermediate.

 

 I think it is yet another one of these things that we as parents worry about more than the students.  I don't think (and someone will correct me) WL does RAD at all now. 

[BlueLou]

My dd is 14 and also hoping to go to vocational upper school in 2018 ballet bean. She does around 16-17 hours a week, mainly ballet but also including tap, modern jazz, contemporary and festival work, and pilates. She does IDTA grades at the village dance school, which I think are probably fairly pointless, but she’s in Adv1 Ballet, Adv1 Modern, and Inter Tap. 

[taxi4ballet]

My son never took Advanced 2, he is now a professional ballet dancer (still love writing that!)  Most of his year have employment, of those I know of that don't both have advanced 2.  Most of the rest who found jobs don't have more than Intermediate.

 

 I think it is yet another one of these things that we as parents worry about more than the students.  I don't think (and someone will correct me) WL does RAD at all now. 

The advantage of passing Adv 2 is that you are then able to use the letters ARAD after your name, and of course a distinction will mean you are eligibleto take the Solo Seal, and to enter the Genee competition.

 

I think maybe Balletbean is wanting to know how many hours of training non-vocational students have to put in, and what standard they need to be at, in order to be able to compete for upper school places with those who are already at vocational school. We are only using exam grades as a general reference point of the level of training - we don't mean that those exams have to be taken in order to have a dancing career, because they don't.

 

In other words, if someone says that it helps if you are studying at Adv 2 level when auditioning for ENBS, they are only using it as a guide to the level of training to help other parents get the idea rather than using the technical terminology relative to that level of training, which would be much less easily understood. Like the way we use Olympic-sized swimming pools as a guide to volume.

Edited September 13, 2016 by taxi4ballet

[Ellie]

The advantage of passing Adv 2 is that you are then able to use the letters ARAD after your name,

 

As an aside I believe you now have to pay the RAD a fee every year to be allowed to keep the letters ARAD after your name. x

[meadowblythe]

The advantage of passing Adv 2 is that you are then able to use the letters ARAD after your name, and of course a distinction will mean you are eligibleto take the Solo Seal, and to enter the Genee competition.

 

I think maybe Balletbean is wanting to know how many hours of training non-vocational students have to put in, and what standard they need to be at, in order to be able to compete for upper school places with those who are already at vocational school. We are only using exam grades as a general reference point of the level of training - we don't mean that those exams have to be taken in order to have a dancing career, because they don't.

 

In other words, if someone says that it helps if you are studying at Adv 2 level when auditioning for ENBS, they are only using it as a guide to the level of training to help other parents get the idea rather than using the technical terminology relative to that level of training, which would be much less easily understood. Like the way we use Olympic-sized swimming pools as a guide to volume.

 

 

Point taken, I really like your analogy of the swimming pool. I would just hate people to think that they shouldn't bother applying because they haven't passed xxx by yyy age ....

[hfbrew]

The advantage of passing Adv 2 is that you are then able to use the letters ARAD after your name,

 

As an aside I believe you now have to pay the RAD a fee every year to be allowed to keep the letters ARAD after your name. x

Well my son certainly doesn't have to pay a fee!

[Ellie]

Well my son certainly doesn't have to pay a fee! 

 

That's great. Maybe they've changed it recently - or maybe it's just for us oldies

 

Edited September 13, 2016 by Ellie

[2dancersmum]

When you have passed your Adv 2 you also have to apply to the RAD and be 18 or over in order to be allowed to used the letters ARAD after your name and as Ellie says you have to remain a member (in other words pay every year) to keep on using the letters too.

 

In terms of hours - don't forget quality over quantity. My DD did not do that many hours compared to many before she went to vocational school at 16. Our local ballet school is only a small one - she had perhaps 6 hours of ballet a week there and a couple of jazz. But she had good teachers and small classes so she got a lot of attention. We supplemented her local ballet class with associates (once a month), workshops (once a month) and a summer school. She was in adv 1 ballet at the time of auditioning and had taken it by  the September she started her new school. If we had had more time and more money so that she could have gone to a school further away and done more hours, she may well have had more offers than she did. There's just no way of knowing and regardless she now dances professionally and is happy doing so, albeit a cruise ship not a ballet company (though she has a ballet solo on pointe).  So regardless of exams taken (and by what age), numbers of hours etc, it shows that the schools know what they are looking for in a potential student. As someone else said, quoting grades is a very general guide.

[taxi4ballet]

As an aside I believe you now have to pay the RAD a fee every year to be allowed to keep the letters ARAD after your name. x

That's the annual membership subscription.

[hfbrew]

Well my son certainly doesn't have to pay a fee!

