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Studying Dance at Uni


kinola67

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Hi everyone, after discovering your forum by chance I thought I'd ask for some advice - as you all seem very knowledgeable! My oldest daughter is leaving school after then end of this academic year and is keen on doing a dance degree. We are in Scotland and the choice here is not huge. She is a dancer rather than an actor or singer so I am trying to persuade her that performance school/college are not her best bet. Why doesn't she use her grades to get into Uni or try for one of the conservatoires? she is coming round to this way of thinking but we are struggling to find out where is good to go...the Dance degree at Surrey looks good, we have spoken to Trinity and NSCD re contemporary courses. We have to factor in cost - would save us a huge headache if she stayed in Scotland....but I also feel if this is something she really wants to do, maybe it's best to get out there and experience as much as she can in different areas. Also thinking about possible career choices with a Uni degree - would need to pay off the loans somehow! One of the many cross roads of life needing sorted out - I am sure many of you have experienced or are experiencing similar and might be able to help. Many thanks! Nicola.

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Welcome to the forum, kinola67. :)

 

What sort of dance does your daughter do, and what sort of career is she aiming for when she graduates? What standard is she working at?

 

In terms of university dance degrees, these threads may be helpful:

 

http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/11679-dance-at-uni/?hl=%26quot%3Bdance+degree%26quot%3B#entry158225

 

http://www.balletcoforum.com/index.php?/topic/9005-studying-dance-at-uni/?hl=%22dance+degree%22

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Hi Anna, thanks so much for responding - really appreciate it! She is at Manor School of Ballet and has been since primary. Her main passion though is contemporary and jazz. She got a distinction in her latest RAD ballet exam (I get so mixed up with all the grades, I can't remember which one it was!) and we do Highers here in Scotland at school, luckily they ran the Higher course last year (sometimes there are not enough pupils to run it) and got an A - she really enjoyed that course. She does love performing but also wants to use her academic grades (I hope!) and is I think looking to her long term employment, well at least I am. She has a friend who got into Elmhurst and is now at Central and she can see the work involved with that training. She would not be dedicated enough for that even if she was good enough at ballet. It's one of those tricky ones where although she could go off and do a Uni course in something completely unrelated - there is nothing she really wants to do other than something dance related as that is what she feels engaged in. I am trying to hold back to some extent as I don't want to go on and on about careers - as my mother did with me, which backfired!! I will look at the threads - thank you for passing them on!

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If you want to hedge your bets a little bit, a friend's daughter studied Dance joint honours at Leicester De Montfort - also covers arts administration.

 

My friend's daughter was not the worlds best dancer, however much she loved it.  She used her degree to go into Wedding planning for a multinational hotel group, and has travelled the world with them.

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A friends DD is wanting to do dance at university. Among those they are looking at are LIPA, Arden Theatre College (Manchester), Leeds Beckett and Derby. She mentioned that they are attending a UCAS event in Manchester in October which includes dance and guidance on courses. This is the event that is closest to them but they do them apparently in lots of different towns and cities. Perhaps a search for UCAS events on google might help you find one nearer to you

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Thanks everyone for the replies, I think that's the key, knowing your limits with the practical side of dance and training and seeing what else you could get out of a course but incorporating dance within it somehow. De Montfort seems to have come up a couple of times so will have a look at their website. DD definitely wants to travel so a year abroad within a course would be good. Wedding planning sounds like my idea of hell ! but that does sound like an amazing job for those good at planning! I will also look at the other places mentioned, I don't know any of those ones. I'm also thinking about travel for her and me from Edinburgh, we can get mostly anywhere but I guess thinking some routes might be easier (and cheaper!) than others. I will see if there are any events near us, there was one that she went to with the school but I think the only dance type course was Sunderland Uni, which she wasn't overly impressed with. I have no idea how I have managed to produce a child that wants to do a dance degree! but it's all very exciting!

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Hi

The RAD/BBO do teaching courses leading to degrees if that's of any interest.

 

Another possibility is physio degree with the chance to specialise in dancers later on.

 

Does she have other areas of interest? The dance degrees at uni are very different to the vocational course her friend will be on at Central. I think they're mostly all contemporary and the level of dance may be less than she's used to.I would look very carefully at graduate destinations.

