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18 minutes ago, Saodan said:

My concern is when advocacy for one dancer risks slipping over into the denigration of others. 

 

I've seen no denigration of anyone.

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Posted (edited)

That's why I rarely post my reviews on performances, especially by some of the deemed "favorites" of the forum (ex: Takada, Lamb, Campbell, Nunez, Muntagirov),  as some of the performances I've seen as of late (Giselle, Mayerling, Don Quixote, Manon etc.) weren't as satisfactory and I know there will be some unhappy respondents if I criticize their performances, technique, port de bras, or artistry. But I do like to read reviews by other ballet-goers on here! So, it'll suffice. 

Edited by HappyTurk
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Happy Turk you should post regardless.

 

Apart from mixed programmes there is one dancer I tend to book for at ROH so I can't really comment on others.  If other people don't like that person's performance or see different things to me in a performance well so be it.

 

What I can comment on in respect of R&J is that that dancer has a proven track record in the role so I find it a bit odd that he hasn't been cast as Romeo.  However it has saved me a lot of money!  I know other people who have dancers they wax lyrical about too.

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This forum is for praise, criticism and balanced discussion.  I was one of the few people who dared to admit I liked Unknown Soldier, although I can certainly see why many didn’t.  I didn’t expect to be ripped to pieces for voicing a different opinion, and I wasn’t. Many people here loved Yasmine Naghdi’s performance in 2P, some disliked her a lot.  Again, there was no nastiness, just differences of opinion.  So you should post without worrying, Happy Turk, but that is of course up to you.  

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Posted (edited)

Discussion about injuries is surely entirely legitimate.  We don’t just follow ballet as an entity, we follow the dancers and very many of us have particular favourites.  I specifically booked for Corrales and Hayward so have a particular interest In his wellbeing,having had my appetite whetted by his Hungarian officer, and then been disappointed by his Bayadere injury.  

 

This is, after all, a discussion forum.  It would be deadly dull if all we did was praise specific performances and little else.  Equally, I cannot imagine dancers would find the fact that their fans are discussing how keen they are to see them dance intrusive, or anything other than an expression of regard.  These people are professional  performers, many of them boosting their profiles through social media; they are not highly-strung racehorses to be protected from real life.  They understand the importance of their commercial value and like to cultivate a following.

 

Ballet Forum is wonderfully civilised and pretty protective of the dancers who enhance our lives,, but it is not a fan club and I sincerely hope it never will be.  Sometimes the list of topics that people would like to put out of bounds seems faintly ridiculous.

 

 

 

Edited by penelopesimpson
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Email just received from ROH.....

"Our records show that you are due to attend a performance of Romeo and Juliet. We are contacting you to let you know that, due to injury, Steven McRae is replaced by Ryoichi Hirano as Romeo on Thursday 28 March".

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For those wondering about R&J casting, I wrote to the ROH customer service email in late January about when casting for other roles in the ballet would be announced and received this back:

 

"Further casting will be announced nearer to the time on our website."

 

This never materialized, so I emailed again on Monday and received the following:

 

"The current policy from The Royal Ballet for the casting on the website is that they don't detail many roles as they often have to change casting due to injury or illness."

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53 minutes ago, miriskusnik said:

For those wondering about R&J casting, I wrote to the ROH customer service email in late January about when casting for other roles in the ballet would be announced and received this back:

 

"Further casting will be announced nearer to the time on our website."

 

This never materialized, so I emailed again on Monday and received the following:

 

"The current policy from The Royal Ballet for the casting on the website is that they don't detail many roles as they often have to change casting due to injury or illness."

 

Then why can't they update the website as and when necessary

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Is there more injury and illness now than there used to be? If so, why? And if so, I fear for the welfare - short term and long term - of the dancers.

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as I said in another posting, they used to manage very well in pre web site days! It seems as though they just can't be bothered, or attach no importance to giving their customers information.

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11 minutes ago, ninamargaret said:

as I said in another posting, they used to manage very well in pre web site days! It seems as though they just can't be bothered, or attach no importance to giving their customers information.

Wrong kind of customer.  They don’t want those boring nerdy people who attend regularly and love ballet and opera.  They much prefer youthful newbies who are much harder to reach and may not return.

 

Why?

