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Anna C

Is there a DVD of Cranko's "Onegin" anywhere?

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On 11/25/2017 at 05:03, Jan McNulty said:

As far as I am aware there isn't a DVD of the ballet.

 

 

It was issued by Home Vision, don't recall the year, quite some time ago.

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4 hours ago, assoluta said:

 

It was issued by Home Vision, don't recall the year, quite some time ago.

 

I've just done a quick scan and can't find it now.  Much wailing and gnashing of teeth ensues!

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The Home Vision issue was on videocassette.  When I searched for it I found an entry in the Stanford University Library Catalogue. 

 

https://searchworks.stanford.edu/catalog?utf8=✓&op=AND&search=&search_title=Onegin&search_author=&subject_terms=&series_search=&pub_search=&isbn_search=&range[pub_year_tisim][begin]=&range[pub_year_tisim][end]=&f_inclusive[format_physical_ssim][]=Videocassette&f_inclusive[format_physical_ssim][]=Videocassette+(Beta)&f_inclusive[format_physical_ssim][]=Videocassette+(VHS)&sort=relevance&search_field=advanced&button=

 

Maybe other libraries have it too?

 

Apologies for the long link. I don't know how to shorten it.  

 

Edited to add that SwissBalletFan and I were posting at the same time.   The link above is for the National Ballet of Canada version.  SwissBalletFan's link is for the Stuttgart version.

 

 

Edited by Bluebird

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I checked my DVD of Onegin, it was indeed transferred from VHS, so please accept my apologies for sending a wrong signal.

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1 hour ago, SwissBalletFan said:

It seems yes there is, and you can buy it here:

http://www.hdcollection.biz/onegin-1976-stuttgart-sd.html

 

I even registered to find the price for you wonderful people ;) it is $30.

 

I haven't come across this link before. It's interesting - thank you.

 

I have registered and received an email that includes "Please note that all items in this store are not commercial releases, neither the copies of commercial releases. These opera & ballet performances have never been commercially released." Their stock includes two Onegins - Stuttgart and Bolshoi. Strange that they seem able to bypass the Cranko Estate veto - one has to wonder where they've been sourced? I can't find any technical info other than that they distinguish between HD and SD stating that these are of blu-ray and standard quality respectively .  The disks with postage are quite pricey - I can't find where  they're despatched from and whether additionally they would be subject to import charges.

 

I'm not going to rush into a purchase, I'm already over-spent this year, but if anyone decides to have a punt I'd be very interested to hear any comments!

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I discovered a similar site a few years ago (it might even have been the same one) that sold recordings of Royal Ballet cinema performances. It looked dodgy so I contacted Opus Arte who confirmed they were bootlegged and had them removed. I would steer well clear of that site and report it if you know who the relevant parties might be.

Edited by Saodan

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Apologies if the link I posted leads to a bootlegged or problem site.

 

I am fine with whatever action the Forum mods prefer to take with the post to protect the members of the forum.

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Just to clear this up once again: all three Cranko story ballets - Onegin, Romeo and Taming - were recorded for German Television in den 1970s, all with Marcia Haydée. There were reruns in German television until the 1990s, but no videos or DVDs of these recordings were published. If you find DVDs of them, these are TV recordings made from video cassettes, but not officially released DVDs. I can't remember reruns of the ballets in a time where DVD recorders were available. It's not that German television did not want to show them, the Cranko Estate did not allow it.

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1 hour ago, Fonty said:

The behaviour of the Cranko Estate never ceases to amaze me. :(

 

I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean. Putting a ballet performance on DVD is extraordinarily complicated because of the rights issues involved (not just the choreography, but the designs, the dancers etc.). Back in the day when the Haydee recordings were made the home video market didn't really exist, so rights would have been negotiated for TV broadcast only. Everything would have to be renegotiated for a home video release. Meantime cinema technology has improved dramatically so there may be a desire to record a performance with good picture quality rather than releasing one with poorer picture quality. All this to say, putting a filmed performance from an earlier time out as a DVD is more complicated than you probably think, and the Cranko Estate should not be dismissed as "baddies" in this. After all, they DO own the rights to Onegin and so they have the right to do with it as they please.

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20 hours ago, toursenlair said:

Meantime cinema technology has improved dramatically so there may be a desire to record a performance with good picture quality rather than releasing one with poorer picture quality. All this to say, putting a filmed performance from an earlier time out as a DVD is more complicated than you probably think, and the Cranko Estate should not be dismissed as "baddies" in this. After all, they DO own the rights to Onegin and so they have the right to do with it as they please.

 

I don't agree with the message of any of the above three sentences. Your "arguments" for not releasing those old recordings don't make much sense to me. In most cases, all of this boils down to somebody making choice between willingness to do something, or an inertia. In the end, we all end up with VERY FEW ballet recordings available, in spite of the fact that MANY were made, and all of us, ballet lovers, ballet students, ballet artists, choreographers LOSE.

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36 minutes ago, assoluta said:

 

I don't agree with the message of any of the above three sentences. Your "arguments" for not releasing those old recordings don't make much sense to me. In most cases, all of this boils down to somebody making choice between willingness to do something, or an inertia. In the end, we all end up with VERY FEW ballet recordings available, in spite of the fact that MANY were made, and all of us, ballet lovers, ballet students, ballet artists, choreographers LOSE.

