Royal Ballet promotions 2016

[aileen]

Well, Choe's Prix wins were a long time ago. What's relevant is what she's like now. O'Hare must have seen something in Takada and Hayward which he didn't see in Choe and so they were cast in many leading roles which have passed her by.

[capybara]

I'm beginning to feel a bit uneasy that we may be taking this discussion too far.

 

Have posters on here seen the comments on the ROH website? http://www.roh.org.uk/news/promotions-and-joiners-at-the-royal-ballet-for-201617

 

At the time of writing this there are 64.

[alison]

My thoughts exactly, capybara.

[Fonty]

Well, personally I can't see that anything that has been said so far could be construed as going too far, although I appreciate that any thread can turn into a expression  of agreements and disagreements regarding the topic being discussed.

 

I didn't realise Choe had been with the RB ffor 13 years, and has been a first soloist for 8 years.  In my mind she was still one of the fresh new youngsters coming through.  Where does the time go?

 

Regarding the reasons for promotion, I remember Dowell saying that raising Yanowsky to principal was his gift to her on his departure.  I think I've got that right?  Not that I am objecting to that, as I am a huge fan of hers.  The sad thing is I feel she was never used properly once she got that promotion, although with her height, finding an appropriate partner was always going to be an issue.  However, you would assume that anyone in a position to give promotions would think about that beforehand. 

[Scheherezade]

I hope that Yuhui has read all the positive comments on this forum, the ROH website and elsewhere and that this in some way helps dissipate what must be a tremendous disappointment for her.

 

This in no way detracts from congratulations to those who have been promoted. As to what Kevin O'Hare saw in the the two female soloists who have been promoted to principal, it seems quite clear in the case of Francesca Hayward - true and immediate star quality - and I have no doubt that Yasmine Naghdi will follow down the same path before too long. Yuhui Choe, however, lights up the stage. If she chooses to leave, it will be a sad loss for the R.B.

Edited June 19, 2016 by Scheherezade

[aileen]

A few people mentioned Zucchetti on the ROH site. Is he in the running for a principal position? Melissa Hamilton presumably moved because she was disappointed with her promotion prospects or didn't want to wait any longer. Not all first soloists will progress to principal. I don't know whether that is because they don't show the further development that is needed to become a principal or whether first soloist position was always the highest position that they were going to achieve. Alternatively, they were good enough but there weren't enough principal slots available for them or there were principal slots available but dancers who were better took them.

[alison]

A few people mentioned Zucchetti on the ROH site. Is he in the running for a principal position?

 

*I* wouldn't have said so - I wouldn't think he'd done nearly enough.  But then I'm not the AD.

[penelopesimpson]

I that the discussion about Choe's position in the company raises some very interesting questions about what criteria should be applied to the appointment of Principal dancers and what they represent to the company itself and its audience. Should such dancers be seen as exemplars of the company's style and the highest levels  of performance that the company can deliver as far as its core repertory is concerned, or are they merely appointments made to reward dancers for services rendered?

 

If the position is a reward for services rendered then you can make a strong argument for Choe's promotion because of the roles that she has danced. However I would describe her performances as pleasing rather than exemplary. She is charming when she dances Lise, but her Lise and Young Girl are virtually interchangeable as far as characterisation is concerned and she does not make me see the roles anew, She reproduces the choreography but it's all rather small scale and a bit bland as it lacks the nuances and fine stylistic details that make Ashton's characters live. I am afraid that I find her Aurora not displeasing as far as reproducing the choreographic text is concerned but totally lacking in any individuality both in relation to other roles that she dances and to other dancers in that role.

 

It is unreasonable to demand that a Principal dancer should be exemplary in every type of ballet which is in the  company's repertory but it is not unreasonable to expect that they should be outstanding in at least one part of it so that you could say to a young dancer or a new ballet goer if you really want to know what lies at the heart of this role you should go and see X dance it. You can say if you want to see how Ashton should be danced go and see Morera her footwork and epaulement are exemplary and she knows how to  bend as Ashton intended. I don't feel that can be said about  Choe's performances. I am not sure what the root of the problem is perhaps she thinks that Ashton is wrong but when she bends it is a bit like an optional add on rather than being an integrated organic movement. Perhaps she is too wedded to the classroom version of the steps to adjust to the style required in performance. I don't know. I find it puzzling that a dancer who can make so much of the quarreling whore in Manon makes so little of bigger roles.

 

Each of the current Principals has a role or roles in which they are outstanding and are exemplary. Among the new appointments there are dancers who have shown that same level of individuality from the word go or have started to do so. There is at least one who has turned a rather lacklustre revival,  which more senior dancers had managed to make little of, into something quite extraordinary. Life is very unfair ten years ago Choe would probably have been promoted to Principal but it would, I fear, have been something of a stopgap appointment. With all the young talent in the company Mr O'Hare will not want to block the career development and promotion prospects of younger dancers who show the ability to dance in a stylistically appropriate manner and have real individuality in performance..

