Private Classes Better?

[hellogoodbye]

Hello all, just want to get some advice from the more experienced here...

 

DD(9) is now moving onto Grade3 ballet so will be doing two classes a week. Trouble is the timings of these classes are really difficult as all her family work full-time and the classes are before 5pm on weekdays (grade 2 class was on a weekend).

 

We might be able to make it work but the head of her ballet school has offered an alternative which is one private class each week at a more convenient time.

 

Naturally I would imagine one private class would be more beneficial to her in terms of progress than two classes of 12-15 kids... would you agree?

 

DD does ballet to support her musical theatre training... ballet is her least favourite style of dance. I don't think she would have the time of her life in a private class but she knows ballet is what she's got to do if she wants to do well in musical theatre. She wants to get to Grade4 so she can audition for Matilda the Musical. Do you think a private class would increase the chances of this happening sooner? If so that might convince her. It's certainly easier for me logistically. 

Edited April 2, 2015 by hellogoodbye

[hfbrew]

One to one attention from a good teacher versus one in twelve...

Hmm, worth a try dont you think?!

 

Short answer is yes, getting to grade 4 standard may well be quicker this way.

[sarahw]

Hellogoodbye

 

Personally I would go with whatever suits you best - working full time is hard enough.

 

I would think a private lesson would speed progress but some skill acquisition is a matter of time.

 

I would discuss with the teacher. She obviously wants to keep your dd in ballet which is a good sign. She may feel she already has the strength etc to pass G3 and that it's just a matter of learning the work.

[Circe]

Seems good idea if also balaned with class work. Could be very expensive though!

[hellogoodbye]

One to one attention from a good teacher versus one in twelve...

Hmm, worth a try dont you think?!

 

Short answer is yes, getting to grade 4 standard may well be quicker this way.

 

Thank you. It does seem like a no-brainer, I suppose my concern was whether she should be doing ballet twice a week as opposed to once a week? I don't know whether there's something to gain from re-visiting the training more often, or whether one private trumps that.

 

It's a choice of two hours a week normal classes or 45 mins a week private.

 

We wouldn't be able to afford to send her to a normal ballet class as well. Though she could keep doing her modern/tap once a week and musical theatre.

Edited April 2, 2015 by hellogoodbye

[Lisa O`Brien]

I would imagine two classes spread out over the week would be far more beneficial than just one class,even if the one class was slightly longer in length. It all depends,of course,on the quality of the teaching;that really is of paramount importance. Being taught by a poor ballet teacher[i know from personal experience] and it can take a very long time to undo the bad habits picked up that were not corrected. Of course,the million dollar question is,what is a poor quality teacher,and would a parent or the pupil know if they had one?

Edited April 2, 2015 by thequays

[Petalviolet]

Being taught by a poor ballet teacher[i know from personal experience] and it can take a very long time to undo the bad habits picked up that were not corrected. Of course,the million dollar question is,what is a poor quality teacher,and would a parent or the pupil know if they had one?

Thequays has put the fear of god into me rather early today. This is a very interesting conundrum and if ever you feel like starting such a thread I'd be keen to see what general advice dancers had? How WOULD I know? :-(

 

Hellogoodbye - my DD learnt so much more in her privates I would honestly say they were worth two or more normal. If you can afford them and your DD won't miss the class experience then she will benefit from the focus. It's much more intense and my DD was a bit glazed afterwards! If she gets on with her teacher well then she might blossom under the one to one instruction and, you never know, come to enjoy it a bit more? Our arrangements were an informal one as her teacher just loved to come over and spend time with DD in the holidays or every once in a while during term and even though her teacher has moved on she still keeps an eye on progress. Your DD has potential and somebody behind her ready to give her the attention to succeed- I think go for it!

[hfbrew]

Thank you. It does seem like a no-brainer, I suppose my concern was whether she should be doing ballet twice a week as opposed to once a week? I don't know whether there's something to gain from re-visiting the training more often, or whether one private trumps that.

 

It's a choice of two hours a week normal classes or 45 mins a week private.

 

We wouldn't be able to afford to send her to a normal ballet class as well. Though she could keep doing her modern/tap once a week and musical theatre.

If it means that she can still do her modern/tap class plus musical theatre then I think give the private lessons a try. I only insist on two Ballet lessons a week in the run up to exams by the way, most of my students wouldn't want to commit to more even if they could.( Obviously its a different matter for those who are really keen and I have a handful who do as many classes as they are allowed!)

 

If Ballet is not her favourite then one 45min private session as opposed to two hours with large classes seems a much better use of time!