 

Good luck!

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Many of the Dance degrees at universities (as opposed to Conservatoires which offer degrees) may not give enough training for a dance career at the very top of the profession. I tend only to know of the English situation. As far as I know the only thing near the mix your DD might like is Theatre Studies at Glasgow, where her dance background could be transferred to a broader sense of performance (eg physical theatre - think DV8 or Vincent Dance, or Frantic Assembly - all of these on English A Level syllabi, I think).

 

But it sounds as though she's more interested in musical theatre? LIPA, Mountview, might be the options there. At conservatoires such as Laban, The Place, or Northern [English!] Contemporary school, she may find the focus on contemporary dance quite different: it's not commercial dance, which a lot of teens think is "modern" or "contemporary" dance!

 

As an example - I've just started teaching a new module where I introduce a number of performance concepts via some pretty basic contemporary dance stuff based on release technique, Horton & graham (that just reflects the stuff I know & have learnt over the years - what's in my body!). It wasn't a dance class as such, but a way of getting them focused & centred & thinking about some performance principles for some text-based work. But I was very surprised that even those who said they had a dance background found the simple stuff quite unfamiliar - I think they had a background in commercial or jazz dance. Very different.

 

So, there may be QUITE a difference between advanced ie University level dance studies and what she's done in a private ballet school since a small child. Contemporary dance is far more linked to experimental theatre, live art, and performance art 

 

A possibility would be to look at performing arts university courses: Queen Margaret's in Edinburgh used to have an interesting one (at least when I did a QAA monitoring a decade ago!). Glasgow's is excellent, and has a strong - world-leading really - tradition of Live Art and Performance Art. Dance comes into this sort of performance work, but not in the way most teenaged jazz dancers might understand it! But a good Theatre Studies/Drama degree with a fair degree of focus on experimental or live art (Lancaster is another one - excellent programme) will allow a student with a dance background to use that dance training in exploring contemporary experimental performance more generally.

 

Surrey, Roehampton & Plymouth (and to a lesser extent, Falmouth) offer good all round dance degrees, again with a focus on contemporary and  ballet training (but not jazz/musical theatre as far as I know) although I wouldn't think they aim to turn out dancers working in companies such as Richard Alston, or Rambert etc. But a lot of graduates from these universities will find dance-related jobs - for example, have a look at the work of dancers in community-based Dance Agencies (not theatrical agencies which get performers work!), such as Ludus in Lancaster, DanceXchange in Birmingham, the fantastic agency in Newcastle: Dance City.  General useful information here:  http://www.onedanceuk.org/

One Dance UK (used to be DanceUK!)

 

Also, your DD might do an entirely unrelated course in a city where there is good private dance teaching. There are various threads in here on that, to help us all find good studios for adults.

 

Hope this helps!

Edited by Kate_N
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It might be worth your DD looking at Ballet West in Taynuilt. Though it has a very strong ballet focus their contemporary training is excellent too. My DD who has always been a classical ballet dancer before is now in her third year at Ballet West and has now decided she really wants to persue contemporary when she graduates. In her words "ballet is lovely but I love the fact that you can express very different things in contemporary". She loves the choreography too. Plus, now this is a real shock, she actually has stepped out of her comfort zone into commercial jazz dance as well (I never thought I would see the day!). So there are lots of opportunities for different types of dance and it is working to a degree! Please PM me if you have specific questions.

 

Dramascientist

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Hi everyone, after discovering your forum by chance I thought I'd ask for some advice - as you all seem very knowledgeable! My oldest daughter is leaving school after then end of this academic year and is keen on doing a dance degree. We are in Scotland and the choice here is not huge. She is a dancer rather than an actor or singer so I am trying to persuade her that performance school/college are not her best bet. Why doesn't she use her grades to get into Uni or try for one of the conservatoires? she is coming round to this way of thinking but we are struggling to find out where is good to go...the Dance degree at Surrey looks good, we have spoken to Trinity and NSCD re contemporary courses. We have to factor in cost - would save us a huge headache if she stayed in Scotland....but I also feel if this is something she really wants to do, maybe it's best to get out there and experience as much as she can in different areas. Also thinking about possible career choices with a Uni degree - would need to pay off the loans somehow! One of the many cross roads of life needing sorted out - I am sure many of you have experienced or are experiencing similar and might be able to help. Many thanks! Nicola.

