Do you mind your own business or get a bit miffed?

[annaliesey]

I can't help feeling a bit miffed about something but part of me just says to mind my own business too.... Here goes ...

 

Our RAD teacher/studio owner put an 11yo straight into grade 4 having never done any ballet before. I don't have too much of a problem with this on its own as I guess it happens.

 

My DD is about 8 months younger with this girl and has been doing ballet since she was 3 and couldn't understand why this newbie went in a grade higher than her. I brushed this off with her and said to just focus on herself and that this other girl would probably be in the grade for quite a while.

 

Anyway wind forward 5 months and my DD and this girl are in the same grade class. My DD complains that the class is really stop/start as when they start to learn some syllabus stuff the teacher frequently keeps stopping to explain things. DD and Her other three friends who've also been dancing since tots all say the same.

 

I fed back concerns to teacher who got a bit stroppy saying they had covered a lot, the class was going at fairly fast pace, and the following week they came out with A4 sheet of paper showing what they had covered in 6 months and it was all exercises and no dances. DD says she's getting bored and can I take her to one or other of two RAD teachers that we know. I explain that there's some loyalty to the teacher and not really fair to go elsewhere because of late starters joining.

 

Anyway, she (DD) agrees that maybe she is being impatient and she would see how it goes.

 

One of her friends had told her that she and the girl I mentioned earlier are doing their exam in November.

 

DD is really cross to hear this (I have to reason to disbelieve this). This new girl has only been in the class for 3 terms at 1 hour per week. Plus for one whole term she missed at least half the class and for another whole term they were doing non syllabus stuff. By my reckoning the girl has done and will have done about 35 hours by the time the exam happens.

 

Now, I know it's only a guide and that students own practise hours can make up the recommended hours to about 78hrs as on the RAD website BUT our teacher has been very firm with all students up until this point about classes and Hours needed for exams. She has always said it's an exam every other year based on one hourly class per week or one exam grade a year based on two hours a week.

 

The mums (including me) who see that this girl only pays and attends one class a week is on track to do her exam in less than half the time and cost as other girls.

 

Now is she super talented? Who knows. Maybe. But personally I don't see it but then I'm not a dance teacher.

 

My DD and two of her friends are all ready to take lessons elsewhere either aswell as or instead of where they are now because they are fed up with the teachers inconsistent and seemingly favouritising treatment of this girl. They feel they are going at a slow pace for her (and three other newbies) yet she has been given the opportunity of doing her exam so early.

 

There is some other history here too but I won't go into that as not sure how relevant it is but depending on responses I might end up revealing more. It's been crazy with this girl. For example when she was put into grade 4 ahead of others of similar age who had been dancing since tots the teacher said it was because she was tall!! Obviously the mums found that extremely funny but just carried on as usual supporting our own kids.

 

But I can understand my DD's frustration now and I think at age 11 if she says she wants to take lessons elsewhere then I should support her regardless of the loyalty I had previously felt to the teacher.

 

Or should I just say stay where you are, mind your own business and concentrate on yourself regardless of what others are doing and how unfair it seems and trust the exam process.

 

I am torn really as DD does a lot of dance there and it would make things awkward with other lessons but I've learned to trust her judgement more in the last year or so as she's pretty accurate with her assessments of what's what and can always give examples

[Fiz]

When my eldest dd went back to ballet at nine, she was put in Grade One with her younger sister and all the other six and seven year olds. I have never heard any different in eleven years of both daughters doing ballet. This girl may have been put in for her exam but equally well she might fail it. If her attendance has been so spotty and she is as unprepared as it seems, she probably will.

[Kate_N]

Oh dear.

 

Can I be frank? You can have no concern about any other child but your own. Just focus on your own DD. Don't compare; don't encourage her to compare. Just encourage her to do her best to become the best dancer she can be, not to beat another child, or compare herself against others.

 

If you think that the class/teacher is no longer helping your DD to become the best she can be, then THAT is the reason to look at other teachers and studios.

 

In my reading, your post suggests your wasting your precious time and energy thinking too much about the other girl in a way which sounds rather carping or envious. Focus on your daughter. She needs your focus, not your envy or dissatisfaction about another child. There's nothing you can do about the teacher's policy and treatment of other children.

 

I say this so bluntly because I've seen the effects of parents whispering and comparing their young children. It is horrible for the children, and a waste of everyone's energy. Believe me, it's really horrible for the children concerned. I'd bet that the other child knows you and other mothers are talking about her. (Been there, done that, go the tshirt).

 

Talent, success, and learning are not a zero sum game: one child doing well doesn't take away from another child. They will all learn more and better if they learn together and co-operatively. Studios where there's jealousy and competition are often not very happy or productive places to learn.

