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Questions about Lower School auditions


outofmydepth

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Hi fussier, simply because she missed us so much and we missed her. The knowledge I have now is, if the dance school is good and your child is part of an associat scheme, then I believe that kind of training is good enough to get them into a good upper ballet school. I am only talking about my experience, everyone is different. In addition to what I have said, a majority of dancers in my daughter year at Central did not go to vocational school. Having said that a majority of them were senior associates with ThebRoyal Ballet. I feel ALS o that my daughter missed out on things that happened in her own home/town etc. when she comes home she doesn't know many people and had left her old friends behind at primary school. At the beginning of our journey my daughter really wanted to go to a vocational school and we supported her in this choice. No one told us how painful it would be though. Vocational school does give your child lots of positive experiences though, and some children are more than happy to be at these schools doing what they love to do, I just feel that I missed out.

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I think this would be my preferred option too Tulip if I had a DD/DS in a perfect world that is!!

So if can find an excellent local dance school and can attend associate classes(if selected of course) and summer schools then waiting till 16 before attending vocational level schools would be the ideal!!

 

But of course not everyone does have an excellent school that can carry some childrens progress at the appropriate rate for their talent so then going off earlier to vocational school may have tobe the option chosen to give more potential of success.

 

I don't suppose many of us would turn down a scholarship place at the RBS if offered to DC's at any age!! Provided they wanted to go of course!!

But it is lovely having children at home.....even if one starts to see less and less of them as they get to the teenage yrs!

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It is indeed a double edged sword! I cannot imagine life without my ds at home and being honest a yes would devastate me and my dh. My ds and his sister, aged 8, are extremely close (Ivf embryo twins born 2.5 years apart) and they have already expressed how much they will each miss the other if it's an eventual yes. To be honest we were incredibly shocked when ds told us of his wishes. He is shy, quiet and not the confident sort, the last child you would imagine going off to boarding school. However, I think, like others have said, that he just wants to be with like minded boys. He is not into football/rugby as all his friends are and at his primary school ballet is not really on the radar. Not one of his teachers or indeed the head have wished him luck or even enquired how his audition went. They didn't even realise he was a JA with RBS until recently. Basically if you're sporty you're of interest and if you're not, like my ds then you will not be noticed. I just want him to feel that he fits in and if this is his chosen path then we have to trust him and allow him the chance. After waiting nine years for his arrival it would break my heart to wave goodbye aged 11 but I feel safe in the knowledge that if he were lucky enough to win a place and then hated it he can come home, no questions asked.

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Even now I still say to my daughter if she ever wanted to change her career choice, that would always be fine with us. She is 17 now and is still driven by her ballet. She has always known she could come home, but she believed at the time vocational school was the right way to go.

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I was very touched by your post Mvobe and of course vocational school is only workable if they are happy there!!

 

Some close friends of mine waited 10 yrs before their first child (with a little help from fertility drugs) was born. when she was born at the Rosie in Cambridge I drove there as quickly as I could from London at the time and saw her when she was less than a day old!! Very exciting it was too!!

 

I'm always dismayed when I hear that teachers at local schools don't show any interest because its not " a sporty achievement"

 

I always seem to have been lucky then to work in schools where all achievements.......especially if out of the ordinary....were very much celebrated. As a class teacher I would have probably been too much the other way and asking whether he could show/teach us his audition piece!!!

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This has rather touched a nerve with me LinMM.

My dd's primary school never acknowledged her achievements of a ballet nature . My dd and I are fairly private people and don't seek publicity/ approval but it might have been nice to get a mention, maybe in the celebration assembly held each fFriday or in the newsletter. Oh well....

 

Edited due to rambling off topic

Edited by along for the ride mum
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Mvobe , my DS started at WL in September in yr7. Every time I drop him off it seems so wrong driving away and leaving him behind. However this is his dream and as a Mum I have to do every thing I can to support him. He is happy and the mad videos and photos are proof, that hard as it is he is in the very best place for him.

WL boys also play football and its lovely too see boys of all different ages playing together. It is however the only match ive seen where the boy in goal was piroetting. Try and relax if its ment to be it will.