 

As for good teaching, well for starters is the teacher well qualified and registered with a main board (ISTD, RAD etc). I know this is no absolute guarantee but teachers with these boards have undergone years of training and have to maintain continuous professional development too. Also check public liability insurance! If this teacher enters students for exams, are the results consistent? And I don't mean do they all get high marks as this is sometime a sign that only the very best students get entered. A better idea is whether the students with less facility are being taught well enough to pass, in which case the teaching is very probably sound!

[hellogoodbye]

 

If Ballet is not her favourite then one 45min private session as opposed to two hours with large classes seems a much better use of time!

 

 

You speak much sense, thank you, and this is how I will propose it to DD!

 

She's a good performer but it's her technique that needs work. Hopefully a private will be the perfect way to sort that out as she won't be able to get away with it one-to-one! 

 

Thank you all for the prompt advice.

[Lisa O`Brien]

Thequays has put the fear of god into me rather early today. This is a very interesting conundrum and if ever you feel like starting such a thread I'd be keen to see what general advice dancers had? How WOULD I know? :-(

 

Hellogoodbye - my DD learnt so much more in her privates I would honestly say they were worth two or more normal. If you can afford them and your DD won't miss the class experience then she will benefit from the focus. It's much more intense and my DD was a bit glazed afterwards! If she gets on with her teacher well then she might blossom under the one to one instruction and, you never know, come to enjoy it a bit more? Our arrangements were an informal one as her teacher just loved to come over and spend time with DD in the holidays or every once in a while during term and even though her teacher has moved on she still keeps an eye on progress. Your DD has potential and somebody behind her ready to give her the attention to succeed- I think go for it!

It was only after I had left my local dancing school and went to the Northern Ballet School in Manchester when I was 12 that both my mum and myself realised I had had a poor teacher for the previous 3 years. So many things were wrong with my basic posture before I had even danced a step that were never corrected at my first dancing school. The most obvious one I remember was the way I used to stand and arch my back. I didn`t know,of course that my back was arched. Until it took my teacher at the Northern almost a year through continuously correcting and reminding me at ever single lesson to stand straight. Then she used to shout "elbows" at me.!  It sounds funny,but my arms were not properly placed and I looked like some sort of a scarecrow. These two problem areas ,to a good teacher,should have been picked up straight away. They were not. For 3 years. If I hadn`t have left I would never have known. To say nothing of the teacher gossiping with parents and being too friendly and chatty with them,instead of maintaining an air of professionalism and treating every parent and child exactly the same. And yes,my dancing teacher was qualified,with the NATD. I honestly don`t know how you would know for sure if you had a good teacher or not.There are so many factors. High exam grade results MIGHT be an indicator of a good teacher. I don`t think anyone at our dancing school ever got high marks in exams. And the school always came last in any local competitions compared to other schools in the North West. Often the teacher was so keen to be teaching the group tap,because that is what the majority of children wanted to learn,that I would be lucky if we got 15 minutes out of the hour spent on ballet. I was the only one there even remotely interested in ballet. Does the teacher actually give students and their parents what they want? Or does she have her own rules and ideas and sticks rigidly to them ,even when it isn`t what her pupils and their parents want?  I suppose at the end of the day you have to use your judgement,and possibly the only way you might be able to compare a good or not so good teacher/school, is to go and watch a number of different classes at another school. Watch how the students dance,and how the teacher corrects them and conducts herself.

Edited April 2, 2015 by thequays

[Petalviolet]

Thank you hfbrew and thequays- wise words indeed! Sorry to take thread off at a tangent hellogoodbye, let us know how the privates progress!

[hellogoodbye]

Thank you hfbrew and thequays- wise words indeed! Sorry to take thread off at a tangent hellogoodbye, let us know how the privates progress!

 

Not at all. Spoke to DD and she's happy to do privates - after the comments here I'm quite pleased actually, seems like a great idea. I will post back later on to let everyone know how she's getting on.

 

Her ballet school is one of those like you're talking about... they only enter kids for examinations if they think they're going to get distinction, otherwise they don't enter them. So maybe not the best reflection.

 

Personally I would rather they enter DD earlier and her pass with merit so that she can at least move on and learn new things. But maybe that's me not really understanding ballet - I appreciate that the technique is so important and should be perfect. At her musical theatre school she's constantly getting nagged at for her arched back and (lack of) turn-out. The teachers always tell me to put her in ballet classes and I have to explain that she already is!! Trouble is she's more of a performer - not one to pay attention to detail!!   Hopefully with privates those things can all be drilled.

Edited April 2, 2015 by hellogoodbye

[annaliesey]

My dd is 10 and did grade 3 exam a couple of months ago.

 

I would definitely recommend the RAD app for iPad, iPhone or tablet as it is working ok now. Unfortunately it didn't work when she did G3 but she's using it alongside teaching for G4 purely as it helps to learn the dances and then she can concentrate in technique in lessons.