 

I hope you find a good solution for your DD. It sounds as though there are other reasons for dissatisfaction, but please, make sure the reasons are to do with your DD's learning, not about the teacher's professional decisions about another child. Apologies for being blunt, but I really mean well.

[sarahw]

Crikey that's a tricky one. I agree in principle on the loyalty issue and also on worrying about yourself. However if your daughter is asking to change you have a problem.

 

My experience is that my dd usually gets things right to one degree or another but her recall of situations is coloured by her opinion.

 

I would be up front with the teacher. Say your dd is asking to leave, explain why and ask her what you should say to your dd.

 

Good luck!

[Happymoocow]

I empathise here, and take the viewpoint that where a child skips grades AND where this adversely affects other children in the class then it is a problem. If your child reports the class is stop start then this is your business and is not borne out of an over-interest in other children's development. I think I understand why your child is frustrated, possibly she feels her future is jeopardised by the current classroom environment. Good luck, really not an easy one to resolve, though I agree with Saraw- you need to start talking to the teacher...

[Jan McNulty]

Are the lessons stop/start because the teacher is having to explain what she means to the newer children?  I can understand that would be frustrating for the more experienced children but a good teacher should be able to cater for all levels within the class.

[annaliesey]

When my eldest dd went back to ballet at nine, she was put in Grade One with her younger sister and all the other six and seven year olds. I have never heard any different in eleven years of both daughters doing ballet.

Yes that's how it has always been for the 8 years we've been there. Nobody skips grades etc if they go then come back. However brand new students off the street, so to speak, get put in at grades appropriate to them after an assesment. Sometimes they go in a high grade and ahead of existing students of similar age but usually nobody pays any attention at all. Similarly students leave and people don't pay attention much to that either. It's usually pretty easy going. The reason there was attention given to this was because my daughter and two of her friends in the class were upset that they were told by the mum and the girl (separately) she was "too good for their grade". Usually stuff like this doesn't get gloated about so openly. (There's been a lot of smug and gloaty comments but students and mums all ignored them initially and just put it down to excitement and ignorance of people's feelings).

 

This girl may have been put in for her exam but equally well she might fail it. If her attendance has been so spotty and she is as unprepared as it seems, she probably will.

I've never known a student to fail. I wouldn't wish that on her either as its not her fault if she gets entered for an exam before she's ready. But, our school does work on the basis of you have to take an exam before you move up. It does seem that there are inconsistencies with the emphasis on exam marks that people aim for though and I can't quite figure out how I feel about this and this is probably the root of any envy or carping I feel. Most students are encouraged and only entered for exams when the teacher feels they could achieve a high merit or distinction. I've known students stay a year or more behind their peer group because the teacher didn't think they were high merit/distinction level.

 

But for some reason this focus has changed for this girl and a couple of others where scraping a pass is good enough.

 

I would prefer for my daughter to carry on aiming for high merit/distinction before moving up as what's the rush? She's doing inter foundation and pointe and happy with what she's doing in those classes but there is a "better than you" behaviour creeping into the graded syllabus classes that is really awkward to respond to and handle with dignity.

 

When I said in my earlier posts that this girl was absent from half the ballet classes in a term that was because she was taking classes in another genre to prepare for a retake where she only passed by a couple of marks

[Fiz]

I have never known a child not being put up after passing a grade even if it wasn't a good grade. It seems if the ethos of your dd's school might be changing from what you say. If your daughter is really unhappy maybe a change of school is not a bad thing. If it will cause difficulty, do you think your dd will be able to ignore this girl and the change in the circumstances?

[annaliesey]

Just focus on your own DD. Don't compare; don't encourage her to compare. Just encourage her to do her best to become the best dancer she can be, not to beat another child, or compare herself against others.

I honestly have had this attitude for the last 2 years when this first started. I've always said to my daughter to focus on herself. When other mums have started talking Ive walked away

 

If you think that the class/teacher is no longer helping your DD to become the best she can be, then THAT is the reason to look at other teachers and studios.

 

Absolutely. And that's what's changed unfortunately. Being the sort of person I am I have tried to understand things to be sympathetic to the pressures the teacher has been under rather than quickly change schools. I've tried to get an understanding of whether it's a temporary blip or the way things are going to be long term. Unfortunately it seems that this is the way it's going to be long term which is why I'm listening to my daughter begging me to let her take ballet with a different teacher. In her own words she feels like her teacher doesn't pay much attention to her any more.

 

In my reading, your post suggests your wasting your precious time and energy thinking too much about the other girl in a way which sounds rather carping or envious. Focus on your daughter. She needs your focus, not your envy or dissatisfaction about another child. There's nothing you can do about the teacher's policy and treatment of other children.