 

That's great. Maybe they've changed it recently - or maybe it's just for us oldies

 

Well as others have pointed out it's the annual membership fee which my son pays anyway so I don't think of it as a fee for the ARAD letters. Sorry if I've been misleading! Edited September 13, 2016 by hfbrew

[Waitingmum]

My son never took Advanced 2, he is now a professional ballet dancer (still love writing that!) Most of his year have employment, of those I know of that don't both have advanced 2. Most of the rest who found jobs don't have more than Intermediate.

 

I think it is yet another one of these things that we as parents worry about more than the students. I don't think (and someone will correct me) WL does RAD at all now.

You are correct WL do not do any exams anymore.

[balletbean]

Point taken, I really like your analogy of the swimming pool. I would just hate people to think that they shouldn't bother applying because they haven't passed xxx by yyy age ....

That's great to here, ENBS SS entrance states ADV1. For my DD age. She is right on the cusp due to her July birthday.

 

The lower age group was Int Fou, A missing grade between the two age groups!

 

We felt that she could not even submit an application form for the SS. 

[taxi4ballet]

That's great to here, ENBS SS entrance states ADV1. For my DD age. She is right on the cusp due to her July birthday.

 

The lower age group was Int Fou, A missing grade between the two age groups!

 

We felt that she could not even submit an application form for the SS. 

I think that they do that for summer school, yes. the younger age group being I/F upwards, and the older age group Adv 1 upwards. Yes, you were caught in the middle unfortunately as your dd was the age for the higher group but not yet in Adv 1. What a pity. It is only a guide though, as many international applicants don't do exams at all. Perhaps give them a ring if it happens another time and ask.

 

Please have a look at the website now though, as I think they are currently advertising an audition workshop for later in the year.

 

PS: Balletbean, I have sent you a PM

Edited September 14, 2016 by taxi4ballet

[balletbean]

Thank you taxi4ballet.  My DD birthday is beginning to be a bane of her life (I blame her mum, lol). 

 

Even last years SS posed some issues of knowing which group to apply for. All the schools ask the students age but don't specify whether it's the students age when attending the SS or at a particular date. Not always clear. Unlike academic/vocational schools which is very straight forward as they appear to match regular school years.

 

PS:

I have replied  

Edited September 14, 2016 by balletbean

[taxi4ballet]

When they ask age like that, you could put current age at the time of the application and age at start date of course, or "Will be x".

That's what I've done sometimes.

[meadowblythe]

That's great to here, ENBS SS entrance states ADV1. For my DD age. She is right on the cusp due to her July birthday.

 

The lower age group was Int Fou, A missing grade between the two age groups!

 

We felt that she could not even submit an application form for the SS. 

 

I had the same with my DS, August birthday.  I felt his life would have been so much easier if he had been born a month later.  He said that his entire personality would have been different if had not had to fight that little bit harder all the way through ....

[balletbean]

Meadowblythe, 

 

My DD July birthday is the day before mine!. I know exactly how she feels. Fortunately this has never affected her academic studies. So at least I didn't fail completely.   

[betterankles]

At least an hour and a half classical class every day, six days a week,  plus preferably some pointe, and some character - if aiming at a professional classical ballet career

[balletbean]

At least an hour and a half classical class every day, six days a week,  plus preferably some pointe, and some character - if aiming at a professional classical ballet career

betterankles,

 

Yikes, Not sure that would even be possible at the DD school.  9 hours of ballet pw.

 

With other students to take into account. (Grades and ages and genres) there is only so many teachers available and studio space. Nice idea though

[Vonrothbart]

I had the same with my DS, August birthday.  I felt his life would have been so much easier if he had been born a month later.  He said that his entire personality would have been different if had not had to fight that little bit harder all the way through ....

 

It is a lot harder for them without doubt, but it also helps to put a little resilience their way. My GDD was born on 30th August, and she was a couple of months premature, but after struggling to even survive, we wouldn't whinge about it at all.

[taxi4ballet]

At least an hour and a half classical class every day, six days a week,  plus preferably some pointe, and some character - if aiming at a professional classical ballet career

 

betterankles,

 

Yikes, Not sure that would even be possible at the DD school.  9 hours of ballet pw.

 

With other students to take into account. (Grades and ages and genres) there is only so many teachers available and studio space. Nice idea though

Not sure whether daily class would be possible for any non-vocational students really. Most people are lucky if they can find more than two or three times a week.

[Harwel]

At least an hour and a half classical class every day, six days a week, plus preferably some pointe, and some character - if aiming at a professional classical ballet career

Most non vocational students will have to get by with a lot less than this - not very realistic unless you live in a city and possibly attend 2 or 3 different studios.

[dramascientist]

I would say it is almost impossible to find a non voc school that offers a ballet class per day for a certain age group. At my sisters school there is one class a week per grade plus another class for those students studying RAD vocational grades. Having said this her students score high marks in both RAD grade and vocational exams and has had several students go on to full time voc schools at 16 and some younger ones going at year 7. Several students attending JAS, MAs and SAs so it is definitely quality over quantity that matters.