175 replies to this topic

[ymancity]

Hi, are there any Junior Associate results out yet!

[grumpybearzuk]

No not yet:( my friend dd who got in last year said the date on her letter was the 18th so not long!!! As this is my first experience of waiting for letters I am a nervous wreck !

[ymancity]

It's our first time, seems ages since the audition!!

[amber21]

Good luck to all those waiting for results for JA's fingers crossed for all of you!!
Ax

[balletjack]

Yes good luck everyone, we had to wait till end of june for london results last year.

[Happymum]

We have been told (Bristol auditions) that we need to wait till July! Hope that it's not true... Our first time as well! I was waiting patiently till few days ago but now I'm so happy that someone started this topic!

[charlie4dancin]

Good luck hope the letters are soon... They might come next week!!
Cx

Edited by charlie4dancin, 13 June 2012 - 05:31 AM.

[Jellybeans]

As an old hand at waiting for letters, RBS and otherwise, I can tell you that the letters will come when they are ready. There is not necessarily a pattern from year to year and they do not often come when they say they will, although it is more often before! Sometimes they are sent out by centre, sometimes not.

The waiting is very frustrating but there is nothing that you can do to speed it up or influence the content so it really is best just to try not to worry. If your dd/ds pick up on how you are feeling they may begin to feel it too, or even feel under pressure to do well if they see that it means a lot to you.

Good luck!

[ymancity]

I am a very proud Nana on mail duty whilst the family are on holiday as I said this is the first time dgd has auditioned (Manchester) Good Luck! to all who are patiently waiting, no pressure on our little one we will be proud of her whatever the news.

[rachaelballet12]

Good luck to all waiting for Ja results lets hope the wait is not to long i know what its like to be waiting but this cannot be hurried so try and chill.

[lisadebs]

Good luck to all waiting - I think we heard around the end of June, but that was a few years ago now. Try not to stalk the postman - although they do seem quite tolerant of wild eyed ballet mothers (or grandmothers) accosting them on the doorstep!

Edited by lisadebs, 13 June 2012 - 09:43 AM.

[Francesizzi]

I must say as this is our first experience it is very daunting!! DD has been accepted after one audition but like all of us I expect JA is the dream!!. My concern is about accepting an alternative place before JA's out. Perhaps we should still dream a bit longer and be thankful she has got something.
I spent last night reading about the school shoes and swayback etc etc.
I feel relief that there is other mum's out there to talk to..... hubby just does not get it !!!

[taxi4ballet]

If it's a disappointing no, then it might help to explain that they see lots of lovely children and they would like to take them all, but there just isn't enough room for everybody this time.

[w445403]

Our teacher told DS that the when the panel are looking at all the dancers it's like having a box of yummy chocolate biscuits and only being allowed to choose one. It doesn't mean that the other biscuits aren't as delicious, just that you can't have all the ones you'd like!

[Francesizzi]

Thanks w445403. I love that........ i did eat most of the chocs last night with the stress of it all....

[Jellybeans]

If it's a disappointing no, then it might help to explain that they see lots of lovely children and they would like to take them all, but there just isn't enough room for everybody this time.

Sadly, however, that is not true, and my personal view is that it is better to be honest, even with very young children. Whilst there are talented children that are overlooked from time to time, these schemes are about taking the MOST talented and that is the nature of the dance world at every level. far better, in my opinion, to prepare them for that straight away rather than building up false hope for the future. Those that want it enough will try again, and some may be successful second or third time around. But some will not.
Apologies for the dose of realism!

[primrose]

Actually I think you are wrong Jellybeans. It is true that there are simply not enough places and they cannot take every child. I also diagree that they take the most talented. These associates look for potential alongside musicality, physicality and so on. Some childrens potential does not show itself until the child is a few years older. My dd was a Royal Associate as were many of her friends. Some children like Heather did not get into associates the first or even second time. I have found the children who were accepted into these classes later on have actually been more succesful in gaining places at vocational schools in 6th form than those who got into the classes when they were younger. I believe that if the childs teachers/parents feel that the child has the right attributes for associates and the child has the desire to audition, then the child should be encouraged, and if not sucessful to have a go the year after if that is what the child wants to do.
Can you imagine a professional dancer giving up ballet just because they were not sucessful at auditions. Dancers are taught to work hard and fight for what you want. These people are determined and will always fight to turn a no into a yes.

[DancingPixie]

I would echo Primrose's post. My DS never made associates but is currently at White Lodge. His friend, also never an associate is joining WL next year. Meanwhile two other friends who were both JAs and MAs didn't even make final auditions for WL last year or this year. You really can never tell!

[Jellybeans]

I believe that if the childs teachers/parents feel that the child has the right attributes for associates and the child has the desire to audition, then the child should be encouraged, and if not sucessful to have a go the year after if that is what the child wants to do.

Which is exactly why I said that those that want it enough will try again nd may be successful on a subsequent attempt.

my post was about managing expectations And I believe that it is wrong to mislead a child by telling them that the only reason they were not accepted is because there were not enough places. I have always said that the reason a child is not accepted is that they were not what the panel were looking for at that time. That does not always mean that they will not be accepted in the future, but, sadly, there are children that will NOT succeed, however many times they try and I personally think it is kinder to help them to understand all eventualities rather than to possibly mislead them.

Edited to make more sense.

Edited by Jellybeans, 13 June 2012 - 04:33 PM.

[primrose]

The child wont know that they are one of those children who are not sucessful unless they have tried a few times. I would let the child read the letter, which usually are very nice and usually say that children develop at different rates and they would be more than happy to see the child at audition the following year. The children who do make it to audition have already passed the photograph selection. So clearly they have the right physicality. I dont think there would be many parents that would say to a young child who has been supported by teachers to audition, "sorry darling, you just arent good enough". Rather callous I would say. Its far better to say to the child, never mind it wasnt your turn this year, but lets see how you develop with your ballet and maybe you can try again next year if you feel you want to. I would sooner maintain the childs self confidence and not to fall down at the first few knocks in life.