 

The RAD have "recommended study hours" for each grade and for grade 3 it's 75 hours so that might provide a guide into the hours they recommend for study and I think it includes practise.

 

Having said that, the RAD do allow students to skip grades and it's down to the teacher so possibly she could go straight into grade 4 if your teacher was happy with that and if she could attend those classes at a different time to save on money with private tuition, especially if she purely wants to be in the grade to go for Mathilda role I think the advert I saw just says "working at grade 4"

 

My DD went through a period of having a few privates, then sharing some privates with 2 other students and also her main weekly class. She has said the shared privates were best as main class has too many newbies/basic corrections/slow pace, and private 1:2:1 ok but the shared privates meant learning from each other's corrections aswell as own and very motivational and fast paced with 3 eager students working at same level.

 

Hope that helps

[youngatheart]

If the issue is basic postural/technique problems and her performance side is good, I would totally agree that privates would be the way to go, at least in the short-term. It will enable the teacher to focus on things that are specific to her, without her faults needing to be constantly highlighted in a group setting, which could be very demotivating and sap her confidence which is the last thing you want.

 

"Working at grade 4 level" does not mean that she needs to have passed the Grade 4 exam, it means that as a minimum she should be working towards Grade 4 with a good knowledge of the vocabulary and mastery of the technique of that Grade. However different syllabi have different vocabulary for each grade, so not quite sure how that would work out in reality!

 

If she has not yet fully mastered the Grade 3 work, moving up to Grade 4 now would probably be counter-productive. It will be easier to address problems at the lower level and then apply them to the Grade 4 work later. No she would not need to actually take the exam before moving up to Grade 4 (unless doing this is important to either her or her teacher) but she would need to be good enough to be capable of passing it, preferably with a high merit or distinction, in order to meet her goals.

[Picturesinthefirelight]

With specific regards to Matilda there is nowhere in the casting brief that specifies grade 4 ballet (or indeed any ballet) just that the children need to be under a certain height & be excellent singers & dancers.

 

The part of Verucca in Charlie & the Choc factory does specify a ballet grade, but even there I know a child who got through to recalls who was only in Grade 3.

[Pups_mum]

I think there are pros and cons of private lessons. At 17 my DD is one of the oldest and most advanced students at our local dance school, and the only one who is serious about ballet. Nobody else has carried on with ballet beyond intermediate and she is now studying advanced 2, so although she does class with the younger ones quite often, all her lessons at her own level are private. She has 3 hours private tuition a week, which obviously does have the advantage of being entirely focussed on her, but she misses being I class with others around the same level. As well as that little element of competition that dancing with others beings, there is a lot to be learned from listening to other people's corrections and compliments. DD really looks forward to summer schools and workshops for that reason.

I think that both methods of teaching have their place. Without doubt, private lessons are invaluable if you have something very specific to work on, but there is also a great deal to be gained from regular class with others. Personally, I would say that a mix is best, and unless circumstances make it unavoidable I would be cautious about opting for 100% private lessons.

[hellogoodbye]

With specific regards to Matilda there is nowhere in the casting brief that specifies grade 4 ballet (or indeed any ballet) just that the children need to be under a certain height & be excellent singers & dancers.

 

The part of Verucca in Charlie & the Choc factory does specify a ballet grade, but even there I know a child who got through to recalls who was only in Grade 3.

 

The casting doesn't specifically say ballet but it does say kids need to be Grade 4, so we've opted for ballet. I think the Grade 4 is there to be a guideline rather than because the kids need the vocabulary. The dancing in Matilda is hard so they use the 'Grade 4' requirement to avoid seeing time-wasters who doesn't have enough dance experience.

 

We know several girls who've been cast in Matilda ensemble who were in fact not grade 4, but they were very very small in height and got cast as the tiny ensemble member. DD is not one of the lucky small ones so I think if she really wants to give it her best shot, she'll have to meet the technical requirements to stand a chance. 

[Dance*is*life]

In my opinion a strong ballet technique is vital even if all you want to do is musical theatre or modern.  At the school where I teach all students are grounded in ballet before being allowed to start learning the other dance genres.  If you look at the short CVs of the dancers in all the West End musicals, which I always do, you will see that they have all graduated from vocational schools and performing arts schools, where ballet is taught seriously.  Your daughter may have aspirations to perform on the West End stage and not in Covent Garden, but that doesn't mean that she doesn't need to invest seriously in ballet training.  If they are complaining of her stance and turn-out at the musical theatre school and the same ballet teacher who trains her for RAD classes is going to give her privates, I'm afraid that doesn't fill me with confidence.