Hi Kinola67, 

 

A couple of things, a fellow student at my DD dance student is preparing to apply to Uni's for a joint degree. Not sure which uni but it's for geography and dance. The culmination of which will give her sufficient degree to be teach both academic and dance as subjects. Manchester was mentioned.

 

After research for my eldest UNI courses do not offer as much studio time as a performing arts college or ballet school. It's purely down to personal preference.

 

The Conservatoire of Scotland in Glasgow looked amazing.

 

As you come from Scotland I'm hoping that you may be able to answer some questions regarding the educational qualifications.  

 

HND - Is it the Scottish equivalent to English A Levels and with that qualification recognised for Uni entry? I'm a tad confused but can't seem to find the answers I'm looking for.  Ballet West offer HND for the first 2 years of the 3 yr course. And, just like you I'm trying to research as much as possible for the "just in case" scenario. Incase of injury, change of personal plans or changes beyond their control in the future. Our darlings ( we were like them at their age) only look at the here and now and now necessarily 5 years down the line and beyond.  

 

Thank you. 

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Or maybe HNC/HND dance at college then onto degree later? I know lots of people who've done that, although definitely performer careers. You'd need to check what degree the HND could be carried forward into

Hi, thanks for getting back to me, there is Edinburgh College (which was 3 colleges which have now merged) that does a dance degree but it seems to be a very roundabout way of getting there, I think you go to a dance school for year 1, spend 2 years at the college doing the HND then a final year to get the BA. Yes that would be the cheaper option! but my DD doesn't want to stay in Edinburgh, she wants to experience city living elsewhere (of course) and doesn't want to live at home either (can't blame her!!) Edinburgh University does have what looks like a great MA course for graduates - that would be a great choice for getting a teaching qualification later on, when I am sure she will return to her home city realising infact how lovely it is!

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Many of the Dance degrees at universities (as opposed to Conservatoires which offer degrees) may not give enough training for a dance career at the very top of the profession. I tend only to know of the English situation. As far as I know the only thing near the mix your DD might like is Theatre Studies at Glasgow, where her dance background could be transferred to a broader sense of performance (eg physical theatre - think DV8 or Vincent Dance, or Frantic Assembly - all of these on English A Level syllabi, I think).

 

But it sounds as though she's more interested in musical theatre? LIPA, Mountview, might be the options there. At conservatoires such as Laban, The Place, or Northern [English!] Contemporary school, she may find the focus on contemporary dance quite different: it's not commercial dance, which a lot of teens think is "modern" or "contemporary" dance!

 

As an example - I've just started teaching a new module where I introduce a number of performance concepts via some pretty basic contemporary dance stuff based on release technique, Horton & graham (that just reflects the stuff I know & have learnt over the years - what's in my body!). It wasn't a dance class as such, but a way of getting them focused & centred & thinking about some performance principles for some text-based work. But I was very surprised that even those who said they had a dance background found the simple stuff quite unfamiliar - I think they had a background in commercial or jazz dance. Very different.

 

So, there may be QUITE a difference between advanced ie University level dance studies and what she's done in a private ballet school since a small child. Contemporary dance is far more linked to experimental theatre, live art, and performance art 

 

A possibility would be to look at performing arts university courses: Queen Margaret's in Edinburgh used to have an interesting one (at least when I did a QAA monitoring a decade ago!). Glasgow's is excellent, and has a strong - world-leading really - tradition of Live Art and Performance Art. Dance comes into this sort of performance work, but not in the way most teenaged jazz dancers might understand it! But a good Theatre Studies/Drama degree with a fair degree of focus on experimental or live art (Lancaster is another one - excellent programme) will allow a student with a dance background to use that dance training in exploring contemporary experimental performance more generally.

 

Surrey, Roehampton & Plymouth (and to a lesser extent, Falmouth) offer good all round dance degrees, again with a focus on contemporary and  ballet training (but not jazz/musical theatre as far as I know) although I wouldn't think they aim to turn out dancers working in companies such as Richard Alston, or Rambert etc. But a lot of graduates from these universities will find dance-related jobs - for example, have a look at the work of dancers in community-based Dance Agencies (not theatrical agencies which get performers work!), such as Ludus in Lancaster, DanceXchange in Birmingham, the fantastic agency in Newcastle: Dance City.  General useful information here:  http://www.onedanceuk.org/

One Dance UK (used to be DanceUK!)