Brilliantly put, as always, FLOSS.  I would hate for the company to employ 'Buggin's Turn' when choosing promotions and I think Kevin O'Hare has been bold in his choices.  It is lovely to see so much RB home talent being rewarded rather than bringing in from outside.  There is a wealth of talent coming through and it is truly an exciting time to be a fan.

[penelopesimpson]

I'm beginning to feel a bit uneasy that we may be taking this discussion too far.

 

Have posters on here seen the comments on the ROH website? http://www.roh.org.uk/news/promotions-and-joiners-at-the-royal-ballet-for-201617

 

At the time of writing this there are 64.

I honestly cannot see why.  Whichever point of view you take, the discussion has been informative and good humoured.  If we are not to discuss such matters, what would the forum be for?

 

Everybody seems to like Ms. Choe.  I have always enjoyed her performances and admire her elegance.  But Principals, surely, have to have that elusive thing called star quality and not all performers, however technically accomplished and however graceful, will have it.  It may not be fair, it's just a fact.  I want to watch Principals who just have that little bit of magic that sends shivers down your spine.

[alison]

But Principals, surely, have to have that elusive thing called star quality and not all performers, however technically accomplished and however graceful, will have it.  

 

 

I completely agree with you, Penelope.  But then, do all principals, whether at the RB or elsewhere, necessarily have it (or develop it post-promotion)?  And if you don't see that star quality in someone, and yet promote them to the exalted position, does that undermine the rank as a whole?

 

I'm slightly uncomfortable broaching the subject in what is supposed to be an *RB* promotions thread, but I think the principle probably applies throughout the world.

[billboyd]

I am not alone in thinking Yuhui Choe has 'star quality'. I think it is a widely held belief.

[Sandi]

Lim, I too sad that Yuhui Choi not promoted this time .

[Tony Newcombe]

So Choe not considered as Principal material by the Director, who had no hesitation in throwing her on as a last minute replacement for Osipova in Beauty.

[aileen]

Good point, Tony. There is a dancer at ENB who's rather in the same situation: a very assured dancer whose services were called upon at short notice; who routinely danced roles 'above his/her rank', who was apparently a favourite with choreographers and yet who was only belatedly promoted out of the corps. Lots of people commented on this dancer's lack of promotion.

[alison]

My thoughts entirely, Tony.  Which is why I'm still not clear as to precisely what KOH expects of a principal.  I had thought, after the acquisition of Osipova, that he might just have exceptionally high standards that mere mortals might be unlikely to meet , but then this year we get four promotions from within the company, so I guess that suggests I was wrong about that.

[MAX]

who is this dancer aileen ?

[Fonty]

I am just musing again here, but are the dancers themselves told why they haven't been promoted?  Perhaps this is why Melissa Hamilton took a transfer to another company?

 

Regarding Miss Hamilton, personally, I didn't think she was principal material - at least, not as far as the RB was concerned. I saw her in several purely classical solo roles, and thought she wasn't as good as some of the others.  The style didn't seem to suit her.  Just my own personal opinion, of course.

[aileen]

I'd prefer not to say on the public forum, MAX.

[RuthE]

I am just musing again here, but are the dancers themselves told why they haven't been promoted?  Perhaps this is why Melissa Hamilton took a transfer to another company?

 

Regarding Miss Hamilton, personally, I didn't think she was principal material - at least, not as far as the RB was concerned. I saw her in several purely classical solo roles, and thought she wasn't as good as some of the others.  The style didn't seem to suit her.  Just my own personal opinion, of course.

 

Melissa Hamilton had only been a First Soloist for a year, I think, when she took her sabbatical to move to Dresden.  Regardless of whether she might have developed into "principal material" or not if she'd stayed at the RB during the last and next seasons, and indeed regardless of how she may be developing in her current chosen circumstances, she was not a dancer who had been languishing for several years at the same rank, and she'd had no shortage of RB principal roles either in her last couple of years as a Soloist or after her promotion to First Soloist.

 

That is, she'd been recently promoted within the RB, so there was nothing - at least from my outsider's perspective - to suggest that she was being overlooked or taken for granted within the company.

 

If I was Yuhui Choe, on the other hand, I might be very seriously considering my options now.

[MAX]

Well if she can continue to have nice things to dance it's the most important...

[Jan McNulty]

 

Everybody seems to like Ms. Choe.  I have always enjoyed her performances and admire her elegance.  But Principals, surely, have to have that elusive thing called star quality and not all performers, however technically accomplished and however graceful, will have it.  It may not be fair, it's just a fact.  I want to watch Principals who just have that little bit of magic that sends shivers down your spine.