 

I know I come across envious and carping and I feel that! It's not towards the girl though but rather I'm envious or resentful of how things have changed with the teaching. I do feel let down if I'm honest about how the teacher can prioritise this one girl over and above her long standing, hard working students that have consistently achieved good grades. They always turn up (and pay!) for the extra classes, the exam rehearsals, the summer and easter schools, they do the fetes and galas (whereas the other girl doesn't) and they are they ones that do EYB, LCB etc that she's seemingly proud of yet happy to slow their progress down to focus on one girl. At this rate she'll only be left with this one girl in this class as one girl kicked out for non payment, one giving up ballet altogether as bored, and my daughter and two friends want to go elsewhere.

 

I say this so bluntly because I've seen the effects of parents whispering and comparing their young children. It is horrible for the children, and a waste of everyone's energy. Believe me, it's really horrible for the children concerned.

Agree. That's why I haven't been sucked into it as far as anyone outside this forum and my husband are concerned! I wouldn't say to anyone and especially my daughter as I completely agree and we've been on the receiving end of whispers on plenty of occasions and know the harm it can do. Not actually just to that other child but also I don't want my DD to be resentful. There's a difference between comparing to be inspired and motivated to comparing and being jealous.

 

I'd bet that the other child knows you and other mothers are talking about her. (Been there, done that, go the tshirt).

 

Yes but not in the way you are alluding to (unless I've got that wrong?) the mum is very gloaty and boastful and has this way of putting others down. The girl not as much but there have been more instances recently.

 

Talent, success, and learning are not a zero sum game: one child doing well doesn't take away from another child.

It's not really working out like that as according to my dd it's more a case of taking away from them to give to her (exaggerated)

 

They will all learn more and better if they learn together and co-operatively. Studios where there's jealousy and competition are often not very happy or productive places to learn.

That's exactly how I'm feeling right now. My dd, her three other friends all in the same graded Ballet class and this girl are all in the competition troupe. My dd and this girl are the ones that go up against each other competitively because of age categories and one of the teachers had been watching to much dance moms I think and really pitched them against each other. I think that's part of the problem. If we move it will be to a school that doesn't have a competition team

 

I hope you find a good solution for your DD.......please, make sure the reasons are to do with your DD's learning, not about the teacher's professional decisions about another child. Apologies for being blunt, but I really mean well.

Thank you and bluntness fine with me I would rather people say what they think otherwise no point in offering up the topic it honestly would only be a move due to teaching alone as I'm pretty good at ignoring other irritating behaviour

[annaliesey]

Thank you sarahw

 

There's no way I can talk to the teacher now as she's far too defensive and emotional and I would be wasting my breathe I feel.

 

She knows there is a challenge with balancing the needs of experienced students with newbies as she introduced a ballet technique class about 4 years ago so that students brand new to ballet started in those classes before moving to a graded class. Somehow though we ended up with newbies in the graded class instead of the technique class and I suspect that she was a bit soft in dealing with a pushy mum and thought she could deal with the range of abilities in the class. Obviously it's her call and not my place to challenge that.

 

All I'm doing now is listening to my dd's frustrations about the stop/start scenario she describes and I genuinely can't make up my mind right now to support her and move her ballet to where she wants to go or whether to suggest that she hang in there and see how things pan out especially as she's happy with pointe and IF

[hfbrew]

Oh dear.

 

Can I be frank? You can have no concern about any other child but your own. Just focus on your own DD. Don't compare; don't encourage her to compare. Just encourage her to do her best to become the best dancer she can be, not to beat another child, or compare herself against others.

 

If you think that the class/teacher is no longer helping your DD to become the best she can be, then THAT is the reason to look at other teachers and studios.

 

In my reading, your post suggests your wasting your precious time and energy thinking too much about the other girl in a way which sounds rather carping or envious. Focus on your daughter. She needs your focus, not your envy or dissatisfaction about another child. There's nothing you can do about the teacher's policy and treatment of other children.

 

I say this so bluntly because I've seen the effects of parents whispering and comparing their young children. It is horrible for the children, and a waste of everyone's energy. Believe me, it's really horrible for the children concerned. I'd bet that the other child knows you and other mothers are talking about her. (Been there, done that, go the tshirt).

 

Talent, success, and learning are not a zero sum game: one child doing well doesn't take away from another child. They will all learn more and better if they learn together and co-operatively. Studios where there's jealousy and competition are often not very happy or productive places to learn.

 

I hope you find a good solution for your DD. It sounds as though there are other reasons for dissatisfaction, but please, make sure the reasons are to do with your DD's learning, not about the teacher's professional decisions about another child. Apologies for being blunt, but I really mean well.

I so agree with this. I also agree that talking to the teacher is important but be careful to focus on your daughters current progress and plan of action for the future. You may well get the impression that your daughter is right to be concerned and it may be a good idea to see if another teacher suits her better.But try and do things by the book 're giving notice and staying on the right side in case you decide to go back.