 

i haven’t got an earthly other than that it mirrors the BBC.  Radio 4 has a pretty rock solid passionate customer base that constantly refreshes through the ages but now the BBC want to make it more youthful.  Radio 2 used to be the great success story, often used in marketing seminars as an example of how to build audience in a segmented market.  In the last year it has been all but destroyed.  If you have any doubts, try listening to Rylan Clark-Neal on Saturday afternoons.

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On 08/03/2019 at 08:35, capybara said:

Come on, folks. This is not a 'fan site' , is it? If it goes on like this, I, for one, will be driven away - as I know that other 'regulars' have been in the past, for similar reasons.

And why do we need to go on and on about the injuries? Let's wish the wonderful Cesar and William well and strong in their recoveries and leave it at that.

I entirely agree Capybara - it’s certainly been putting me off a with the ‘fan club’ type posts recently.  I thought this forum was to discuss dance and dancers and not to berate some dancers just because they’re not part of the ‘fan club favourites’ - seems very narrow minded to me. 

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12 hours ago, Springbourne3 said:

I entirely agree Capybara - it’s certainly been putting me off a with the ‘fan club’ type posts recently.  I thought this forum was to discuss dance and dancers and not to berate some dancers just because they’re not part of the ‘fan club favourites’ - seems very narrow minded to me. 

 

I think it is quite natural for people to have favourite dancers -   Fonteyn would be one of yours perhaps? -  and I don't think much, if any, "berating" of non-favourites goes on here, to be honest, unless I have missed something - perhaps you have some particular examples in mind?   

I find  most discussions of performances suitably restrained and fair, even where I am not in agreement, and I am sure the excellent moderators would soon deal with anything that went too far.

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I noticed a rather cool reception to the news that Hirano (and not Campbell) would be stepping in as a substitute Romeo on various dates; in past seasons the announcement that Iana Salenko would be partnering McRae has not been received with enthusiasm.  And sometimes I think that Francesca Hayward will never be forgiven by some for being promoted to Principal before Yasmine Naghdi.

 

There will be other examples which I noted at the time but have forgotten the details of. I don’t think I’m imagining things.

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I think you are being a bit harsh re Hirano comments.  One person said he wouldn't pay to go and see him and several people (Me, number one Campbell fan, included) all said how much we enjoyed his performances (obviously not yet as Romeo).

 

I think the Salenko issue is a bit different because she is not a company member.  I know many people who follow different companies who do not like guest artists being brought in except in extremis.  I must admit that I did think many of the comments about her and why she had been brought in as a guest were more than somewhat harsh.

 

I recall when I joined the forum (original version) that hardly anyone ever mentioned Miyako Yoshida but there was an outpouring of angst when she announced her retirement.

 

I would urge everyone to post, whether you think your views will be popular or not.

 

 

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I think sometimes it’s the absence of “looking forward to seeing X instead” posts which I notice.

 

I know what you mean about guest artists, but I don’t recall much objection to Shklyarov being parachuted in, or Ferri appearing in Marguerite et Armand.

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Well, I guess that's partially due to an acknowledgement that the range of available male principals wasn't necessarily suitable.  Shklyarov was replacing David Hallberg following injury, wasn't he?  I suppose it was felt that someone equally starry was needed.  And of course the objections to Salenko were largely because there were a number of up-and-coming smaller ballerinas who it was felt merited being given the opportunity.  Ferri, I suppose, is at least ex-RB, so not a total outsider.

 

Personally, if I've booked specifically to see someone, and they get injured, it takes quite a bit for me to go as far as "looking forward to see his/her replacement" :) 

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I'm afraid that, irrespective of the Company or the undoubted merits of a contracted guest, I am among those who would always prefer to see one of the 'home team' given the opportunity, if at all possible.

I think that I have expressed surprise and puzzlement elsewhere that David Hallberg should be cast as Belaiev in Month in the Country, especially as he is in his late thirties and given that there are young RB dancers (Ball, Clarke, Richardson etc etc) who seem ideally suited to the role. As in the case of Salenko a few years back (e.g.), this suggests to me that a partner's preferences have been given undue weight and I don't like bringing that feeling with me to a performance.

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2 hours ago, alison said:

And of course the objections to Salenko were largely because there were a number of up-and-coming smaller ballerinas who it was felt merited being given the opportunity.