 

 

I completely agree with you, Penelope.  But then, do all principals, whether at the RB or elsewhere, necessarily have it (or develop it post-promotion)?  And if you don't see that star quality in someone, and yet promote them to the exalted position, does that undermine the rank as a whole?

 

I'm slightly uncomfortable broaching the subject in what is supposed to be an *RB* promotions thread, but I think the principle probably applies throughout the world.

 

 

 

I have seen dancers promoted, unexpectedly to me, to principal over the years and most of them have risen to the occasion.  I have also seen some dancers promoted who have not risen to the occasion.  

 

There are also established principals who do not (and never have) floated my boat.  It does not mean to say that they don't float other people's boat but we all see things differently, including Directors/Artistic Directors.

 

I am talking about my experience of several companies, not specifically the RB.

 

I am very happy that K O'H has chosen to promote from within, even if YC is not on the list.

[Fonty]

Very true, Janet.

 

I have been going to the ballet since I was about 5, and there are always going to be certain dancers who do nothing for me.  However, I think I can say that of the current crop of ladies, I can't think of a single one who doesn't deserve their place at the top.  I haven't seen either Hayward or Takada in much yet, so I look forward to their future performances with great enthusiasm

[SwissBalletFan]

I think again it is important to remember that Ballerinas and Dancers are people too with their own personalities, backgrounds, and demeanour. As a Senior Manager, I can understand the role of promotions aligned with performance, but also with other factors to take into account.

 

Many employees, could (rightly) be aggrieved that a manager doesn't feel that it's fair when a colleague is promoted above them. There is a huge amount to consider about a person and their performance and of course, personal affinity with a manager is a major part of that.

 

KOH has answered a lot of questions about his vision of the future with the promotions. There are constant discussions behind the scenes and these will continue.

 

I think that what happens on stage is a factor to these decisions, but I think KOH could certainly explain his actions to those disappointed by not being promoted, and that should stay between the Artist and Manager.

 

Congratulations to this who have made it, and some have been fast-tracked, which is a great sign about rewarding those who step up to challenges when they arise. There is usually a lot of drama happening off the stage too

[LinMM]

I always thought that these days in the UK anyway jobs had to be advertised so the promotion wouldn't be sole decision of a Manager....talking generally here of course not about RB.....

 

Otherwise a Manager could go solely on his PERSONAL like or dislike of someone .....not always for their suitability for the job etc

[alison]

I doubt that applies to artistic directors, though, Lin - of any company.

[David]

I always thought that these days in the UK anyway jobs had to be advertised so the promotion wouldn't be sole decision of a Manager....Otherwise a Manager could go solely on his PERSONAL like or dislike of someone .....not always for their suitability for the job etc

 

I am sure that Mr O'Hare consults widely not just across the Company but also with his individual dancers before taking these decisions.

 

May I say I share the general delight that some of our favourite dancers have been promoted in the latest round and look forward to seeing them in leading roles in the forthcoming season. However I venture to strike a discordant note. One of the major factors in the rise of the RB as one of the two or three greatest ballet companies in the world is the fact that it has acted as a magnet to some of the finest dancers the world has to offer. Not all of them have been brought in at the lower ranks and grown within the Company and I dare to suggest that the Company would have the poorer without them. They have played a major role in setting the bar to which the Company’s own dancers must aspire and importantly have made their own contributions to the evolution of what we now see as the Company’s House style.

 

My only point is that I hope the apparent policy to focus on home grown talent will not close the door completely to the infusion at senior level of outstanding talent from outside. There is a balance to be struck. The consensus seems to be that in the past the recruitment policy has been at the expense of internal promotions. Okay! Fair enough! But we are all fiercely loyal to our own, sometimes too much so if the anti-Osipova feeling expressed here and elsewhere is anything to go by and I for one do not wish to see the pendulum swing entirely the other way!

 

Inward-looking organisations tend to shrink! I am hoping that the Company will not close its doors entirely to some of the incredible top-ranking dancers who might aspire to join its ranks. I believe it needs to infuse new blood at all levels if it is to maintain its place on the world stage! And I fear it is a brutal fact that our home-grown dancers need to compete against the best that the world has to offer! As I say, it's a matter of finding the right balance and I'm sure the powers that be within the Company are mindful of this.

 

I shall now retire to a corner and like Alice wait for an entire pack of cards to rise in fury and engulf me! 

 

Edited to correct my grammar!

Edited June 20, 2016 by David

[LinMM]

I did say my post did NOT refer to the RB....

 

Have no idea how ballet companies work

Was talking generally in reply to previous poster!!