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I know exactly how you feel along for the ride mum.

I have been quite hurt for my ds that school have been so disinterested in his ballet. They knew he was going for JA auditions in 2012 but never bothered to ask if he'd been successful, which he had. We didn't even bother to tell them as it was clearly not that interesting. It would have been nice to mention him in weekly assembly. I think they actually find it embarrassing because he's a boy doing ballet. However, as my ds is very shy and not the showy type I think he was probably glad in a way.

 

I agree that if it's meant to happen it will. Whatever the White Lodge letter says I will still feel guilty. If it's a no I will feel guilty for secretly being relieved as I know it's his big dream. If it's yes I will feel guilty for even considering allowing him to go away. So damned either way!

 

Anyway there is no time to dwell as we have Elmhurst tomorrow!

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I don't want to offend anyone, but if schools aren't interested in ballet achievements, perhaps it is simply through ignorance. Being selected for an Associate scheme is a real honour, being offered a place at Vocational school even more so.  Maybe the school didn't ask the results of the audition because they assumed you would tell them if it was good news, and thus thought it was a "no" and didn't want to risk upsetting you.

 

Can I suggest that parents and teachers should try to educate their local schools.  Don't hide your light under a bushel, make them understand how important it is.  Or you could try the local newspaper, they will often run a human interest story, and the schools may then take more notice.

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If I had my time again and with the knowledge I have now, I definitely would not have let my daughter go away. Family in my oppinion is so important, there is no rush to go away, it is a personal choice.

 

Me neither Tulip - but I guess you have to experience that the grass isnt always greener to have confidence you are doing the right thing.  There are huge benefits but I'm not sure the environment or sacrifices are always worth it. 

Edited by BankruptMum
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Mvobe , my DS started at WL in September in yr7. Every time I drop him off it seems so wrong driving away and leaving him behind. However this is his dream and as a Mum I have to do every thing I can to support him. He is happy and the mad videos and photos are proof, that hard as it is he is in the very best place for him.

WL boys also play football and its lovely too see boys of all different ages playing together. It is however the only match ive seen where the boy in goal was piroetting. Try and relax if its ment to be it will.

I remember mad videos! Joyous moments of boys jumping over ditches, climbing trees, water fights...I honestly believe my ds had a better quality of life than if he stayed at home an only child who didnt fit in with local football mad kids.

Of course it wasnt easy and we missed him terribly but couldnt help but be happy for him at the same time.

And even though he is a grown man I still miss him and I havent had to see him leave the country to follow his dreams!

Being a parent is for life and all we can do is provide the best opportunities we can in whatever circumstances we find ourselves to ensure our children thrive and become decent, contented and independant human beings.

 

Good luck to all auditioning, try to live and enjoy the moment. You have ballet.co for support whereas when ds was auditioning there wasnt quite the wealth of stories from experienced suffering parents to learn from!

 

Mind you had there been I might have got my way, not let ds go and possibly condemned him to a lifetime of regret that I see too often in adults...

Edited by hfbrew
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Hi fussier, simply because she missed us so much and we missed her. The knowledge I have now is, if the dance school is good and your child is part of an associat scheme, then I believe that kind of training is good enough to get them into a good upper ballet school. I am only talking about my experience, everyone is different. In addition to what I have said, a majority of dancers in my daughter year at Central did not go to vocational school. Having said that a majority of them were senior associates with ThebRoyal Ballet. I feel ALS o that my daughter missed out on things that happened in her own home/town etc. when she comes home she doesn't know many people and had left her old friends behind at primary school. At the beginning of our journey my daughter really wanted to go to a vocational school and we supported her in this choice. No one told us how painful it would be though. Vocational school does give your child lots of positive experiences though, and some children are more than happy to be at these schools doing what they love to do, I just feel that I missed out.