 

Personally as a teacher I get very depressed when I hear of teachers only entering students who are certain to get high merits or distinctions. I have students who work their socks off just to get a good pass and I don't see why they shouldn't have the opportunity to do exams too. But I wouldn't hold a class back if the majority were exam ready.

 

From a business point of view, some of my classes would have had to close had I not accepted late starters or amalgamated some. One or two parents were concerned but have since been mollified because I still made sure their children did their exam when it was due.

 

Good luck!

 

Edited to add that reading through your latest post it does seem that the teacher has lost sight of trying to make sure all the students are getting the best they can from the classes in the attempt to keep one difficult customer happy.

Edited August 21, 2015 by hfbrew

[annaliesey]

I empathise here, and take the viewpoint that where a child skips grades AND where this adversely affects other children in the class then it is a problem. If your child reports the class is stop start then this is your business and is not borne out of an over-interest in other children's development.

Thank you I feel a bit reassured now it is hard as I completely understand that the teacher has a passion for teaching ballet to anyone and everyone at all stages in their lives and it's one of the things I love about her. She also quite frankly has a business to run. I get all that. But my priority is my DD and I have to listen to what she's saying and I'm seeing and hearing things that help me understand what's going on and why and how.

 

I think I understand why your child is frustrated, possibly she feels her future is jeopardised by the current classroom environment.

That's exactly it. I took her to another teacher for some IF classes as we missed 6 out of 12 in a term because of competitions and her teacher had no plans or time available to make up time (I would have paid extra). After those classes my dd said that she really wished her current classes were like that. She felt that she got so much out of them. She told me that she had actually done things wrong in her current class on purpose to see if it was noticed and it wasnt and this is why she thinks she should move. It's me that feels awkwardly loyal but I think I need to get over that. I've focused on the other girl to try and put into context myself what is happening just to try and make a decision.

 

Good luck, really not an easy one to resolve, though I agree with Saraw- you need to start talking to the teacher...

Yeah I really can't do that without just coming across all bitter and twisted or like I'm telling her how to run her dance school it was bad enough when we did 6 classes somewhere else. The timetable was changed and the class we were going to elsewhere suddenly clashed with her regular pointe class! And besides I can put money on her saying that it's all DD's fault for one reason or another as Ive had 8 years with her and can predict precisely what she'll say

[annaliesey]

Are the lessons stop/start because the teacher is having to explain what she means to the newer children? I can understand that would be frustrating for the more experienced children but a good teacher should be able to cater for all levels within the class.

Yes it it's Janet. DD says they will get started with something and they'll all be happy with getting through the syllabus, doing what they've been told to do with use of terminology which they get and they go for it then the teacher stops and either explains the terminology (and they groan because they know it and don't want to pause whilst she explains it to others) or she will demonstrate the exercise/position for those that don't know it.

 

Apparently my DD is used to demonstrate which winds her up even more

[annaliesey]

Thank you hfbrew for comments as great to hear your perspective as a teacher

 

....But try and do things by the book 're giving notice and staying on the right side in case you decide to go back.

 

Absolutely I would.

 

Personally as a teacher I get very depressed when I hear of teachers only entering students who are certain to get high merits or distinctions. I have students who work their socks off just to get a good pass and I don't see why they shouldn't have the opportunity to do exams too. But I wouldn't hold a class back if the majority were exam ready.

 

So this is part of my dilemma on what to do now and why I mention that this other girl will only have done 35hrs (one class a week etc) whereas we will have done the recommended 78 hours or so by the time my DD takes her exam and the teacher would presumably want her and two other students to be high merit/distinction level before doing the exam. I could possibly have a conversation about my DD doing her exam early too and risking a lower mark but I'm not sure of whether there is benefit in this or not.

 

At the moment there is no grade 5 running so if this girl and one other do their exam in nov there would only be two students in the class but one of them is giving up ballet after she does her grade 4 exam so this girl would be the only grade 5 student and presumably have private lessons for a while until the other students do their exam.

 

However it's a double edged sword because even if my DD does do her exam then she would be stuck in a class with this girl with the same problems that there are now. But very likely if I had a conversation about my DD doing her exam earlier then her two friends would probably do it too so maybe that would be OK.

 

 

From a business point of view, some of my classes would have had to close had I not accepted late starters or amalgamated some. One or two parents were concerned but have since been mollified because I still made sure their children did their exam when it was due.

 

And thats OK though as everyone knows where they stand and what they are aiming for

 

Edited to add that reading through your latest post it does seem that the teacher has lost sight of trying to make sure all the students are getting the best they can from the classes in the attempt to keep one difficult customer happy.

Yes But the teacher doesn't accept there is any of this happening and says the class isn't stop/start even though my DD spoke directly to her and gave examples of what she meant so it didn't come from me.