[bridiem]

Interesting post, David. I’d just make a couple of points in reply: Yes, the RB has attracted some of the finest dancers in the world, and I hope will continue to do so. But it has also recruited/employed dancers who though sometimes very good do not necessarily fall into that category. No doubt there have been all sorts of reasons for this, but I have sometimes found it frustrating. And, I think that the growing internationalism of ballet companies has indeed influenced the evolution of the RB’s style, and that of many other companies, so that they're increasingly similar. I think that’s sad. Like eating McDonald’s wherever you go in the world. (NOT that I’m comparing dancers to burgers, of course.)

[FLOSS]

The Royal Ballet and its predecessor company have always been dependant on foreign born dancers. At one time those companies represented virtually the only opportunity for employment in a classical ballet company for talented dancers in Australia, Canada,New Zealand and South Africa. Some, arrived here as fully trained dancers others like Alexander Grant. Johaar Mosaval and Lynn Seymour came initially for training and then joined the company.The major difference between then, and now, is not the numbers involved but the fact that the presence of foreign dancers was not as obvious then as the "foreign" dancers of the 1930's, 1940's, 1950's, 1960's and 1970's had British sounding surnames or acquired them and were often the descendants of immigrants to the "White Commonwealth". the presence of foreign dancers is more obvious now because their  surnames are obviously not British in origin.

 

The company has had its ups and downs as has the school since the1970's.One day a very interesting book will be written about what went wrong at the RBS. It will explain why de Valois had to go in and sort things out at the school during Ashton's directorship and why Park took charge of the school before she had retired from dancing. It will reveal a great deal but it is unlikely to be written while any of the participants are alive. Gailene Stock and Monica Mason seem to have restored the standards of both institutions.

 

As far as the company is concerned I don't think that it can hope to be one of the great companies unless it recruits the best from wherever it can find them. There is not the tradition here that there is in France and Denmark of ballet as a career for boys and girls and as a result the company it is probably unreasonable to expect it to recruit all of its dancers, let alone its Principal dancers, from those born in this country. All we can reasonably ask is that recourse is not made to the chequebook as often as it has been in the past; that the majority of dancers at all levels in the company have spent some time at the RBS and that serious attempts are made to preserve the correct style of performing Ashton's works. As far as the RBS is concerned it would be good if it would at least introduce some Cecchetti based classes as that is the basis of Ashton's style and is significant  in the performance of Petipa's ballets in the appropriate style.

Edited June 20, 2016 by FLOSS

[betterankles]

The vision of an artistic director should be the reason they are appointed, to make this vision a reality over time.

And this vision should surely includes choices of repertoire, of dancers, choreographers, conductors, artistic staff, casting and promotions...

[penelopesimpson]

Anti-Osipova sentiment? I haven't detected anything other than concern and sometimes irritation that she has been very injury prone.

 

For my part she is a wonderful dancer who thrills her audience and am grateful she is at RB. However, I think Kevin O'Hare has made wise and bold choices and the RB will go from strength to strength.

[LinMM]

And from an article in the Times Culture magazine it seems Osipova very much considers the RB her home company now.

She was also hinting at the idea of dancing with Polunin with the RB as she thinks it's very much his company too!!

 

But for another thread I think.

 

I realise that in the Theatre and Film world a lot hangs on the Director/ artistic Director etc and what he likes and dislikes so perhaps that's par for the course in that environment and tough if he doesn't see your potential etc etc

Think how many famous actors have said they've been rejected by major drama schools and how many continually get rejected for parts but then get employed by another Director who does like what they see and so on.

It's slightly different because this is all usually free lance whereas people employed by one ballet company could get a bit trapped if things not turning out for them there.......what do you do ....make the best of your circumstances .....which may not be too bad or risk having months out of work. Not easy.

[FLOSS]

I wonder if the company is perhaps repositioning itself as far as the Ashton repertory is concerned. Next season there are almost as many programmes involving works by Ashton as there are programmes involving MacMillan's. It will be interesting to see whether being able to produce the goods in Ashton's ballets becomes an essential qualification for female dancers who are potential candidates for promotion.

 

Given the number of Principal dancers who are in their mid to late thirties and the number who have already left the company it would appear that Mr O' Hare is likely to be one of the few RB directors who actually gets to recruit and appoint his own team of Principal dancers rather than working, in large part, with someone else's chosen dancers. In a few years we shall see exactly what his vision for the company is as exemplified by his choice of Principals. The recent promotions  give a strong indication of the skill set he  thinks the company's leaders must have, their level of stylistic sensitivity towards the works of the choreographers whose ballets they perform and the relative value he places on technique and expressiveness. A director's choice of dancers to occupy the upper ranks of a company tells the audience just as much about his vison for his company as his choice of repertory does.

Edited June 21, 2016 by FLOSS