 

Also, your DD might do an entirely unrelated course in a city where there is good private dance teaching. There are various threads in here on that, to help us all find good studios for adults.

 

Hope this helps!

Thanks very much indeed for this - yes it does help. DD is not a singer (I blame the husband for that!) and shies away from acting parts so really we are looking at dance as the main passion. I can understand how odd it seems for the youngsters not to know what contemporary really means in terms of expressing their dance, I would say the dance school she has been at, although known for ballet mainly, does try to incorporate contemporary style into shows etc DD has also done a really good course with another company (can't remember the name!) over two years - which was more along the contemporary route, the first time I saw her perform this I was quite amazed...it really did look so different. When we went to 'move it' in London we spoke to the contemporary schools which was interesting and came away thinking yes that's what she wanted to do. But her dance school changed her mind by saying you need to cover all bases to start with and try for performing arts schools. But we have come right round to thinking that a degree either in contemporary or in a dance related subject would best suit her talents and good grades (you can imagine it is me who is thinking about the grades!), it also means she can diversify more easily if it all goes belly up after first year. So at the moment (of course it could change any time!) we are narrowing it down to those choices which means applying through UCAS to Unis and to Laban/Glasgow/Leeds. We also have to take in practical matters such as travel and accomodation. I found Surrey by accident when trawling the internet, it looks great as there are a few joint honours courses which might be of interest, I will look at Roehampton too. I love the south west but Plymouth will be too far!

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It might be worth your DD looking at Ballet West in Taynuilt. Though it has a very strong ballet focus their contemporary training is excellent too. My DD who has always been a classical ballet dancer before is now in her third year at Ballet West and has now decided she really wants to persue contemporary when she graduates. In her words "ballet is lovely but I love the fact that you can express very different things in contemporary". She loves the choreography too. Plus, now this is a real shock, she actually has stepped out of her comfort zone into commercial jazz dance as well (I never thought I would see the day!). So there are lots of opportunities for different types of dance and it is working to a degree! Please PM me if you have specific questions.

 

Dramascientist

Hi thanks so much for getting back to me, she has done a summer school at Ballet West and did love it but it's too remote for her. I would love it I have to say but she is a city girl at heart! That's good that your DD has discovered her inner dancing passions - if she has a talent for choreography that will be an important asset, my DD loves that side of things and I think it's something that could keep her going in future employment!

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A rather simple way to assess the type of dance degree/course is whether entry is by audition, or by A levels/UCAS points.  If the former the standard of classes will be higher, if the latter, the focus will be more theoretical.

Thanks for getting back to me, yes I noticed last night whilst trawling the internet, some youtube videos of stuents talking about their auditions for Uni, so guessing it's not as easy to get into some as others, not like applying for a regular course based on points only.

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Hi Kinola67, 

 

A couple of things, a fellow student at my DD dance student is preparing to apply to Uni's for a joint degree. Not sure which uni but it's for geography and dance. The culmination of which will give her sufficient degree to be teach both academic and dance as subjects. Manchester was mentioned.

 

After research for my eldest UNI courses do not offer as much studio time as a performing arts college or ballet school. It's purely down to personal preference.

 

The Conservatoire of Scotland in Glasgow looked amazing.

 

As you come from Scotland I'm hoping that you may be able to answer some questions regarding the educational qualifications.  

 

HND - Is it the Scottish equivalent to English A Levels and with that qualification recognised for Uni entry? I'm a tad confused but can't seem to find the answers I'm looking for.  Ballet West offer HND for the first 2 years of the 3 yr course. And, just like you I'm trying to research as much as possible for the "just in case" scenario. Incase of injury, change of personal plans or changes beyond their control in the future. Our darlings ( we were like them at their age) only look at the here and now and now necessarily 5 years down the line and beyond.  

 

Thank you. 