 

But, barring grants or similar funding, releasing a DVD has to make commercial sense, surely?

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Well, certainly it's clear that certain HD performances have been released on DVD whereas earlier non-HD but otherwise superior performances haven't been.

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CD's of old recordings of classic performances are often marketed as being 're-mastered', does a similar technique exist to enhance old videos?

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I copied the Canadian version from TV onto VHS tape at the time, rusty old aerial, mono, analogue, dreadful picture and sound, and then copied it to DVD, and finally now if I play it back through a Blu-Ray I think it does look better, so there must be proper technical ways.

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9 hours ago, MAB said:

CD's of old recordings of classic performances are often marketed as being 're-mastered', does a similar technique exist to enhance old videos?

 

Certainly does.  You should see what they've done to the original Star Trek episodes :(

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I first saw Onegin at the London Coliseum on 26 May 1984.  It was the performance that converted me to watching ballet and I have never forgotten it.  It was years later when I found the programme and realised who I had seen - Marcia Haydee and Richard Cragun!!  No wonder I was converted.

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On 29/11/2017 at 14:33, toursenlair said:

 

I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean. Putting a ballet performance on DVD is extraordinarily complicated because of the rights issues involved (not just the choreography, but the designs, the dancers etc.). Back in the day when the Haydee recordings were made the home video market didn't really exist, so rights would have been negotiated for TV broadcast only. Everything would have to be renegotiated for a home video release. Meantime cinema technology has improved dramatically so there may be a desire to record a performance with good picture quality rather than releasing one with poorer picture quality. All this to say, putting a filmed performance from an earlier time out as a DVD is more complicated than you probably think, and the Cranko Estate should not be dismissed as "baddies" in this. After all, they DO own the rights to Onegin and so they have the right to do with it as they please.

I suspect that if there really are any 'baddies' then the Musicians Union may well be the cause of problems.  Trying to get permission for a commercial release for which their members provided the live music is, according to what I've read, a total nightmare.  These days recorded rights are part of standard contracts but for earlier recordings permission has to be gained from every single person who performed and that includes the members of the orchestra.  I remember Darcey Bussell being asked why there were not more recordings of her performances and she said that the union requirements had made it impossible to release any of the RB's early recordings (and there are many of them) of her performances for commercial use.

 

Linda

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But Prince of the Pagodas and Winter Dreams were released commercially ...

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The German TV station ZDF has a copy of the performance by Marcia Haydee and Heinz Claus, filmed way back in the 70's (I think). I've contacted them and they sent me a copy for 45 Euros..

Also (as indicated in the many replies in the Forum) the performance by Alicia Amatrian and Friedemann Vogel was filmed and, as far as I know, the film company is looking for a sponsor to bear the cost of production of a dvd. Still looking.

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1 hour ago, ChMeBa said:

 

Also (as indicated in the many replies in the Forum) the performance by Alicia Amatrian and Friedemann Vogel was filmed and, as far as I know, the film company is looking for a sponsor to bear the cost of production of a dvd. Still looking.

 

Good to know. Thank you.

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On 24/01/2019 at 20:49, Don Q Fan said:

The Stuttgart Onegin is available online until 28 January as it was shown on German ARTE at Christmas in case anyone wants to see it.

https://www.arte.tv/de/videos/080523-000-A/onegin/

 

I've just watched this - just in time! I've never seen the ballet before but I've seen half a dozen productions of the opera so it's very interesting to see how the ballet differs. I didn't think the music was as good as that of the opera. It's nice to see some of the same dancers as in the Romeo and Juliet and lucky Germany to have had 2 ballets on TV over Christmas!

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15 hours ago, Dawnstar said:

I didn't think the music was as good as that of the opera.

 

I always find I get an earworm of the B section of the Polonaise from the opera leading into the A section of the one from the ballet...

 

(I bought the DVD of this a few weeks ago but have yet to watch it.)

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if you are making comparisons for ballet then the music score for Onegin is so much better than that of Tatiana, that you can only contrast them.Auerbach music for Tatiana.

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18 hours ago, Dawnstar said:

 

I've just watched this - just in time! I've never seen the ballet before but I've seen half a dozen productions of the opera so it's very interesting to see how the ballet differs. I didn't think the music was as good as that of the opera. It's nice to see some of the same dancers as in the Romeo and Juliet and lucky Germany to have had 2 ballets on TV over Christmas!

 

I managed to finish it off after midnight tonight, too!  I don't know whether it was just me, but I found there was a disconnect between the dance and the music somehow.  Felt I should have been more thrilled by it, or something.

 

BTW, we have a separate discussion thread on possible Onegin DVDs here:

 

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1 hour ago, alison said:

 

I managed to finish it off after midnight tonight, too!  I don't know whether it was just me, but I found there was a disconnect between the dance and the music somehow.  Felt I should have been more thrilled by it, or something.

 

I felt that at times the music wasn't dramatic enough for the choreography and the emotions that the dancers were conveying.

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