[LinMM]

Well I agree some "pushy" mothers can be difficult to deal with but I seem to be not really understanding something here!!

 

It seems your DD and friends are not being held up to do their exam. They are on target presumably just as if this new girl had never joined the class.

 

In the end it seems the one with the real problem is the new girl!!

She will be taking the exam early it seems so could risk failure and then have to have private lessons because there will be no group class if she does pass. And to boot she will then have to face your DD and friends if she does fail!! I'm jolly glad I'm not her!!

 

On a more serious note it seems strange that the teacher would be SO influenced by this mother that she would risk putting a child in for an exam too early so she may fail or just scrape a pass.....if she doesn't do this with any of the other children.Though there is a limit to waiting till a child may get distinction .....as some never do!!

And if you wait too long most children will get bored. Most grades have a year to 18 months ...to the exam ..lifespan I feel. There's a point where the child just has to have a go after a certain amount of study. Not every child doing ballet lessons will be taking seriously by the age of 14 or so or thinking of doing for a career. Is this girl a little older than the others in the class and this may be the reason for the "fast tracking"?

As long as your DD and others are not actually being prevented from taking their exams on time I wouldn't worry. Though it does seem as if you have lost a bit of confidence in this teacher at the moment.

I think I must have been lucky in a way. My mother NEVER went with me to ballet lessons. She only ever came to the end of year show.

For the first few years I walked .....about a mile to the other side of the village. And later on when I changed schools I cycled the four miles there and four back!!

I was occasionally taken in the car if the weather was bad but my parents came back later to collect me .....they never hung around gossiping with other parents about the merits of this or that child.

[Melody]

That's exactly it. I took her to another teacher for some IF classes as we missed 6 out of 12 in a term because of competitions and her teacher had no plans or time available to make up time (I would have paid extra). After those classes my dd said that she really wished her current classes were like that. She felt that she got so much out of them. She told me that she had actually done things wrong in her current class on purpose to see if it was noticed and it wasnt and this is why she thinks she should move. It's me that feels awkwardly loyal but I think I need to get over that. I've focused on the other girl to try and put into context myself what is happening just to try and make a decision.

 

 

 

This doesn't sound good. It sounds as though the teacher is letting the more experienced pupils coast while she's trying to get the newcomers up to speed, but that isn't good for the ones being ignored. This whole thing about not being able to find the time for your DD to make up some classes, and then missing mistakes, sounds as though she's being a bit casual. Is this something new or, in hindsight, has it always been like that?

[aileen]

Well, if your dd doesn't rate the classes any more and you have lost confidence in the teacher's professionalism you need to change schools. Carping about so-called favouritism towards another child and the way that the teacher runs her classes is no good for anyone. Find another studio.

[Harwel]

I've read this thread with interest and there are lots of helpful comments. I understand that it is good for you to get it off your chest in this environment, with no harm done. If I were you, I would listen to what your dd wants and move her to the school she felt happier with. Things change, a school that has been good for her up until now may not suit right now.

 

If she wishes to persue dance seriously she will have many, many teachers over the course of her training and hopefully she will gain something useful from all of them. Some teachers will be special to her and others not so much. It sounds as if she has had good basic training with her current teacher and got her to a good standard - something to be thankful for. Perhaps this relationship has just come to a natural end? Nothing at all wrong with that. There are always things that happen to prompt a change, maybe that's all this is. Go with what feels right and I'm sure you will make the right decision for your dd.

[Kate_N]

AnnaLiesey, thanks for not being offended by my bluntness. It does sound as though the studio is not a happy place to  be, and that somehow the dynamics have become that rather nasty mix of gossip & envy that I remember at times from my youth (shudder). It's tough dealing with that, isn't it? As someone says above, it's far better when parents don't hang around the studio, but it sounds as though the girl herself is complicit in some boasting. I hope you can give your DD some useful life tools to deal with that: ignore, ignore, ignore is the basic one, I think!

 

A child of 10 or 11, however, isn't necessarily best placed to see that her training is beneficial. The stop/start you say she reports could be just as good for her -- slow and steady attention to the basics -- even if she feels she's beyond it, and more advanced.

 

A tricky situation, and such a shame that you feel you can't speak to the teacher openly. Are there ways you can try, that will come across as completely non-judgemental and simply ask about the way your daughter is feeling and progressing, in the teacher's professional view? I think if you went from the point of view of your daughter's progress, not the issue of the other girl in the class, or the stop/start or slowing down of the class to accommodate her, would that be more productive?

 

You could rehearse a conversation here, with the other dance teachers, maybe, to see what would work.

 

Tricky situation, but if your daughter is still so young, it's not at all a disastrous thing in her trainng. Dealt with well, it will make her more resilient & able to deal with this sort of situation, which is by no means limited to the dance world, throughout her life.