Hi thanks for getting back to me, yes Glasgow looks great, we are going to the open day to find out more, I don't think it's as ballet based as we thought it was which would suit my DD but we'll see what they say. A joint degree was something I thought of ages ago but as they are relatively new in the UK (for dance anyway) it's hard to know what graduates are doing later on, where do they end up I wonder?

HND is done after school so like the first and second year of Uni, then folk if they want to go onto to the 3rd/4th year to do the BA or BSc, which could be done at a different Uni I'm assuming. Ballet West is mentioned above - you could ask about the entry requirements. My DD did a summer school there and loved it!

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Thanks Kinola67, 

 

My DD also attended the Ballet West SS this July. Absolutely loved it, Would have stayed given half the chance!! I think the wild deer trotting across the driveway as she walked back to her chalet, sealed the deal!!!

 

Going back to HND, if my DD completed 1st and 2nd year and completed her HND then decided either it wasn't for her or the decision was made for her (you just never know). Would an HND be sufficient for entry to a Uni for some courses? As BW do not offer A levels like other vocational schools I was wondering if this was because they were in Scotland and I wasn't familiar with the educational system. Thank you  :)

Edited by balletbean
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Thank you Picturesinthefirelight. 

 

Armed now with this further information is helpful. Local student education dept were clueless. And that's being polite!

 

We aren't in the UK so have access to completely different type of funding. Fortunately, by the looks of things  -  at the moment.  ;)

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Yes the above is right, it seems (from my trawling) that many students will do an HND to give them a good basis for either going on to get work or completing a degree at the same place of study or elsewhere, assuming it has to be in a related field. In Scotland, we don't do A levels (not at state schools anyway) but we do Highers in 5th year and Advanced Highers in 6th year. Many of our honours degrees are 4 years and tuition is free for those living in Scotland (that's why it's such a big decision for us to consider going down south!) HND is a more advanced qualification than both Highers and A Levels so if your DD got that, she could then decide what to do next, but yes if 2 years of funding were used up at HND level at one college/uni, then there might only be funding for one more year if the subject of study is only a 3 year course - which most of the dance related ones seem to be. I think!! Here's me thinking once we got the exam results everything would be easy and fall into place - hehe. You're right, they are thinking in the here and now, we are thinking forward to the mortgage/children/life. Good luck with your research!

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Thank you. Explained it beautifully.

Slightly different here. Funding for HND would be classed as a different level of qualification to a BA (Hons) so funding would be available should decisions change. Thankfully. Thinking of no retirement anytime soon though. Even if DD is funded travel costs won't be!! Eek. Life was so simple when they were babies.

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Thanks Kinola67, 

 

My DD also attended the Ballet West SS this July. Absolutely loved it, Would have stayed given half the chance!! I think the wild deer trotting across the driveway as she walked back to her chalet, sealed the deal!!!

 

Going back to HND, if my DD completed 1st and 2nd year and completed her HND then decided either it wasn't for her or the decision was made for her (you just never know). Would an HND be sufficient for entry to a Uni for some courses? As BW do not offer A levels like other vocational schools I was wondering if this was because they were in Scotland and I wasn't familiar with the educational system. Thank you  :)

Hello balletbean

 

The first years at ballet west are given the possibility to do at least English highers exams through Oban High. I don't know if they can take more subjects too, I know one of the first years parents was looking into that. My dd started ballet west this year, but she finished her highers this year, so I have not personally looked into this.

 

What week of summer school did your dd do? Mine did week 1 :-)

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Hi Frost, 

 

More info, great, can never have too much. 

 

We were at Ballet West for the last week.  July was rather challenging to schedule all the events in. Birthdays, school activity week, DD Graduation and a SS. Needed the whole of August to recover!!

 

Really keen to return next summer, ideally for 2 weeks according to my DD. Just trying to sort the diary out as her academic school are finishing a week later than they ever have before! 

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[quote name="Frost" post="185739" timestamp="1474486827"

 

The first years at ballet west are given the possibility to do at least English highers exams through Oban High. I don't know if they can take more subjects too, I know one of the first years parents was looking into that. My dd started ballet west this year, but she finished her highers this year, so I have not personally looked into this.

 

I asked if they were able to take the Advanced Higher English exam and was told this wasn't possible.

Edited by All4dancers
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