 

Oh gosh. Now I feel slightly sick :unsure: . My DD has 2 brilliant teachers, who are very keen to help her progress through ballet. We are just about to embark on Inter foundation training (think I've got that right!). She is encouraged to attend festivals, they offer private tuition on technique as and when we ask for it and she attends year 6 JAs. Now I feel like she really dosen't need to go off anywhere.

Note to self 'calm down, you haven't even had a letter yet. Slaps myself across the face'.

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Not offended Pas de Quatre! I agree that schools should take more notice and I have tried. I asked the head for time off for WL audition so I hoped that either she or teachers would remember and say "good luck". I actually went to see head the day before with ds to remind her he would not be in school but she just said " ok, can you put it in writing please". Quite sad for it's an excellent school with great results of sats etc but it seems not all achievements are to be celebrated.

 

Just to say also good luck for everyone waiting for letters!

 

Also - is anyone doing Elmhurst tomorrow?

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Oh gosh. Now I feel slightly sick :unsure: . My DD has 2 brilliant teachers, who are very keen to help her progress through ballet. We are just about to embark on Inter foundation training (think I've got that right!). She is encouraged to attend festivals, they offer private tuition on technique as and when we ask for it and she attends year 6 JAs. Now I feel like she really dosen't need to go off anywhere.

Note to self 'calm down, you haven't even had a letter yet. Slaps myself across the face'.

 

To be honest if she is already doing well and her teachers are supportive of you both then that's a step ahead of a lot of youngsters and maybe she will be better off at home, and applying later.  There are lots of competitions, festivals, workshops, associates, EYB, to keep her doing 'extras' - there are a couple of dance schols I am aware of which wont let their students apply for Associate schemes as they know they offer 'as good as' training.  They aren't being boastful, or restricting - its a fact, you only have to go to certain festivals and see their techniques. 

 

People are always keen (and rightly so, its a great achievement) to sing the praises of vocational schools but few will be open about the niggles which are part and parcel of the experience - just remember they are no different than regular secondary school and you are the customer.  Children will also be children, being given the priviledged environment they are in I thought they would be respectful of others talents, and dedicated in approach - was very surprised to find this wasnt the case.  Its a difficult one but dont stress too much until you have decisions to make.  Best of luck, just keep in mind when taking advise that everyone's opinion is very personal to their situation and goals, plus their expectations may be different - mine were clearly set far too high! :)

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Without wanting to spark controversy, as I'm aware that this is a ballet forum, surely it is a decision based on more than purely ballet? It will also depend on the quality of academic schools available locally as well as a myriad of variables around financial implications and travelling distances to schools, ballet schools, associate schemes etc as well as the impact on parents who act as dancers taxi! The truth is this will all be very different for each family and there's no one perfect solution! I just wish everyone peace of mind in finding their own 'best fit' solution x

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Without wanting to spark controversy, as I'm aware that this is a ballet forum, surely it is a decision based on more than purely ballet? It will also depend on the quality of academic schools available locally as well as a myriad of variables around financial implications and travelling distances to schools, ballet schools, associate schemes etc as well as the impact on parents who act as dancers taxi! The truth is this will all be very different for each family and there's no one perfect solution! I just wish everyone peace of mind in finding their own 'best fit' solution x

You are so right, I couldnt have put it better myself. And the quality of education was a big deciding factor for us. My ds says he probably would not have continued dancing had he had to go to ordinary state school (the local authority did not issue him one anyway)

Some people are lucky to have access to excellent dance schools who can offer like for like training perhaps alongside associates too. If they are also lucky to have a good academic school then the chances are that they will still have a realistic chance of full time training at 16 or even 18.

Everyones circumstances are indeed different, there is no right or wrong path other than what suits the child and family.

But for what its worth Ive observed far more stress in my teenage ballet students trying to fit in school, ballet. Jobs and general living than I ever did in ds. I think opting to stay at home is just as hard a decision as going away!

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I think a KatyMac style spreadsheet would be of use here !

Pros and cons of boarding -etc.

I must say that I do have more Quality Time with big DS than I did when he was at home madly rushing from one lesson / festival/ rehearsal / JA class / audition to another .

It has been hard to let go of that sense if control /responsibility over his progress , but getting used to it slowly .