 

Good luck to you both!

Edited August 22, 2015 by Kate_N

[annaliesey]

Thanks LinMM

 

... It seems your DD and friends are not being held up to do their exam.

Yes that's right. Thats why I've been taking the stance with DD of just telling her to worry about herself. Its just I'm listening to her getting in the car and complaining on the way home about the pace of the class, where the attention in the class is going, and that she thinks she won't be ready for her exam by her target date. She thinks it will be a mad rush to learn the dances and she might not learn them properly. Maybe she is over worrying but I don't know what to say to her. She's been watching the RAD app more than usual and says she is trying to teach herself from that (whereas usually she would use it for the music and a little prompt)

 

 

In the end it seems the one with the real problem is the new girl!!

She will be taking the exam early it seems so could risk failure and then have to have private lessons because there will be no group class if she does pass.

 

I can't imagine her or anyone else actually failing. The teacher could always move her up without doing the exam anyway.

 

If our students end up being the only student in a grade then usually the teacher still runs the class. Students then get in effect the benefit of private lessons for a whole term but just pay standard term fees rather than private lesson rates. This is something my DD would be jealous of! She would love to be in that position getting so much attention. Sometimes lessons get amalgamated for grades in other genres but it hasn't happened with ballet classes in the time we have been there.

 

On a more serious note it seems strange that the teacher would be SO influenced by this mother that she would risk putting a child in for an exam too early so she may fail or just scrape a pass.....if she doesn't do this with any of the other children.

No she's never done this with any children and has been quite vocal slagging off other dance teachers that rush kids through grades, skip grades, or put kids in high grades to win customers! I've tried to not think about this too much as I can't help it that the mum winds me up My view is that if the girl is talented then the teacher is doing a good job by encouraging and supporting so much.. Good on her but not when it's at the expense of my DD and her other classmates if they are actually getting behind or getting a poorer learning experience

 

..... And if you wait too long most children will get bored. Most grades have a year to 18 months ...

Usually the teacher does not budge on this at all! There are kids who were in grade 3 for 3 years and IF for up to 4 years!! In the teachers words the kids don't work hard enough to be ready (bearing in mind she usually aims for high merit / distinction)!

 

Is this girl a little older than the others in the class and this may be the reason for the "fast tracking"?

 

 

No, not at all. Out of a current class of 8 she is the 4th youngest. When she was put directly in grade 4 she was the youngest and there were girls older than her in grade 3 who had been dancing since tots.

 

As long as your DD and others are not actually being prevented from taking their exams on time I wouldn't worry. Though it does seem as if you have lost a bit of confidence in this teacher at the moment.

Yes I have lost confidence based on what my DD is telling me. I also lost a lot of respect for the teacher when she told me that this girl went into grade 4 because of her height and that my DD "was still waiting for her growth spurt". I still don't know what that has to do with anything. It was a ridiculous conversation. Since then there have been too many jibes about my DD being short and it's made her very prickly about her height as this other girl (and one other) get treated as "older girls" because of their height. Going off track slightly but it's another aspect of confidence in the teacher

 

I think I must have been lucky in a way. My mother NEVER went with me to ballet lessons. She only ever came to the end of year show.

For the first few years I walked .....about a mile to the other side of the village. And later on when I changed schools I cycled the four miles there and four back!!

I was occasionally taken in the car if the weather was bad but my parents came back later to collect me .....they never hung around gossiping with other parents about the merits of this or that child.

Please don't think I sit about gossiping about merits of other children. I don't. I've listened to what my DD has been telling me and Ive tried to understand things to help figure out what's best for her to guide her and support her. I gave up worrying about other peoples kids a long time ago!! The only time it's of interest to me now is when it directly or indirectly impacts on us.

 

Yes I get irritated by other mums on occasions but that's usually when they are showing off, being bitchy about other people's children, etc. The competition mums are a different thread altogether

[t_rose]

As a parent with a DD that has recently moved studios, this post is similar to conversations I had with another dance mum. As was said earlier, you need to do what is right for your DD. It's never an easy decision to move studios, especially when you've been at the same place for a long time - but you & your DD need to be happy & have confidence in the teacher, otherwise it will effect your experience & ultimately your DDs progress. Good luck with whatever you decide x

[annaliesey]

.... It sounds as though the teacher is letting the more experienced pupils coast while she's trying to get the newcomers up to speed, but that isn't good for the ones being ignored.

Yes that sums it up really

 

This whole thing about not being able to find the time for your DD to make up some classes, and then missing mistakes, sounds as though she's being a bit casual. Is this something new or, in hindsight, has it always been like that?

