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How much is it about the body?


Flora
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Ok

Get child to begrudgingly sit by wall, nice and straight.

Measure where their head comes too. This gives you torso length. (Though also includes head but...anyway)

 

Measure height.

Minus torso from height to give you leg length.

 

Then (and this bit is tricky) I THINK you then divide leg length by height X 100? Now I could be wrong but I googled this?

I hope I'm wrong actually as DD's real measurement was so extraordinarily non classical we should really just pack up and go home right now!

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Just for fun last year, with my Years 8 - 10 class, I took two photos.  First one I got them to stand in a line side by side in height order.  Then I got them to sit with straight back, legs extended forwards (towards me) for the second one - the line of heads was very up and down in the second photo!

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So you measure from the floor (where they're sat) to the top of the head, then heir height, minus the first measurement from the second to get the leg measurement.

 

Then I'm totally befuddled as to the next stage! Luckily for Dd she is out shopping!

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Caught up with this thread today- there are plenty of successful dancers without the right physique but with something special to offer and plenty of dancers with the right physique that don't secure contracts.. To have both the body and special 'something ' must be great :)

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If I'm right it's

Height x 100 divided by inside leg measurement .

Please correct me if I've done it wrong anyone ... Still looking for that article .

 

Edited to say I have visions of poor children being frantically measured lol .

Edited by HAIRBELLES
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Have visions of racks & implement of medieval torture being used prior to an audition day to try to reach the 'golden leg to torso ratio'.....Please, please can't all this ridiculous measurement idea stop being talked about? How are our kids going to feel if we start getting a tape measure out? They are not stupid....they will ask what it's about then how did they measure up. Then what? Oh - your the ideal 'length leg' (so how do you explain a failure then?) or sorry, your legs are the wrong length (so then say well may as well stop dancing?) !!!!! :angry:  :angry:  :angry:

We would all say it is wrong to discuss bust sizes for maturing girls in the big wide (non dance) world & the imagery of big is best in the 'celebrity' world leading to boob jobs being sought by very young women is universally condemned. Well, this is surely just as bad.

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Have visions of racks & implement of medieval torture being used prior to an audition day to try to reach the 'golden leg to torso ratio'.....Please, please can't all this ridiculous measurement idea stop being talked about? How are our kids going to feel if we start getting a tape measure out? They are not stupid....they will ask what it's about then how did they measure up. Then what? Oh - your the ideal 'length leg' (so how do you explain a failure then?) or sorry, your legs are the wrong length (so then say well may as well stop dancing?) !!!!! :angry::angry::angry:

We would all say it is wrong to discuss bust sizes for maturing girls in the big wide (non dance) world & the imagery of big is best in the 'celebrity' world leading to boob jobs being sought by very young women is universally condemned. Well, this is surely just as bad.

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I don't know how I posted peanut68 comments again.

I don't think anyone on here is suggesting that there is a golden leg length.

And how can measuring proportions for potential be universally condemned as bad as encouraging boob jobs ?

This is a rhetorical question as I won't be logging back on to read the answer !!

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I really didn't mean to upset anyone! Sorry! I was just trying to balance a sensitive thread by giving a lighthearted example from the "less than ideal but not going to let it stop us but yes we are realistic but then hope springs eternal" point of view?!

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To me, the whole "ideal" leg length makes little sense to be honest. If it's about biomechanics, I can't imagine there can be a single universal ideal, as there will be so many other factors influencing things like elevation, extension and so on. And if it's purely about aesthetics....well, you shouldn't need to measure it should you? It seems a complete oxymoron to me, that anyone should measure something to decide whether it looks "right" or not - if something isn't apparent to the eye, does it really matter? Maybe I'm missing something, but if an observer can't tell the difference between, say a 47% ratio and this supposed ideal of 52% then can it really matter? And what looks ideal to one person may not to another anyway, there has to be a subjective element to the appreciation of any art form.

As a scientist myself, I'd rather like it if there was some kind of formula that would predict success (however you define that) but I can't imagine there ever will be one. Sports science is fascinating, but even in fields where success depends on objective measures like speed, height etc it's an inexact science. I've just finished reading Mark Cavendish's autobiography. "On paper" he basically does not have the physical attributes required for a top flight cyclist, and he was told that in no uncertain terms early in his career. But his career achievements say something very different. So many other things, including personality and mental abilities play a role - that's what makes humans so amazing really. How much more difficult therefore is it to predict outcome in dance, where artistry as well as physical prowess is key? We could all easily send ourselves quite mad trying to measure, analyse and predict the future.