 

2 hours ago, capybara said:

I'm afraid that, irrespective of the Company or the undoubted merits of a contracted guest, I am among those who would always prefer to see one of the 'home team' given the opportunity, if at all possible.

I think that I have expressed surprise and puzzlement elsewhere that David Hallberg should be cast as Belaiev in Month in the Country, especially as he is in his late thirties and given that there are young RB dancers (Ball, Clarke, Richardson etc etc) who seem ideally suited to the role. As in the case of Salenko a few years back (e.g.), this suggests to me that a partner's preferences have been given undue weight and I don't like bringing that feeling with me to a performance.

 

But that's kind of the point - dancers sometimes attract adverse comment because of who they aren't, not because of any shortcomings of their own.

 

If we're not happy with their casting (and I too think the casting of Hallberg as Belaiev is a wasted opportunity), we can't blame Hallberg or Salenko or even McRae or Osipova - the decision lies squarely with Kevin O'Hare, who I think it's fair to say has proven himself pretty adept at progressing his own dancers' careers.

 

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Are the castings for Balanchine's Symphony in C out yet? I couldn't find them on the ROH website yet. I'm trying desperately to book to see Osipova!

 

 

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I was less impressed with Hallberg than I had hoped when he came over to Sadlers Wells with ABT a few years back so I am looking forward to seeing him again to see how I feel this time. It will also be interesting to gauge whether the connection between him and Osipova is as strong as it is said to be. I do, however, feel not a little disconcerted that the many superb younger dancers will be denied the opportunity that they might otherwise have had.

 

I am also looking forward to Corrales' return to the stage. Does anyone know whether this is likely to be any time soon? I know that he is still listed for R & J but that doesn't count for much these days given the generally unreliable information shown on the website.

 

And I can't wait to see Francesca Hayward again. I have missed the very special and individual interpretative qualities that she brings to everything that she does.

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Posted (edited)

I think the discussion of Ilana Salenko is a bit different.  There was great excitement when she was brought in to guest in DQ largely due to RB injury at the time .... as was Eleana Obraztsova at the same time in R&J.  Guest Artists are usually brought into most companies to cover in emergencies/need, yes, but also to inform Company/Audience members in rep they are known for/have key international experience in.  Salenko certainly had been doing the DQ PDD around the world.  Of that there was no question.  In that instance she was certainly apt.  The issue a goodly number had with Salenko as time went on is that she was KEPT being brought into the RB to guest in roles that she had no great or certainly little experience in - indeed in a few cases in roles that she had NEVER danced before; Two Pigeons for example.  Such situations are surely the preserve of the native Company members.  Also she danced with one core RB Principal and that meant he too missed out on opportunities to dance with the blossoming talents that were and certainly ARE now plentiful at the RB.  Happily time has moved on and the situations from all sides have been rectified.  People will once again thrill to see Ms. Salenko on her home stage in Berlin once she returns from her latest maternity leave.  I always enjoy seeing her there - especially when paired with her husband, another long standing Company principal. 

 

Edited by Bruce Wall
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Posted (edited)

Was Hallberg slotted to dance in "A Month in the Country" to begin with though? Perhaps since he wasn't able to perform all of the 4 performances Kevin O'Hare initially intended for him to dance (excluding R&J), he thought of giving him another go around with Osipova to make up for it? I can't imagine him performing this ballet if he hadn't gotten injured for Giselle and Manon -- as it very much seems like a company role to me. 

Edited by HappyTurk

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16 hours ago, alison said:

Personally, if I've booked specifically to see someone, and they get injured, it takes quite a bit for me to go as far as "looking forward to see his/her replacement" :) 

 

Indeed, especially if (a) I'm already scheduled to see that replacement in one of their own scheduled performances, or (b) the replacement is somebody I actively avoid booking for!

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Looks like Steven McRae is injured and out of R&J.

 

He announced himself on his facebook page here

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I suspected as much :( .  He must be really frustrated after all this time out, but knees can be tricky things, so better to get something done and let it heal properly - even arthroscopies can take longer to heal than the rather optimistic "back to normal in 2 weeks" my doctor told me (and I of course am not a dancer!).  Wishing him a full recovery.

 

Presumably he'll be replaced by Hirano again in due course.

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As usual the ROH website has not yet been updated!!!

 

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