There's two diffetent things here really. On the one hand the school has always been very casual in its organisation. If they miss a class then tough luck as long as teacher tried her best but things happen. On one occasion we attended a river gala with local business stands and displays on a Saturday when there were term time Saturday classes due to run. The girls did their display dances (advertising the school) and then their inter foundation, pointe and lyrical classes were going to be held in front if the gazebo on the grass! It was a half hearted attempt as baking hot day, couldn't dance on grass very well with people walking by, girls were embarrassed but it was one of our paid lessons so no need to make up the time even though the lyrical teacher was nowhere to be seen! And she has been quite snappy with parents who asked for refund of half a terms fees for that class. One of the 6 classes missed was our fault (DD went for CAT audition) but rather than ask for time to make up for missed classes (I wouldn't dream of asking for refund of missed classes) I thought it just would be easier and less fuss all round to nip off to another school for some classes. She sent me some rather stroppy text messages about me going elsewhere but I stood my ground and explained it was for missed classes and our only option etc.

 

As for missing mistakes I honestly don't know if that's new or not. It's new that my DD did that. I was quite taken aback when she explained and showed me what she had done. I don't understand the things she did but said it was all her teachers pet hates (sticking her bum out and arching her back, then rolling into the middle of her feet, not turning out properly in plié, letting her tummy sag out in port de bras etc ... Was probably quite comical I suppose) but even though I played it down with DD I have picked up on the extent of her frustration.

 

I don't think things have been missed much before as she has had distinctions in her last 5 exams (ballet tap modern jazz) and one merit that was two marks off a distinction in her last ballet exam

[annaliesey]

Thank you Harwel

 

... I understand that it is good for you to get it off your chest in this environment, with no harm done.

 

If I were you, I would listen to what your dd wants and move her to the school she felt happier with. Things change, a school that has been good for her up until now may not suit right now.

 

If she wishes to persue dance seriously she will have many, many teachers over the course of her training and hopefully she will gain something useful from all of them. Some teachers will be special to her and others not so much. It sounds as if she has had good basic training with her current teacher and got her to a good standard - something to be thankful for. Perhaps this relationship has just come to a natural end? Nothing at all wrong with that. There are always things that happen to prompt a change, maybe that's all this is. Go with what feels right and I'm sure you will make the right decision for your dd.

Yes I think that's sound advice.

 

I think on the basis of some replies here and just mulling things over properly and in context with other things going on I will let her do a graded ballet class elsewhere. I will try out of courtesy to explain again to the current teacher about attention and progress DD wants without going into the stuff about any other children as a) she will have a defensive hissy fit and she will know without me saying anything anyway

[annaliesey]

AnnaLiesey, thanks for not being offended by my bluntness.

 

It does sound as though the studio is not a happy place to be,

 

 

Sometimes yes but sometimes no my DD has some truly wonderful friendships there and vast majority of mums get on brilliant (98% for 98% of the time haha)

 

and that somehow the dynamics have become that rather nasty mix of gossip & envy that I remember at times from my youth (shudder).

 

 

Gossip is mainly the kids all talking amongst themselves and what with Instagram and snapchat .... Arghhhh!!!

 

 

 

.... I hope you can give your DD some useful life tools to deal with that: ignore, ignore, ignore is the basic one, I think!

 

I have so far there's always something going on with someone and someone's always got something to say and if anything I've used it as an excuse to tell her to practise more if she doesn't like something. Especially being in and around competitions she knows there's akways someone better Ive just made sure recently that she does activities away from dance with non dancing friends too or dancing stuff somewhere where she doesn't know anybody ive also told her that if I ever catch her boasting or sniping then she'll have me to deal with!

 

A child of 10 or 11, however, isn't necessarily best placed to see that her training is beneficial. The stop/start you say she reports could be just as good for her -- slow and steady attention to the basics -- even if she feels she's beyond it, and more advanced.

 

 

I would normally agree with you. I've told her we know people who have gone through all their grades and aren't doing any dance now so as you say, ignore it. However she's starting on level 1 of a CAT scheme next month and they have pre warned her that the ballet will be going back to basics. She has been quite grown up about this in what she's said saying she wants to make sure any wrinkles were ironed out (which was a phrase another teacher used). So I think because she is going back to basics in the CAT ballet class I have to be careful she's not bored silly in her current class where she really does want to get on

 

A tricky situation, and such a shame that you feel you can't speak to the teacher openly. Are there ways you can try, that will come across as completely non-judgemental and simply ask about the way your daughter is feeling and progressing, in the teacher's professional view? I think if you went from the point of view of your daughter's progress, not the issue of the other girl in the class, or the stop/start or slowing down of the class to accommodate her, would that be more productive?

 

 

yes I'll try somehow to approach it again but I'm realistically not expecting any openness no matter how I phrase it

 

You could rehearse a conversation here, with the other dance teachers, maybe, to see what would work.