I also have more and better time with little DS and his behaviour is better as a result !

 

Also I have to say with modern technology we manage to stay in touch pretty well when he wants to and his first stop when he is to visit all his old Dancing friends - not the school as he never did fit in there nor was his success even when winning at All England Finals ever acknowledged by the school !

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I agree totally hfbrew and we opted for vocational school with our decision based on academics and having a happy well balanced child in equal measure, as well as the excellent dance training. However our set of circumstances will be very personal and unique to us and I totally respect anyone who comes to a different conclusion. The only thing I would say though is that nothing is set in stone and you can always try it and if it doesn't work out for your child there's no shame in saying this is not for us and bringing them home, nothing ventured - nothing gained

Edited by along for the ride mum
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Academic schools are odd - they do appear to have a kind of tunnel vision, and the subject teachers seem incapable of understanding that their pupils might have chosen 'their' subject, but that doesn't necessarily mean they want to become an artist, physicist, geography teacher or whatever :)

 

The only time dd's academic school has shown any real understanding of her ballet training was at a parents' evening when they were talking about GCSE's, subsequent A-levels and amassing UCAS points etc.

 

I mentioned that dd had been earning UCAS points from her ballet exams since she was 12, and was now studying a level 4 qualification, which was higher than A-levels in any case. That seemed to sink in (as it was relating ballet to the academic framework which they are familiar with), and seems to have helped them 'get' the idea now!

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I agree with others that the decision has to be made taking into account all the factors affecting not just the child but the rest of the family *including* the parent(s). Every family's circumstances are different. For example, a single parent who works full-time and has other children but little social support may find it very difficult if not impossible to take a dc to hours of lessons, associate classes etc. Unless a dc is an only child the parent(s) has/have to consider the impact that the dc's intensive dance schedule has on his/her siblings. Hanging around in cars or church or school halls is not much fun for younger children and older children may lose out as well. As with many parenting decisions, there is no right or wrong answer. All a parent can do is make the best decision that s/he can, based on the information available at the time. With hindsight, many of us would do things differently with our children but we should not reproach ourselves for this as the original decision was made with the best of intentions. And, if we had made a different decision at the time, there is no guarantee that it would have produced a good result either. We cannot go back in time.

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For one reason and another DS didn't audition for vocational school for Year 7 and when I asked him about auditioning for them in the following years he said he didn't want to try. He wanted to stay at home and didn't want to leave home.

 

He was happy with his associate classes at London Junior and Senior Ballet, had support from his local dancing teacher/school, had support from his school friends who all knew about his dancing from year 7 and there was no bullying and went to a really good Comprehensive school.

 

For years he coped with all the dance classes, travelling, homework and then the GCSE's and auditions in Year 11. He was very focused. Looking back I wondered how he/we did it all but we did.

 

He's now in his 3rd Year at Central and off auditioning for jobs in Europe and he's only 18.

 

At the end of the day it's what feels right for your child and you and if they want to go away.

 

And remember they can get to a Vocational school at 16-18 without going to a Vocational school between 11-16. It is possible. :)

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It is indeed a huge decision, based on a lot of factors. Enjoy the audition process if you can because it can be exciting. Vocational training did and does suit my child, but I have already mentioned why thing would be done differently if we had our time again. Also as a paying customer I certainly would have put my foot down regarding some situations, but I didn't because I was fearful that it would have an impact on my daughter. Any way I have digress, enjoy the auditions and take the opportunity to shine.

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I am feeling a bit ashamed of some in my profession for their lack of recognition of the achievements of some children in their care!!

 

What on earth is going on.....are they all just too busy or stressed these days or too SATS orientated to find what I used to call "personal time" on Friday PM mostly where children shared their news and so on.

I really feel for the child where the Head just said "put it in writing" to the parent in front of her child without any acknowledgement of what was about to do.....not something I can personally relate to I must say.

And yes a mention in Assembly or school newsletter should be par for the course!!