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DD not too tramatised by results of measuring experiment. More troubled by some of tonight's lamb curry going down wrong way and now tedious hiccups. That leg of lamb has lasted well. It must surely have had excellent leg to lamb ratio.

 

Please no one take offence as none was ever intended. X

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I loved your 'leg to lamb' quote Petalviolet, it really made me laugh!

 

I just measured my Dd out of curiosity. She was in her room chatting with two friends (non dancers) and I got them all to quickly do it, saying that it was a quick height prediction quiz I was doing! Dd was 46% and her other two friends were 45.5% and 43.7%, so I would imagine that 52% is somewhat of a rarity in most normal, non dance, every day life kind of circles. When you watch some of the Vaganova exam videos it's the first thing that strikes you, just how extremely leggy those girls are :)

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That is reassuring atacrossroads! A real variation.

 

The Vagnova video was a bit unsettling. I was struck by the auditionees in just their underwear but that must be a cultural difference? Totally normal for them and that's just how it's done. It did make me feel protective over how exposed to criticism they literally were. Wanted to swoop in with a blanket. I'm sure auditions are conducted very privately but certainly a very rigorous approach.

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I watched another one yesterday Petalviolet that was set in Poland and again they had to stand, dance and be generally manipulated in front of a large panel of male and female staff in just knickers. I really felt for them as it seemed so humiliating and unnecessary.

 

My Dd and her friend had their spines examined during Elmhurst Finals by the physio, but in their leotards. That was 3 years ago. I would expect to be warned by a school if they were going to ask my Dd to take her leotard down for a stranger, as it goes against everything we and our schools tell our children is appropriate, acceptable behaviour.

 

I'd be interested to know if that is still happening now, or if that's happened to anyone else's Dc at finals?

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I loved your 'leg to lamb' quote Petalviolet, it really made me laugh!

I just measured my Dd out of curiosity. She was in her room chatting with two friends (non dancers) and I got them all to quickly do it, saying that it was a quick height prediction quiz I was doing! Dd was 46% and her other two friends were 45.5% and 43.7%, so I would imagine that 52% is somewhat of a rarity in most normal, non dance, every day life kind of circles. When you watch some of the Vaganova exam videos it's the first thing that strikes you, just how extremely leggy those girls are :)

In old days, they (panel at Russian ballet schools) just 'scanned' with their very experienced eye the prospective students at the preliminary audition on a 1/3rd basic, where 2/3 must be leg line from the hip, but it wasn't just the length what is important, but the very 'architecture' of the leg (and feet), CURVE and length of a muscle, narrow knee and ankle, and, of course some degree of swayback... The same principles for the arms (elbow, wrist) sholder line to the fingertips and so on...

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The aesthetic can't have been as crucial back in 1980 when they accepted Leanne Benjamin into Upper School. By that time of course she'd had top class Australian ballet training as a child.

She then then made it into the RBC in the early 90's, becoming a principal within a year, despite not having sway backs (but obviously so many other attributes that made her so beautiful to watch).

The question is, would she have been given the chance to become the dancer she became in today's associate system? Are prospective Leanne Benjamin's slipping through the net, being turned down, disenchanted, or financially unable to gain the required training go as far as she did.

 

 

 

I was just reading back through this thread and thought I would mention that Leanne Benjamin started her career at SWRB (now BRB) before moving to ENB and then following Peter Schaufuss to Berlin before coming back to the Royal.  As she was at least a soloist by then it is not surprising that she quickly rose to principal at the Royal.  She had plenty of experience in her previous companies.

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I found that really interesting also Janet. Why did RBC not take her out of school I wonder, only wanting her when she'd become so experienced elsewhere?

 

Even more surprising to me was why they didn't take Vadim Muntagirov out of Upper School. He has everything. He then rises extremely quickly at ENB and then they want him back and as a Lead Principal. I wonder how many of the RBC Principals have come to them straight out of Upper School and risen through the ranks? And of those, how many are British?

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My Dd is definitely leggy and even my maths could figure that her leg to whole height ratio is 50%. I think her legs look even longer because she's got a high waist or a long bum or something (11 inches difference between waist to floor and inside leg) and a small upper body (shoulder to waist is 12inches). She must also have a long head...

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