[Jellybeans]

Primrose, nowhere did I say that I would tell a child simply that they weren't good enough. In my last post I said that I would say that a child was not what they were looking for at that time. I don't think that that is so different from saying that it wasn't their turn this year and let's see how they develop. What I would NOT say is that the only reason that they didn't get in was because there weren't enough spaces.

With reference to photos, certainly JA s and all other associate schemes that I know do not select who to audition on the basis of photos and everyone is invited to audition.

[Ribbons]

Sometimes those that show the most potential at 8 or 9 and are taken as JAs reach the limit of that potential at 12 or 13 and don't go any further. Have seen many a young JA develop the wrong body shape or simply reach the limit of their capability.

Equally some that are not the right body shape at a young age, grow into it at puberty and continue to develop their capability.

One thing I have definitely learned over the years is that potential and ability is a moving feast and two auditions a year apart can produce startlingly different results - both ways!

[Mumofballetmaddaughter]

IMO I see no harm in supporting a child who wants to keep auditioning, without success, if they are able to cope with the rejections as one learns valuable life skills as a result. From my own experience, if my daughter had been persuaded to give up after the first few rejections (and the many more that followed) she wouldn't be dancing professionally today. Strength of character and determination are great attributes to have regardless of what you do in life.

[Tulip]

I like the idea of allowing the child to read the letter if it is a rejection. No one will know why a child has not been chosen, it may well be that they just did not shine enough on that one particular day. Surely a dance teacher would discuss with a childs parent if their child was not suitable for classical ballet and therefor discourage the child from auditioning. Each to their own, if a gentle explenation is used to inform a young child of a rejection fine, why knock their confidence. When my daughter got a rejection I used to just say to her 'Aw it was a no, oh well never mind, you can try again if you want to next year'. Which she did and was then offered an associate place. By the way I am not suggesting anyone is saying they would knock a child confidence.

[tutugirl]

If I may be so bold as to suggest from 25 years teaching experience , that the RB seem to base their choices for JA admission on physique rather than those who actually have a talent and can dance. Sometimes these go hand in hand , but the very simple audition and the time spent on looking at the child's proportions and physique , leaves little or no time to see the child actually perform. This is why many JA s do not get into white lodge and many who have never been JA s actually flourish . Just based on my previous pupils and my humble opinion.

[grumpybearzuk]

There is a dancer at my dd dance school who after years of trying to get in associate classes got in at white lodge last September she is 14 now I think . I think If my dd wants to keep trying I will support her all the way. She is only 8 now so who knows what will happen but I will be there for her if it is not what she wants to hear. At my dd ballet school her teacher only picks the children she thinks will have a good chance ,so we are all a little hopeful

Edited by grumpybearzuk, 13 June 2012 - 08:46 PM.

[amber21]

No matter what the outcome as long as the child has had an enjoyable positive experience at the audition, especially JA's . . . . . which I think many do with them being so young. I made my dd aware that we were supporting her keeness to audition for the experience of having the opportunity of attending a class being taught by one of the worlds best ballet schools and that there were only so many places that maybe available. If she didnt get through then it was no big deal it certainly wouldnt change her dreams or ambitions and if she did get through then it was a wonderful opportunity to be attending extra ballet classes with such a prestigious school with a world class reputation.
Each child is individual and what one parent might say to their child maybe polar opposites to what another parent may say to their child to prepare them for possible rejection / acceptance. My dd is under no illusion that because she is privileged enough to be attending these classes at the moment that her path will be an easy one in whatever she decides to do or be at a later date when she is older.
Ax

[rachaelballet12]

even at JA level the RBS are looking for a number of different reasons why the Ja is chossen it is certainly not just on physical propotion alone as anyone who has had a DD in JA s will know go back to the letter recieved after the audition that states the critira how children are choosen children could only have one of these elements missing to be turned down. Like everything in life there will be dissapointments unfortunatly its part of life . Anyone who has seen a JA class will know all the children work very hard but most of all they are gaining invaluble training .

[balletjack]

Not sure i agree with your comment tutugirl-very few ja's get into white lodge-at my dd centre this year a couple of girls & a few boys have been accepted & also i hear 3 from bristol centre accepted into white lodge. The girls in my dd ja class do all have a similar physique but many do have performance experience from festivals/competitions & opportunities to dance with the royal ballet company! The ja programme is a fantastic & my dd has learnt so much that is not covered in her normal ballet class.

[spannerandpony]

I can't see anything constructive or motivating in telling an 8, 9 or 10 year old child that they may not be good enough. An audition result is one person or one panel's opinion based on one audition. That child may dance completely differently a day, week or year later; likewise their physique may change hugely. This is precisely why it's worth trying again and why RBS letters sometimes say "We'd like to see you again next year".

Ok, if by 18 your child has never got finals or a place at a ballet school, then it would be time to steer them down a different path - but I suspect they would have reached that conclusion themselves.

But at 8, 9 or 10, far kinder and more motivational to say (as Mr Kelly used to say at auditions) "You all did well, but they only have 12 places, so can't take everyone they want - so keep going, and you can try again next year".

My dd is a late developer and at 13 is only now coming into her own as a dancer. She knows she wasn't ready at 10 but is determined to try for a post 16 place. She works her socks off and has real drive. Would she have had that drive and perseverance if I had told her at 10 "Sorry, you weren't good enough", rather than "It's not a never darling, it's just a not yet".