But then I'm one of those awful sixties trained teachers who were taught that Education is Education for Life (and about Life) so had a broad philosophy which educated children to be well rounded. Well we probably went too far down that road but looks like need a bit of this approach back in schools again then.

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Seversl years ago an older girl from dds junior school & dance school became a JA, danced in Nutcracker with BRB & got into White Lodge.

 

At the leavers prize giving we sat through all manner if sporting achievements, children who had represented their county in sport & announcements of who had won academic scholarships to senior schools.

 

Her, not a dicky bird. It was never mentioned in a newsletter despite all manner of other achievements being mentioned

 

Last year at dds leavers prize giving we sat through the same. This time I was even crosser as the children who had been chosen for county orchestras, represented the school at the local drama festival (& won) wernt mentioned either. Dds drama & dance achievements wernt mentioned, we were used to that being out of school but I'd have thought the children entered by the school deserved a mention.

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When my DD was accepted into White Lodge, her teacher let her call me during school time so that I could open the 'yes' letter and let her know the result. At the end of year assembly, the headmaster asked her to dance her ballet solo for the whole school and parents. This primary school still says alongside the year 6 grammar school places achieved, that they had a student accepted to The Royal Ballet School. They certainly made my DD feel very special.

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I think all the schools I've worked in would acknowledge & celebrate achievements like that - assemblies & displays & so on (I once got a certificate at an assembly and a show photo on the achievement wall - as a teacher!) Definitely now (in Scotland) it's part of the curriculum almost to "celebrate wider achievements" & big things children achieve out of school rated equal to achievements in school, all part of their learning.

 

I really hope it's just that schools don't quite realise what they're dismissing.

 

And I'd probably be completely the other way, & want to hear every little detail, get the child to show what they can do at any opportunity!

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Our experience has been that the achievements were celebrated in the lower schools. Our secondary schools go from year 9 and at that stage it became sporting and academic achievements were mentioned and school drama productions, music shows but nothing for any accomplishments in dance or drama outside of school. It came as quite a shock to some of the teachers when DD was auditioning for 6th form vocational school as she had not taken part in school productions as rehearsals always clashed 100% with her ballet classes. Others her age were able to do them as they were in lower grades and never seemed to have the clash. Ironically, the Leavers Magasine in year 11 did mention and celebrate the achievements of dancers going to the local college to do a level 3 btech in dance but not a whisper of DD's achievement of getting into vocational school to do the Diploma in Professional Dance.

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LinMM We need you at our school!!!!! Everything you say is right but it just does not happen in our school. I know sport is important to

 

some children but not all. My ds is just not sporty. He is very active with his dancing and loves to be outside tearing around but sport is

 

not his thing. In a recent assembly about bullying, one very sporty boy who had been asked to read out his written theory on bullying,

 

actually said his idea of a bully would be someone who wasn't sporty! INCREDIBLE.... This was allowed to stand without being

 

corrected in front of the whole school and parents.

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Hello to all, happy 2014, and here we go again.....
 

     I've just done a  bit of catching up so welcome LittleNutcracker and MVOBE, enjoy the ride. These forthcoming weeks and months can be very tense, frustrating and anxiety filled but at the same time extremely exciting. I wish you and your DC's well.

Good luck at Elmurst tomorrow today MVOBE, it's a lovely school and has always left a good impression on us. (I think I know who you are and if I'm right, I'm sure he'll do just fine.)

 

I have to say that the talk of regrets over opting for vocational boarding is a tad un-nerving to us as we're only 4/5 months into that journey and with it being so soon after having made that decision.

We, like many others I've read on these forums, would never have considered boarding prior to all this so it has been a dramatic and sometimes traumatic choice for us to make.

I am, however confident that it is the right thing for our DD having seen how well she's taken to the life and how much she loves to be there but would add that it's almost impossible to advise others on though as it's such a highy individual choice both for child and parent.

 

now, to matters in hand;

 

Does anyone have any insight into when the WL finals yay/nay letters are due ?

I know that there are still some auditions to come but my partner and I were argui..... debating as to whether in the past couple of years we'd recieved the letters before the other centres had completed or not ?

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