 

Tricky situation, but if your daughter is still so young, it's not at all a disastrous thing in her trainng. Dealt with well, it will make her more resilient & able to deal with this sort of situation, which is by no means limited to the dance world, throughout her life.

!

I agree and reading the other thread on here about qualifications being meaningless (haha)!I'm mindful to not get screwed up about the wrong things

 

I'm just waiting for a timetable to come through for another dance school then I think I'll plan a conversation based on what she wants to do and why. We have "show term" coming up so that's a good excuse to do syllabus work somewhere else as that stops for us for most of the term this term

 

Thank you again

[taxi4ballet]

Usually the teacher does not budge on this at all! There are kids who were in grade 3 for 3 years and IF for up to 4 years!! In the teachers words the kids don't work hard enough to be ready (bearing in mind she usually aims for high merit / distinction)!

 

Three or four years in one grade is absurd

 

Their progress in all that time has nothing at all to do with whether or not the pupils 'work hard' and everything to do with the quality of teaching and the ability of the teacher IMHO. Students can work their butts off, but if they aren't being motivated and are not receiving the right sort of corrections consistently, they will never improve!

[Harwel]

Not all children are able to do the vocational exams and should do the higher level children's exams.

[LinMM]

Thank you for such a comprehensive reply annaliesey.

I hadn't picked up your DD and friends were actually being held up in their learning for this exam by this current situation just that they were getting bored going over stuff they knew but obviously they need to get on to the things they don't know as well!!

 

Keeping children in grades for three years is very strange imo .....imagine playing the same pieces of music for three or four years if this was for a piano exam for example!!

Also usually children progress because of their improved capabilities in dancing not their height.....also a bit strange!!

 

Sorry if it appeared I meant you were hanging around gossiping .....just meant in general....there are mums who do this and it can get rather unpleasant. My own mum always avoided such scenarios both at main school and ballet school!!

But if your daughter is continually showing signs by what she says and how she behaves that she is no longer happy with the situation in this school then it may be a time for a change.

Have you tried writing to this teacher? Though doesn't sound as if will help much!!

[primrose]

It sounds like you and your daughter would be happier moving on to a new school. You say that the current teacher has been very good up until this situation with the new girl. I suspect the teacher has seen something special in this girl and feels she has the ability to progress a lot further. 11 year old girls very easily have their noses put out and I suspect there is jealousy going on here with all the girls ganging up together. I can imagine that no matter what this girl says it will be seen as boasting. All classes can be stop start even in vocational schools. The teacher does need to make sure that all students understand the exercises. Throughout my daughters time at voc schools including upper school there was always students who seemed to recieve more attention from the teacher purely because they needed it but everybody had a slice of the teachers attention. Your daughter will come up with this situation again in her dancing. Good luck to you and your dd in her new school.

[Vonrothbart]

It's a sad fact that children or indeed people with natural talent in any form, can sometimes come across as being boastful. I think the reason is maybe they find things easier than the majority, who have to work hard to achieve the same results. It might not be in this case, but just a thought.

[taxi4ballet]

It's a sad fact that children or indeed people with natural talent in any form, can sometimes come across as being boastful. I think the reason is maybe they find things easier than the majority, who have to work hard to achieve the same results. It might not be in this case, but just a thought.

I agree with this, and I suppose it takes a very good teacher to be able to teach a class with someone like this in it, and give everyone in the class an equal share of their time. It must be very hard to have a group of students with varying abilities and natural facility, who all need slightly different corrections to bring out the best in them individually.

 

It must also be very difficult for those students who feel a bit hard-done-by and think that someone else is being treated differently from them, especially for this age group.

[Lisa O`Brien]

You never know,it could be that this girl`s mother has indicated her daughter wants to audition for vocational school . Maybe the teacher is just trying to get her ready as quickly as possible,and knows the situation is different for the rest of the girls in the class. Just a guess,of course.

[Fiz]

She has only been doing ballet for five months, Lisa. Unless she wants to go for drama vocational school or musical theatre but she would still need more ballet than that.

[primrose]

I suspect that there is something very special the teacher has seen in this child. She probably has all the desired physical attributes and is probably a fast learner. If she has done other dance exams she clearly is not new to dance.

The teacher seems to get good results from the students exam wise and seems to be well established with competitions and festivals. This reading between the lines is not normal behaviour for the teacher to give this type of attention to one child. I suspect this child already has knowledge about ballet, I can not see a well established teacher or school allowing a child with absolutely no ballet training into a grade 4 class as the child would not be able to do the exercises, when in actual fact she has been entered for the exam. The teacher clearly knows when a child is ready for the exams as in the schools history there has never been a failure result.

I think the poster and her child need to concentrate on themselves alone and move on to another school if they are not happy with the teachers decisions.